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Thread: Another Stupid Camera Test: IQ 260 / A7r / 5d2 / Epic cross posted to LuLa

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    Member Chris Barrett's Avatar
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    Another Stupid Camera Test: IQ 260 / A7r / 5d2 / Epic cross posted to LuLa

    So, I recently picked up this little 36 MegaPixel toy from Sony. I call it a toy because I just can't get over it's minuscule size. I've been testing it very casually, just going out and shooting and seeing what I get. Nothing very scientific. I'm using EOS mount lenses on it via the Metabones Smart Adapter III. It performs beautifully with the Canon Tilt / Shifts... allowing it to be what I wish the D800 had been (a high MP little camera with excellent T/S glass). The A7r actually has the same chip as the D800 (as I understand it) which Sony manufactures. Since it's mirrorless, it has a super short flange distance and you can adapt practically any lens to it, including Leica M glass.

    Anyway, here are some shots from my living room:

    Phase One IQ 260 / Arca Swiss Rm3d / Schneider Apo-Digitar 35mm/f5.6 XL *Processed in C1 Pro


    Sony A7r / Canon 24mm TS-E II *Processed in LightRoom 5


    Canon 5d2 / 24mm TS-E II *Processed in C1 Pro


    Red Epic / Canon 17mm TS-E *Processed in RedCine-X


    Right away I can see the difference in the C1P vs LR processing. C1P always seems to have snappier color to me whereas LR can usually dig out a little more Hilight info. I set the hilight recovery sliders at 30 in C1P and LR for all the still cameras. All three still cameras have comparable sharpness with the IQ back being a clear winner upon pixel peeping (no surprise). I turned off all in-software sharpening and the little cameras have neutral profiles in camera. I don't find the Red that useful for my stills work. It possesses much more shadow noise and much less sharpness than the still cameras but It's fun to see how it blows them away on DR. I think it was really designed to feel like Neg Stock.

    You can download all the RAW files or my processed TIFFs via DropBox and draw your own conclusions: https://www.dropbox.com/sh/coeaopdb1srglbe/jdi7ZiT4IX

    In closing... this was really all about evolving my own workflow and making life a little simpler and well... hell I'm a big gear nerd (but you knew that). Speaking of workflow, the only way I've found to shoot the Sony tethered is to use their Remote Camera Control software and setup LightRoom to auto import the files from a watched folder. Lame, but usable. C1P support is coming, they tell me.

    CB
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    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Another Stupid Camera Test: IQ 260 / A7r / 5d2 / Epic cross posted to LuLa

    Canon still has to this day has over saturated red orange in the reds. Like to see the Nikon in here. My bet when C1 supports the Sony it will look more like your Phase file.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

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    Re: Another Stupid Camera Test: IQ 260 / A7r / 5d2 / Epic cross posted to LuLa

    Hi!
    Chris, since you have the 7R, metabones adapter and Canon lenses, could you comment on the AF speed ? I know your post is about a manual focus lens, but wonder if you have also tested other lenses. This info is very hard to find...
    I'd just like an impression on the AF, like "useless" or "ok" or "super"...

    Thanks and sorry for highjacking the thread...

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    Re: Another Stupid Camera Test: IQ 260 / A7r / 5d2 / Epic cross posted to LuLa

    Hi Chris,
    It seems that Capture One and LR 5.3RC are not getting everything out of the A7R files based on Vincent's comparison shown it this post. It is always fun to test a new camera to get a better feel for how it can be integrated into your shoots. I expect the results of your test represent a worst case and things will only get better when your preferred raw processing software is optimized for A7R images. As it is, the A7R is starting off pretty darn good in my opinion. I just received mine and look forward to doing some testing of my own.

    Mark

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    Re: Another Stupid Camera Test: IQ 260 / A7r / 5d2 / Epic cross posted to LuLa

    Miska, the only AF lens I own is the Canon 17-40. The camera definitely hunts, reminds me of my old Contax G1. Sort of usable.

    Mark, yeah, the detail in that Sony output is impressive, I actually had sharpening turned off for all images.
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    Re: Another Stupid Camera Test: IQ 260 / A7r / 5d2 / Epic cross posted to LuLa

    My take from those images:
    IQ back - gorgeous colors and tones - best looker regardless of resolution.
    A7 - colors are more subdued exept for yellow, which is quite a bit more saturated, probably a difference in processing? I don't like the way the highlights blow out, but given the available DR, you could have shot -1EV and lifted the shadows in post.
    5D2 - I have this camera and yeah it looks like that, very cooked with poor DR, love mine anyways.
    Epic - DR is off the hook, but it also looks "off" or unnatural in some way, the highlights look all grey and blended together. I wonder what the Dragon sensor would turn out with it's extra 3-4 stops of DR.

    Btw, Metabones have written about this themselves, but you won't get any sort of good AF speed from the mkIII adapter. It's merely a bonus feature at this stage and will disappoint if you actually expect to use it as regularly as with a native lens. Ironically, Contax G lenses will focus even faster on the A cameras than they used to with this new adapter that's being developed.

    As always, it's amazing that the A7r is only $2,300, this makes it cheaper then some accessories for MF.

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    Re: Another Stupid Camera Test: IQ 260 / A7r / 5d2 / Epic cross posted to LuLa

    Chris thanks for sharing I would actually love to see how the 24TSE holds up on the IQ260 (i guess only the FPS and Hartblei offer this) in comparison to the 24TSE /A7 combo and ideally 23HR on your Arca

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    Re: Another Stupid Camera Test: IQ 260 / A7r / 5d2 / Epic cross posted to LuLa

    Definite advantage to the IQ260, at least in this test. Better rendering and separation of colors, and more neutral shadows. Better rendering of the tree. Just an all-around superior "presence".

    Will be interesting to see the A7R when it gets more software support and user familiarity, be it C1 or LR. DXO has added the Sony cams to their supported list on their latest release.

    Hopefully, Adobe will support tethered shooting when these cameras are added to ACR/LR, so you don't have to shoot to a hot folder.

    (BTW, LOVE the tree ... just saw one in a second hand shop and almost swung back to get it ... but then thought of the frying pan to the head it would garner me if I bought it without asking the boss).

    - Marc

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    Re: Another Stupid Camera Test: IQ 260 / A7r / 5d2 / Epic cross posted to LuLa

    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Gowin View Post
    Hi Chris,
    It seems that Capture One and LR 5.3RC are not getting everything out of the A7R files based on Vincent's comparison shown it this post. It is always fun to test a new camera to get a better feel for how it can be integrated into your shoots. I expect the results of your test represent a worst case and things will only get better when your preferred raw processing software is optimized for A7R images. As it is, the A7R is starting off pretty darn good in my opinion. I just received mine and look forward to doing some testing of my own.

    Mark
    Also why this lossy raw compression from Sony ??
    D800 raw files av. 79,5Mb
    Leica S2 : 76Mb
    Sony A7r: 37Mb
    ___________________________________
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    Re: Another Stupid Camera Test: IQ 260 / A7r / 5d2 / Epic cross posted to LuLa

    Correct me If I am wrong but I see more Dynamic Range in the Sony sample

    Can you show 100% crop?

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    Re: Another Stupid Camera Test: IQ 260 / A7r / 5d2 / Epic cross posted to LuLa

    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Santoso View Post
    Correct me If I am wrong but I see more Dynamic Range in the Sony sample

    Can you show 100% crop?
    The Highlight and Shadow tools in LR are way better than the ones in C1 7. This is the one area where IMO LR has an important edge.
    It would be telling to see the Phase image processed in LR.

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    Re: Another Stupid Camera Test: IQ 260 / A7r / 5d2 / Epic cross posted to LuLa

    Quote Originally Posted by hcubell View Post
    The Highlight and Shadow tools in LR are way better than the ones in C1 7. This is the one area where IMO LR has an important edge.
    It would be telling to see the Phase image processed in LR.

    Really?? I found this hard to believe. C1 6 to 7 was a big step.

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    Re: Another Stupid Camera Test: IQ 260 / A7r / 5d2 / Epic cross posted to LuLa

    Quote Originally Posted by hcubell View Post
    The Highlight and Shadow tools in LR are way better than the ones in C1 7. This is the one area where IMO LR has an important edge.
    It would be telling to see the Phase image processed in LR.
    Exactly. I was going to play with the IQ image in LR but it really needs the LCC correction and I haven't quite figured out the FlatField Plugin for LR.

    The RAWS are available via DropBox if anyone wants to see what they can get out of the images.

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    Thumbs up Re: Another Stupid Camera Test: IQ 260 / A7r / 5d2 / Epic cross posted to LuLa

    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Santoso View Post
    Correct me If I am wrong but I see more Dynamic Range in the Sony sample

    Can you show 100% crop?
    Well if it's the D800E sensor, it should have the most dynamic range over the others. It's nice to see how good the Epic did and that's before the Dragon update? Nice.

    Although I want the Sony for it's ability to use my Canon TS-E lenses with the quality of my D800E, there are other major advantages to this camera. It will be a killer travel camera with it's small size and the ability to accurately focus my Leica R's through the viewfinder! I'm not sure what excites me more.

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