Anyone having problems with their XF?

[Craig Stocks]

I've had my XF since late last year and while I really like it it's not without its issues. I've been working with my dealer to diagnose and correct them, but they're still issues.

Lock-ups. Almost every tethered studio session has at least one lockup where I have to power cycle the back/camera to clear (IQ 260 back, all the latest firmware).

Focus. Most say it's night and day different from the DF but in my experience it's more like night and a different night. I still have to double or tripple tap to focus and I think I still have more out of focus than I did with the DF.

Construction. The grip had a noticible feeling of play in it that I eventually traced to a loose screw that needed 2 or more turns to tighten (top-left screw on the back of the body).

Power button. press it a little too firmly or off-center and it sticks down. I try to avoid touching it.

Features like focusing stacking don't work well. Lens doesn't repeat settings correctly.

And of course there's the decision to change the remote socket and it's taken a year to release a cable. There still doesn't seem to be a way to trigger from a Pocket Wizard.

I love the idea of the XF and some of the features are a great addition. I feel like it has great potential, I just hope that the potential is realised soon.

Anyone else having these kinds of issues?

 

[Paul2660]

The only lockup situation I have seen is with Live View, tethered to S2. I have had a few situations where I could not get the Live View session to end, which required the XF/back to be powered off.

Remote, I agree, on the pin out, and the fact that no remote is available. The only one in stock right now is the 6 meter version? strange. DT briefly had some of the 1M in stock, but they are gone now. Come on Phase/Mamiya, Sony is not making these parts, I can't figure out what the delay is.

Focus, I find that the focus is improved over the DF for sure as it's a one hit and done situation for me. As an outdoor shooter, I still fall back on Live View a lot, but I have used the AF quite a bit and all seems good. Most of my lenses did need micro adjustment.

Focus stacking, seems to work for me, not that I am shooting hundreds of frames in a stack, more like 4 to 5, landscape shots where I want full range focus. Helicon focus works well also. The setup for Focus stacking is a bit strange, and I would have liked to see a better interface for it. It's strange enough that so far each time I use it, I have to remember the process, but you can write down the range numbers for the wides and just re-enter them. But hopefully it will get more attention. BTW Digital Transitions has a webinar tomorrow 2 times during the day that is free, you might sign up for.

Construction. Overall very impressed, Except, the latch for removal of the 90 degree finder, way way to easy hit this when bringing the camera out of the bag. If you just tap it, it tend to release 1 side. I have since covered mine with Gaffer tape. Love the feel of the camera and deep grip. Only time will tell on longevity of parts, but to me the shutter/mirror seem the same as in the DF series, so they should be OK. Not sure who thought up the strap attachment parts, takes a while to get anything into those.

Love the Vibration reduction idea, seems to really work (interesting idea instead of VR on the lenses or sensor).

Improvements:

1. More AF points (I realize that won't happen
2. touch AF from the Live view touch screen (that would be really nice)
3. Larger milliamp battery, 5000 or so,
4. Not sure what power share really does, or if it really works between back and camera
5. EVF to replace the 90 degree finder, at least for CMOS backs. (pretty sure that will happen in 3 to 4 years but not with this generation)

Paul C

 

[Chipcarterdc]

My experience:

Lockups: only once. Yesterday, while shooting handheld, the camera started making this sustained loud beep and everything was frozen. Turned off and back on, no further problems. I'd really like to know what caused it, though.

Focus: I find it quite good in terms of both accuracy and speed (relative to medium format cameras).

Construction: mine is rock solid: no wobble or looseness anywhere. Good to know about the screw on the grip, though, in case mine ever starts feeling loose.

Power button: haven't had that problem.

I've had my XF since late last year and while I really like it it's not without its issues. I've been working with my dealer to diagnose and correct them, but they're still issues.

Lock-ups. Almost every tethered studio session has at least one lockup where I have to power cycle the back/camera to clear (IQ 260 back, all the latest firmware).

Focus. Most say it's night and day different from the DF but in my experience it's more like night and a different night. I still have to double or tripple tap to focus and I think I still have more out of focus than I did with the DF.

Construction. The grip had a noticible feeling of play in it that I eventually traced to a loose screw that needed 2 or more turns to tighten (top-left screw on the back of the body).

Power button. press it a little too firmly or off-center and it sticks down. I try to avoid touching it.

Features like focusing stacking don't work well. Lens doesn't repeat settings correctly.

And of course there's the decision to change the remote socket and it's taken a year to release a cable. There still doesn't seem to be a way to trigger from a Pocket Wizard.

I love the idea of the XF and some of the features are a great addition. I feel like it has great potential, I just hope that the potential is realised soon.

Anyone else having these kinds of issues?

 

[mjr]

I haven't used mine a great deal but have had no issues at all with lock ups or build quality. I have found the focus stacking to be really good for close up subjects, to be honest it works perfectly on stacks of up to 30 shots, not tried any more than that.

I don't like the way the viewfinder latch rattles a little, I always place it in to the bag/case with the catch side down and handle up so have not had an issue with it unlatching on removal, I am only picking it up by the handle.

Other than that, mine is working really well, no complaints so far.

I hope you get your issues sorted out.

Mat

 

[DougDolde]

Yeah the prism finder lock is totally unacceptable for a camera in this price range. I only now use the waist level finder but it makes verticals impossible. If I want to do a vertical I do a two shot stitch using my Arca Swiss Cube to change the angle.

I bugged Phase One for an answer to what they planned to do about the prism lock. The answer I got was just denial, something like "what's the problem".

 

[Christopher]

I love both of my XF cameras. So far rock solid through the year. Only one lockup I can remember.

Focus is good as long as the lenses are trimmed.

Remote socket is a little laughable.... However, I never use anything except my iPhone for remote triggering.

I have used focus stacking a lot and LOVE it. Super fast and NEVER did it not work probably.

Power sharing works great. It's great that one does not need to change the battery right away if one goes empty.

Things I really don't like are:

- settings; WHY CAN'T I access ALL XF settings from a connected back ?
- it would be great if it would be possible to save/export XF settings to a CF card.
- WHY can't I disable the stupid black frame on the XF?!?!?

 

[Bill Caulfeild-Browne]

I got my XF last August and have about 7,000 shutter actuations to date. In the early days I got frequent lock-ups, usually when it was cold. (I rarely got them indoors.) Late last year there was a major firmware upgrade (1.08.1) which solved the problem completely and I haven't had a lock-up since.

The autofocus has worked way better than the DF and I'm very pleased with it. My only complaint has already been mentioned - it's far too easy to inadvertently unlatch the prism. One day it fell off altogether but my reflexes were uncommonly good that day and I caught it before it hit the ground. Now I always store the camera left-side down, so I take it out by the grip.

I haven't used the focus stacking much but it's worked just fine. The feature I most like is the hyperfocal setting. It's a real time saver and very repeatable.

I have found the battery sharing between the XF and the IQ3 100 to be just fine. The back's battery typically goes flat while there is still 40% left in the body's. I frequently just change the one battery and wait until the next one expires until replacing it.

All in all, since the critical firmware upgrade, my XF has functioned perfectly. (As has the IQ3 100 back.) It sounds rather as if the OP has a lemon.

 

[etrump]

I thought I was going to hate not having a remote shutter release but am actually liking things without it. Will probably get one for the timing critical shots.

Had none of the problems you discuss but have a few of my own but relatively mild so I'll work through with my dealer

Wish the tools could ge accessed from the back. Shooting focus stack or hdr with camera high is very difficult.

 

[Paul2660]

Yes. The camera tools need to be accessible from the back. Just like any other integrated camera system.

As Ed points out you can always look down at the top of the camera conviently.

Strange to me this was overlooked.

Paul C

 

[dougpeterson]

Remote, I agree, on the pin out, and the fact that no remote is available. The only one in stock right now is the 6 meter version? strange. DT briefly had some of the 1M in stock, but they are gone now. Come on Phase/Mamiya, Sony is not making these parts, I can't figure out what the delay is.

We actually had quite a few. But they all got ordered within a few days once word got out.

We expect more soon.

 

[mjr]

Actually, being able to access all functions from the back would indeed be good, I would like to be able to go in to XF controls and swipe left to access the focus stacking tool from the back, I have had a couple of situations where I haven't been able to see the top screen and have had to fumble about and guess that I am pressing the right place to register the lens position, adding that functionality to the back screen would be great.

For me, as I am not having any issues with the body beyond a few usability things, I find that whole thing pretty good and very nice to use, one of the best things is being able to fire the profoto strobes direct from the back, that's excellent!

Hopefully Phase will continue with updates to the system as we go along, they have been great so far.

Mat

 

[narikin]

Love the Vibration reduction idea, seems to really work (interesting idea instead of VR on the lenses or sensor).

Paul C

? You mean the sensor that waits for no more vibration before releasing shutter, or is there some other setting/feature I'm unaware of ?

 

[narikin]

5. EVF to replace the 90 degree finder, at least for CMOS backs. (pretty sure that will happen in 3 to 4 years but not with this generation)

Paul C

+1, with gold knobs on!

But see no reason why this should take years. Decent EVF's exist, excellent HDMI out signal is already on the CMOS backs. So all the pieces are there - just needs Phase to put them together. If they don't someone else will, hopefully.

 

[Paul2660]

? You mean the sensor that waits for no more vibration before releasing shutter, or is there some other setting/feature I'm unaware of ?

Yes, I should have said Vibration awareness mode in that the camera will wait to fire until the seismograph determines no movement.

Paul C

 

[dougpeterson]

Hopefully Phase will continue with updates to the system as we go along, they have been great so far.

The XF Platform is already, in my highly biased opinion, the best medium format body ever made.

But it's absolutely clear to me that Phase One's investment in the XF Platform is ongoing in a very meaningful way. Just as we've seen two feature updates that added significant features and improved AF you will see continuing feature updates and refinements.

Now that I've been a product manager for a while I can confirm what I was told for years... the hardest challenge of product management is that every feature you add creates a request for two more. Focus stacking (as covered in our webinar today) is really great (and should work repeatably and reliably; so if you're not experiencing that consult with your dealer to track down the issue) but the moment they added it the very addition of this feature, which was never in a high end body before, spurred legitimate and real requests for more (e.g. the very good suggestion to be able to access it from the digital back or computer screens). Same thing for time lapse. Same thing for the vibration-sensing-delay mode.

There are so many great things they can do with the platform they have created. It will be interesting for everyone to see what they choose to prioritize for the next feature update. Stay tuned .

As to the OP: no, we haven't seen any wide spread problems. No lockups other than a rare once-in-a-blue-moon type. The first week or two the initial firmware had a couple obvious bugs (not unheard of or unexpected). I do agree the viewfinder latch could be more robust or lockable. It's not elegant, but a piece of gaffe tape over the switch works very well for users that aren't changing to the waist level viewfinder. Notably in shooting three weddings with three different XF bodies my experience with the AF and keeper rate is definitely night-and-day compared to the DF+. Sounds like you have something going on with your kit. Could be firmware, hardware, a setting, an accessory (bad battery?), or some form of misunderstanding or user error (the last seems the least likely; just being thorough in my list). It's precisely for these types of situations that your dealer is there; I'm sure they will help you figure it out!

 

[Craig Stocks]

The focus issue is very noticeable when trimming a lens. For instance, I just revisited the trim setting for my P1 150 LS lens. I use a yardstick at a 30 degree angle set up so that the 10 inch mark is even with the target.

My procedure and results:

Turn the lens to infinity (or there-about), lens wide open.

Half press shutter, wait while the lens hunts, lens stops hunting and the focus confirmation light comes on.

Press the shutter the rest of the way to expose a frame.

Check focus - the lens focused beyond the target at about the 6 inch mark instead of the 10 inch mark.

Half press the shutter again, lens jogs and the focus confirmation light comes on.

Press the shutter the rest of the way to expose a frame

Check focus - the lens focused right on the 10 inch mark.

I just did this sequence twice in a row and got the exact same results both times.

Based on this experience, I set the trim based on a double or triple tap and then always at least double tap when shooting for real. It does seem like sometimes the extra taps will move the lens out of focus so I do have to be careful about the extra tapping. Shooting in the studio I always try to shoot tethered and always try to confirm focus after the first shot. About 20 to 30 percent of the time I have to readjust focus and check again.

My purpose for posting the question was to try to determine if this was a common problem or if I have a real problem in my setup.

 

[kdphotography]

Craig, it sounds like you have a DF with an XF sticker placed over the the DF :ROTFL:

Sorry---sounds like either something is up with your set-up/settings or its the camera. I'd work with a dealer to resolve the issue, and if the issues remain, you just may have a lemon that needs to be replaced/repaired. Everyone I've seen with the XF or talked to about the XF (who had a DF/DF+/AF prior)---the experience has been pretty uniform: eyes light up, smiles, and pretty happy. The DF was a pretty mediocre body, but it did work. The XF generally works so well, I think it has actually caused disdain for the DF to increase...

Hope you get it sorted out in short order.

Ken

 

[GrahamWelland]

My only problems with the XF have been with the v4 firmware and IQ150. The sync is a problem when the exposure requires FP shutter and after a while if shooting longer exposure images will start getting out of sync.

My dealer is working the same issue with a number of other IQ1xx users who upgraded. I had to downgrade to v3 but I miss the XF controls on the IQ150 back. I too would love to be able to invoke all functions via the IQ back's LCD vs having to look down on the top XF LCD.

I've had a couple of random lockups but only with the v4 IQ software. Given that there are known issues with it and IQ1xx back's I'm waiting for the next firmware upgrade.

 

[Christopher]

@Craig quick question: what focus setting are you using ? As far as I can remember there are to "focus lock priority and release priority"

 

[Craig Stocks]

My focus settings are spot, single and focus. I've experimented with average instead of spot and get the same result.

Yesterday I re-ran my trim procedure and paid closer attention to what was happening. My home-made target uses a yardstick at a 30 degree angle where the focus target is at the 10 inch mark. Fort he last run I did a series of 10 half-presses to focus then exposed the frame. It took seven half-press sequences before the focus finally settled on the 10 inch mark for the last three frames. The actual focus point for the first seven frames fluctuated back and forth from 5.5 inches to 16 inches (from 10 feet away). I did note that the focus confirmation light did come on for each of the half-press sequences before I exposed the frame, but would start out as off with the next half-press sequence.

That, to me, is completely unacceptable auto-focus behavior and far worse than I experienced with my DF. I don't have the DF anymore to compare, but it certainly seems like the XF has more trouble finding an initial focus as well. With the DF I would usually just double-tap and was good to go. With the XF I frequently have to move it around the frame to get it to lock focus, add additional light from a bright flashlight, and then go through the tap-tap-tap-tap-check-tap-tap-check-Ok now I can start taking photos sequence. (I usually have a static subject in the studio so once I have it focused I turn off auto-focus.)

Focus stacking (at least with my setup) is very unreliable. My testing simulated a landscape near-far composition where I might want two frames, one near and one far. The problem is that after setting up the shot the auto-stacking sequence doesn't return to the same focus distance that was set. The focus readout on the LCD will show the correct value but the actual lens focus point is not the same. When I test with more than two frames it seems to work OK, so it may just be a bug in the firmware such that it doesn't work correctly with just two frames selected.

Obviously I'm working with my dealer but so far the issues are unresolved.

I would be curious if others who have had good results with the focus stack tool have tried it with only two frames.