MFD A/F focus points

[aztwang]

So when I first made the plunge into MFD which was the DF+, one of my first questions was why only 1 auto focus point on this camera (DF+ w/ Phase1 iq250).
It was explained to me that adding additional focus points even on the XF system would be almost prohibitive because of
some type of limitations with in the auto focus system. Honestly I dont remember why but I'm sure many of you have asked the
same question....

Enter the Fuji GFX which has 3 different A/F zones and 117 focus points.....

My question, why now can the Fuji pull it off but not Phase1 even with the latest release of a day ago, the Honey Bee Auto focus platform Hap-2 system? Is it because the Fuji is mirrorless?
Im baffled....


Cheers

Don

 

[dave.gt]

So when I first made the plunge into MFD which was the DF+, one of my first questions was why only 1 auto focus point on this camera (DF+ w/ Phase1 iq250).
It was explained to me that adding additional focus points even on the XF system would be almost prohibitive because of
some type of limitations with in the auto focus system. Honestly I dont remember why but I'm sure many of you have asked the
same question....

Enter the Fuji GFX which has 3 different A/F zones and 117 focus points.....

My question, why now can the Fuji pull it off but not Phase1 even with the latest release of a day ago, the Honey Bee Auto focus platform Hap-2 system? Is it because the Fuji is mirrorless?
Im baffled....


Cheers

Don

Hi, Don!

Not being a technical geek by any stretch of the imagination, I cannot answer your question. It is interesting...

In my case, I have always been a little different, preferring simplicity and purity over all the new bells and whistles. Coming from Nikon, I find the H5D a breath of fresh air much in the same manner as using my M3. With only a single focus area with true focus capability, it is not that simple but good enough.

The endless features and menus of Nikon cameras have driven me away, never to return. I would give up photography if I were to be bound with too much tech and after a lifelong career in engineering, I seek solace in the simple life which is increasingly hard to find.

But, like I said, I have always been different... lol, but I do respect and understand why most enjoy what they do.

It is just that I prefer less. It is hard living in a concrete world with an abstract mind!:thumbup:

 

[Paul2660]

I got bashed for being to negative, but personally I don't see why it can't be done.

Pentax has more than one on the 645Z, albeit they are mainly clustered around the center, in fact I believe Pentax used one of their K series focus modules on the Z, but it works.

Both Fuji and Hasselblad have figured out a way to do it on the 50MP Sony.

Many ask why, do you need more than one AF point. Well for me there are many times where focus recompose won't work. Other times working on a tripod, the single AF point on the XF is in the sky and I don't trust that even if it locks. If you are working for best DOF in MF, odds are you will need to change the focus many times, from foreground to background. If you move the camera to focus recompose, you will not ever be able to re-line up the camera.

More and more technology arrives on the scene and having more than one AF point is just part of the package.

Phase One has done a good job of keeping the XF up to date and to their credit added quite a few unique features for MF and 35mm. However the Honeybee, HAP1 system which sounds like a lot of tech operates to me very similar to the system in the DF+. It's clear with the advent of the HAP2 that P1 will stay with 1 focus point. Thankfully the Live View on the IQ back is still state of the art and still the best I have used on any camera and it makes up for the single AF point.

Paul Caldwell

 

[tcdeveau]

I think this is one of the questions that only the manufacturer can answer...

It is my understanding that it is a hardware limitation of hardware-based AF modules in the bodies of SLR-style MF cameras. I believe the discrepancy you note relates to the mirrorless X1D and GFX using on-chip (sensor) AF points, the 645z/Hasselblad H-series/Phase DF/XF SLR-style body/back combo using a hardware AF module in the body of the camera separate from the sensor. There seem to be limitations to adding/using/creating hardware AF modules in MF cameras (such as the XF/H-series/etc) with a multi-point AF system that span the FOV of the sensor as in 35mm cameras, and that it may not be possible to truly have a hardware AF module in cameras like the XF and H6D with a multi-point AF system such as that found in the GFX and X1D or in 35mm cameras. I don't the reason why - whether none exist and it would be cost-prohibitive to make; whether its physically impossible; whether there's IP and licensing issues that prevent the implementation; etc etc etc. I also don't know enough about AF systems and sensor manufacturing to know if on-chip AF systems like those in the X1D can be ported over to the 50MP XF/H6D/etc variants via firmware or in the chip hardware of future models (like an XF+ or H7D), or if the AF systems of the X1D/GFX would even work on an SLR-style MF camera. I could be wrong about all of the above, and someone please step in and correct me if I am.

The 645z as Paul noted does have multi-AF points, but they're all clustered in the center, so effectively it's not much different than a single point (at least not the way I shoot). During the time I had the 645z, I relied on focus/recompose and live view with focus magnification (you can move the magnified area all around the field of view in live view without any restrictions), so lack of multiple AF points wasn't a big deal. Now being an X1D user, I will say that having multiple AF points is very helpful and increases the keeper rate considerably in some scenarios (especially handheld for me), and it is definitely a welcome addition to the medium format universe. For those that rely on multiple AF points for their shooting, this could be a big distinguishing factor and selling poing for mirrorless MF vs. traditional MF for now.
-Todd

 

[Paul2660]

Good points, as I guess an EVF style body allows for a lot more control on the AF points, even with a sensor like the 50MP Sony which has no phase detect only contrast.

On the IQ backs as the Live View experience is so good, I agree it's not as big an issue for me in my shooting, and for a studio/portrait shooter this new HAP/2 update probably makes a lot of sense.

I had hoped Phase would add focus peaking to their CMOS backs via firmware. That can help a lot in low light also. The Pentax 645Z had this as I recall, but I never tried it. The K1 has it and it's excellent, as is peaking on any Sony brand camera like the A7RII.

Paul Caldwell