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Thread: IQ180: Contax 645 vs Hasselblad H5X

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    IQ180: Contax 645 vs Hasselblad H5X

    I'm about to upgrade my Phase One p25+ to an IQ180. I've been using my P25+ with a Contax 645 system that I love. I don't particularly like the Phase One DF+ so I'm not really interested in that system beyond the fact that the Schneider leaf shutter lenses are appealing to me. The new Hasselblad H5X does intrigue me and I could be talked into switching away from the Contax for the H5X.

    My main concern with the Contax system is the age of the lenses. I know the lenses are considered to be great and I've loved them on my P25+, but now that I'd be jumping up to 80MP, I'm wondering if they can handle it.

    And how would they compare to their comparable Hasselblad lenses?

    My Contax lenses are the 80mm f2 (used 80% of the time), the 120mm f4 Makro (which is amazing but only used 10% of the time, and the 45mm F2.8 (use 10% of the time).

    I shoot portraits. 75% Location, 25% Studio.

    Thoughts?

    Thanks!

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    Re: IQ180: Contax 645 vs Hasselblad H5X

    To be honest the contax 645 lenses would show some age when getting resolved by the IQ180. 1/125s sync would also be a limitation to shoot locations rather than studios.

    With the H4X/H5X route you also have compromises - yes you gain APL True Focus but only the HCD lenses are ideal in resolution, but again the HCD lenses are for crop sensors and the corners would be a bit disappointing for an IQ180. You also only sync up to 1/800s.

    The 645DF+ route is perhaps with least compromise as it can sync up to 1/1600s, besides the fact that the body is ancient.

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    Re: IQ180: Contax 645 vs Hasselblad H5X

    The D series Hasselblad lenses are indeed designed from 1.1x crop. These lenses include the 24mm, 28mm and the 35-90mm zoom. With the exception of the 35mm – which has a reputation as being the weakest link in the H lineup, all the other lenses are certainly up to task. I don't know what Void is talking about, as the H lens lineup is excellent (although I fail to understand why they chose to design the D series lenses with reduced image circles...)
    I have no experience with the Contax, sorry.

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    Re: IQ180: Contax 645 vs Hasselblad H5X

    Jerome posted this excellent test series on LuLa.
    “Field” test of Hasselblad H wide-angle lenses.
    I'd encourage him to restart the thread here, as I think it'd be a great discussion point within this more collegial community.

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    Re: IQ180: Contax 645 vs Hasselblad H5X

    I've shot with both camera systems.

    In fact, I moved from the Contax 645 to the H system for better AF and an ongoing supported system ... eventually ending up with a H4D/60.

    I also do not understand what Voidshatter is talking about ... seems uninformed.

    For what you do, there is no need for any HCD lenses ... the HC lenses will cover it all.

    The HC-50/3.5 II is arguably one of the best Hasselblad H lenses now available. I used it for group shots and "environmental" type portraits.

    IMO, for portrait work skip the HC-80mm, the HC-100/2.2 is the one for people/portrait work ... lovely look and feel. The HC-150/3.2N (N stands for the later "New" version) was tweaked by Hasselblad to stand up to the 60 back+200MS. The unheralded sleeper in the H lens system is the HC-210/4 for portraits. Add the 13mm extender for tight head shots.

    - Marc

    P.S., the Hasselblad True Focus APL would be worth the move, even if the lenses were equal. Amazing feature especially when shooting people.

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    Re: IQ180: Contax 645 vs Hasselblad H5X

    Quote Originally Posted by tjv View Post
    Jerome posted this excellent test series on LuLa.
    “Field” test of Hasselblad H wide-angle lenses.
    I'd encourage him to restart the thread here, as I think it'd be a great discussion point within this more collegial community.
    The file limitations are such that I cannot post the images of that test on this forum.

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    Re: IQ180: Contax 645 vs Hasselblad H5X

    I am not sure you need to worry about your lenses. Why not try an IQ180 on your camera and find out. Surely, your dealer can lend you one.

    I guess the only reason for switching to a Hasselblad system would be more of insurance. The Contax 645 is no longer in production and replacement is tough. But if you love your Contax, why not use it?

    BTW, does anyone know how difficult it is to change a back mount? Is it possible?
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    Re: IQ180: Contax 645 vs Hasselblad H5X

    Quote Originally Posted by tjv View Post
    although I fail to understand why they chose to design the D series lenses with reduced image circles...
    Until recently MFD sensor size has been a moving target...

    What I've heard is that Hasselblad thought that the 49x37mm sensor size would be a long-term size and they designed towards that size. There are advantages with not making the image circle larger than you need. Unfortunately that size died with Kodak, and they did not choose to pick up Dalsa's 48x36mm size (not sure if there will be more of that size either...).

    The new standard is 44x33mm and 54x41mm. I've heard that they tried to convince Sony to make a ~49x37mm size of them but that it could not be done (the story does not say if it was for business reasons or technical reasons).

    I hope for a return of that size as it fits my tech cam lens range so well, but I don't think it will happen.

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    Re: IQ180: Contax 645 vs Hasselblad H5X

    Quote Originally Posted by Shashin View Post
    ...
    BTW, does anyone know how difficult it is to change a back mount? Is it possible?
    My understanding, based on too much time spent on GetDPI, not actual experience, is that with the better Phase One warranty, one 'free' mount change is included, but otherwise I think that a mount change is said to be about $3,000.

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    Re: IQ180: Contax 645 vs Hasselblad H5X

    Quote Originally Posted by Arjuna View Post
    I think that a mount change is said to be about $3,000.
    I understand that with Phase One a mount change isn't a mount change. The back is exchanged for a same spec. back with the new mount required. As there are subtle, and some report more than subtle, differences between examples of the "same" back this may be an issue (both ways).

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    Re: IQ180: Contax 645 vs Hasselblad H5X

    Quote Originally Posted by torger View Post
    Until recently MFD sensor size has been a moving target...

    What I've heard is that Hasselblad thought that the 49x37mm sensor size would be a long-term size and they designed towards that size. There are advantages with not making the image circle larger than you need. Unfortunately that size died with Kodak, and they did not choose to pick up Dalsa's 48x36mm size (not sure if there will be more of that size either...).

    The new standard is 44x33mm and 54x41mm. I've heard that they tried to convince Sony to make a ~49x37mm size of them but that it could not be done (the story does not say if it was for business reasons or technical reasons).

    I hope for a return of that size as it fits my tech cam lens range so well, but I don't think it will happen.
    As Kodak died I don't think you can get anything better than the P45+ in the short term. The larger Dalsa sensors are plagued by tiling issues and low SNR, while the smaller Sony sensors are not tech-cam friendly.

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    Re: IQ180: Contax 645 vs Hasselblad H5X

    IF you do not need to use the HCD lenses and would like to get more lenses than the expensive body.. I'd get a H2 (around $1500ish on ebay or less) and some nice lenses.

    The HC 120 f4 macro is incredible.. same with all the other lenses in the lineup. Despite people's complaints with the 50-110 and the 35 as being the weakest lens.. both are amazing performers and have shot some of my personal best images.. It's all apples and oranges.

    I suggest trying the body out before you try it. To me personally I like how it feels vs the other options.
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    Re: IQ180: Contax 645 vs Hasselblad H5X

    Quote Originally Posted by voidshatter View Post
    As Kodak died I don't think you can get anything better than the P45+ in the short term. The larger Dalsa sensors are plagued by tiling issues and low SNR, while the smaller Sony sensors are not tech-cam friendly.
    Kodak died, but the KAF-50100 is still available:
    KAF-50100: Full Frame CCD, Image Sensor, 50.1 MP

    (it is the CCD in the 50 mpix backs from Hasselblad, 1600$ a piece).

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    Re: IQ180: Contax 645 vs Hasselblad H5X

    Quote Originally Posted by Zerimar View Post
    The HC 120 f4 macro is incredible..
    The HC-120 is very good, but the HC-120 II is even better. The longitudinal chromatic aberration is better controlled. I posted a short macro comparison here:
    Macro comparison between HC 120 and HC 120-II

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    Re: IQ180: Contax 645 vs Hasselblad H5X

    Quote Originally Posted by 1957Goldtop View Post
    I'm about to upgrade my Phase One p25+ to an IQ180. I've been using my P25+ with a Contax 645 system that I love. I don't particularly like the Phase One DF+ so I'm not really interested in that system beyond the fact that the Schneider leaf shutter lenses are appealing to me. The new Hasselblad H5X does intrigue me and I could be talked into switching away from the Contax for the H5X.

    My main concern with the Contax system is the age of the lenses. I know the lenses are considered to be great and I've loved them on my P25+, but now that I'd be jumping up to 80MP, I'm wondering if they can handle it.

    And how would they compare to their comparable Hasselblad lenses?

    My Contax lenses are the 80mm f2 (used 80% of the time), the 120mm f4 Makro (which is amazing but only used 10% of the time, and the 45mm F2.8 (use 10% of the time).

    I shoot portraits. 75% Location, 25% Studio.

    Thoughts?

    Thanks!

    I really believe the lenses will hold up and most will be a close match to the Hasselblad H lenses. At least that's what we've see in some of the limited head to head testing we've done. Your bigger questions should probably be targeted more toward the importance of flash sync speed, and platform sustainability related to continued digital back development, as well as parts for Contax repairs.


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    Digital Cam: • Phase One | Leaf | Leica | Sinar • Authorized Reseller
    TechCam: • Alpa | Cambo | Arca Swiss | Sinar • Authorized Reseller

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    Re: IQ180: Contax 645 vs Hasselblad H5X

    Quote Originally Posted by jerome_m View Post
    Kodak died, but the KAF-50100 is still available:
    KAF-50100: Full Frame CCD, Image Sensor, 50.1 MP

    (it is the CCD in the 50 mpix backs from Hasselblad, 1600$ a piece).
    Yep, unfortunately Hassy has decided to discontinue all backs with that sensor, they're selling off the remaining H5D-50s now. Anyway, it's all bit off topic (sorry, I started it!) I just mentioned the sensor as to why some Hassy lenses are designed for 49x37mm size

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    Re: IQ180: Contax 645 vs Hasselblad H5X

    Quote Originally Posted by torger View Post
    Yep, unfortunately Hassy has decided to discontinue all backs with that sensor, they're selling off the remaining H5D-50s now.

    How do you know that? The H5D-50 is still listed as current on their web site.

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    Re: IQ180: Contax 645 vs Hasselblad H5X

    Quote Originally Posted by jerome_m View Post
    The HC-120 is very good, but the HC-120 II is even better. The longitudinal chromatic aberration is better controlled. I posted a short macro comparison here:
    Macro comparison between HC 120 and HC 120-II
    I am sure the V2 is even better.. I snagged my V1 for only $1500 with 691 shots on it, so it will have to do for my needs.. it's quite a lovely lens for portraits and beauty work.
    Rick Rose
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    Re: IQ180: Contax 645 vs Hasselblad H5X

    Quote Originally Posted by jerome_m View Post
    How do you know that? The H5D-50 is still listed as current on their web site.
    Jerome,see this article.. H5D-50 CCD Pricing Promotion - Hasselblad Bron News

    Rob

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    Re: IQ180: Contax 645 vs Hasselblad H5X

    Quote Originally Posted by RVB View Post

    And we also have a CI Certified H5D-50 in our pre-owned inventory (with the same 1 year warranty as new).

    https://captureintegration.com/produ...selblad-mount/


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