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Thread: 23HR on RM3Di

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    23HR on RM3Di

    Wondering if anyone is using this lens in Arca R-mount.

    Typically all R-mount lenses ship with a spacer labelled "remove for Rotaslide". When you attach the DB directly to the camera, you leave the spacer on, and when using the Rotamount or Rotaslide, you take the spacer of the lens. This allows the distance between lens and sensor to be consistent.

    I never use spacers as I always have the Rotamount or Rotaslide installed. With the new 23HR I just received, I spent hours trying to figure out why I could not get nothing in focus. Then I removed the rotamount and put the spacer on the lens and tried it, and everything looks great.

    Any thoughts or experience with this?

    Second issue, though I need to test a little more is a weird colour cast in the middle of the image. LCC does not appear to remove it entirely. I am using the CF for the lens.

    Thanks for your help.

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    Senior Member yaya's Avatar
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    Re: 23HR on RM3Di

    IIRC the 23mm can only be focused to infinity if the back is mounted directly

    The cast in the middle is a "hot spot" created by flare...you need a large lens shade with the 23mm...if you look at the lens from the front you could actually sometimes see where that spot shows and flag it with your hand...

    Watch the spot in the top image disappearing when I flagged it. This was done in HK about 18 months ago

    Hope this helps
    Yair Shahar | Product Manager | Phase One | Mamiya Leaf
    e: [email protected] | m: +44(0)77 8992 8199 | yaya's blog

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    Re: 23HR on RM3Di

    Thanks Yair. I was hoping it was not a hot spot, I it was quite overcast when I shot, but I think you are right on this one.

    On the spacer issue, are you sure? The ring has the typical "remove for Rotaslide" label on it. Walter also spoke to Martin who was looking into it. I would have thought this would have been a pretty straight forward answer. Again, I think you are right.

    Cheers,

    Jag

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    Subscriber & Workshop Member GrahamWelland's Avatar
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    Re: 23HR on RM3Di

    As yair mentioned, the red center flare needs careful control. The LEE wide hood does a great job with avoiding this. Sometimes though you have to give it a more extreme flag. However, it's worth it.
    Remember: adventure before dementia!

    As Oscar Wilde said, "my tastes are simple, I only like the best"

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    Re: 23HR on RM3Di

    Thanks Graham. Having used the 32HR for a while, I am used to the flare, but the hot spot got me a little off guard. How do you verify this in the field? I did not even catch it on the image review on the back, only noticed it on the computer when I was applying the LCC.

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    Re: 23HR on RM3Di

    I assume its in every shot if there's sun or a bright light source and will make sure that I take steps to flag that source whether I think I need to or not.
    Remember: adventure before dementia!

    As Oscar Wilde said, "my tastes are simple, I only like the best"
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    Administrator Bob's Avatar
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    Re: 23HR on RM3Di

    Yes, the 23 HR is infamous for those internal reflections. The wider a lens gets the harder it is to avoid some bright light source just outside the image.
    Even on overcast days, or maybe especially, the large white sky is very effective at causing it so aggressive flagging is the way to go.
    I used this lens for several kitchen shots and found that skylights were a problem, so I used a 2 stop black silk to cover them and things improved considerably.
    -bob

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    Re: 23HR on RM3Di

    Thanks Bob. I am just finding it a little complicated to use in the field, even compared to the very fussy 32HR.

    I use 105mm screw on ND filters with my other lenses, and they are not usable on this lens, even with the CF removed, I can see the corners cut-off. Reflections appear to get even worse with the additional glass in front.

    The fact that I cannot use the Rotamount also means I've now got to flip the camera, another pain. This is strange since the lens came with a spacer labelled "remove for Rotaslide".

    When things are right, the images are stellar, but I don't have the same love at first sight I had with the 32 or 40 HR lenses. Still waiting for Martin to get back to me, but not sure if all the little idiosyncrasies are going to allow me to keep this one in the bag.

    Cheers...

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    Workshop Member Wayne Fox's Avatar
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    Re: 23HR on RM3Di

    Quote Originally Posted by GrahamWelland View Post
    As yair mentioned, the red center flare needs careful control. The LEE wide hood does a great job with avoiding this. Sometimes though you have to give it a more extreme flag. However, it's worth it.
    Have you ever posted pics of your tech camera with this hood? I have the 23HR on the way and need to research best practices for shading this thing.

    I'm probably going to opt for the center filter, as I don't like making the LCC's do so much work. Curious of anyone using the center filter has found the flare problem is less of an issue.
    wayne
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    Re: 23HR on RM3Di

    Quote Originally Posted by Wayne Fox View Post
    Have you ever posted pics of your tech camera with this hood? I have the 23HR on the way and need to research best practices for shading this thing.

    I'm probably going to opt for the center filter, as I don't like making the LCC's do so much work. Curious of anyone using the center filter has found the flare problem is less of an issue.
    Wayne,

    I have tried with and without and it is there. In some interior shots, I don't see it, but otherwise, even with moderate amount of sun, the hot spot appears. Attached shot is with the CF, and LCC applied. LCC does not pickup the hotspot since the process of taking the LCC shades the lens.

    You can see the read hue in the middle of the image, and this was with a relatively overcast sky.


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    Subscriber & Workshop Member GrahamWelland's Avatar
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    Re: 23HR on RM3Di

    Quote Originally Posted by Wayne Fox View Post
    Have you ever posted pics of your tech camera with this hood? I have the 23HR on the way and need to research best practices for shading this thing.

    I'm probably going to opt for the center filter, as I don't like making the LCC's do so much work. Curious of anyone using the center filter has found the flare problem is less of an issue.
    Here's a shot of the LEE shade on the 23HR. It's on my Alpa but that shouldn't really be significant. There are a couple of versions and this particular one has the filter slots. I also have the un-slotted version which sits a little further back and is flush with the holder and so has no gap.


    I was shooting in portrait mode and there is no vignetting at this amount of shading.

    Remember: adventure before dementia!

    As Oscar Wilde said, "my tastes are simple, I only like the best"
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    Re: 23HR on RM3Di

    Hi..
    Regarding the Leefilter wide angle Lenshood and the LCC:
    - Do you take it off each time you shoot the lcc frame ?
    - Did some of you tryed to make a bigger plate to put in front of the hood? Does this could introduce strange correction as you can't be sure to be parralele // to the lens?
    Any tips are welcome ... as i found difficult to remove it without introducing a litte move to the camera or lens ... so not good for stitching or blending option.

    I do have a flair buster, but doesn't work well for interiro shoot with many lights...

    I saw someone using a rubber Hood... Is there any reference which could fit the 35XL+CF , and allow a bit of shift?

    Thanks

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    Subscriber & Workshop Member GrahamWelland's Avatar
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    Re: 23HR on RM3Di

    For LCC I remove the filter, although since I very rarely use any movements I don't need to often shoot an LCC as I already have them for common aperture stops.

    No need for a bigger LCC plate. It's a simple matter of releasing the spring loaded clip and the hood comes off the LEE ring that I have on the lens.

    Which version of the LEE hood do you have? Mine has a brass spring loaded clip that you pull up to release from the LEE ring. I don't have any movement when I do that between shots - although I am using a big heavy tripod and a CUBE head. Also since I'm shooting with a full size sensor I really don't have much room for movements anyway.

    On the occasions where I shift the lens I just remove the hood and hold the LCC card flush to the front of the ring and shoot. It's simple.
    Remember: adventure before dementia!

    As Oscar Wilde said, "my tastes are simple, I only like the best"

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    Re: 23HR on RM3Di

    UPDATE - Lens went back to Martin and came back. Turns out my Helical focus mount was slightly off. Never bothered the rest of the lenses, but the 23 sits so close to the DB @ infinity that something went astray.

    Now works fine with the Rotamount & Rotaslide (although no real IC for shifting).

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    Re: 23HR on RM3Di

    Another way to use the Lee Wide Angle hood for a LCC is to use the large sheet that comes with a Phase One back, at least the older P45+'s. It fits over the outside opening of the Lee Wide hood perfectly. I use two small spring clips to hold it to the hood. This is a nice solution if you are using a filter on the Lee Hood slot and want to take a LCC with the filter on. You can order this from Phase One (dealer) or have a similar one made.

    I also have the 105mm ring for my hood that allows me to use a 105mm CL-PL on the hood.

    Only issue, is this adds a considerable amount of weight to the hood. Lee's Brass spring clip that holds the hood to the Lee wide angle ring doesn't lock and it's easy to have the hood fall off. The brass spring clip does not have a lot of pressure and when you are making adjustments to the lens, i.e. aperture or shutter speed, your hand can hit it and release the clip. I use a large rubber band around the filter slot that fits over the brass release spring on the hood which helps to keep it from coming open.

    Paul Caldwell

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