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Thread: IQ3 Live View

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    Member Paul David's Avatar
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    IQ3 Live View

    I'm using my IQ180 primarily with the Alpa TC because it is much lighter weight than an SLR body. As slick as tethering with a Surface Pro is, it's not practical when hiking and size and weight are important. As I shoot mostly with wides, a smaller sensor CMOS isn't an option either.

    While the "live view" on the IQ180 is workable, the need for ND filters is a pain. So I'd like to know if the IQ380 behaves the same as the IQ180 in the need for ND filters.

    Thanks.

    Paul

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    Re: IQ3 Live View

    Phase One made a point in the announcement of the 380 to mention that the Live View was improved over previous generations of CCD backs. 1fps to 3fps adjustment if I recall correctly. They mentioned "in the right light" when talking about this so I am also curious if a vario ND is needed in outdoor conditions. And if the blooming issues have been resolved.

    Paul

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    Senior Member kdphotography's Avatar
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    Re: IQ3 Live View

    I'll place bets you'll still need the vario ND. But the xume filter attachment system makes it a snap.

    ken

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    Re: IQ3 Live View

    I'm assuming an ND filter will still need to be used. The FPS rating is for the smoothness of how the live view is transmitted. The need of an ND filter is due to the sensitivity of CCD technology, I don't think anything can be done about that.

    But then again, you know what happens when you assume.

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    Senior Member Steve Hendrix's Avatar
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    Re: IQ3 Live View

    That Phase One themselves had the presence to mention "in the right light" on the marketing material, I think is your hint that in terms of improvements, the refresh rate is improved (and may be the only improvement). But I could be wrong - until we get it in our hands, I would simply recommend keeping expectations appropriate.


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    Member Paul David's Avatar
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    Re: IQ3 Live View

    Thanks, all...

    I was hoping that one of the dealers already had their hands on one and would have seen the live view. I personally see little advantage of upgrading from the IQ180, other than the long exposure, if the live view isn't improved. The main advantage for me of MF backs over the high pixel FF is the increased dynamic range of MF. As the pixel gap is closing, and the cost of upgrading P1 is approaching that of a complete FF system with body and lenses. I hope PhaseOne comes out with CMOS sensor the size of an IQ180 soon!

    Paul

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    Re: IQ3 Live View

    I too was hoping to see a full frame CMOS 50 to 80MP but it seems that may be as far out as 2017.

    A bit longer than I had hoped.

    Pail

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    Re: IQ3 Live View

    My bet is that a 40x54 CMOS sensor in a P1 camera will be 2016 and will be by Dalsa, not Sony

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    Re: IQ3 Live View

    I really hope not. I would prefer a 14 stop sensor by Sony. Or perhaps even 15 stops. With dalsa I fear we are more towards canon level when it come to dynamic range.

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    Workshop Member Wayne Fox's Avatar
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    Re: IQ3 Live View

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul David View Post
    Thanks, all...
    I personally see little advantage of upgrading from the IQ180, other than the long exposure, if the live view isn't improved.
    Paul
    I'm pretty comfortable with LiveView and a faster refresh rate will definitely help. While I skipped the 180-280 upgrade, the long exposure time to me is a big deal. I hate having to use my Sony whenever I want to do a long exposure at the shore which is frequent. I"ve gotten good use out the the 180,which is longest I've ever owned a digital back. I think I"m gonna make the leap ...

    ... plunging further into the inferno.
    wayne
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    Re: IQ3 Live View

    I wonder what the trade in on a 180 (or a 160) will be, to upgrade to a 380.

    I've been hugging the 160 for a while now, but the 380 with long exposure, and the upgrade in MP does look attractive.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Ken,

    How does Xume work with things like he HR32 with its 90mm ring ? Any good solution for doing the quick ND on this ?

    Note: I use Lee filters on the 32HR fine via the push on adapter. But a VariND doesn't fit in that very well at all.

    Regards

    Mark

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    Senior Member kdphotography's Avatar
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    Re: IQ3 Live View

    I think you're SOL on lenses with large filter rings in regards to the xume filter holder system. AFAIK, 82mm is the largest magnetic ring that the Xume system has....

    ken

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    Re: IQ3 Live View

    49mm is also the smallest size for Xume which means it won't fit any of the smaller Schneider Digitar's (40.5mm) without a ring adapter. I also have the Lee system but not the 100 but rather the Seven5 which is perfect for all but the very largest Rody's which I don't own.

    Victor

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    Re: IQ3 Live View

    Quote Originally Posted by Wayne Fox View Post
    I'm pretty comfortable with LiveView and a faster refresh rate will definitely help. While I skipped the 180-280 upgrade, the long exposure time to me is a big deal. I hate having to use my Sony whenever I want to do a long exposure at the shore which is frequent. I"ve gotten good use out the the 180,which is longest I've ever owned a digital back. I think I"m gonna make the leap ...

    ... plunging further into the inferno.
    You may want to look into keeping your 180 and also purchasing a Credo 50. I have both and can't say enough about the Credo. The files are phenomenal and live view is a dream..... plus all the long exposure you could ever want. When the full frame back finally comes out I'll trade in both backs. I am convinced I will save money in the long run. Don't let the crop factor influence you..... its no big deal.

    Victor

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    Re: IQ3 Live View

    Just another opinion on the crop factor. (like out west) then the crop actually may work for you. I would for sure test it out with your glass.

    The crop, was a huge deal breaker for me. Number 1 reason I did not go with a 150. The difference between 1:0 and 1:3 is about 12 full backward steps. Totally surprised me as I figured it would be max 6 feet. I tested with with 35XL, 28 HR and 40 HR-W. Many times I was not able to frame the shot where I wanted it.

    I also felt that shifting was limited to about 12mm (and that is max due to excessive color cast) and 10mm at times dues to excessive color cast in the sky. But Phase did tell me, "we don't recommend the 50MP back for movements".

    But back to Live View. On the DF body, and all my lenses, Live View worked well and as expected. It was easy to obtain a good focus off the LCD at 100% view. However with the Arca rm3di, I found that I could not really the image to just pop into focus as it did with the DF or how it does with a 35mm camera. The Arca has such a fine focus adjustment you can easily get fooled (on distance subjects) and be off just a tad. I found I was using the LCD too much for focus and using up the battery pretty quickly. I did love the ability to frame a subject with Live View and did not realize just how time I had been using before with the Acra viewfinder or hit and miss.

    Paul

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    Re: IQ3 Live View

    If I had to only live with one back then it would be the Credo 50. The benefits, for me, way outweigh any Cons. My latest photo trip to the Dolomites had me shooting with my Credo 99% of the time. My 150 turns into a 180, my 100 turns into a 120+...... no big deal for me, in fact a benefit many of the times. I may actually have to invest in the new Schneider 180 to match the reach I had with the 150. Horses for courses but I think all of this crop factor doom talk is way overplayed. In the end I will be ahead of the game money wise and in the mean time I have my pick of either back.

    Victor

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    Re: IQ3 Live View

    I agree Horses for Courses, I fully disagree it's overplayed. If you need telephoto, it's an asset, as it's always been. If you need wides, i.e. I have invested heavily in MF wides, 28mm, 35mm, 40mm etc. I need them as wides, not 30% less of the view able area.

    The crop is something that everyone needs to work with for themselves to see if it will be an asset or problem. For me it was fully a problem.

    What would be great if and when a full frame CMOS happens, would be the ability to go to a cropped format, just like Nikon, Sony and now Canon offer on their full frame DSLR's. So when you need the 1.5 crop (on a DSLR to APS-C) you can select it.

    As most of my work is close in and needs wides, I felt I was going to pay a pretty high price for 30% less image and it became pretty clear once I used the back side by side with my 260. But there are also times, where I would like to have the crop for if I was in Yosemite or Colorado, I am sure the crop would be an asset.

    It's too bad that the only solution is one way or the other, or own 2 backs, which is not a viable alternative for me at the current cost basis of a MF back.

    Paul

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    Re: IQ3 Live View

    You don't need two backs..... the only lens, from my perspective, that would be worrisome would be your widest. All of the other's can be substituted by the next widest focal length. Even your 28 could be fully utilized by pivoting 5 degrees left and right - stitch - and you're there.....and then some. That's what I do when I really want to utilize my 35XL at its ff focal length. When the full frame CMOS finally realizes itself it could end up being a lens buster. I don't shift all that much but I do require 10mm shift for 2X1's with my 60, 100 and 150. If I couldn't even do that without cast issues then I would have to really think about just staying where I am until the dust settles.

    Victor

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