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Thread: New Phase One IQ3-100 Trichromatic and XF Feature Set # 4

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    Workshop Member lance_schad's Avatar
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    New Phase One IQ3-100 Trichromatic and XF Feature Set # 4

    Continuing the trend of innovation, Phase One has announced a new digital back that will allow you, the photographer, the ability to capture in astonishing color definition. The IQ3 100MP Trichromatic Digital Back for the Phase One XF contains a new CMOS sensor designed to capture color in the same way the human eye perceives it.
    Here is a link to the announcement .

    They also have announced a Free Feature Release # 4 for the XF Camera as well. This includes features such as :
    Autofocus and Recompose Mode
    Zoom to Focus
    Automatic Focus Stacking Calculator
    Focus Nudge
    Vibration Analysis
    Infinite Vibration Delay
    Profoto Remote Shutter Release

    More complete coverage available https://digitaltransitions.com/phase...955950&mc_eid=[UNIQID]

    We will be posting additional detail throughout the day here on GetDPI and on our site

    Lance
    LANCE SCHAD - Digital Transitions - Phase One,Mamiya | Leaf,Arca-Swiss,Cambo, Profoto
    direct/cell:610-496-5586 office:877-367-8537x224
    http://www.digitaltransitions.com email:[email protected]

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    Re: New Phase One IQ3-100 Trichromatic and XF Feature Set # 4

    So much for the Phase One announcement at 15:30 CEST!

    Is this actually cleared to announce already?

    One more question. From your website - "The only place to see it is Digital Transitions – sign up for demo below!"

    Is that true? You have a worldwide exclusive on this back?

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    Senior Member ejpeiker's Avatar
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    Re: New Phase One IQ3-100 Trichromatic and XF Feature Set # 4

    Well it's up on the P1 website so it must be ok

    Nowhere have I found pricing or upgrade pricing.
    E.J. Peiker
    www.EJPhoto.com

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    Senior Member Pemihan's Avatar
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    Re: New Phase One IQ3-100 Trichromatic and XF Feature Set # 4

    Good thing I only do B&W
    Peter
    My website

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    Re: New Phase One IQ3-100 Trichromatic and XF Feature Set # 4

    Quote Originally Posted by ejpeiker View Post
    Well it's up on the P1 website so it must be ok

    Nowhere have I found pricing or upgrade pricing.
    $45K for the back according to FStoppers -

    https://fstoppers.com/gear/phase-one...-update-195772

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    Re: New Phase One IQ3-100 Trichromatic and XF Feature Set # 4

    P1 specifically calls out the issue of crosstalk being addressed ( first time I have seen them admit it even exists) which is good. But I wonder it the new filter array will help on color cast issues with movements?

    That would be very impressive.

    Paul Caldwell

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    Senior Member ejpeiker's Avatar
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    Re: New Phase One IQ3-100 Trichromatic and XF Feature Set # 4

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul2660 View Post
    P1 specifically calls out the issue of crosstalk being addressed ( first time I have seen them admit it even exists) which is good. But I wonder it the new filter array will help on color cast issues with movements?

    That would be very impressive.

    Paul Caldwell
    I doubt that it will make much of a difference as the cause for that is different than what the tricolor array is attempting to fix. But one can hope
    E.J. Peiker
    www.EJPhoto.com

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    Re: New Phase One IQ3-100 Trichromatic and XF Feature Set # 4

    Quote Originally Posted by lance_schad View Post
    Trichromatic Digital Back for the Phase One XF contains a new CMOS sensor designed to capture color in the same way the human eye perceives it.
    You mean large overlap in red and green and very little sensitivity in the blue? That is how the human eye does it.
    Last edited by Shashin; 13th September 2017 at 07:35.

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    Senior Member jdphoto's Avatar
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    Re: New Phase One IQ3-100 Trichromatic and XF Feature Set # 4

    "Continuing the trend of innovation, Phase One has announced a new digital back that will allow you, the photographer, the ability to capture in astonishing color definition"

    Oh you mean now we can get that? More planned obsolescence and marketing hype, imo.
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    Re: New Phase One IQ3-100 Trichromatic and XF Feature Set # 4

    Reading the very short technical points P1 presents on their web page, it looks like the color array has been changed to have little (or no) overlap in wavelength between the different color filters.
    The consequence is that (I guess):
    - Better color resolution, each pixel is dedicated to a color
    - Worse sensitivity / quantum efficiency, since now each pixel detects photons over a narrower color range (previously, since there was overlap, a broader wavelength range of photons were detected by each pixel). This probably explains the ISO 35.
    - Worse spatial resolution, since now each pixel is more specialized (with big overlap in wavelength, you can still observe a feature, but get its color wrong, whereas now, if the color is wrong for that pixel, there is no signal at all).

    It will be interesting to see a direct comparison between an IQ3-100 and IQ3-100 Trichromatic.
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    Re: New Phase One IQ3-100 Trichromatic and XF Feature Set # 4

    Looks to me like a way to clear inventory/stock of the IMX211 near end of life cycle before the launch of IMX411 and IMX461.

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    Re: New Phase One IQ3-100 Trichromatic and XF Feature Set # 4

    Quote Originally Posted by lance_schad View Post
    Continuing the trend of innovation, Phase One has announced a new digital back that will allow you, the photographer, the ability to capture in an astonishing color definition. The IQ3 100MP Trichromatic Digital Back for the Phase One XF contains a new CMOS sensor designed to capture color in the same way the human eye perceives it.
    Here is a link to the announcement .

    They also have announced a Free Feature Release # 4 for the XF Camera as well. This includes features such as :
    Autofocus and Recompose Mode
    Zoom to Focus
    Automatic Focus Stacking Calculator
    Focus Nudge
    Vibration Analysis
    Infinite Vibration Delay
    Profoto Remote Shutter Release

    More complete coverage available https://digitaltransitions.com/phase...955950&mc_eid=[UNIQID]

    We will be posting additional detail throughout the day here on GetDPI and on our site

    Lance
    Hi,
    It looks great. The "Autofocus and Recompose Mode" looks identical to the Hasselblad technology. I will have expected them to have a Patent on it. Maybe they don't (we know about Hasselblad issues). It seems to me that Phase One is the only one that normally blocks the access to basic technology (like the sensors) to other companies.
    Not a critique, it's just one way to get an advantage.

    Great to see that Phase One continues to invest in technology.
    Let see if he color technology actually works or it's a gimmick. What is not a gimmick and is super important is ISO 35.
    Phase one Shutters go to only 1/1600 of a second. With ISO 35 your latitude becomes closer to a DSLR with base ISO 100 and 1/4000 Shutter like the D750

    Best regards,

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    Senior Member ejpeiker's Avatar
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    Re: New Phase One IQ3-100 Trichromatic and XF Feature Set # 4

    Quote Originally Posted by jduncan View Post
    Hi,

    Phase one Shutters go to only 1/1600 of a second. With ISO 35 your latitude becomes closer to a DSLR with base ISO 100 and 1/4000 Shutter like the D750
    The focal plane shutter goes to 1/4000 on the XF. Even with a Leaf shutter lens, which does have limitations like you describe, you can put the system in focal plane shutter mode where the leaf shutter in the lens is not used and achieve 1/4000s.
    E.J. Peiker
    www.EJPhoto.com

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    Re: New Phase One IQ3-100 Trichromatic and XF Feature Set # 4

    Isn't this better suited for videos, making movies than stills?

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    Senior Member ErikKaffehr's Avatar
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    Re: New Phase One IQ3-100 Trichromatic and XF Feature Set # 4

    Hi,

    The described response would lead to a sensor that would be blind to some colours. Overlap is needed to detect colours. Human vision has very large overlap between M and L, what would be called "green" and "red".



    Best regards
    Erik


    Quote Originally Posted by miska View Post
    Reading the very short technical points P1 presents on their web page, it looks like the color array has been changed to have little (or no) overlap in wavelength between the different color filters.
    The consequence is that (I guess):
    - Better color resolution, each pixel is dedicated to a color
    - Worse sensitivity / quantum efficiency, since now each pixel detects photons over a narrower color range (previously, since there was overlap, a broader wavelength range of photons were detected by each pixel). This probably explains the ISO 35.
    - Worse spatial resolution, since now each pixel is more specialized (with big overlap in wavelength, you can still observe a feature, but get its color wrong, whereas now, if the color is wrong for that pixel, there is no signal at all).

    It will be interesting to see a direct comparison between an IQ3-100 and IQ3-100 Trichromatic.

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    Re: New Phase One IQ3-100 Trichromatic and XF Feature Set # 4

    Quote Originally Posted by ErikKaffehr View Post
    The described response would lead to a sensor that would be blind to some colours. Overlap is needed to detect colours. Human vision has very large overlap between M and L, what would be called "green" and "red".

    Not really, no. Any linear combination of the human spectral sensitivity curves satisfies the Luther-Ives conditions. You could subtract the green and red curves, would have no overlap and still satisfy the Luther-Ives conditions. Colour theory is a bit more complex than "the curves should have no/some overlap".
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    Re: New Phase One IQ3-100 Trichromatic and XF Feature Set # 4

    Quote Originally Posted by ejpeiker View Post
    The focal plane shutter goes to 1/4000 on the XF. Even with a Leaf shutter lens, which does have limitations like you describe, you can put the system in focal plane shutter mode where the leaf shutter in the lens is not used and achieve 1/4000s.
    I'm sure he was talking about sync speed. With ISO35 one can use shallower depth of field in open daylight.

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    Senior Member ErikKaffehr's Avatar
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    Re: New Phase One IQ3-100 Trichromatic and XF Feature Set # 4

    Hi Jerome,

    It is sort of well known that there is no physical sensor that satisfies Luther-Ives conditions.

    Just make a small experiment of thought. If there would be no overlap, say between red and green, the sensor would detect all yellows either red or green.

    Best regards
    Erik


    Quote Originally Posted by jerome_m View Post
    Not really, no. Any linear combination of the human spectral sensitivity curves satisfies the Luther-Ives conditions. You could subtract the green and red curves, would have no overlap and still satisfy the Luther-Ives conditions. Colour theory is a bit more complex than "the curves should have no/some overlap".

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    Re: New Phase One IQ3-100 Trichromatic and XF Feature Set # 4

    Quote Originally Posted by ErikKaffehr View Post
    It is sort of well known that there is no physical sensor that satisfies Luther-Ives conditions.
    The human eye is a physical sensor and satisfies the Luther-Ives conditions. Cameras, usually, don't but there is no law of physics which would prevent them to do so.

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    Re: New Phase One IQ3-100 Trichromatic and XF Feature Set # 4

    So does this mean that color rendition was bad on my older back???!!!
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    Re: New Phase One IQ3-100 Trichromatic and XF Feature Set # 4

    Quote Originally Posted by JoshMerwin View Post
    So does this mean that color rendition was bad on my older back???!!!
    Yes! But instead of just throwing it away you might as well give it to me...
    Peter
    My website
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