The GetDPI Photography Forum

Great to see you here. Join our insightful photographic forum today and start tapping into a huge wealth of photographic knowledge. Completing our simple registration process will allow you to gain access to exclusive content, add your own topics and posts, share your work and connect with other members through your own private inbox! And don’t forget to say hi!

Hasselbladish RX100

Jorgen Udvang

Subscriber Member
Hasselblad's creative writers have been working again:

"The Hasselblad Stellar redefines quality with its elegantly designed aluminium body and metal operation controls."

If there's a recently released camera that "redefines quality" within this segment, it's the Sony RX100 II. Hasselblad tries to get away with the fact that they deliver yesterday's dinner warmed up by talking about the nice packaging, but this is a camera after all. Scraping off the paint and attaching a piece of wood can hardly be defined as "redefining quality".

--

"ZEISS has helped document some of the most iconic moments in human history. When NASA astronauts landed on the Moon in 1969, unforgettable images from the harsh conditions of the lunar surface were captured with Hasselblad camera fitted with lenses by ZEISS.

The unique partnership between ZEISS and Hasselblad is one that stretches back over 50 years and we are proud to continue the tradition of supplying the very best optics on our cameras."

Strange then that the Lunar wasn't launched with the already available Zeiss lenses, particularly considering the fact that Hasselblad's CEO, Larry Hansen, worked for Zeiss for 26 years. 16 of CEO of those years, he was the CEO for Carl Zeiss Asia Pacific operations based in Japan.
 

drevil

Well-known member
Staff member
didnt that unique partnership ended with the introduction on the HC lenses?
 

Jorgen Udvang

Subscriber Member
You mean the Fujinons? I'm getting increasingly curious about who has been doing what in the relationship between Hasselblad and Fuji. The lenses say both Fuji and Hasselblad, but who designed them and who builds them?

GX645AF Professional :
 

drevil

Well-known member
Staff member
hasselblad never designed any lens to my knowledge, its just a camera maker
just the other way around, zeiss never made a camera themselves, just lenses, the contax name was always leased to other companies like kyocera
 

fotografz

Well-known member
hasselblad never designed any lens to my knowledge, its just a camera maker
just the other way around, zeiss never made a camera themselves, just lenses, the contax name was always leased to other companies like kyocera
FYI, the Contax 645 lenses, and all the N mount Zeiss lenses were made in Japan, as were many of the later CY mount Zeiss lenses. The manufacture was overseen by the Carl Zeiss institute in Japan but to my knowledge not actually made in a Zeiss factory. All of those lenses are marked "Made in Japan".

- Marc
 

fotografz

Well-known member
Why does this still bother you, making fun of H has been going on for years.
Because much of the past years of "making fun" has been unwarranted and just plain in bad taste ... often supported by blatant miss-information or authoritative pronouncements that are simply not true. All that does is weaken the whole MFD category which doesn't need to be weakened in the face of other "format competition" and the still sluggish economy.

Nick is a really good guy, and has helped many photographers along the way ... he resists bashing other products and has insights into Hasselblad products gained from a close working relationship with them, as well as running his own photo business.

IMO, those that have persistently engaged in wholesale negative comments about Hasselblad as a whole, are just ignorant of what the products can and have done ... products still used by many really good photographers. Oddly, even when answered with proof, the basher will pop up again and post the same misinformed opinion as if it were fact. Frankly, that DOES get irritating.

Admittedly, the whole Lunar launch, and subsequent lunacy roll out, doesn't help matters ... I seriously doubt that any Hasselbald H system owner didn't wince when it all unfolded at Photokina.

- Marc
 

fotografz

Well-known member
You mean the Fujinons? I'm getting increasingly curious about who has been doing what in the relationship between Hasselblad and Fuji. The lenses say both Fuji and Hasselblad, but who designed them and who builds them?

GX645AF Professional :
Who cares?

All the H lenses are clearly marked Hasselblad and "Made in Japan". None of mine said Fuji on them. Of course the Fuji GX645 versions restricted to the Japanese market wouldn't say Hasselblad on them now would they?

Most all of the H system lenses are stellar (proper use of the word) ... and they continue to improve with optics like the HC 50-II, 150N, 120-II, HCD24 and HCD 35-90. If Fuji did the whole thing start to finish I couldn't care less, or if Hasselblad had technical input, I also couldn't care less. All that counts is the end result.

- Marc
 

drevil

Well-known member
Staff member
FYI, the Contax 645 lenses, and all the N mount Zeiss lenses were made in Japan, as were many of the later CY mount Zeiss lenses. The manufacture was overseen by the Carl Zeiss institute in Japan but to my knowledge not actually made in a Zeiss factory. All of those lenses are marked "Made in Japan".

- Marc
i am aware of that! but the optical formula is from zeiss and there are also zeiss lenses made in germany, for a much higher price of course
 

jecxz

Active member
Ok Marc, calm down, Nick knows who I am, you know who I am (we are friends on FB), and why I wrote that. For years I have defended Hasselblad too and it just doesn't stop. My comment to Nick was meant to communicate just that. He knows many of the detractors don't even use Hasselblad. You'll recall it first started with the H system being made from plastic; then when that wasn't true it was a closed system (like Canon, Nikon, Pentax, Leica aren't closed systems and mind you C1 didn't process H files for years or perhaps they still don't). Then it went to where the lenses were made, and so forth. For years David Grover would defend Hasselblad with little effect. It doesn't end and I was just asking the rhetorical question. Nothing more. Nonetheless, you are correct, we repeat the same cycle again and again year after year. I know this is your retirement, please tell me it's not what's in store for me. :) Be well.

Kind regards,
Derek

Because much of the past years of "making fun" has been unwarranted and just plain in bad taste ... often supported by blatant miss-information or authoritative pronouncements that are simply not true. All that does is weaken the whole MFD category which doesn't need to be weakened in the face of other "format competition" and the still sluggish economy.

Nick is a really good guy, and has helped many photographers along the way ... he resists bashing other products and has insights into Hasselblad products gained from a close working relationship with them, as well as running his own photo business.

IMO, those that have persistently engaged in wholesale negative comments about Hasselblad as a whole, are just ignorant of what the products can and have done ... products still used by many really good photographers. Oddly, even when answered with proof, the basher will pop up again and post the same misinformed opinion as if it were fact. Frankly, that DOES get irritating.

Admittedly, the whole Lunar launch, and subsequent lunacy roll out, doesn't help matters ... I seriously doubt that any Hasselbald H system owner didn't wince when it all unfolded at Photokina.

- Marc
 

fotografz

Well-known member
Ok Marc, calm down, Nick knows who I am, you know who I am (we are friends on FB), and why I wrote that. For years I have defended Hasselblad too and it just doesn't stop. My comment to Nick was meant to communicate just that. He knows many of the detractors don't even use Hasselblad. You'll recall it first started with the H system being made from plastic; then when that wasn't true it was a closed system (like Canon, Nikon, Pentax, Leica aren't closed systems and mind you C1 didn't process H files for years or perhaps they still don't). Then it went to where the lenses were made, and so forth. For years David Grover would defend Hasselblad with little effect. It doesn't end and I was just asking the rhetorical question. Nothing more. Nonetheless, you are correct, we repeat the same cycle again and again year after year. I know this is your retirement, please tell me it's not what's in store for me. :) Be well.

Kind regards,
Derek
Better understood now ... however, I don't mind addressing some of the communications issues and persistent negative false info when it pops up ... even though I don't have my H4D/60 anymore.

If by "you hope I tell you it isn't what is in store you" ... all I can say is get back to me when you are almost 70 :eek:. I had a great run, and Hasselblad was a good part of that ... now I pick and choose what and for whom I shoot, and am enjoying working with my S2 ... still using some Hassey products on it to boot :thumbup:

- Marc
 

Jorgen Udvang

Subscriber Member
Why does this still bother you, making fun of H has been going on for years.
Unfortunately, this is much more than making fun of a camera maker that has gone a bit over the top, like Leica has done on occasions. These new cameras are not based on Swedish traditions, they are in no way offsprings of the cameras used on the Apollo missions, they do not redefine quality in any significant way and the fact that one of them has a Zeiss lens is not based on Hasselblad's previous relationship with Zeiss, but on Sony's relationship with the same lens maker.

Sales arguments like these are commonly used by all kinds of manufacturers of crappy products. But Hasselblad wasn't a manufacturer of crappy products. Hasselblad was one of the most respected camera makers on the globe, a company that was trusted by at least two generations of photographers, professionals as well as amateurs, to deliver what they said they delivered: Some of the best cameras money could buy.

When a change in attitude like this appears, it's only fair to ask if this represents a general change of policies or if there are now two cultures within the organisation: One for professional customers and one for rich but ignorant people. Somehow, I doubt that two opposite cultures would survive for long under the same roof. The one that generates the most profit will usually win.

I had a long chat with a camera retailer in Bangkok today, one that among other things stocks cameras and lenses aimed at well healed customers, including an abundance of expensive Leica gear. He told me that Shriro, the previous owner of Hasselblad and distributor of the brand in many countries in Asia, approaches retailers with the Lunar. He told me that, then he shook his head an laughed.

If I had $7,000 to waste on photographic tools that I don't need, a brand new Rolleiflex TLR plus a NEX7 will cost around that sum. The Rolleiflex isn't based on German tradition of course, it is German tradition, and I doubt that any Italian designer will ever be allowed to bolt pieces of wood onto it :eek:
 

fotografz

Well-known member
Unfortunately, this is much more than making fun of a camera maker that has gone a bit over the top, like Leica has done on occasions. These new cameras are not based on Swedish traditions, they are in no way offsprings of the cameras used on the Apollo missions, they do not redefine quality in any significant way and the fact that one of them has a Zeiss lens is not based on Hasselblad's previous relationship with Zeiss, but on Sony's relationship with the same lens maker.

Sales arguments like these are commonly used by all kinds of manufacturers of crappy products. But Hasselblad wasn't a manufacturer of crappy products. Hasselblad was one of the most respected camera makers on the globe, a company that was trusted by at least two generations of photographers, professionals as well as amateurs, to deliver what they said they delivered: Some of the best cameras money could buy.

When a change in attitude like this appears, it's only fair to ask if this represents a general change of policies or if there are now two cultures within the organisation: One for professional customers and one for rich but ignorant people. Somehow, I doubt that two opposite cultures would survive for long under the same roof. The one that generates the most profit will usually win.

I had a long chat with a camera retailer in Bangkok today, one that among other things stocks cameras and lenses aimed at well healed customers, including an abundance of expensive Leica gear. He told me that Shriro, the previous owner of Hasselblad and distributor of the brand in many countries in Asia, approaches retailers with the Lunar. He told me that, then he shook his head an laughed.

If I had $7,000 to waste on photographic tools that I don't need, a brand new Rolleiflex TLR plus a NEX7 will cost around that sum. The Rolleiflex isn't based on German tradition of course, it is German tradition, and I doubt that any Italian designer will ever be allowed to bolt pieces of wood onto it :eek:
I doubt any pro or serious enthusiasts will argue against the notions you present. What I took exception to is the "years" of making fun, and all the misinformation or general ignorance of the brand's contributions with the H system. The Lunar isn't even 1 year old.

- Marc
 

Jorgen Udvang

Subscriber Member
I doubt any pro or serious enthusiasts will argue against the notions you present. What I took exception to is the "years" of making fun, and all the misinformation or general ignorance of the brand's contributions with the H system. The Lunar isn't even 1 year old.

- Marc
When Leica went through it's most scary "Hermès Limited Edition" period, I was always of the opinion that, if people are willing to pay a lot for over-decorated cameras, why not? They were after all Leica cameras, and Leica cameras were good then too. This is of course something completely different. Still, I reserve the right to make fun of designs that look too silly. Hasselblad seems to aim for a 100% score in that department.
 

BlinkingEye

New member
On a more serious note, do we know if "H" requested any internal changes to the Sony before slapping their "H" on it? I am thinking of technical differences for product differentiation such as: better firmware, better AF, tweaks to the sensor, etc.
 

fotografz

Well-known member
When Leica went through it's most scary "Hermès Limited Edition" period, I was always of the opinion that, if people are willing to pay a lot for over-decorated cameras, why not? They were after all Leica cameras, and Leica cameras were good then too. This is of course something completely different. Still, I reserve the right to make fun of designs that look too silly. Hasselblad seems to aim for a 100% score in that department.
Total agreement here. Evil forces have commandeered the company and the good name of Hasselblad. IMO.

- Marc
 

Jorgen Udvang

Subscriber Member
One certainly can't blame them for not trying. The Aston Martin is made from carbon fiber. The Lunar can have a carbon fiber grip. Must be as good as the car then. I wonder if the Aston has a Camry engine under the bonnet :confused:

Pity they couldn't move Mr. Reichman to mention the Lunar though :ROTFL:

Hasselblad Lunar

Edit: Now I see. Aston Martin actually did that; the Cygnet, based on the Toyota IQ, continuously variable transmission and all.



And the comments from the car enthusiasts are not any kinder than ours about the Stellunar:

Has Aston Martin lost the plot? | My Car Heaven
 

hcubell

Well-known member
Because much of the past years of "making fun" has been unwarranted and just plain in bad taste ... often supported by blatant miss-information or authoritative pronouncements that are simply not true. All that does is weaken the whole MFD category which doesn't need to be weakened in the face of other "format competition" and the still sluggish economy.

Nick is a really good guy, and has helped many photographers along the way ... he resists bashing other products and has insights into Hasselblad products gained from a close working relationship with them, as well as running his own photo business.

IMO, those that have persistently engaged in wholesale negative comments about Hasselblad as a whole, are just ignorant of what the products can and have done ... products still used by many really good photographers. Oddly, even when answered with proof, the basher will pop up again and post the same misinformed opinion as if it were fact. Frankly, that DOES get irritating.

Admittedly, the whole Lunar launch, and subsequent lunacy roll out, doesn't help matters ... I seriously doubt that any Hasselbald H system owner didn't wince when it all unfolded at Photokina.

- Marc
I am sure that there are thousands and thousands of photographers who own
medium format digital cameras, including Hasselblads, who would agree that the Lunar and these other rebadged Sony cameras coming out of Hasselblad are a joke. Notably, however, none of them have wasted their time making dozens and dozens of posts about it, throwing in for good measure a litany of falsehoods about the design and manufacture of the H system cameras and lenses. AFAIK, there is only one such individual, and he does not even own a medium format digital camera or back. What is he doing here?
 

mmbma

Active member
Hasselblad needs to stage a comeback. but maybe that would only happen after it hits rock bottom.

On the other hand, the Lunar and the Stellar probably cost them next to nothing to make especially they have some kind of rev share agreement with Sony that doesn't require a huge upfront payment. There are always idiots out there who will buy these stuff
 

Nick-T

New member
You mean the Fujinons? I'm getting increasingly curious about who has been doing what in the relationship between Hasselblad and Fuji. The lenses say both Fuji and Hasselblad, but who designed them and who builds them?
The HC lenses are designed in Sweden (I know the designer). The shutters are also designed and built in Sweden. The lens are built in Japan by Fuji.
 
Top