X1D: Where are we at?

[siddhaarta]

Good question. I've used the X1D for just over one year and here are my observations and wish list:

The X1D comes closest to the ideal camera for me compared to its predecessors in my kit. I emphasize “comes closest” and “for me” for good reason. There are several major differentiators that I’m pleased with:

• Simplicity and ease of use - the UI is simple, the buttons and knobs are few and large, and the rear LCD is made for people, like me, who would prefer not to put on reading glasses to change camera settings; the menu is simple and iconic; the rear touchscreen works like a smartphone using touch, tap and pinch gestures
• Color and dynamic range - the colors straight out of the camera are closer to the reality I see in front of me than any other camera I’ve used; the dynamic range and ISO performance are good enough to reduce or eliminate the need for grad ND filters, or flash indoors; shooting at ISO 3200 or 6400 yields quite acceptable results
• Size and weight - I have large hands [insert political humor here] and have occasionally (with Nikon bodies) used a vertical grip accessory to lengthen the grip of a camera to accommodate my hand size. The X1D fits perfectly; the camera and prime lenses are well balanced allowing hand-held shooting without IBIS
• Lenses - the native XCD lenses (so far) are exceptional in performance; sharpness edge-to-edge and corner-to-corner is as good as or better than the Zeiss, Phase One Schneider, Pentax, Leica M and Leica S lenses that I’ve used

Having said all that, there are a few things that could be improved, and likely will be in an X2D (or X1DII). The in-camera CPU is probably incapable of doing some tasks faster (e.g., writing files to the SD card, AF-C rate, start-up time, EVF frame rate). The CPU may also be the bottleneck to getting a live histogram. Not having a live histogram isn’t a deal breaker for me, but it’s something I’d enjoy using. The 2.36MP EVF is virtually identical to that of the a7RII. Sony (with the a7RIII) and Fuji (with the GFX) have gone to a 3.63MP EVF and a faster frame rate. The Leica SL has a 4.41MP EVF. Clearly the X1D’s EVF needs an eventual upgrade. Finally, the movement of the AF point using either the scroll wheels or the rear LCD touchscreen is less desirable than using a rear joystick. And Ming Thein agrees. None of my wish list items can be accomplished with a firmware update (except perhaps a live histogram), so the next iteration of the camera body is something I’ll look forward to.

I'd prefer an internal redesign, not a new form factor, to improve performance per my wish list. I don't need more megapixels though and would likely find hand-held shooting to be very difficult with a 100MP camera. Hand-held shooting is one of the joys I have with the X1D.

Finally, here's a portion of a comment from Ming Thein's blog that I couldn't agree with more:



Joe

After nearly one year using the X1D, I agree with nearly all of your points. For me, there are still 4 major shortcomings of the camera (3 of them could be implemented with firmware, I assume):

1) lack of automated focus stacking: with MFD, focus stacking has become a regular exercise (still life, landscape, macro). Problem is that with focus-by-wire lenses it is a PITA. With my previous Leica S, this was fun (although slow), as the lenses give you the mechanical feed-back. I am optimistic that Hasselblad implements something similar what Nikon D850 or P1 already can do.

2) not so-good depth of field control: yes, there is the DoF button, but Leica S has this implemented in a perfect way, as you see the estimated DoF distances in the top-LCD. So it is quite easy to plan the hyperfocal distance for landscape shots. Any distance information would be also welcome as the focus-by-wire lenses have no markings, making it complicated to use an external app.

3) no way to control shutter speed algorithm in AE-mode: the shortest shutter speed seems to be 1/focal length. I would like to have more flexibility to program this (fixed shutter speeds or at least 1/2 or 1/3 x focal length), as most other cameras do.

4) no tiltable LCD

 

[ErikKaffehr]

Hi Joe,

I read some recent write up un Ming Thein's blog. It seems that his analysis is pretty close to mine. Hasselblad did develop the X1D within the constraints they had. Developing a proprietary ASIC and thermal management in connection with continous feed to live view has been an issue.

A lot of improvements have done in firmware. But, hardware implementation sets some limits.

He also wrote that even he has not received the latest firmware. Hasselblad does what it can to deliver to customer so Chief Of Strategy needs to wait.

Ming tein indicates that he hopes that the next generation of sensor will have PDAF.

It is a worthwhile read: https://blog.mingthein.com/2018/01/31/long-term-review-the-hasselblad-x1d/

Best regards
Erik

Good question. I've used the X1D for just over one year and here are my observations and wish list:

The X1D comes closest to the ideal camera for me compared to its predecessors in my kit. I emphasize “comes closest” and “for me” for good reason. There are several major differentiators that I’m pleased with:

• Simplicity and ease of use - the UI is simple, the buttons and knobs are few and large, and the rear LCD is made for people, like me, who would prefer not to put on reading glasses to change camera settings; the menu is simple and iconic; the rear touchscreen works like a smartphone using touch, tap and pinch gestures
• Color and dynamic range - the colors straight out of the camera are closer to the reality I see in front of me than any other camera I’ve used; the dynamic range and ISO performance are good enough to reduce or eliminate the need for grad ND filters, or flash indoors; shooting at ISO 3200 or 6400 yields quite acceptable results
• Size and weight - I have large hands [insert political humor here] and have occasionally (with Nikon bodies) used a vertical grip accessory to lengthen the grip of a camera to accommodate my hand size. The X1D fits perfectly; the camera and prime lenses are well balanced allowing hand-held shooting without IBIS
• Lenses - the native XCD lenses (so far) are exceptional in performance; sharpness edge-to-edge and corner-to-corner is as good as or better than the Zeiss, Phase One Schneider, Pentax, Leica M and Leica S lenses that I’ve used

Having said all that, there are a few things that could be improved, and likely will be in an X2D (or X1DII). The in-camera CPU is probably incapable of doing some tasks faster (e.g., writing files to the SD card, AF-C rate, start-up time, EVF frame rate). The CPU may also be the bottleneck to getting a live histogram. Not having a live histogram isn’t a deal breaker for me, but it’s something I’d enjoy using. The 2.36MP EVF is virtually identical to that of the a7RII. Sony (with the a7RIII) and Fuji (with the GFX) have gone to a 3.63MP EVF and a faster frame rate. The Leica SL has a 4.41MP EVF. Clearly the X1D’s EVF needs an eventual upgrade. Finally, the movement of the AF point using either the scroll wheels or the rear LCD touchscreen is less desirable than using a rear joystick. And Ming Thein agrees. None of my wish list items can be accomplished with a firmware update (except perhaps a live histogram), so the next iteration of the camera body is something I’ll look forward to.

I'd prefer an internal redesign, not a new form factor, to improve performance per my wish list. I don't need more megapixels though and would likely find hand-held shooting to be very difficult with a 100MP camera. Hand-held shooting is one of the joys I have with the X1D.

Finally, here's a portion of a comment from Ming Thein's blog that I couldn't agree with more:



Joe

 

[sog1927]

I agree, especially with items 2 & 3. I'm not a big user of focus stacking, but it would be a good addition to the X1D feature set, and seems consistent with recent offerings from other camera makers. While all but item 4 are likely possible with firmware, the current CPU may not be powerful enough to carry out those tasks. Hence an X2D or X1DII. Also, I'm reminded when I compare the X1D to those cameras with tilt-type rear LCD displays that the X1D is sleeker and less thick. A tilt-type rear LCD display would change the form factor and may, as a consequence, be a turnoff (for me).

One more "wish list" feature I would add to our combined lists is the ability to use Auto ISO in M mode. I'd like to be able to set the shutter speed and aperture and let the ISO "float". There is some debate about this feature, so I'm not suggesting it as the default behavior, just as an option.

Joe

The auto ISO in M mode would be somewhat useful to me as well.

Other thoughts:
If they display DoF, I'd like to be able to set the acceptable circle of confusion somewhere. Maybe the S007 does that (I've never used one). What's the default going to be? A single pixel?

Yes, a tiltable LCD would be lovely - although like you I don't think I'm willing to sacrifice the wonderful form factor to get it.

A faster readout time on the sensor would be fantastic - and I think that's a given looking at the sensor roadmap. I'd also like to be able to use flash with the electronic shutter if the shutter speed is set to longer than the readout time (but thats for a very specific application that wouldn't apply to most people).

 

[D&A]

Although I am not an owner nor a regular user of the X1D (although I have had occasional use of one at various times this past year), I wouldn't be qualified to submit an extended wishlist. In my limited use though I felt for myself and my own particular use and needs, improvements implemented as some pointed out by others, would be helpful. They are the following:

1. Start up time shortened.

2. EVF resolution and frame rate. As I am most often a user of cameras with OVF's, I have adjusted to using a lower quality external EVF with a given camera, but ultimately my eyesight fatigues with extended use and so in this one area, I was sensitive to the X1D's current implementation from the get go. I realize its subjective from user to user.

3. Blackout time was maybe the biggest bugaboo for myself in certain applications and often would be a no-go for these applications.

4. Another important change would be how the Af point is changed/moved...preferably via a touch pad as previous mentioned. For myself, it needs to be changed much faster, on the fly.

5. Ming's mention of a future 100MP sensor with PDAF would be an important step in my opinion although the 100MP part although nice isn't an absolute necessity, especially if it means keeping the level of processing and operational speed at current levels of the X1D. I believe (although I am no expert), that both the readout speed of any new sensor as well as processing speed of the internal processor, would have to be increased.

6. Although not a show stopper for me, but I generally like knowing and having some idea of the depth of field using a given lens at a specific f-stop. Yes, with high level digital cameras with a good LCD, that can often be circumvented as well as using depth of field charts. If it was possible to display a given lens's DoF, that would be useful. I'd suppose it would take a higher level algorithm to be able to have a user set the acceptable circle of confusion in conjunction with this feature (as suggested), but that again brings on a complexity that I'm not sure would be in line with the X1D design philosophy.

7. I like the idea of Auto ISO being implemented in manual mode as Joe suggested. For myself, it provides a unique mode in use during concert photography, with knowledge that the stage lighting might/will momentarily change intermittently in a fast sequence of fast moving subjects. The ability to keep both the aperture (for a defined Dof) and shutter speed for moving subjects consistent, is a big plus while the auto ISO adjustment will address the changes in exposure.

Some (not all) of the above niggling "wants" consists of the primary reasons I ultimately deferred considering moving to the X1D biosphere, although the camera is certainly compelling in so many ways and still gets my rapt attention when it's both discussed (as its done here on Getdpi) and the impressive and realistic images that are posted.

Dave (D&A)

*** P.S. I periodically added additions and made changes to my list "above" after my initial posting.

 

[tcdeveau]

My biggest X wish right now is release of the 21mm, 65mm, and 35-75mm I've been checking B&H every day for about the past two months to see for preorder buttons and nothing yet. Sigh.

 

[etto72]

My biggest X wish right now is release of the 21mm, 65mm, and 35-75mm I've been checking B&H every day for about the past two months to see for preorder buttons and nothing yet. Sigh.

Me too!!
I really want and need the 65mm 2.8, is the equivalent of my favorite focal length and so far also the fastest aperture available !
There crazy thing is that those lenses are not any longer on the Hasselblad website:banghead::banghead:

 

[sog1927]

Me too!!
I really want and need the 65mm 2.8, is the equivalent of my favorite focal length and so far also the fastest aperture available !
There crazy thing is that those lenses are not any longer on the Hasselblad website:banghead::banghead:

Well, that's certainly alarming. Or at least disappointing.

 

[etto72]

As Ming Thein said several times some of the limitations of the X1D are related to the Sensor hardware, which is not surprising considering that the 50mp Sensor of the X1D is the first generation medium format sensor which Sony ever produced, it was lunched in 2014!!
and we also shouldn't forget that it was aimed to reflex medium format cameras


For those that are still confused, Sony is producing only 2 types of medium format sensors:
44x33 and the 55x41

The new generation (2nd) Sony 44x33(for cameras like the X1D) which was announced in November 2017 comes only at 100mp, but it seems that the data specs are a huge jump forward from of the old 50MP (6fps at 14-bit and 4k/30fps video at 12bit)
and if I understood well from Thein, it will feature PDAF too, which will improve AF speed dramatically.


Beside the sensor, the X2D will have a Joystick (both Bengston and Thein seems to agree that this addition is necessary), I also think that we may see an higher resolution EVF (not sure if will be as good as the one of the SL) but frankly I am confident that no camera design changes are needed since I think many photographers are saying (and I full agree) that the X1D is by far one the best camera to hold in the hands !

I am still looking forward to some further firmware improvements.
Besides Live histogram and minimum shutter speed in auto Iso mode(as Joe mentioned), I do really want to see an Intervalometer!!!
This camera could make the most fantastic time lapse files but right now there is no way to do it at less you tether the camera from a laptop using the Phocus intervalometer function....which is very unpractical on location

I am also looking to see the X1D successor ..... and I hope won't take too long

Cheers
Ettore

Although I am not an owner nor a regular user of the X1D (although I have had occasional use of one at various times this past year), I wouldn't be qualified to submit an extended wishlist. In my limited use though I felt for myself and my own particular use and needs, improvements implemented as some pointed out by others, would be helpful. They are the following:

1. Start up time shortened.

2. EVF resolution and frame rate. As I am most often a user of cameras with OVF's, I have adjusted to using a lower quality external EVF with a given camera, but ultimately my eyesight fatigues with extended use and so in this one area, I was sensitive to the X1D's current implementation from the get go. I realize its subjective from user to user.

3. Blackout time was maybe the biggest bugaboo for myself in certain applications and often would be a no-go for these applications.

4. Another important change would be how the Af point is changed/moved...preferably via a touch pad as previous mentioned. For myself, it needs to be changed much faster, on the fly.

5. Ming's mention of a future 100MP sensor with PDAF would be an important step in my opinion although the 100MP part although nice isn't an absolute necessary, especially if it means keeping the level of processing and operational speed at current levels of the X1D. I believe (although I am no expert), that both the readout speed of any new sensor as well as processing speed of the internal processor, would have to be increased.

6. Although no a show stopper for me, but I generally like knowing and having some idea of the depth of field using a given lens at a specific f-stop. Yes, with high level digital cameras with a good LCD can often circumvent this as well as using depth of field charts, If it was possible to display a given lens's DoF, that would be useful. I'd suppose it would take a higher level algorithm to be able to have a user set the acceptable circle of confusion in conjunction with this feature (as suggested), but that again brings on a complexity that I'm not sure would be in line with the X1D design philosophy.

7. I like the idea of Auto ISO being implemented in manual mode as Joe suggested. For myself, it provides a unique mode in use during concert photography, with knowledge that the stage lighting might/will momentarily change intermittently in a fast sequence of fast moving subjects. The ability to keep both the aperture (for a defined Dof) and shutter speed for moving subjects consistent, is a big plus while the auto ISO adjustment will address the changes in exposure.

Some (not all) of the above niggling "wants" consists of the primary reasons I ultimately deferred considering moving to the X1D biosphere, although the camera is certainly compelling in many ways and still gets my rapt attention when it's both discussed (as its done here on Getdpi) and the impressive and realistic images that are posted.

Dave (D&A)

*** P.S. I periodically added additions and made changes to my list "above" after my initial posting.

 

[siddhaarta]

The auto ISO in M mode would be somewhat useful to me as well.

Other thoughts:
If they display DoF, I'd like to be able to set the acceptable circle of confusion somewhere. Maybe the S007 does that (I've never used one). What's the default going to be? A single pixel?

Yes, a tiltable LCD would be lovely - although like you I don't think I'm willing to sacrifice the wonderful form factor to get it.

A faster readout time on the sensor would be fantastic - and I think that's a given looking at the sensor roadmap. I'd also like to be able to use flash with the electronic shutter if the shutter speed is set to longer than the readout time (but thats for a very specific application that wouldn't apply to most people).

As regards circle of confusion, Leica S007 does not allow to set this variable, but the setting is quite "conservative". With my X1D, I use the iPhone app "TrueDOF-Pro", but the problem is, I need to guesstimate the distance in focus (as X1D does not provide any info) or use a Disto.

As regards tilt-LCD, sure there are trade-offs, and it depends on personal user-cases. In my case, I work a lot near the ground, and I am getting older ... an interesting alternative would be an external tiltable EVF for the hot-shoe (something like the Fuji GFX has). Maybe the next-generation CPU does allow something like that.

 

[tcdeveau]

Me too!!
I really want and need the 65mm 2.8, is the equivalent of my favorite focal length and so far also the fastest aperture available !
There crazy thing is that those lenses are not any longer on the Hasselblad website:banghead::banghead:

The press release from November at the very least is still up. I asked Ming Thien recently about them via Facebook in a comment on one of his posts, and he replied something to the tune of they’ll be coming soon, but the supply chain is complex and there are a lot of variables and they want to make sure they do it right and so forth. The press release said available expected to be available first half of 2018 (except for the 80mm, which was expected second half), so my guess is we’ll them for preorder/order sometime around May-June.

I just hope it doesn’t take them 8 months to deliver like it did the 120mm and that the prices are reasonable...esp for the 65mm which I need the most.

 

[DB5]

My biggest X wish right now is release of the 21mm, 65mm, and 35-75mm I've been checking B&H every day for about the past two months to see for preorder buttons and nothing yet. Sigh.

This is what's holding me back too.

There should have been the 65 at launch, that was a really big mistake I think.

The 35-75 will be very useful and I'm also waiting for the fast 80mm.

I'm not going for it until it's right and I hope it's not another 2 years!

Actually the fast 80mm has me wondering about the X in general. I wonder if we see it when they squeeze the full frame 645 sensor in it? The body certainly looks modular enough in the way it has been made to house it, so who knows.

 

[sog1927]

This is what's holding me back too.

There should have been the 65 at launch, that was a really big mistake I think.

The 35-75 will be very useful and I'm also waiting for the fast 80mm.

I'm not going for it until it's right and I hope it's not another 2 years!

Actually the fast 80mm has me wondering about the X in general. I wonder if we see it when they squeeze the full frame 645 sensor in it? The body certainly looks modular enough in the way it has been made to house it, so who knows.

I don't have any native lenses yet. I've solely been using my V-series lenses with the Fotodiox adapter and the electronic shutter. I wanted a chance to evaluate the camera body (and return it if I didn't like it) before blowing a bunch of cash on new lenses.

I had a lot of theoretical objections to the X1d early on (fiddly firmware, no way to use adapted lenses (other than H) and hence no easy migration path for us stubborn V-series dinosaurs, etc.). Nearly all of them have been dealt with as the firmware has matured (which is why I eventually bought one). The blackout doesn't really bother me - I'm used to a 503, after all (i.e., I'm still impressed that I don't have to wind it to get the view back ). Ming Thein has explained why the startup time is the way it is (there's a large amount of custom calibration data for each individual sensor that's being loaded into RAM - it's why the color is so consistent). I don't find it that bad. It's faster than my Aptus digital back. The live view/100% zoom/focus peaking is really great - it's a much easier camera to manually focus than, say, a Leica S006 (which I have). I do intend to set up a custom mode with another button as the zoom (the "star" button is hard for me to hit accurately when I'm looking through the EVF), but other than that it's great. That and the fact that the GPS receiver seems to be completely useless indoors.

I really want a cable release.

My goal with the X1d was, quite frankly, a smaller, lighter alternative to the V-series with good image quality - mainly for travel since my habit of hauling around tens of kilograms of V-series gear on trips has proven to be something of a domestic irritant.:shocked: Obviously, I'm really interested in the zoom.

I can't comment on autofocus. I've never used autofocus in my life. I'll probably try it when I actually get some XCD lenses.


If Hasseblad makes a mirrorless body with (say) a 150 MP 645 sensor, it won't be an X-series camera. I don't think any of the XCD lenses will cover 645 (looking at the relative illumination charts on the datasheets). It'll be something else, like an H7 or that mockup modular camera of the future Hasselblad passed around at Photokina.

As for the 80mm - it's much easier to make excellent fast lenses with limited coverage so I seriously doubt it would cover 645 - particularly if it's much faster than f/2.

 

[Paratom]

After using the x1d a little bit more I really like the compact size of the body and lenses. The camera sits very good in the hand. So it fulfils what I expect, medium format in a compact package.
The other side is speed, here it feels that the x1d is the 5 year old camera and the S is the new addition to the market. Start up time, black out, shot to shot time.
I also learned today that in low light 1,5 stops faster lens of the S-system doesnt hurt.
So I agree with others, a fast 80mm would be welcome.
On the other side you cant have all at the same time, fast and compact.

I would love to be able to adapt my 70mm S lens to the x1d.

 

[sog1927]

And do you believe the black version draws less attention than the silver one?
Best, Thomas

Particularly from snipers (historical reference to the origin of the "black professional body" that may be lost on younger photographers).

 

[sog1927]

And do you believe the black version draws less attention than the silver one?
Best, Thomas

Particularly from snipers (historical reference to the origin of the "black professional body" that may be lost on younger photographers).

 

[sog1927]

After using the x1d a little bit more I really like the compact size of the body and lenses. The camera sits very good in the hand. So it fulfils what I expect, medium format in a compact package.

I am just plain astounded to have a quasi-MF body that I can (and do) literally stick in a jacket pocket. It's simply amazing.

 

[SrMphoto]

I am surprised how well touch-pad based focus point positioning works. No other camera that I own implements it as well, kudos to HB engineers. In fact, I prefer it to using the joystick. However, setting focus point in live view is a bit tedious.

Would like to see focus bracketing (not focus stacking, i.e., do not need the camera to assemble/stack the images), but it should be smarter than many other implementations that provide only a step number and number of images to be taken.

Blackout time and start-up time could be shorter.

Stopped using a cable release on all my cameras (using shutter delay instead), therefore not missing it.

Very happy with X1D, but missing some lenses, especially 135mm and 21mm (expected this year).

 

[OleBe]

Dear all,

so my camera has arrived. Really impressed by the build quality and first quick shots.

Have tested my Godox X-ProN - TTL is NOT working for the time being, manual works splendid. Am in contact with Hasselblad to check this. Profoto Air TTL for Nikon works I was told, so there should not be a reason why the Godox does not (both using i-TTL).

However one thing which I would like to know is why my overexposure warning is only blinking in playback mode. Is that not supposed to do the same in live view? Someone able to help out?

Firmware on everything is the latest. Had checked it first thing.


Thank you!

 

[sog1927]

Stopped using a cable release on all my cameras (using shutter delay instead), therefore not missing it.

Shutter delay doesn't have an option for "trip the shutter when the wind dies down". At least not in the current firmware release.

 

[gmfotografie]

Hi Guys, i´ve got the X1D for testing one Week ;-)

Love this baby - will order it...

A Question:
I will use my Broncolor Flash.
Put the RFS Trigger on it and use the Shutter - but there is no signal to the Flash.
In the menue the flash is turned on.

Anybody have some tipps for me ?

THX Michael

Soled !!! - I had the electronic shutter on...