Site Sponsors
Results 1 to 37 of 37

Thread: Hasselblad H5D 50c WiFi vs. Phase One XF/IQ350

  1. #1
    Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Location
    Santa Fe, NM
    Posts
    21
    Post Thanks / Like

    Hasselblad H5D 50c WiFi vs. Phase One XF/IQ350

    Just thought I would post this here - this is a review I posted just last week comparing the Hasselblad H5D 50c WiFi Phase One XF/IQ350

    The Hasselblad H5D 50C WiFi vs. The Phase One XF IQ350 » Michael Clark Photography

    There is a thread that was started on this review over on Lu-La as well.

    Also, here is a review of the H5D 50c WiFi that I posted a few weeks ago:

    Equipment Review: The Hasselblad H5D 50c WiFi » Michael Clark Photography

    Cheers, Michael

    Michael Clark Photography - Adventure Sports Photographer Editorial Advertising Photography
    Thanks 1 Member(s) thanked for this post

  2. #2
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    North Sweden
    Posts
    1,403
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Hasselblad H5D 50c WiFi vs. Phase One XF/IQ350

    Hi

    You got 7 images out of 200 sharp with the XF?! Ha! Had you set the lens up with the focus trimming? I have an XF and use it every day, there is no way I could earn a living with a camera that focussed that poorly, I don't expect it to focus like a D5/1DX but it's pretty quick and I honestly have minimal focussing issues, mainly down to me still learning the camera.

    Mat

  3. #3
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    North Sweden
    Posts
    1,403
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Hasselblad H5D 50c WiFi vs. Phase One XF/IQ350

    Actually, some more comments, I have no wish to be rude at all but I honesty don't see the point of writing a review when you don't actually spend some time with a camera, I don't understand it!

    "With the H5D, you can change settings without moving your eye away from the viewfinder. With the XF, unless you have certain functions set up with a custom button this is difficult if not impossible to do. Need the mirror up? With the H5D you dont have to take your eye away from the viewfinder. Need to do that on the XF, you have to very precisely touch the top LCD and youll have to look at it to do so."

    An hour with a camera, setting it up how you want it is key to using it properly, I have focus on the rear button, mirror up on the front button down by the grip, ISO is rear dial, Aperture on the right rear dial and shutter speed on the front dial, you can operate everything you would need without moving your eye from the viewfinder, this is a very basic setup.

    The H5Dc is obviously the right camera for you, excellent but if you're going to write about something, isn't it better to do it from knowledge?

    Like I said, I don't wish to be rude but you had access to some great kit and you've really not done it justice in my opinion.

    Mat

  4. #4
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    598
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Hasselblad H5D 50c WiFi vs. Phase One XF/IQ350

    Thank you for the review. It was informative and well written.

  5. #5
    Super Duper
    Senior Member
    Bill Caulfeild-Browne's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Bruce Peninsula, Canada
    Posts
    2,535
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    184

    Re: Hasselblad H5D 50c WiFi vs. Phase One XF/IQ350

    Thank you for your comments, Mat. I find the XF autofocus extremely accurate. I did have to apply focus trim to all my lenses; interestingly they all needed about -150 points. I can shoot with autofocus, take another shot focussing with live view and not be able to tell the difference between the two files.

    I have shot over 6,000 frames with the XF and except for a cold weather problem that was corrected in an early firmware update, I have had no issues. None. Not even a hint of one.

    Like all complex machinery, one needs to spend at least a few days of real shooting to comprehend the XF properly, and to adjust the UI to one's own preferences. I don't feel a comparison based on less use than that is very useful. Having said, that I have used the Hassy quite briefly and think very highly of it.
    Bill CB

    www.billcaulfeild-browne.ca
    Likes 1 Member(s) liked this post

  6. #6
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    N.S. Canada
    Posts
    2,010
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Hasselblad H5D 50c WiFi vs. Phase One XF/IQ350

    Nicely done Michael, thank you.
    Likes 1 Member(s) liked this post

  7. #7
    Member modator's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Location
    Northern Italy
    Posts
    126
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    32

    Cool Re: Hasselblad H5D 50c WiFi vs. Phase One XF/IQ350

    Hy Michael,

    Only 7 out of 200 ? seems like there is some mis calibration / alignment in the XF copy tested, the better ISO performance of the H5D-50c lie in it's CMOS that is a little bit different from the Phase, it has more blind pixel mask, to get a more precise noise bias, then the software denoise made by Phocus is a little improved, also the CFA is slight different... result: the H use a SONY CMOS it's 50mpixel but it's different from the one used by Phase in many aspects.

    Best regards, Domenico.

  8. #8
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Posts
    1,588
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Hasselblad H5D 50c WiFi vs. Phase One XF/IQ350

    Quote Originally Posted by modator View Post
    Hy Michael,

    Only 7 out of 200 ? seems like there is some mis calibration / alignment in the XF copy tested, the better ISO performance of the H5D-50c lie in it's CMOS that is a little bit different from the Phase, it has more blind pixel mask, to get a more precise noise bias, then the software denoise made by Phocus is a little improved, also the CFA is slight different... result: the H use a SONY CMOS it's 50mpixel but it's different from the one used by Phase in many aspects.

    Best regards, Domenico.
    That's interesting information, how do you know this is the case? If true and I'm not saying I doubt what you've said then I wonder if it has any effect on how the 50c backs perform on a technical camera with movements?

  9. #9
    Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Location
    Santa Fe, NM
    Posts
    21
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Hasselblad H5D 50c WiFi vs. Phase One XF/IQ350

    Mat -

    I don't know about focus trimming. What is that? Is it a setting in the IQ350 back or on the XF? The rep I worked with never said anything about that. We weren't shooting tethered the whole day so we couldn't check focus on a laptop as we were shooting. I tried out a camera that the rep had so I would have imagined that they would dial in the camera before letting me shoot with it. If not then that could have helped.

    Also, I did a lot of focus and recomposing during my test of the XF and that seemed to make matters worse. All I have reported is what I experienced.

    I would have loved to have four or five days with a test Phase One XF camera to really run it through it's paces but Phase One doesn't seem to offer that unless you pay $1500/day to rent it - or at least that is what I have found or was offered.

    By comparison, Hasselblad sent me a camera with two lenses to test out for five days for free and even paid shipping both ways. If Phase One would have done that I would have taken them up on it. Especially since I had to drive to another state, pay for hotel rooms and expenses, and go out of my way just to test the XF.

    As I state in the comparison, I didn't have as much time with the XF as I would have wanted. But straight out of the box the Hasselblad focused just fine. Over on the Luminous-Landscape forum there are a bunch of folks talking about how bad the XF AF is so it wasn't just me. I have talked with several Phase One shooters who have had the same experiences I had while testing it. Seems like there are quite varied experiences on that front.

    Cheers, Michael

    Quote Originally Posted by mjr View Post
    Hi

    You got 7 images out of 200 sharp with the XF?! Ha! Had you set the lens up with the focus trimming? I have an XF and use it every day, there is no way I could earn a living with a camera that focussed that poorly, I don't expect it to focus like a D5/1DX but it's pretty quick and I honestly have minimal focussing issues, mainly down to me still learning the camera.

    Mat

  10. #10
    Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Location
    Santa Fe, NM
    Posts
    21
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Hasselblad H5D 50c WiFi vs. Phase One XF/IQ350

    Domenico -

    There is definitely a difference at high ISOs. Interesting to read your info there. Hasselblad has done some tweaking on the chip.

    And I talked with several Phase One users to confirm my findings on the High ISOs samples. They all said on the IQ350 they would only go up to ISO 1600 or so as that is where the noise was beyond their comfort zone - and these were working pros.

    Cheers, Michael

    Quote Originally Posted by modator View Post
    Hy Michael,

    Only 7 out of 200 ? seems like there is some mis calibration / alignment in the XF copy tested, the better ISO performance of the H5D-50c lie in it's CMOS that is a little bit different from the Phase, it has more blind pixel mask, to get a more precise noise bias, then the software denoise made by Phocus is a little improved, also the CFA is slight different... result: the H use a SONY CMOS it's 50mpixel but it's different from the one used by Phase in many aspects.

    Best regards, Domenico.

  11. #11
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    North Sweden
    Posts
    1,403
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Hasselblad H5D 50c WiFi vs. Phase One XF/IQ350

    Focus trimming is a setting on the XF body to ensure the AF point matches between body and lens, i.e focussing on a known point and then using the xf body to adjust back/front focus for the lens until it is correct, takes 10 mins.

    I didn't mean to sound rude in my response but I honestly feel it's a matter of integrity as a professional to realistically record what the situation is, I personally have no interest in your ultimate decision on what you use, that's your business, but as I said, writing a review without knowing how to use the camera is pointless, I don't get it. As a professional, I can't imagine you would ever buy a piece of equipment without setting it up to complement how you work, and then using it in a variety of situations to get a decent handle on it before making a decision or committing your opinion, I don't see how you can have an opinion without using a camera properly. If you weren't able to get a decent length of time with the camera then surely all you can write is that you'd have loved to do a decent comparison but Phase didn't offer you one for long enough to form an opinion, because the alternative is to do as you have done and produce an article that isn't representative of the camera.

    My entire living comes from my cameras, I buy the cameras that work for my own contracts and even the concept of buying the XF if I couldn't get it to focus or I couldn't change basic settings without accurately tapping the top screen is ridiculous, I would have returned it immediately, but it took less than an hour to check the focus was spot on and adjust it, get the key settings where I can access them quickly and start shooting.

    By the way, this is not about the camera you chose, I have the same issue with anyone who writes a review within a day of having a camera, regardless of what it is, maybe I'm alone in this or a bit thick, but it can take me weeks to understand a camera and get it to work for me.
    http://matrichardson.com/
    Workshops for 2018! http://www.matrichardson.com/workshops
    Likes 1 Member(s) liked this post

  12. #12
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Little Rock AR
    Posts
    1,927
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    4

    Re: Hasselblad H5D 50c WiFi vs. Phase One XF/IQ350

    Hello Michael:

    The focus trimming is a similar to a AF micro adjust that you can do with most Canon or Nikon lenses on their DSLR's

    The DF+ allowed this also, but only for one lens at a time.

    The XF allows multiple lenses and with the blue label lenses can store multiple versions of a set focal length.

    So which each lens you have as long as each has a different focal length, you can micro adjust the AF and it's stored in the XF from that point on. Interface is quick and easy.

    As to the noise, from what I have seen in posted tests and shots I took with the Phase, the noise floor on the 50MP Phase is possible not as good as the other companies using the chip. However I was able to get to 1600/3200 with the IQ150 with no real issues when I tested it last year. The tests that DT did over 2 years ago with the older IQ250 were extremely impressive, as much as 2.5 to 3 stops of shadow lift at base iso of 100. These were the tests done in a private library with the IQ250/260 and 280. I have also always found that with a Phase One file, the best raw converter is C1, (which I believe you used), as Phase seems to get the best results on higher ISO files than LR.

    Personally in my use, AF on the XF has been excellent, coming from the older DF+ and previous to that DF. I am a user that would have preferred some form of multipoint design (probably an exception) but so far the center point seems very accurate on landscape work. Phase did upgrade the firmware on the XF about 2 weeks ago and one of the improvements was supposed to be a low light improvement.

    Paul C

  13. #13
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Chicago
    Posts
    551
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Hasselblad H5D 50c WiFi vs. Phase One XF/IQ350

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul2660 View Post
    Hello Michael:

    The focus trimming is a similar to a AF micro adjust that you can do with most Canon or Nikon lenses on their DSLR's

    The DF+ allowed this also, but only for one lens at a time.

    The XF allows multiple lenses and with the blue label lenses can store multiple versions of a set focal length.

    So which each lens you have as long as each has a different focal length, you can micro adjust the AF and it's stored in the XF from that point on. Interface is quick and easy.
    Paul C
    FYI - the Rollei Hy6 also had this feature, allowing you to dial in both AF and MF lenses. The mod II version would save the AF lens data for different lenses; on my earlier Hy6, I just keep the settings on the iPhone and look them up.

    Its a great feature - my 150 tele-xenetar was (I thought) very soft; a bit of dialing in, and its now sharp as a tack. Recommended for all cameras.

  14. #14
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Posts
    1,588
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Hasselblad H5D 50c WiFi vs. Phase One XF/IQ350

    Quote Originally Posted by Geoff View Post
    FYI - the Rollei Hy6 also had this feature, allowing you to dial in both AF and MF lenses. The mod II version would save the AF lens data for different lenses; on my earlier Hy6, I just keep the settings on the iPhone and look them up.

    Its a great feature - my 150 tele-xenetar was (I thought) very soft; a bit of dialing in, and its now sharp as a tack. Recommended for all cameras.

    I'd say it's essential for all cameras to have this feature, actually.

  15. #15
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    598
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Hasselblad H5D 50c WiFi vs. Phase One XF/IQ350

    I am actually surprised to find out that one needs to focus trim on PhaseOne cameras (I did not know that, I use Hasselblad). I had that on my 24x36 and I found myself a bit cheated that the manufacturer left the last adjust operation to the end user.

    So the comparison review was interesting for me because I learned something.

  16. #16
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    North Sweden
    Posts
    1,403
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Hasselblad H5D 50c WiFi vs. Phase One XF/IQ350

    Jerome, what did you learn from the article? Focus trimming you learned from this thread. The article was in no way balanced, it's still perfectly reasonable to choose the Hasselblad, it's obviously an excellent camera and nobody can argue with personal opinion, it just seems a shame to not do it properly and actually understand what both cameras can do if you're going to write a review.

    Obviously that's just my view, no need for anyone to agree with that.

    Mat

  17. #17
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    598
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Hasselblad H5D 50c WiFi vs. Phase One XF/IQ350

    Well. I have had 2 H bodies. The first one was an H3D-31, ancient by any standard. Its AF was faultless with all the lenses I tried. So I thought it normal that on MF cameras the manufacturer would calibrate the lenses themselves. I expected that all MF manufacturers would do this.
    Now I use an H4D-50, which has true focus. The AF is, again faultless. Many users praise the system, so it is not just me.
    The article also says that the XF has difficulties focussing in darker scenes. I also found that surprising, since the H is indeed slower but can AF in relatively dark scenes, even without the built-in illuminator.

    What else did I learn? I learned about the difference in sharpness (maybe the mirror is not damped as well?), in high iso noise, in ergonomics (weight and the grip bulge), and in high synchronization flash uses. I learned that the user interface of the XF needs to be customized.

    The article noted some negative points of the H as well. In truth, I did not learn them from the article, because I have a H camera and knows its negative points. But they were there.

  18. #18
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    North Sweden
    Posts
    1,403
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Hasselblad H5D 50c WiFi vs. Phase One XF/IQ350

    I understand Jerome, there are some sections where you can interpret his view, but as there are so many mistakes on the abilities of the XF, it throws the whole thing out for me, maybe not for anyone else. Things like saying the Hasselblad mirror stays locked up and the XF you have to lock it up for each shot is just wrong.

    My point is that doing a proper test of both cameras does nothing negative, it in no way diminishes the abilities of the excellent Hasselblad, in fact the only thing it does do is increase the credibility of the writer by showing a balanced view and in turn, gives more weight to the reason for his choices as they relate to him.

    Lets face it, the idea that there is such a thing as a perfect camera is a fairly daft one, I can list negatives of every system I have used but ultimately the positives need to out way them or else it's out the door. I'm not pro any brand, I'm just pro sensible, balanced reviews with information that people can transfer to their own requirements.

    Mat

  19. #19
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    598
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Hasselblad H5D 50c WiFi vs. Phase One XF/IQ350

    Let us wait for another comparison test, then...

  20. #20
    Member modator's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Location
    Northern Italy
    Posts
    126
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    32

    Cool Re: Hasselblad H5D 50c WiFi vs. Phase One XF/IQ350

    Quote Originally Posted by tjv View Post
    That's interesting information, how do you know this is the case? If true – and I'm not saying I doubt what you've said – then I wonder if it has any effect on how the 50c backs perform on a technical camera with movements?
    Hi tjv,
    for now I don't made any test of perf on tech camera, but I can say both CMOS chip have micro lenses (and also 100Mpix too), so the performance with shifted wide angles are degraded in comparison of old CCD without micro lenses... (this argument is not new..).

    About what I state is not coming from my imagination...

    Simply looking at the difference of RAW file,, everyone that can find raws of H5D-50c and IQ250/350 can do this...

    Using Rawdigger with the "Masked Pixel" option checked in the preference, loading Hasselblad file You get the image surrounded by TOP / LEFT / RIGHT masked pixel like this:



    In the case of an IQ250/350 raw file You get an image with only TOP / LEFT mask like this: (file from "Capture Integration" IQ250 raw samples)



    I hope this clears the fact that the two CMOS are masked in a different way, and this masking is not software... it's HARDWARE !
    SONY in the manufacturing have put a sort of "black paint" to mask some area of the chip to enable the respective customer to apply the proprietary algorithm of de-noise, thermal noise estimation, drift, biasing etc. etc.

    Result : Hasselblad CMOS is different from Phase CMOS.. both are made By SONY but it's a different model/customization.. "Custom Chip".

    Best regards, Domenico.
    Thanks 1 Member(s) thanked for this post

  21. #21
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Posts
    1,588
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Hasselblad H5D 50c WiFi vs. Phase One XF/IQ350

    Thanks Domenico, that's really interesting although I admit to it being a little over my head.

    I have actually tried a CFV-50c back on my Linhof Techno, and while the performance was excellent – although not quite versatile enough for my own needs in terms of freedom of movements before crosstalk etc set in – the live view at the time was very poor. The screen didn't refresh enough (i.e. read off the pixels quick enough) for me to have the back set to 100ISO and focus with the tech lens wide open at f5.6 in broad daylight. When doing this to find critical focus, the entire image blew out. I needed to stop down past f16 at least, or use a strong ND to control the light. Neither option was acceptable to me, and in the end I opted for a 60mpx full-frame back and just enjoy using / persevere with using the ground glass on my Techno. In another demo with the Credo 150, the live view worked very well at any setting. But the price was over double of what I eventually paid for my used Credo 60, which was also the same price of the CFV-50c new.

    I state the above about live view because I wonder if it still applies today for this back, or if it also applies to the H5D-50c live view. Before I committed to buying my Credo 60, Hasselblad put me in touch with a very well knowen Hasselblad architectual photographer (who was very generous with his time to talk to me, half way around the world,) who was beta testing an updated firmware to enable faster live view to fix the performance issues I'd encountered. He said he'd been using it for some time with no issues encountered and that a firmware update release was imminent. That was a year ago now and I wonder if there have been any firmware updates in the meantime, either for the CFV or the H?

    Still, all that said, if I were an SLR shooter mainly, I'd personally go for the H as I like the ergonomics and local Hasselblad dealer, and can't stand the local Phase / Leaf dealer "network" (I put this in quotes as I'm being sarcastic. Not every country is blessed with the good fortune of Capture Intergration like service and support.) This, plus the H is substantially cheaper here for what by popular account – going by this this and other user accounts I've read – is identical if not better aspects of performance that matter to me on some fronts.

    I'm interested to hear what Hasselblad will release on the 7th. I am hoping to by an H kit for work this year, and I'd love it if they updated their 35mm lens like they did the 50mm II, and pushed the user interface to new heights – this is where I really love my Credo, as it's simply the easiest menu on a piece of gear I have ever used. It never gets in the way.
    Thanks 1 Member(s) thanked for this post
    Likes 1 Member(s) liked this post

  22. #22
    Workshop Member
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    NYC
    Posts
    3,275
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    7

    Re: Hasselblad H5D 50c WiFi vs. Phase One XF/IQ350

    I'd suggest those who are concluding the Phase One file doesn't hold up at higher ISO take another look with a highly detailed subject and a large print. I think they've chosen an excellent balance of noise handling and detail retention, but of course I'm biased. I tend to push the noise reduction *lower* than default. It can look a bit rough on screen but in print the resulting grain is something I find very pleasant.
    Last edited by dougpeterson; 4th April 2016 at 06:42.
    Doug Peterson , Digital Transitions | Email
    Dealer for: Phase One, Mamiya Leaf, Arca-Swiss, Cambo, Eizo, Profoto
    Office: 877.367.8537. Cell: 740.707.2183
    Likes 1 Member(s) liked this post

  23. #23
    Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    Miami FL USA
    Posts
    53
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Hasselblad H5D 50c WiFi vs. Phase One XF/IQ350

    Michael is an accomplished action/adventure photographer. However his review of the XF350 is inaccurate. I would suggest partnering up with a photographer who shoots with the XF system on a regular basis. Not sure how helpful to make assertions when you have limited experience with a camera system. I would gladly rent an IQ350 and meet Michael to do some photography. He could give me some pointers of the actual use of Hasselblad system. I have only shoot with the H1/H2 and not the latest models.

    Upon a quick reading of Michaels blog I noticed several statements which are not factual.

    The article asserts that the Auto-focus on the XF is poor. This is not true.
    The article makes some incorrect remarks about LS glass and flash syncing.
    His opinions about the Reliability based upon Almost everyone has to send in their XF for service are disingenuous and could greatly benefit from fact checking.


    AUTO FOCUS

    I have shot over 10,000 frames with my XF and have a very high percentage of sharp images. Recently I shot three magazine covers for a national sports magazine. The photo editors were very happy with the take. No problems with focus on the XF.

    This is how I do it.

    In my long term experience in photography I have found that the majority of the time when a photographer has a lot of out of focus images it's due to operator issues and poor camera technique. Heres just a few examples.


    1. Out of focus VS camera shake/motion Blur. It's vital to remember when handholding any camera to use at twice the focus length of the lens as a shutter speed. This is especially true when shooting on a MFD camera.

    2. Diopter adjustment. On the view finder of the XF is a Diopter adjustment. A) Focus on an object. B) While looking through the viewfinder - turn the dial until the image is crisp.

    3. Holding the camera. The elbows should be in. One hand cups underneath the lens while the other hand holds the camera. When you place your (non-shutter) hand over the lens it's easy to actually push the lens down a bit while shooting causing a bit of motion blur.

    4. Focus assist light. Go into the menu of the XF and you can adjust the brightness to help the camera/lens snap into focus.

    5. Focus trim. Is not only for dialing in the sweet spot of a lens. The most important use of focus trimming is when your camera in lock into place and you chose not to focus and recompose. For example you a shooting a vertical magazine cover featuring three quarter photograph of a woman wearing a swimsuit. You can focus on her midriff area and simply apply a minus/negative amount of focus trim. This reduces the adjusts focus and brings the focus the eyes.

    This also comes into play when you have a background that is extremely contrasty or backlighted and the auto focus has the tendency to back focus leaving the foreground subject blurry, simple dial in a positive amount of focus trim. Its pretty straightforward to use.

    SCHNEIDER KREUZNACH 35mm LS f/3.5

    Yes it does sync at 1/1600 of a second. I own this lens. The strobe system I use is Profoto combined with the Profoto Air Sync remote.

    I also shoot with an LS 28, LS 55, LS 110, LS150 and they all sync at 1/1600 of second with Profoto Air Sync remote on the Profoto packs.

    The LS 40-80 Zoom syncs at about 1/800 to 1/1000 with Profoto air sync.


    RELIABILITY

    (In the blog it says everyone who has a Phase One system has to send it in for repair?)

    This is not true.

    I dont climb mountains or jump out of planes. Just do advertising and editorial photography. My Phase digital back has about XX,XXX frames on it. Im a bit shy to say how many..it has never been to Denmark for service. My XF has as mentioned about 10,000 on the shutter. Never been in for service. My Phase One system lives in a Gura Gear backpack (the 34L) I wish I could say that I wrap my gear in bubble wrap, most readers of the forum would say Jeff please please put a little protection around your gear

    Name:  xf_frame_counter.jpg
Views: 812
Size:  467.8 KB
    Last edited by Jeffery Salter; 4th April 2016 at 14:02. Reason: attach xf frame counter photo
    Jeffery Salter
    www.jefferysalter.com
    Thanks 2 Member(s) thanked for this post
    Likes 2 Member(s) liked this post

  24. #24
    Senior Member kdphotography's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Carmel/Tucson
    Posts
    2,355
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Hasselblad H5D 50c WiFi vs. Phase One XF/IQ350

    Quote Originally Posted by Jeffery Salter View Post
    .... I wish I could say that I wrap my gear in bubble wrap, most readers of the forum would say Jeff please please put a little protection around your gear
    Actually, last time I saw you with the Phase XF with the IQ3 100MP at Capture Integration in Carmel, we were more worried about protecting you!

    Ok, so maybe Ziv was a little antsy about the proximity of the waves and the new IQ3 100....

    kenName:  DSCF5889.JPG
Views: 1451
Size:  732.7 KB

  25. #25
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    598
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Hasselblad H5D 50c WiFi vs. Phase One XF/IQ350

    Quote Originally Posted by dougpeterson View Post
    I'd suggest those who are concluding the Phase One file doesn't hold up at higher ISO take another look with a highly detailed subject and a large print. I think they've chosen an excellent balance of noise handling and detail retention, but of course I'm biased. I tend to push the noise reduction *lower* than default. It can look a bit rough on screen but in print the resulting grain is something I find very pleasant.
    It is a comparison review and, to my eyes, Phase One has color blotches (which I personally find ugly) while Hasselblad does not. That's all.

    This being said, one would expect the noise reduction to be tweaked with every new version of Phocus or Capture One, so this is probably not a very bid deal.

  26. #26
    Workshop Member
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    NYC
    Posts
    3,275
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    7

    Re: Hasselblad H5D 50c WiFi vs. Phase One XF/IQ350

    Quote Originally Posted by jerome_m View Post
    It is a comparison review and, to my eyes, Phase One has color blotches (which I personally find ugly) while Hasselblad does not. That's all.

    This being said, one would expect the noise reduction to be tweaked with every new version of Phocus or Capture One, so this is probably not a very bid deal.
    Are we talking about the same comparison image?
    http://www.michaelclarkphoto.com/fil...50_fullres.jpg

    Both cameras show significant wonka-wonka (low-frequency) color blotchiness in that side by side. If you don't see it right away (we all have different color perception) just bring the image in Photoshop and crank the saturation so you see the pattern; hard to unsee it after. You'd expect to see more in the Phase One file since it's of a red subject matter where only 1/4th of the pixels are getting strong light (red channel only) vs the neutral subject matter of the Hassy where all pixels are getting strong light.

    Both images could probably be improved by increased color noise reduction in their respective software. Notably, in C1 you can do that on a local adjustment layer so it doesn't affect other areas of the image.

    I would personally also turn down the luminance noise reduction on the P1 file; it looks to be at default, which is a perfectly defensible setting for a review, but not the setting I'd normally recommend our customers to use (if they, like me, don't fear grain, they fear ugly grain).
    Last edited by dougpeterson; 4th April 2016 at 12:30.
    Doug Peterson , Digital Transitions | Email
    Dealer for: Phase One, Mamiya Leaf, Arca-Swiss, Cambo, Eizo, Profoto
    Office: 877.367.8537. Cell: 740.707.2183

  27. #27
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    598
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Hasselblad H5D 50c WiFi vs. Phase One XF/IQ350

    Quote Originally Posted by dougpeterson View Post
    Are we talking about the same comparison image?
    http://www.michaelclarkphoto.com/fil...50_fullres.jpg
    Yes we are.

    Both cameras show significant wonka-wonka (low-frequency) color blotchiness in that side by side. If you don't see it right away (we all have different color perception) just bring the image in Photoshop and crank the saturation so you see the pattern; hard to unsee it after. You'd expect to see more in the Phase One file since it's of a red subject matter where only 1/4th of the pixels are getting strong light (red channel only) vs the neutral subject matter of the Hassy where all pixels are getting strong light.

    Both images could probably be improved by increased color noise reduction in their respective software. Notably, in C1 you can do that on a local adjustment layer so it doesn't affect other areas of the image.

    I would personally also turn down the luminance noise reduction on the P1 file; it looks to be at default, which is a perfectly defensible setting for a review, but not the setting I'd normally recommend our customers to use (if they, like me, don't fear grain, they fear ugly grain).
    Doug, I appreciate your efforts as a salesman, but, frankly, let us just wait for a new version of Phocus and Capture One. I am pretty sure both Phase and Hasselblad can do better than that.
    Likes 1 Member(s) liked this post

  28. #28
    Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    Miami FL USA
    Posts
    53
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Hasselblad H5D 50c WiFi vs. Phase One XF/IQ350

    Quote Originally Posted by kdphotography View Post
    Actually, last time I saw you with the Phase XF with the IQ3 100MP at Capture Integration in Carmel, we were more worried about protecting you!

    Ok, so maybe Ziv was a little antsy about the proximity of the waves and the new IQ3 100....

    kenName:  DSCF5889.JPG
Views: 1451
Size:  732.7 KB
    This is photo belongs in the NSFW section of Getdpi! Anyway much thanks to your son, the water polo champion for keeping an eye on me.
    Jeffery Salter
    www.jefferysalter.com
    Likes 2 Member(s) liked this post

  29. #29
    Workshop Member
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    NYC
    Posts
    3,275
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    7

    Re: Hasselblad H5D 50c WiFi vs. Phase One XF/IQ350

    Quote Originally Posted by jerome_m View Post
    Let us just wait for a new version of Phocus and Capture One. I am pretty sure both Phase and Hasselblad can do better than that.
    I think that's fair. Just looking at an H25 file in Capture One 3,4,5,6,7,8, and 9 shows you what improvements in raw processing can have.
    Doug Peterson , Digital Transitions | Email
    Dealer for: Phase One, Mamiya Leaf, Arca-Swiss, Cambo, Eizo, Profoto
    Office: 877.367.8537. Cell: 740.707.2183

  30. #30
    Workshop Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Brooklyn
    Posts
    4,043
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    1253

    Re: Hasselblad H5D 50c WiFi vs. Phase One XF/IQ350

    Jeffery is shown flagrantly violating his third principle; a compelling reason to avoid MF users' advice. 😄
    Likes 1 Member(s) liked this post

  31. #31
    Senior Member DanielDuarte's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2016
    Location
    Boston, MA
    Posts
    287
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Hasselblad H5D 50c WiFi vs. Phase One XF/IQ350

    I've handled a friends XF, seems like a powerful tool. I own a 50c, it's a powerful tool.

    That said, MF is a bit much for me and I'd move the camera and go back to 35mm. I was working on a project where I was regularly printing 40x60 inch prints. It helped a lot, but now I'm back to working in my normal print range and I feel like I'm wasting the potential of this tool.

  32. #32
    Workshop Member
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    NYC
    Posts
    3,275
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    7

    Re: Hasselblad H5D 50c WiFi vs. Phase One XF/IQ350

    In this thread and in the original article there was some confusion over sync speeds of the Schneider / Team Phase One LS lenses.

    For absolute clarity:
    - the 240LS syncs at 1/1,000
    - ALL other Schneider LS lenses sync at 1/1,600

    Your flash transmitter needs to be capable of communicating at 1/1600th if you want to go that fast.
    - An example of a transmitter not capable of this is the standard PocketWizard which can only fully sync up to 1/500th.
    - An example of a transmitter capable of this is a Profoto Air transmitter.

    Notably a Profoto Air transmitter is built into the Phase One XF. That allows you to trigger (at up to 1/1600th) any Profoto Air light without any separate transmitters/receivers/cables/batteries or with any other kind of light (e.g. Broncolor) by attaching a Profoto Air receiver to it. You, of course, can also put any transmitter (e.g. a Broncolor RFS) you want on the XF.

    We have the full Schneider LS lens specs on our website.
    Doug Peterson , Digital Transitions | Email
    Dealer for: Phase One, Mamiya Leaf, Arca-Swiss, Cambo, Eizo, Profoto
    Office: 877.367.8537. Cell: 740.707.2183

  33. #33
    Senior Member kdphotography's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Carmel/Tucson
    Posts
    2,355
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Hasselblad H5D 50c WiFi vs. Phase One XF/IQ350

    Quote Originally Posted by dougpeterson View Post
    In this thread and in the original article there was some confusion over sync speeds of the Schneider / Team Phase One LS lenses.

    For absolute clarity:
    - the 240LS syncs at 1/1,000
    - ALL other Schneider LS lenses sync at 1/1,600

    ....
    Not interested in the 75-150LS, but I think this zoom is also limited to 1/1000th flash sync, but still no slouch.

    I love the built-in Profoto Air on the XF! If using the Profoto transmitter (e.g., DF+ body), you need to set the Profoto Air to "fast" mode, which will eat batteries faster. No need to set fast mode on the XF! Just shoot!

    ken

  34. #34
    Workshop Member
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    NYC
    Posts
    3,275
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    7

    Re: Hasselblad H5D 50c WiFi vs. Phase One XF/IQ350

    Quote Originally Posted by kdphotography View Post
    Not interested in the 75-150LS, but I think this zoom is also limited to 1/1000th flash sync, but still no slouch.
    Ken, thanks for watching out for me! However, the information I posted is correct. The 240LS syncs at 1/1,000. EVERY other LS lens in the lineup (including the 75-150LS and 40-80LS) sync at 1/1,600th.
    Doug Peterson , Digital Transitions | Email
    Dealer for: Phase One, Mamiya Leaf, Arca-Swiss, Cambo, Eizo, Profoto
    Office: 877.367.8537. Cell: 740.707.2183

  35. #35
    Senior Member kdphotography's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Carmel/Tucson
    Posts
    2,355
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Hasselblad H5D 50c WiFi vs. Phase One XF/IQ350

    Quote Originally Posted by dougpeterson View Post
    Ken, thanks for watching out for me! However, the information I posted is correct. The 240LS syncs at 1/1,000. EVERY other LS lens in the lineup (including the 75-150LS and 40-80LS) sync at 1/1,600th.
    I think you better watch out for Phase One! Their website has the 75-150LS listed with a 1/1000 flash sync. Still no slouch either way! I don't have the 75-150LS so can't test. No matter---it's not on my shopping list.

    https://www.phaseone.com/en/Products...-150mm-LS.aspx

    ken

  36. #36
    Senior Member stephengilbert's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Santa Monica, CA
    Posts
    2,275
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    2

    Re: Hasselblad H5D 50c WiFi vs. Phase One XF/IQ350

    Ken,

    Buy the lens or shut up. You know that GetDPI does not permit posts not basd on personal knowledge or experience.

    Steve
    Likes 1 Member(s) liked this post

  37. #37
    Senior Member kdphotography's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Carmel/Tucson
    Posts
    2,355
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: Hasselblad H5D 50c WiFi vs. Phase One XF/IQ350

    Quote Originally Posted by stephengilbert View Post
    Ken,

    Buy the lens or shut up. You know that GetDPI does not permit posts not basd on personal knowledge or experience.

    Steve
    Damn, Steve. This Dante's Inferno crowd is tough. So I had the old 75-150, and I did shoot the new 75-150LS once at a CI in Carmel, but I guess that doesn't count. I'll have to call CI this afternoon....

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •