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X1D: Where are we at?

J

JeRuFo

Active member
I'm still more interested in the new XCD lenses than I am the X2D at the moment.
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Yes, exactly. If the lens roadmap HB put out still holds true, there should be a new lens at the dealer about every week starting now...

I wasn't holding my breath before, but a relatively complete lens kit before the summer seems far off.
 
J

jduncan

Active member
Joe Colson said:
The Phase One announcement is definitely encouraging because it means that the 100MP 33x44mm sensor is in production and going into cameras that will be shipped in June, albeit "industrial" aerial cameras. I would expect Hasselblad and Fuji to announce new products at Photokina or in the flurry of pre-Photokina press coverage in late summer. But the sizes of these companies are radically different. Hasselblad is tiny in comparison to Fuji and likely needs to squeeze all the juice it can from the current models before cannibalizing the market for those models by announcing new ones. I also expect the price point for a 100MP X camera to be north of $10K USD.

With a 100MP sensor comes the need to process twice the amount of data in-camera for a 3.63MP EVF (my prediction), higher resolution Live View rear LCD display, creating a RAW file (and JPEG if the user chooses), and writing to an SD card. That processing produces heat, which may be the biggest bugaboo in the design process. We all know how hot the base of the current X1D gets during use. I'm a fan of the current X1D form factor and would not be in favor of changing that form factor to accommodate a 100MP sensor.

In the meantime, my X1D is performing great. I just got back from the Smokies and had 2½ days of fun photography, sometimes in the rain. I had one "lock up" that required a battery drop and reboot, but nothing that would cause me to miss a shot. I'm in the "good enough" zone.

Joe
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Hi,

I agree with you, but wanted to add some extra bits:

1) Following Ming Thein comments about the "needs of X1D" I will hope that they offload part of the software functions to ASIC (application specific integrated circuit) or FPGAs or even better DSPs (fully programmable thus). If they do that, and Thein was not venting because they don't listen to him, that improve the performance per watt in a meaningful way. Kepping the form-factor as close as possible is key.

2) They could go the two cameras during the transition route. They will have the same sensor size, and that is less than ideal and will let them open to a P1 assault but it will work for them: Sale the camera around 10K and keep the X1D at the current discount price until sellout. This is the last time the jump in resolution will be so high in a long time, so, if there is a moment to do that is now.

3) The new sensor, as stated before is not only about resolution. The capabilities it has, including readout time are much better.

4) I hope they are working on the "Big sensor" mirrorless. I am not sure that the traditional MF format modular construction will support the tolerances of a 150mpixel sensor, let alone a 200Mpixel one. They need new lenses, and I am not sure they can sustain the development of two different platforms simultaneously.

Best regards,
 
S

sog1927

Member
Just a few observations, now that I've actually gotten some X lenses and can use the camera as it was intended to be used:

1) This my first autofocus camera. After years working with V-series Hasselblads and large-format cameras, I think I pretty much hate autofocus. I find manual focus on the X1d to be really easy with focus-peaking and 100% magnification (for critical work). I can manually focus faster than autofocus and I think my hit rate is higher.

2) The lenses are fantastic

3) The GPS doodad is my least favorite part of the system. At least around here (Boulder, CO, USA), it really doesn't work at all indoors. It also seems to slip out of the hot shoe whenever I remove the camera from my bag. In fact, it may have done so for the very last time since I have been unable to locate it for a couple of days. This may be a blessing in disguise.

4) The sensor is (still) fantastic

5) The form factor is (still) fantastic

6) Did I mention the lenses are fantastic?

All in all, I really like the camera (although a wired release would be nice).
 
G

gmfotografie

Well-known member
Is there chance for flashing with electronic shutter activated?

in other words ... do i have a possibility to use a cambo actus , view camera, and do flashing

best michael
 
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S

sog1927

Member
gmfotografie said:
Is there chance for flashing with electronic shutter activated?

in other words ... do i have a possibility to use a cambo actus , view camera, and do flashing

best michael
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No. The long readout time of the sensor (about 0.3 seconds) really wouldn't permit it to be useful in most circumstances (your shutter speed would have to he longer than the readout time for the whole sensor to be illuminated by the flash), so flash is disabled when the electronic shutter is enabled. If your shutter speed was long enough, I suppose you could conceivably do what used to be known as "open flash" (firing the flash manually while the shutter is "open"). I haven't tried it, though.

See: http://photographytraining.tpub.com/14209/css/Open-Flash-144.htm for a discussion of open flash, if you're not familiar with it.
 
S

siddhaarta

Member
The rumor seems correct.

In Germany it is listed for preorder for 3.568 EUR, including 19% VAT.

Hopefully, on Monday we get to see the tech sheet with the MTF.
 
T

tcdeveau

Well-known member
siddhaarta said:
The rumor seems correct.

In Germany it is listed for preorder for 3.568 EUR, including 19% VAT.

Hopefully, on Monday we get to see the tech sheet with the MTF.
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Good deal. I don’t see any preorder info here in the US yet.

Are the 65mm, 35-75mm, and 135mm also available for preorder over in Germany or just the 21mm?
 
S

siddhaarta

Member
tcdeveau said:
Good deal. I don’t see any preorder info here in the US yet.

Are the 65mm, 35-75mm, and 135mm also available for preorder over in Germany or just the 21mm?
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I am pretty sure that Monday the preorder channels will be open all over.

No news yet on the other lenses though.
 
J

jduncan

Active member
for
tcdeveau said:
Yesss :clap:

I went ahead and placed my order through the Hasselblad US Store. No sales tax and free shipping, says estimated time of delivery is 15 days.

Oddly B&H doesn't have it available for pre-order yet but Adorama does.

Here's the datasheet: https://cdn.hasselblad.com/76a0253f-3df6-49d6-b37c-1934c22a4710_xcd21+datasheet+uk+180420.pdf

Definitely wasn't expecting a 77mm filter thread, or for it to be under $4k.
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It's not that odd. B&H is not often the first to have preorder links. They are probably negotiating with Hasselblad. I am a little bit concerned with the design: Light, compact and with a 77mm filter (beautiful). I hope they did not prioritize size over all other factors. Phocus will handle vignette, but not all the other optical parameters. If the lens proves to be very good, like the others on the XD series, this is truly a winner.

Best regards,
 
H

hcubell

Well-known member
jduncan said:
for

It's not that odd. B&H is not often the first to have preorder links. They are probably negotiating with Hasselblad. I am a little bit concerned with the design: Light, compact and with a 77mm filter (beautiful). I hope they did not prioritize size over all other factors. Phocus will handle vignette, but not all the other optical parameters. If the lens proves to be very good, like the others on the XD series, this is truly a winner.

Best regards,
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Maximum aperture is f/4. I believe they prioritized size over speed. Thankfully.
 
T

tcdeveau

Well-known member
jduncan said:
for

It's not that odd. B&H is not often the first to have preorder links. They are probably negotiating with Hasselblad. I am a little bit concerned with the design: Light, compact and with a 77mm filter (beautiful). I hope they did not prioritize size over all other factors. Phocus will handle vignette, but not all the other optical parameters. If the lens proves to be very good, like the others on the XD series, this is truly a winner.

Best regards,
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Yeah I have some of the same concerns. I was definitely expecting an 82mm filter thread like the Fuji GF 23mm. We'll see what trade-offs there are, if any, when they start getting out in the wild. I'm happy to post sample shots, impressions, etc. when I get mine. Hopefully it'll get here in a little over two weeks like they said.
 
H

hcubell

Well-known member
tcdeveau said:
Yeah I have some of the same concerns. I was definitely expecting an 82mm filter thread like the Fuji GF 23mm. We'll see what trade-offs there are, if any, when they start getting out in the wild. I'm happy to post sample shots, impressions, etc. when I get mine. Hopefully it'll get here in a little over two weeks like they said.
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There are MTF charts posted on the Hasselblad web site for the lens. These are based upon actual measurements, as opposed to hypothetical performance off of the design parameters. Perhaps someone who understands MTF charts can comment and compare with other MTF charts for similar focal length lenses.
 
Godfrey

Godfrey

Well-known member
There are always tradeoffs. :)

Ach, the lens I was hoping for! And at the point where I've decided that bulky professional gear doesn't do it for me any more!

G

"...For the gods are tricksy, malicious, and swift to thwart." - Fritz Lieber, from the tales of Fafrd and the Gray Mouser
 
T

tcdeveau

Well-known member
hcubell said:
There are MTF charts posted on the Hasselblad web site for the lens. These are based upon actual measurements, as opposed to hypothetical performance off of the design parameters. Perhaps someone who understands MTF charts can comment and compare with other MTF charts for similar focal length lenses.
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Here's a comparison with the other XCD lenses. The way I'm interpreting it resolution and contrast won't be as strong in the corners of the 21mm as the 30mm. I'm a bit surprised as the 21mm doesn't appear to be much different at f4 than f8.

Here's some info regarding MTF for the Batis 18mm:

https://diglloyd.com/blog/2016/20160414_1752-ZeissBatis18f2_8-MTF.html

I've never been one to judge a lens by MTF though. I want a native wider than 30mm lens for the X1D and am just happy the 21mm is here.

Capture.JPG
 
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