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Thread: HB H5X announced

  1. #1
    Senior Member Swissblad's Avatar
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    HB H5X announced

    On Photorumors….. Hasselblad H5X announcement | Photo Rumors

    Run out and buy….
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    Re: HB H5X announced

    Only if it has something useful like sweep panorama and art filters...
    Will

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    Re: HB H5X announced

    Can you actually buy H4X/H5X without trading in an existing Hasselblad camera these days? Wasn't sure if that bone-headed restriction still remains.
    Remember: adventure before dementia!

    As Oscar Wilde said, "my tastes are simple, I only like the best"

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    Re: HB H5X announced

    Quote Originally Posted by GrahamWelland View Post
    Can you actually buy H4X/H5X without trading in an existing Hasselblad camera these days? Wasn't sure if that bone-headed restriction still remains.
    From the press release:

    This cutting edge camera body, which can be purchased with no trade-in required...
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    Re: HB H5X announced

    Seems as though it will now be possible to use True Focus with film backs as well as digital - very cool!
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    Member pedro39photo's Avatar
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    Re: HB H5X announced

    If the H5X body is a true open system, for any generation or brand of backs, Hasselblad have here a true game changer 645 body in DMF.
    And i think will be a good bold marketing change, because the people with old backs will keep them as backup and make technical revisions on hasselblad, the sales of H5Dx bodys and H lens will go up for phase ones users with old bodys like the mamiya 645AFD I ..II...III...DF...

    Super great news and a bold move from hasselblad, maybe my nikon D810 purchase have to wait...
    Finaly some exciting times again in the DMF !!!

    EDIT:this its great news to all photographers that start selling old backs because of lack of parts, now a photographer that have a old H3D 22MP or 31MP fat pixels closed system maybe don´t need sell the system to go the d810 way...now can spend 5k on a new H5Dx body, 500$ on a back revision and have modern 645AF system with a beautiful CCD 22MP old back, i like this very very much. I saw some photographers selling they "old" H3D complete systems and change to 35mm.
    Last edited by pedro39photo; 9th September 2014 at 10:08.

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    Re: HB H5X announced

    US pricing for the H5x is as follows and orders are being accepted now:

    H-3013700 H5X Camera Body $6,200
    H-3013702 H5X w/ HV90X-II VF $7,800
    H-3013704 H5X w/ HVD-90x VF $7,800

    Please note that the H5x , like the H4x are not compatible with Leaf Aptus Backs. I am only mentioning it since there was a previous comment about using it with older 'FatPixel' backs.

    Lance
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    Re: HB H5X announced

    Quote Originally Posted by lance_schad View Post
    Please note that the H5x , like the H4x are not compatible with Leaf Aptus Backs. I am only mentioning it since there was a previous comment about using it with older 'FatPixel' backs.
    I assume you mean Aptus-II backs? As far as I know my super-old Aptus 75 should work, just as Aptus 75s and Aptus 22, right?

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    Re: HB H5X announced

    Quote Originally Posted by torger View Post
    I assume you mean Aptus-II backs? As far as I know my super-old Aptus 75 should work, just as Aptus 75s and Aptus 22, right?
    No Leaf Backs prior to the Credo are compatible with the H4x/H5x.

    Lance
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    Re: HB H5X announced

    For the H4x, HB says:

    All third party backs operating within the H1/H2/H2F protocol are supported by the H4X.


    Source

    For the H5x, HB says:

    The same compatibility as H1 and H2 cameras.


    Source

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    Re: HB H5X announced

    Very good news. Interestigly, this is now the most advanced medium format camera available for film.

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    Re: HB H5X announced

    Quote Originally Posted by f8orbust View Post
    For the H4x, HB says:

    All third party backs operating within the H1/H2/H2F protocol are supported by the H4X.


    Source

    For the H5x, HB says:

    The same compatibility as H1 and H2 cameras.


    Source
    From original Hasselblad H4x announcement at the bottom of the Q&A page.
    LINK
    *Due to Leaf Aptus S & Aptus II not communicating within the specified protocol the H4X currently does not function with these two digital back models. Our investigations have concluded that this is due to parts of the communication from the digital back not being within specification, causing a fault condition and a lock-up of the camera body and digital back. The H4X platform is more accurate and sensitive and therefore detects the signals from the digital back as outside of specification.

    Lance
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    Re: HB H5X announced

    I like the next paragraph below the one just quoted:

    All technical information has been passed on to Leaf and we are at their disposal to help rectify the problem. At present time we have not had any response from Leaf and therefore are not in a position to say when this will work.

    I guess they're still waiting?

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    Senior Member malmac's Avatar
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    Re: HB H5X announced

    This is really good news - True Focus working with an IQ back is what many of us have been waiting for.

    So I buy a new H5X camera body fantastic - damn I have all these Phase One lenses and not a single H lens to use.

    mmmmm lets hope Phase One will release their new camera body now and then we will have real choice of how to use our MF backs and glass.


    Mal
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    Re: HB H5X announced

    Call me cynical, but the only reason may be that Phase is f i n a l l y coming out with the, years in the making, camera. But, who knows, maybe Hasselblad has at last put someone in charge with a brain. Hasselblad has the best color, the best software, the best camera, maybe not as good as Leica, but very good lenses (certainly the best lineup), the best support in NJ as well as overseas, and the very, very best people in the business. Sadly they have lost some very good people in the mess they have had in the last couple of years. Two years ago, I had very high hopes for Hasselblad and was sorely disappointed. Maybe this news portends a new and positive direction for the company. My optimism is building for Photokina.

    Greg
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    Re: HB H5X announced

    I'm quite sure the Aptus 75 works on H4X (haven't tested it in person though, and don't for sure remember the source). If that's true and if it has stopped working on the H5X something has changed in the protocol. Not a big issue though of course (users interested in H5X probably have recent backs), and as far as I understand it's Leaf's fault not properly implementing the protocol and not caring to fix it.

    I was incorrect prevously, the Aptus 75S should not work, but I think Aptus 75 and Aptus 22 have a chance working... which is only the two oldest out of the many Aptus backs that have been released, so saying Aptus does not work is reasonably correct even if those two backs work :-)
    Last edited by torger; 10th September 2014 at 01:28.

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    Re: HB H5X announced

    Quote Originally Posted by f8orbust View Post
    I like the next paragraph below the one just quoted:

    All technical information has been passed on to Leaf and we are at their disposal to help rectify the problem. At present time we have not had any response from Leaf and therefore are not in a position to say when this will work.

    I guess they're still waiting?
    From a safe source (Yair) we know that this will never work. Leaf don't do fixes for old backs.

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    Member Jay Emm's Avatar
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    Re: HB H5X announced

    So, is the H5X simply an H5D sold as "body only" - or have I misunderstood this?

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    Re: HB H5X announced

    Quote Originally Posted by Jay Emm View Post
    So, is the H5X simply an H5D sold as "body only" - or have I misunderstood this?
    No, with a "normal" H5D body, you can't attach a film back or a third party digital back even if you remove the Hasselblad back.
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    Cool Re: HB H5X announced

    Quote Originally Posted by Jay Emm View Post
    So, is the H5X simply an H5D sold as "body only" - or have I misunderstood this?
    i don't think so, because the film back isn't compatible with H5D ...
    But why they didn't make a film back compatible also... To permit this possibility to H5D owner instead ??

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    Re: HB H5X announced

    Can the H5X be used with the H4D-40 or H3D/H2D digital backs?

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    Re: HB H5X announced

    Quote Originally Posted by Landscapelover View Post
    Can the H5X be used with the H4D-40 or H3D/H2D digital backs?
    I guess so. This from Hasselblad's home page:

    "Although aimed primarily at current H1, H2, H2F and H4X users wishing to upgrade to H5 capabilities, the H5X can naturally act as a backup for H5D users too."


    Last edited by Jorgen Udvang; 10th September 2014 at 02:37.

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    Re: HB H5X announced

    Quote Originally Posted by Jorgen Udvang View Post
    I guess so. This from Hasselblad's home page:

    "Although aimed primarily at current H1, H2, H2F and H4X users wishing to upgrade to H5 capabilities, the H5X can naturally act as a backup for H5D users too."


    Very interesting, so maybe in te future they can sell separately h5d backs...

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    Re: HB H5X announced

    Quote Originally Posted by Landscapelover View Post
    Can the H5X be used with the H4D-40 or H3D/H2D digital backs?
    No. Older Phase backs yes, older Hassy H backs no.
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    Re: HB H5X announced

    Quote Originally Posted by dougpeterson View Post
    No. Older Phase backs yes, older Hassy H backs no.
    That's ironic.

    IMHO, At least venerable H is back on track

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    Re: HB H5X announced

    Quote Originally Posted by dougpeterson View Post
    No. Older Phase backs yes, older Hassy H backs no.
    Why then do Hasselblad publish the photo above?

    Edit:
    Ah... I see. Those are the CF and CFH backs, those that were compatible with H1 and H2. So anything (almost) except the backs from H3D and H4D then.
    Last edited by Jorgen Udvang; 10th September 2014 at 06:50.

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    Re: HB H5X announced

    Quote Originally Posted by Jorgen Udvang View Post
    Why then do Hasselblad publish the photo above?
    Here is the relevant section of the technical specification sheet:
    "Digital Compatibility = All Hasselblad H5D, ixpress, CF and CFH digital backs. 3rd party backs that where compatible with the H1/
    H2 cameras" (page 5, here)

    I'll speak with Hasselblad directly today to confirm.
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    Re: HB H5X announced

    What backs does the datasheet photo actually show?

    P+, Leaf Valeo, IQ, CFH-39, H3DII-39(?), H4 and H5D-60?

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    Smile Re: HB H5X announced

    If the H5Dx its a true open format and can receive the H3D, H3DII H4D backs its a smart and bold move from hasselblad ! and bring exciting again to the DMF.
    They will sell very well to old H3D body users and old phase one 645AFD I and II users. Now all the photographers that have a H5Dx can use a new recent back, and travel with just a "old" 31-39mp H3D or H4D back as a backup.

    Great news, and its time for bold moves in the DMF industry to refresh some ideas. Lets open again the "private club" to a wider users.
    20 years ago any policeman or people on the street know that a 645 mf was a photo camera.
    Now with my H3D in the street i have people asking me..."what its that? cinema camera????"

    Lets democratize, a little...i think all the brands will do well with more competition

    DMF was never a resolution war, its about the format and the prices. even a nikon D800e user will be in love for the viewfinder of a old Mamiya ZD or H1 or H2 if they experiment just one time.
    I love DMF, and its sad to see this amazing tool just in the hands of a small nich of users, i put sometimes my old H3D 22Mp in the hands of some kids starting to enjoy and in love for photography and the never saw or heard about hasselblad or phase one or even medium format...its sad to see that...

    Lets start promote the MF like a different tool, a different way to feel the act of composition, to photograph. Not the 60MP back...Give old MF models to the photo schools and in the future those kids will be using MF.

    Pedro
    Last edited by pedro39photo; 10th September 2014 at 07:38.
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    Senior Member Steve Hendrix's Avatar
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    Re: HB H5X announced

    I was told that the H5X at this time will not support H2D/H3D/H4D digital backs. On the plus side, I also confirmed that True Focus II would work with 3rd party digital backs (can't imagine how or why it wouldn't, but with the recent relationship between Hasselblad and 3rd party, one never knows).


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    Senior Member yaya's Avatar
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    Re: HB H5X announced

    Quote Originally Posted by torger View Post
    I'm quite sure the Aptus 75 works on H4X (haven't tested it in person though, and don't for sure remember the source). If that's true and if it has stopped working on the H5X something has changed in the protocol. Not a big issue though of course (users interested in H5X probably have recent backs), and as far as I understand it's Leaf's fault not properly implementing the protocol and not caring to fix it.

    I was incorrect prevously, the Aptus 75S should not work, but I think Aptus 75 and Aptus 22 have a chance working... which is only the two oldest out of the many Aptus backs that have been released, so saying Aptus does not work is reasonably correct even if those two backs work :-)
    FWIW; Aptus 17, 22, 65 and 75 work OK on H4X. S and II models do not work on it.

    Best

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    Re: HB H5X announced

    That seems to make sense Steve. The Hasselblad cameras with the designation "D" (H2D, H3D, H3D-II, H4D), were factory matched back/body as a single unit (the so called "closed system").

    The only possible exception to that may be the "D" bodies that could accept a film back (H2D and H3D). The H3D-II and H4 no longer could take a film back.

    It seems that the H5X improves on the H4X in that it can also take a current H5 back. That begs the question of how you get a stand alone H5 back? Or, will they bundle a kit (H5X+H5 digital magazine). Perhaps it is just meant to be a possible back-up body for current H5 users?

    - Marc

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    Re: HB H5X announced

    Quote Originally Posted by fotografz View Post
    Perhaps it is just meant to be a possible back-up body for current H5 users?

    - Marc
    That is exactly what they say on their website.

    Could H2D and H3D take film backs? I thought the H2F was the last model before the H4X to do that.

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    Re: HB H5X announced

    Surely they could just unlock legacy D series backs to use with the body via firmware? It's not like the backs are physically different, right?
    Last edited by tjv; 11th September 2014 at 02:45. Reason: Oops, I accidentally wrote "D series bodies" rather than "D series backs"...

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    Re: HB H5X announced

    Quote Originally Posted by Jorgen Udvang View Post
    That is exactly what they say on their website.

    Could H2D and H3D take film backs? I thought the H2F was the last model before the H4X to do that.
    Yes, the H2D and H3D could take film backs. When they closed the system with the H3D-II, it was followed by the H2F (F for film). The H2F could also be used with CF and CFH backs. I used a H2F with a CF/39 MS back as well as H film backs.

    - Marc

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    Re: HB H5X announced

    Quote Originally Posted by fotografz View Post
    Yes, the H2D and H3D could take film backs. When they closed the system with the H3D-II, it was followed by the H2F (F for film). The H2F could also be used with CF and CFH backs. I used a H2F with a CF/39 MS back as well as H film backs.

    - Marc
    Ah... now I remember. The H2F actually came after the H3D.

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    Re: HB H5X announced

    Quote Originally Posted by tjv View Post
    Surely they could just unlock legacy D series backs to use with the body via firmware? It's not like the backs are physically different, right?
    This was always the subject of controversy. After the H1/H2 series of cameras, the HD cameras were sold as a bundle … usually complete with back, finder, and 80mm lens. After the CF and CFH backs were discontinued, there were no more stand-alone Hasselblad backs for the H camera, just the CFV for the V cameras.

    Supposedly, the HD cameras were all matched and fine tuned at the factory. This was years ago when Hasselblad was encorporating a lot of new data exchange between the modular components … which led to their automatic fine focus feature to mitigated focus shift, and DAC corrections … and eventually True Focus Automatic Position Lock (APL)

    As usual, they did a poor job of communicating that decision and why it was necessary. I sort of understood it all because I recall all the shimming and adjustments that sometimes was needed to get miss-matched MFD components all working together precisely back in those days. For example, it took a trip to Kodak to get my ProBack 645C to work precisely on my Contax 645, where they micro-adjusted the sensor positioning.

    I think a few Hasselblad photographers were able to send in their existing HD backs to get another H body tuned to it, but that was the rare exception.

    So, while it seems possible that legacy backs could be unlocked, I think it is highly unlikely.

    - Marc

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    Senior Member Steve Hendrix's Avatar
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    Re: HB H5X announced

    Quote Originally Posted by fotografz View Post
    This was always the subject of controversy. After the H1/H2 series of cameras, the HD cameras were sold as a bundle … usually complete with back, finder, and 80mm lens. After the CF and CFH backs were discontinued, there were no more stand-alone Hasselblad backs for the H camera, just the CFV for the V cameras.

    Supposedly, the HD cameras were all matched and fine tuned at the factory. This was years ago when Hasselblad was encorporating a lot of new data exchange between the modular components … which led to their automatic fine focus feature to mitigated focus shift, and DAC corrections … and eventually True Focus Automatic Position Lock (APL)

    As usual, they did a poor job of communicating that decision and why it was necessary. I sort of understood it all because I recall all the shimming and adjustments that sometimes was needed to get miss-matched MFD components all working together precisely back in those days. For example, it took a trip to Kodak to get my ProBack 645C to work precisely on my Contax 645, where they micro-adjusted the sensor positioning.

    I think a few Hasselblad photographers were able to send in their existing HD backs to get another H body tuned to it, but that was the rare exception.

    So, while it seems possible that legacy backs could be unlocked, I think it is highly unlikely.

    - Marc

    Spare bodies for H2D/3D/3D-II were available for $3,250 at least from 2008 for anyone who sent their existing unit in for co-calibration.


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    Re: HB H5X announced

    So as a loyal HB customer that upgraded often I have this fairly new H4D60 with which I cannot use the H5X but the oldest P21 can be used with it???? I certainly hope HB does not let their loyal customer down and provide some sort of solution for this.....

    Great addition otherwise BTW but we have been here before....

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    Re: HB H5X announced

    Yes, seems a bit strange that their own new camera isn't backwards comparable with their own backs. Surely they could offer a factory calibration if that's the issue?

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    Re: HB H5X announced

    A software update is probably forthcoming that will allow the H3X and H4X cameras to be compatible as well. At least that is being hinted on another forum.

    Greg
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    Re: HB H5X announced

    Well, I guess Hasselblad's Photokina marketing slogan is "back to the future", whatever that means.

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    Re: HB H5X announced

    It would be just like Hasselblad to announce a new product just right before Phase can release their own new product---sorta like an attempt to steal their thunder imo. And they just raised the ante a bit with the H5X.

    All I have to say is that Phase One better be releasing an all new super camera body at Photokina, and it better be a home run.

    ken

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    Re: HB H5X announced

    Quote Originally Posted by tjv View Post
    Well, I guess Hasselblad's Photokina marketing slogan is "back to the future", whatever that means.
    Hopefully, it means they extracted their head out of their a$$, and are returning to what made them a viable MFD choice in the past.

    IMO, their future was always in providing MFD solutions, not grossly over-priced trashy looking make-overs of quickly obsolete 35mm tech that had little to do with real photography.

    With any luck there is enough of the brain trust left to make even more of what gear like the H5X can bring to existing or potential customers … firmware that allows full use of the H4 backs would be a good start … or at least a 2nd body match service like Steve Hendrix mentioned above.

    Speaking of marketing … IMHO Hassey needs to stop over-reaching with certain things they say like they did in past, and do a better job of communicating what they do have: multiple viewfinders, True Color, True Focus APL-II, auto micro-adjust for focus shift, their pioneering efforts in DAC, unified ergonomics, optical make-overs of many lenses like the spectacular 50-II with its' matched CU adapter, etc.

    The real challenge for Hasselblad in future will be to convert their cameras to dual shutter bodies … then everyone with an investment in lenses will suddenly have the best of both worlds … I can't tell you how valuable this is as I've learned with my S2P and all CS Leica lenses.

    My best to Hasselblad in future.

    - Marc
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    Re: HB H5X announced

    I'm hoping that the "back to the future" approach is a return to the older CF type backs with changeable adaptors, so users can mix and match bodies how they please. That in combination with the H5X would be great news for all MFD enthusiasts, especially if they can price their backs at more competitive prices (dreams are free).

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