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Help Needed for Getting in to Medium Format!

kapil Syal

New member
Hi 'Oamkumar'
interesting that you are trying to upgrade from the D800e to MFD
i have a few questions - and since i'm also based in India - i will find your answers very relevant:

1. forget the import problem - who in India is going to give you the dealership support?
even a casual perusal of the posts on this forum will show you that MFD needs a dealer (and close proximity to repair/service centre) - just one example of why MF manufacturers too think this important - the warranty terms include a loaner back) are you willing to live weeks without your MFD while its couriered across to europe, if you need service?

2. I notice from your previous posts that you've done a comparison of - quote " a in studio test with D800e with new phase one IQ250, haselblad h4d-40, leaf aptus 80mp and 5d Mark III. And the lenses were normal lenses" unquote -
do you really think a 40mp MFD will enhance your image quality?
btw - in that test you used a Nikkor 50/1.8D on D800e ... try the test again with a Zeiss, even the 50/2 Makro, if not the Otus

3. my own professional experience shows that the output-printing quality in India is so "variable" (am trying to be politically correct here) that it robs all of the minute differences in colour & tonal gradation that we work so hard to capture

now - instead of that small 40 MP back .. if you were looking at the 80mp backs .. my questions would be different..
 
Hi 'Oamkumar'
interesting that you are trying to upgrade from the D800e to MFD
i have a few questions - and since i'm also based in India - i will find your answers very relevant:

1. forget the import problem - who in India is going to give you the dealership support?
even a casual perusal of the posts on this forum will show you that MFD needs a dealer (and close proximity to repair/service centre) - just one example of why MF manufacturers too think this important - the warranty terms include a loaner back) are you willing to live weeks without your MFD while its couriered across to europe, if you need service?

2. I notice from your previous posts that you've done a comparison of - quote " a in studio test with D800e with new phase one IQ250, haselblad h4d-40, leaf aptus 80mp and 5d Mark III. And the lenses were normal lenses" unquote -
do you really think a 40mp MFD will enhance your image quality?
btw - in that test you used a Nikkor 50/1.8D on D800e ... try the test again with a Zeiss, even the 50/2 Makro, if not the Otus

3. my own professional experience shows that the output-printing quality in India is so "variable" (am trying to be politically correct here) that it robs all of the minute differences in colour & tonal gradation that we work so hard to capture

now - instead of that small 40 MP back .. if you were looking at the 80mp backs .. my questions would be different..
Kapil,

I'm not getting into Nikon D800e vs. MFDB image quality debate here, however I can say when I had tested Nikon D800e vs. IQ160 (which I own), Nikon D800e didn't have color and tonal recipe of Phase One. Again, this thread is not intended for that discussion. Assumption was Omkumar is planning to enter the medium format league.

FYI... my family friend and one of the top of the line fashion photographer in India (https://www.facebook.com/studiodubs) uses both Nikon as well as MFDB. He told me that he rents MFDB in India based on how big the job is. If you wish, have a chat with him. Technical Support by phone should be possible wherever you are in the world.

Yes, physical loaner could be an issue, but you will have Nikon D800e & 50/2 Makro as a backup. :)

Subrata
 

kapil Syal

New member
thanks for your inputs Subrata1965 - India 2014 is a bit different from your memories. why?
welll:
1. 35% duty is cheap insurance to make the manufacturer give us the same "privileges" as the rest of the world
2. most (Hasselblad Nikon Canon et al) have local distributors AND service - AND have absorbed that 35% into their list prices .. they manage to sell us their best at globally competent prices
eg. Nikon D800e - $ equivalent 2825. Sony A7 - $ equivalent 1440
and me, and two friends can tell you dramatically how valuable it was to have an india billing and warranty for the lovely D600 ..


btw - i am one of those technically challenged individuals who find it difficult to rent equipment .. mainly because blind familiaity with the controls/behavior and process of our gear differentiates us professionals from the sunday brigade ..

but thank you for replying
 

Oamkumar

Member
Subrata1965 - Thanks for the offer. I will consider that :)
Thanks for the replies. Actually I am looking for a medium format, and hence not expecting a great image quality upgrade. Here my works do not need 16bit color al least for now. My clients will convert the files to 8bit CMYK and print them as billboards or magazine prints. This is just to impress the clients and most of the advertising agencies emphasize that their photographer works with medium format camera and that that’s the best. So they can bill the client according to that. But sometimes, huge billboards shows a marked difference. I am sure that the 40mp credo cannot deliver much better detail and quality when compared to my D800E and 85mm f1.8G or zeiss otus 55mm. But the color will be much better for sure. However, the shadow details are a plus in D800E. I am not starting a debate here as 800 vs Credo 40. I just want to impress the clients. There are renting options in Chennai. They have IQ180 or Hasselblad 40mp cam available for rent. But some of my clients will not have the budget for a rent and shoot medium format.
I got a good quote from the Phase dealer here. US $ 12,800 for the Credo 40, 80mm LS lens and Phaseone DF+ back with warranty (Slightly used). And he asked me about 56mp Leaf Aptus II 10. Is that a good choice? I think that’s a full frame sensor. What about the corner quality?

Regards,
Oamkumar Thottungal
 

shlomi

Member
16 bit doesn't mean anything - it's just a marketing buzzword.

Leaf 56 MP is not full frame - it is 56mm x 3mm, which is not 4:3 ratio like most MF backs, but a little wider than 35mm DSLR.

I've had this back for a year a liked it.

I've had no problems with the corners.

Note that the 56MP back is old technology so:
- user interface on the touch screen is not very modern or easy to see or operate.
- the colors out of the back are very pretty but sometimes if you shoot strange colors, it will give you a different color than reality.

Both of these problems do not exist with Credo.
 

Oamkumar

Member
Thanks..
One more doubt.. 80mm LS lens. In full frame it will be equal to 50mm in 35mm format, what will be the focal length in this credo 40 back?
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
Hope you realize you walked into Dante's Inferno. Give your wife your credit cards. Trust me your much safer if you can believe that. LOL
 

Oamkumar

Member
Thanks.. That's a nice offer.. But the problem is I'm planning to get only the basic kit first.. Then add more lenses to it later. I can not afford many lenses at a time. To be frank, I am struggling to arrange the money for this kit. Within few months, I will take some more lenses.
Guy - true.. There are a lot of good offers here.. I have to give my card to my wife.. :)
 

Oamkumar

Member
I decided to buy credo 60 and phaseone 645 df+ back, 80mm LS lens and 150mm LS lens. All new. And extension tubes. And I will get wide and 120 macro TS version later. And hope my camera will reach me this week.. Waiting..! Thanks a lot for the help everyone!
My shoots last 10 - 12 hrs and I will be shooting through USB. I would like to know do I have to buy extra batteries for body and back? If yes, how many shots credo battery last.? And df body accepts different battery.. Do I need to buy that too extra?

Thanks and regards
Oamkumar Thottungal
 

kdphotography

Well-known member
Congratulations!

I would definitely get several extra batteries for your MFDB. The Li-ion insert battery for the DF/DF+ lasts an extremely long time. At most you'll need two battery inserts allowing you to charge one while the other is in use. In reality, you won't ever deplete the DF li-ion battery insert during one session. The inexpensive AA battery insert (with Energizer lithium AAs) will work fine as a backup.

ken

p.s. If you shoot tethered, you might want to check out the Surface Pro for working on location
 

steve_cor

Member
I have a Leaf Aptus II rather than the Leaf Credo back. I find the battery lasts for a period of time, rather than a number of shots. For example, if the battery lasts two hours, then you can take as many shots as you like within the two hours. If you just leave it running and shoot zero pictures, it will still die after two hours. The time the battery lasts is also affected by the brightness setting of the screen and how often the screen is in use.

You need a separate battery for the camera body. Capture Integration currently has a sale running on the Ejji batteries and charger. But we found out the Phase One battery doesn't fit in the Ejji charger, and the Ejji battery doesn't fit in the Phase One Charger. Although either one will fit in the camera. The 645DF+ comes with a Phase One Li-ion battery and charger. These batteries are good for 10,000 shots before you need to recharge them. So you might be better off getting one more Phase One battery, even though it costs more than the Ejji battery, so you only need one charger.

Regarding "120 macro TS version." The Schneider Kreuznach 120mm Manual Focus Tilt / Shift Lens is not a macro lens. I haven't tried one, so I couldn't tell you anything about it. I was just pointing out that it's not actually a macro lens. You can just use your extension tubes with it. All the lenses are manual focus with extension tubes anyway.


--Steve.
 
I decided to buy credo 60 and phaseone 645 df+ back, 80mm LS lens and 150mm LS lens. All new. And extension tubes. And I will get wide and 120 macro TS version later. And hope my camera will reach me this week.. Waiting..! Thanks a lot for the help everyone!
My shoots last 10 - 12 hrs and I will be shooting through USB. I would like to know do I have to buy extra batteries for body and back? If yes, how many shots credo battery last.? And df body accepts different battery.. Do I need to buy that too extra?

Thanks and regards
Oamkumar Thottungal
Congratulations Oamkumar! Welcome to the club!!!

I just came back from India, and trying to catch up.
 

Oamkumar

Member
Thanks Ken and Steve.. I will buy 1 extra battery for DF+ and 2 for Leaf. I never used surface pro. Actually I use my 13 " macbook pro for outdoor shoots and 27" iMac latest version for studio shoots. with iMac I can use usb3. FW port is unavailable in this. Adaptor can be used but not sure it can charge the battery inside the back, while shooting tethered.

Oam
 

Ken_R

New member
I decided to buy credo 60 and phaseone 645 df+ back, 80mm LS lens and 150mm LS lens. All new. And extension tubes. And I will get wide and 120 macro TS version later. And hope my camera will reach me this week.. Waiting..! Thanks a lot for the help everyone!
My shoots last 10 - 12 hrs and I will be shooting through USB. I would like to know do I have to buy extra batteries for body and back? If yes, how many shots credo battery last.? And df body accepts different battery.. Do I need to buy that too extra?

Thanks and regards
Oamkumar Thottungal
You will love it. The 60-MP sensor is a significant jump in size and resolution over the Nikon D800E sensor. Much more significant jump than with the 40MP IQ140/Credo 40 sensor. The 80 and 150mm focal lengths are perfect for people work with the large sensor.

:worthless:
 
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