IQ260 lens choices

[satybhat]

So,
Many many thanks to everyone for chiming in on the previous threads.
I have finally decided on the IQ260, Cambo WRS500 and have one lens that I've shortlisted: Schneider 60 XL. (that makes it a really short list ) and that's where I would like your advice.

Just to establish the relevance of replies. I shoot landscapes (only) and would like to stitch 2 or 3 frames on occasions. I'll be trying a 2 lens setup.

1. Recommendations for a wide angle please. on an IQ260, does 32 HR / 40 HR need LCC anyways even being a retro-focal ? Is the 40 hR sharper than the 32 HR ? Would the 43 XL hold the edges when stitching 2 shot 15mm each side ? Would it be sharper and with less distortion than the HRs ?

2. stitching 2 shot ( 15 mm either side on IQ260 ) with the Schneider 60 XL, what would the equivalent focal length be ? would I need LCCs taken for both shots or not ? If I'm getting a good angle after stitching, then I could dispense with the wider angle and go 120XL.

Thanks guys, I'm in the final throes of ecstasy here before I commence my descent !!!

 

[kdphotography]

Congratulations on getting jumped into the Cambo brotherhood...

On an IQ180 and Cambo, I started with an Rodenstock HR40 t/s and later added the HR70 t/s.

If I had to do it again, I would start exactly the same way: Find the wide angle lens that suits you best first, then go from there. For me, the HR40 is perfect, and I've been content on sometimes using it on trips where I limited myself to one lens only. The HR40 t/s is ideal. I like the idea (not the price) of the HR32, but it's too close in range to my HR40. From there, it was relatively easy to then consider the HR70 or new HR90, and then something on the longer end, either the 120 or 150.

No problems stitching or shooting panos. Although an LCC frame may not be entirely necessary on the HR40 or HR70 (imo), it is better practice to always shoot an LCC frame, especially with larger movements. It's better to have that LCC frame later to correct easily in C1 Pro 7 than to not have it. Once you incorporate shooting an LCC frame into your workflow, it really becomes habit and quite easy to do.

Nice choice. You didn't want to hang out with those Alpa-bangers anyway... :ROTFL:

 

[satybhat]

Ken / (others),
On your IQ 180 / (better if someone can comment on IQ280), what is the longest long exposure you've had at ISO35 ?
Also, Ken, could you comment on how the HR40 or 70 fare on a 2-3 shot stitch on the IQ180 ? Did you find distortion to be an issue on the Rodies as opposed to the schneiders ?

Here we go, just when I thought I was done !!!!
Alpa-bangers !! no offence to anyone, sounds like fang-bangers from True Blood !

 

[jotloob]

Congratulations on getting jumped into the . . . . . . .
Nice choice. You didn't want to hang out with those Alpa-bangers anyway... :ROTFL:

Don't worry satybhat

We are all bangers here in the Technical Camera Forum .
Call them ARCA-bangers , ALPA-bangers , CAMBO-bangers , LINHOF-bangers etc.-bangers .
It's the banger community .:ROTFL:

 

[gerald.d]

Ken / (others),
On your IQ 180 / (better if someone can comment on IQ280), what is the longest long exposure you've had at ISO35 ?

This is very ambient temperature dependent.

Personally (based in Dubai, where it's rather hot), I've not been content with anything over 45 seconds with my IQ180.

Kind regards,

Gerald.

 

[Dogs857]

Just to establish the relevance of replies. I shoot landscapes (only) and would like to stitch 2 or 3 frames on occasions. I'll be trying a 2 lens setup.

1. Recommendations for a wide angle please. on an IQ260, does 32 HR / 40 HR need LCC anyways even being a retro-focal ?

Mate get into the habit of ALWAYS shooting an LCC, whether you think you need it or not. If you make this part of your workflow then it becomes second nature. On my IQ180 I find it useful even without movements as it helps a lot with dust removal as well.

Also, Ken, could you comment on how the HR40 or 70 fare on a 2-3 shot stitch on the IQ180 ? Did you find distortion to be an issue on the Rodies as opposed to the schneiders ?

If I can add for this one as well (though Ken has more experience than me in this) for landscapes the 40/70 combination is pretty sweet. I have not had any issues with distortion and pano's stitch up without a problem.

This is 3 shots, centre and 10mm left and right with the Rodie 40mm. If you are nodal stitching then the sky is the limit really. For landscapes these are pretty good lenses.

 

[anGy]

I was using a Cambo WRS with 32mm T/S and 55 Rodie + IQ180 before my back was sold.
Did hesitate a lot between 40 & 32 before jumping for the 32mm.
32 and 55mm give a 21 and 35mm equivalent focal length, both most important ones for tech. cam wide angle shooting in my regard.

Although the 32 is quite expensive, it's possible to save much money on the 55 by using the very cheap Sinaron digital which however is a superlative lens.
The 32 + 55 combo is then not more expensive than a 40 + 70mm combo.
I didn't regret this choice once as the 32mm is a wonderful lens and I like the 21mm focal lens so much, perfect match for high res. shots.
Furthermore the T/S option on the 32mm brings a tremendous advantage: put the lens focussed at Infinity with 1 deg of tilt and everything is sharp from 1m to infinity (at full length tripod distance from the ground). So easy not having to deal with focus considerations anymore.

Like other members already said, lcc anytime (unless I shoot for Black & white of course).

 

[Guy Mancuso]

If you stick with the 260 you can use the SK 35xl which is fairly cheap. If 180 or 280 you cannot use it. 32 you can use on any back

 

[Guy Mancuso]

As popular for many the 40/70 is a great combo so is the 32/60 . Either combo is outstanding. The latter combo will be more money.

 

[satybhat]

Thanks Guy(s)...
OK, slightly off topic, but trawling through the forum, I found 2 or 3 posts speaking about flare issues on the WRS.... with no relevant mention to any lens. By this, I suppose they mean internal flare ?

Thanks a lot for all your replies to my original question and for your comments, very much appreciated!...

Camera-wise the background of my question was Alpa. I had tested a Cambo WRS which, in a way, was a pleasant surprise. It seems to me that it is a remarkable camera but: it is plagued by serious flare problems. To me this is a show-stopper. At the same time I had an Arca RM3d for a brief test. It's an interesting camera but I am not convinced. Yes, focusing using a disto and a small table with the helicoid settings simply works. But I'm pretty sure that I would never be able to memorize the tables of three different lenses, so I would have to look up the correct value. Moreover, I had the impression that, at least for my way of working, the camera isn't optimal: for example, why on earth is it impossible to check the spirit levels if the camera is mounted at eye-level? In a way, this is a trivial problem but to me it is extremely important. It's definitely a nice camera but I wouldn't call it well thought-out. Enter Alpa. I don't like their marketing speech (and they should hire someone for proof reading before talking about all these things at the top …), I don't like the way they write about Arca on their web site, I don't believe in what they say about precision when it comes to a sliding back. But: So far I am really impressed by the Max. And that's the reason why I asked about tilt with short lenses.

Chris

not sure whether any particular lens combination was targeted here, or was this a fault in the wrs line that has since been ironed out.
Any thoughts ?

 

[Guy Mancuso]

Never had a major flare issue that was not normal lets say. Obviously I have had to shade the lenses in some shots but nothing out of the ordinary has come up. Now if someone was mentioning the Roadie 23 than YES you really need to shade that lens and light striking it from the side cause serious flare and also internal reflections but thats with any cam. Im not sure what Chris is referring to here but if the plate is off or something with the back not attached correctly than yes light leaks can happen. This is extremely rare though

 

[dougpeterson]

Thanks Guy(s)...
OK, slightly off topic, but trawling through the forum, I found 2 or 3 posts speaking about flare issues on the WRS.... with no relevant mention to any lens. By this, I suppose they mean internal flare ? not sure whether any particular lens combination was targeted here, or was this a fault in the wrs line that has since been ironed out.
Any thoughts ?

I believe early versions of the RS used different internal baffling. I've not seen any body-based flare issues in several years.

The 23HR and 32HR have large front elements, wide AOV, and as such are prone to flare; you need to be careful about that. I suggest the Cambo Compendium which makes strong flare protection pretty straight forward.

 

[Paul2660]

If you want to shift, IMO the 35XL is not really a good solution on the 260. I have one and it's really not that good past about 8mm. You will see considerable magenta color shifting and detail smearing past 8mm. If you are on center the 35XL is an excellent solution. As Guy pointed out it's a much lighter and smaller lens than the 40mm but has some limitations unlike the 40mm. I have shifted the 40mm to 20mm and still not found hardly any magenta color in the LCC's where as the 35mm Schneider shows this issue with shifts past 3mm. The LCC will correct most it. The 35mm needs the physical CF all the time, even on center.

You can shift the 60mm Schneider easily to 20mm, I have one and have taken it to 30mm shifts on a Arca rm3di, rotated 90 degrees to turn my rise/fall to shift. This an amazing optic on the 160/260 class chip. DOF with a bit of tilt is also pretty impressive. You might want to consider the physical CF for the 60mm if you want to do extreme shifting I have it and it makes a big difference.

The 40mm HR is also a very impressive optic. Easily would make 20mm of usable shift if not for the disc that Rodenstock places inside the lens. As it is you can get to around 17mm before the disc becomes an issue. The 40mm will flare if the sun is anywhere near a angle to the lens and the Compendium is a good idea. You can also use the Lee Wide angle hood, but that's another subject. There is not a physical CF for the 40mm Rod

I have shot a 32mm Rod, but don't own one. Just a bit much for me. Overall probably the best single wide on the market. Easily could replace both the 28mm and 40mm in the field (through shifting). The 32mm is not filter friendly (if you use Polarizers and ND filters in combination) Some people say the 32mm needs the physical CF other don't. This lens will easily shift to 15mm before you hit the internal disc.

The other lens to consider is the Schneider 43mm. 110mm image circle and on the 260 you can get 12mm shifts before you start to see loss of image detail. I have pushed this lens to over 15mm depending on the subject. I also use the physical CF on this lens.

All of these lens really need a LCC to correct the color cast and light fall off.

Enjoy the back.

Paul Caldwell

 

[dchew]

1. Recommendations for a wide angle please. on an IQ260, does 32 HR / 40 HR need LCC anyways even being a retro-focal ? Is the 40 hR sharper than the 32 HR ? Would the 43 XL hold the edges when stitching 2 shot 15mm each side ? Would it be sharper and with less distortion than the HRs ?

I have the IQ180 which is more sensitive to the LCC requirement, but I always shoot one with the 40hr. I used to have the 43xl and loved it (with the center filter). I can shift the 40hr a bit more, as expected. The only reason I switched is because Alpa now has an SB version of the 40hr, so I can tilt with it but could not with the 43xl. The 43 is so nice and light! BTW, I started out with the P65+, and the 43xl definitely needed an LCC when shifted, but it was pretty good straight on. There are some old threads around where I show the shift @18mm with and without the center filter. Not sure if I can find that... :facesmack:

I would say the 40hr is "slightly" sharper, especially wide open. But definitely splitting hairs there. Less distortion with the 43xl; not sure if that matters? These two lenses are the classic trade-off: Retrofocus vs. traditional, and the relative merits of each!

2. stitching 2 shot ( 15 mm either side on IQ260 ) with the Schneider 60 XL, what would the equivalent focal length be ? would I need LCCs taken for both shots or not ? If I'm getting a good angle after stitching, then I could dispense with the wider angle and go 120XL.

15mm horizontally gets you to a diagonal equal to a 43mm. Shifting 15mm vertically equals a 45mm diagonal. Of course the ratios are different, so it is not quite the same view. FWIW, a 15.6mm shift vertically gives you a 4:3 format. With the 60 that gives you a 45mm equivalent view, with more megapixels too

Here's the thing: With the 60xl I might lean more towards the 32. Of course you can't stitch in every situation, but it just seems a better gap for a two lens system. It really depends how often you think you might need something that wide.

Personally I like the 30mm gap. But as others have pointed out, on the wide end a few mm makes a noticeable difference!

Hmm. I didn't help did I...

Dave

 

[Marlyn]

Welcome to Cambo Land !.

On my WRS-AE and IQ-160 I use the following.

HR-32mm
SK-60mm
SK-120mm

I chose my lenses for exactly the same reason you are looking at:
- Landscape
- Maximum Stitching ability

I also wanted a 3 lens kit. However I am seriously considering the 90mm.

For reference, the 32-HR is the sharpest, nicest lens I have ever owned, and sadly I own quite a lot of glass, both MF and 35mm. It is just stunning.

It's only downside, as posted above, is susceptible to flare when sun shines on it directly at an angle, but a simple shade/hand/hat/whatever solves that. It actually works ok when sun is in the frame though, not too bad flare at all (its 'nice flare' if that makes sense.

Will see if I can find a shot.

Regards

Mark.