Rodenstock HR Digaron-S 180mm ?

[Jamgolf]

Its quite difficult to find much information regarding this lens.
Are there any current (or prior) users of this lens willing to share some first hand feedback and images captured using this 180mm?
How does this lens compare to other lenses in the HW-S or HR-W range?

Thanks in advance!

 

[voidshatter]

I'm a keyboard-based photographer so can't help much here with real-world test shots with it.

I'm sure you've already looked into the sample image (IQ180) posted by rodenstock-photo: link, and I think it's quite impressive.

Looking into the MTF diagrams at their website it seems to perform even better than the 90HR-SW, but that's no surprise for a telephoto lens.

I'm with the Alpa system so I don't like the heavy and bulky long barrel, but since you are with Cambo you might find better alternatives e.g. bellow.

I'm sure it cannot be too wrong to click the "Add to cart" and "Begin checkout" buttons, since you are on the way to have a full set of Rodenstock HR! :grin:

 

[vjbelle]

As you know I shoot the 180mm Schneider Digitar and very much like the lens. I toyed with getting the Digaron S 180mm but it was the image circle that stopped me. I think that if you can get away from needing large movements and instead just swing around the nodal for pano's that this could be a wonderful lens. I would want to test it for sharpness but the mtf charts look very nice to me. I realize that this doesn't help you with respect to practical usage but thought I would pass along my thoughts. You may want to talk to Paula at Linhof Studio and get some reaction from her. She's very knowledgeable about these lenses......

Victor

 

[algrove]

Do some prefer the Schneider teles because they are lighter than the Rodenstock teles?

 

[Jamgolf]

I'm sure you've already looked into the sample image (IQ180) posted by rodenstock-photo: ... and I think it's quite impressive.

Thanks. Yes, I have downloaded that image. That's basically the only real piece of information available.

Looking into the MTF diagrams ... it seems to perform even better than the 90HR-SW, but that's no surprise for a telephoto lens.

I agree, MTF looks spectacular although the image circle is quite small (80mm) for a telephoto lens. But all Digaron-S lenses have smaller image circles compared to HR-Ws, but they also have impressive MTFs.

I'm sure it cannot be too wrong to click the "Add to cart" and "Begin checkout" buttons, since you are on the way to have a full set of Rodenstock HR! :grin:

OK - you got me there , I am generally quick to pull the trigger, but with other equipment its far easier to get out if something does not suit me. With technical equipment, it is considerably harder. So "Add to Cart" can also mean "Own in perpetuity" - so better be sure.

 

[dchew]

Do some prefer the Schneider teles because they are lighter than the Rodenstock teles?

I certainly do. I don't have the 180 but I do have the sk150. The filter threads are 40.5mm, and the total length of the lens in an Alpa mount is less than 1/2" longer than the 90hrsw (both are SB34's).

Dave

 

[vjbelle]

Do some prefer the Schneider teles because they are lighter than the Rodenstock teles?

The Rody and Schneider 180mm lenses (Digaron S and Digitar) are similar in weight. The Rody weighs about 100 grams more in copal 0 shutter which is minimal (both under 1lb). I've always wanted to test the Rody but its common for me to shift 10mm with the Schneider and this would be shifting the Rody to the edge which may or may not be detrimental. I would also not consider this lens on anything other than a copal 0 lens board rather than a proprietary mount either Alpa or Cambo as it would really be too far front forward for me.

Victor

 

[Jamgolf]

As you know I shoot the 180mm Schneider Digitar and very much like the lens. I toyed with getting the Digaron S 180mm but it was the image circle that stopped me. I think that if you can get away from needing large movements and instead just swing around the nodal for pano's that this could be a wonderful lens. I would want to test it for sharpness but the mtf charts look very nice to me. I realize that this doesn't help you with respect to practical usage but thought I would pass along my thoughts. You may want to talk to Paula at Linhof Studio and get some reaction from her. She's very knowledgeable about these lenses......
Victor

I appreciate your input, Victor. I know you've got the 100, 120, 150, 180 Schneiders and put them to great use. Unfortunately, none of these are available any more and they are hard to find now even in the pre-owned market. Rodenstock 180 has always caught my imagination. Its MFT is seriously impressive.

Its surprizing that no one has ever posted an image captured with this lens in the "images with ..." threads. That can mean not that many people have tried it or it can also mean that the ones who tried it, did not feel excited enough to share the images captured.
May be one of these sasquatch owners will speak up

 

[vjbelle]

I appreciate your input, Victor. I know you've got the 100, 120, 150, 180 Schneiders and put them to great use. Unfortunately, none of these are available any more and they are hard to find now even in the pre-owned market. Rodenstock 180 has always caught my imagination. Its MFT is seriously impressive.

Its surprizing that no one has ever posted an image captured with this lens in the "images with ..." threads. That can mean not that many people have tried it or it can also mean that the ones who tried it, did not feel excited enough to share the images captured.
May be one of these sasquatch owners will speak up

I think that you should try to find a way to try it for yourself..... The MTF is flat as a board but that doesn't mean anything as it could be theoretical. You really, really do need to consider an Actus as it would make all of this much easier. I do feel, though would have to be tested, that the Rody could be better than the Schneider but with limited movements.

Victot

 

[JohnBrew]

I have the APO-Sironar Digital 180 which may be the older version of the lens you ask about? Maybe same lens formula? Maybe someone can enlighten me on this. Anyway, I've only had the lens for about three months and it demonstrated some odd behavior so I sent it to Rod Klukas, the Arca-Swiss man in US, who confirmed there was something out of synch with it and it went to Arca-Swiss in France for re-calibration. I have yet to shoot it since it returned but plan to use it either Thursday or Friday depending on the weather. If you would like me to share some images I would be happy to PM them to you with my observations.

 

[Jamgolf]

I have the APO-Sironar Digital 180 which may be the older version of the lens you ask about? Maybe same lens formula? Maybe someone can enlighten me on this.

I think the Digaron-S 180 might be a totally different lens because it has only an 80mm image circle.
Contrast this to:
1. Sinaron-S 180 with a 262mm image circle
2. Sinaron Digital 180mm with a 168mm image circle
(Source: sinar_2001_brochure_part_06-5.pdf)

I am always confused by Sironar vs Sinaron. I realize your lens is Sironar and this data is for Sinaron lenses, but as I understand Sinar lenses are re-branded Rodenstocks. But even still according to B&H APO-Sironar Digital 180 (your lens) has an image circle of 150mm.

But all of these are definitely a lot more than 80mm image circle - hence I conclude they must be different.
Although some think Rodenstock APO-Sironar Digital HR is now called the Rodenstock HR Digaron-S 5.6/180 mm (source).
But I do not believe so, since the evidene suggests otherwise - perhaps I am wrong ...
So, clear as mud (I know)

If you would like me to share some images I would be happy to PM them to you with my observations.

Thanks very much for your offer. I'll PM you. I'd appreciate some some raw files, even just for a comparison/reference.

 

[Alkibiades]

Rodenstock have two Digital 180 mm lenses:
- Apo Sironar Digital 5,6/180 mm/ Sinaron Digital that based on classic symetrical gaus design with modern ED glasses ( digital optimated Apo Sironar S)
- Apo Sironar Digital HR/ Digaron/ Sinaron Digital HR S 180 mm- absolutly different lens design, similar to other retrofocus Digaron S lenses like 4/60 HR

Sinaron S is the standart analoge 72° lens without ED glass- Apo Sironar -N.

Schneider use for they longer lenses like 180 and 210 mm Digitars the Apo Componon HM lensdesign.

 

[vjbelle]

I have the APO-Sironar Digital 180 which may be the older version of the lens you ask about? Maybe same lens formula? Maybe someone can enlighten me on this.

That lens is very different from the Digaron-S. Its main use, from my point of view, was/is for film with a very large image circle. The couple of mtf charts that Rody publishes are for other lenses in that group and only show line pairs to 30 which is nowhere near the resolution needed for todays backs.

Victor

 

[JohnBrew]

That lens is very different from the Digaron-S. Its main use, from my point of view, was/is for film with a very large image circle. The couple of mtf charts that Rody publishes are for other lenses in that group and only show line pairs to 30 which is nowhere near the resolution needed for todays backs.

Victor

Good to know. I am shooting film also . Thanks.

OTH, from Rodenstock: Apo-Sironar Digital. This line of lenses provides the photographer with even larger image circles for digital photos with adjustable professional cameras.
Due to the small formats on the one hand (which are sensitive to higher diffraction!)...digital photography does not allow the lenses to be stopped down as much as in conventional large-format photography. As a result, these lenses have been optimized for a working aperture of 8 to 11.

This doesn't sound to me like they were intended for film.

Addition: I don't want to beat this thing to death but I stand corrected by a later Rodenstock quote: "The Apo-Sironar digital...the ideal high performance lenses for all who need digital photography as well as analog photography on roll film or sheet film."

Further research revealed the HR Digaron S 180 replaced the Apo-Sironar Digital 180 while other Apo-Sironar Digitals continued production so Rodenstock must have felt the first 180 could be improved.

 

[dnercesian]

Okay, earlier today in another thread there were a few requests regarding this lens, so here is something I put together for you guys. Lets start with shooting distances. Disclaimer, I am using the 300mm rail on the Actus DB2.

These were shot as a part of a test shoot today on the Cambo Actus DB2 and IQ3100 with the Rodenstock 180mm HR-S.

ISO 200, f/8, 1/125 - LED Fresnel Lights (4 of them)

4 foot distance. No cropping.

5 feet 9 inches distance. No cropping.

My next post will be a drop box link with 10 images. 9 of them are a series 3 rows/3 columns hitting the center and every extremity of the Acus DB2 shifting range. So Center, 12mm up, 15mm down, 20mm left, 20mm right, and combinations of these movements out to each extreme corner. The images are all labeled by name saying which movement/movements each represents.

The 10th image is labeled "Panorama". Obviously, this is a photoshop stitch of all 9 images into a ~309 megapixel file. These are uploading now and I will post as soon as they are available.

 

[dnercesian]

Here is the dropbox link. These images are unedited. They were converted to jpeg on export, with the panorama being stitched in photoshop CC from these jpegs. No LCC or any other edits. the shooting distance was 9 feet. ISO 100, f/8, 0.5 seconds.

I am posting this now while they are still uploading, so if you go check and don't see 10 images marked as mentioned in my previous post, then they are still uploading.


Rodenstock 180mm HR-S Extreme Shift Test (Actus DB2 limits)

 

[Digitalcameraman]

Thanks for posting Darwin.

And we were able to delivered this new lens in about a week. It can be purchased in a Cambo WRS mount with or without Tilt. Or it can be ordered as regular lens to be used on Cambo Actus DB or Mini.

Here is the dropbox link. These images are unedited. They were converted to jpeg on export, with the panorama being stitched in photoshop CC from these jpegs. No LCC or any other edits. the shooting distance was 9 feet. ISO 100, f/8, 0.5 seconds.

I am posting this now while they are still uploading, so if you go check and don't see 10 images marked as mentioned in my previous post, then they are still uploading.


Rodenstock 180mm HR-S Extreme Shift Test (Actus DB2 limits)

 

[stonebird]

Apo Sironar Digital 5,6/180 mm
Apo HR Digaron-S 5,6/180 mm
Apo Sironar Digital HR 5,6/180 mm


Rodenstock APO-Sironar Digital HR which is now called the Rodenstock HR Digaron-S 5.6/180 mm.