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X1D Discount

tcdeveau

Well-known member
The whole reason the GFX exists in the first place was they didn’t think 35mm FF (24x36mm) was worth it over APS-C X-Trans. I don’t see them putting out a 40x54mm for similar reasons.

I’m not sure we’ll see 50mp for much longer. Sony doesn’t have any new 50mp sensors on their roadmap, and I’m not sure how much more can be squeezed out of the current sensor IMX161 50mp sensor, or even how much longer it will continue to be manufactured. With the X1D, ppl want to see to performance gains, and some of those will require improved specs on the sensor side (like readout time, FPS, etc). For the moment, the only info we have to go off of is the published sony sensor roadmap, which suggests in order to get improvements in the sensor side resolution will also increas - 100 mp for 33x44mm and 150mp for 40x54.

Yes legacy glass is also a selling point for Fuji and Hasselblad, but both companies still have yet-to-be released lenses, and will continue to sell their own lenses - which seem to be ready for 100mp and beyond. I’d image Fuji could implement an electronic crop mode or something as well (maybe pixel binning?) for situations where less resolution is desirable.
 

Paratom

Well-known member
The xcd 45mm allready vignettes quite a bit on 33x44 sensor, so I do not believe they want to go with a bigger sensor. A bigger sensor would lead to bigger lenses and destroy the whole idea (IMO) of the x1d.

I hope they will come up with a faster processor for the x2d and allow a hardware upgrade for x1d users (just wishfull thinking).
 

hcubell

Well-known member
Why do you think Fuji will do it . They have been very stubborn(?) in their continued support of their APS-C sensor . I think Fuji sees their market correctly as amateurs moving up to MF to gain improved IQ . The design to a price point like many consumer products . They bought market share early by discounting almost immediately .

Not sure that either Fuji or HB will be in a hurry to get to 100MPs .....rather stay at 50MP for $6500 and continue gaining customers from the high end of the DSLR market .

Fuji has also made a big deal about using Legacy glass of almost any variety ....but at 100MPs most of the legacy glass will be insufficient . In addition 100MP s normally means tripod territory for most users .

My guess is that both Fuji and Hb will be slower to 100MPs than we might anticipate ......but of course its only a guess. :facesmack::facesmack:
I am "sure" that Fuji and Hasselblad will release their new bodies with the 100MP sensor just as soon as they can. In this case, it's not at all about resolution The existing sensor technology is a huge roadblock to improving things like AF, EVF quality, EVF blackout, overall operational speed, etc. With its considerable experience with mirrorless technology and deep resources, Fuji to its credit has done the very best that it could do with that 50MP sensor, but what's possible with the new sensor should be really impressive compared to where we are now.
 

sog1927

Member
You are right in principle but I think the X and GFX is the the model of the future and it's only a matter of time before we see the 645 sensors in them.

I'm sure Fuji will do it. Hasselblad will have to make a decision at some point.
I think we'll probably see a 645 mirrorless Hasselblad at some point (which I would certainly be interested in) - I just don't think it will be called an X-series camera. I think the X line will remain a "compact medium format mirrorless" camera and there will be an additional "full-size medium format mirrorless" line which might eventually replace the H-series (although not immediately). I suspect we won't see that for a few years (until EVFs improve to the point where they can completely replace an OVF in all applications).
 

ErikKaffehr

Well-known member
Hi,

No bigger sensor, smaller pixels.

3.7 micron pixels, 6FPS read out, backside illumination. Sony has published all details 1.5 years ago.

Best regards
Erik

The xcd 45mm allready vignettes quite a bit on 33x44 sensor, so I do not believe they want to go with a bigger sensor. A bigger sensor would lead to bigger lenses and destroy the whole idea (IMO) of the x1d.

I hope they will come up with a faster processor for the x2d and allow a hardware upgrade for x1d users (just wishfull thinking).
 

GrahamWelland

Subscriber & Workshop Member
Hi,

No bigger sensor, smaller pixels.

3.7 micron pixels, 6FPS read out, backside illumination. Sony has published all details 1.5 years ago.

Best regards
Erik
I agree with Erik. Pentax, Fuji and Hasselblad have all built complete systems around 33x44mm sensors to differentiate themselves from the 35mm/m43rds market. They've avoided bankrupting themselves trying for the larger 'full frame' (whatever that really means - it means 6x6 or 6x7 or 6x9 to me!) MF sensors and systems that are too expensive for most people to move to and can't support a mass market.

I expect to see lots of innovation with the 33x44mm sensor systems. Surely the same will happen with 54x40 sensors too (eg 150Mp+) but primarily ripple down to more affordable 33x44mm systems.

Btw, why would folks like Hassy & Fuji come out with complete new lens systems for these 'crop' sensors only to obsolete them within five years. That would make absolutely no sense to me.
 

ErikKaffehr

Well-known member
Hi,

I would say that it makes perfect sense to stay with 44x33 mm. A well designed 44x33 mm sensor system will be a very capable design, especially with the 100 MP sensor.

The "small medium format" is much more affordable than full size medium format, with prices near Nikon's and Canon's high end. So it is a much larger market. The high end MFD market is probably well served by Phase One and Hasselblad.

I would also guess that Phase One may have more focus on full frame MFD while Hasselblad may be more geared towards the 44x33 mm format.

I don't know about Pentax 645Z sales figures, but I have not seen Pentax going into 100MP at 54x40 mm, although the system is designed for that format.

There is a professional market outside what we see, like image reproduction work and aerial photography. Those areas depend on resolution. If you can map an area with 66% of the flight time I would guess that 150MP can be a very lucrative investment.

There is also a small market of technical camera users who seek the ultimately quality. But, I don't think the X1D or the GFX are addressing that kind of buyer.

Ming Thein has a very interesting write up about the X1D here: https://blog.mingthein.com/2018/01/31/long-term-review-the-hasselblad-x1d/ , there is also a QA section in the end.

I hoped to "touch" the X1D on display. I was at Stockholm Foto Exhibition, but it seems that Hasselblad did not have representation there. I looked at the GFX, though, and I found it like likeable camera and AF-speed was more than OK. But, playing with a camera for a couple minutes gives very little useful information.

Best regards
Erik





I agree with Erik. Pentax, Fuji and Hasselblad have all built complete systems around 33x44mm sensors to differentiate themselves from the 35mm/m43rds market. They've avoided bankrupting themselves trying for the larger 'full frame' (whatever that really means - it means 6x6 or 6x7 or 6x9 to me!) MF sensors and systems that are too expensive for most people to move to and can't support a mass market.

I expect to see lots of innovation with the 33x44mm sensor systems. Surely the same will happen with 54x40 sensors too (eg 150Mp+) but primarily ripple down to more affordable 33x44mm systems.

Btw, why would folks like Hassy & Fuji come out with complete new lens systems for these 'crop' sensors only to obsolete them within five years. That would make absolutely no sense to me.
 

DB5

Member
The discounts are coming, something is definitely brewing. I've just seen this at Ffordes in the UK.

X1d.jpg
 

jduncan

Active member
Looks like the big retailers are dropping the price on the body, no discounts on the lenses. Will the smaller retailers drop their price as well?
Hi,

What continues to amaze me is the very short time that Adorama kept the below 7000 US$ price. Now is $7995 vs $6495 in B&H. I wonder what is the name of the game.

Best regards,
 

sjg284

Member
Strangely Fotocare is still at the full $8995


Going through the US dealer list @ Hasselblad website it seems like about 1/3 of dealers have dropped pricing to $6500.
 

DB5

Member
Have just seen two more X1D deals in the UK, both around £6500. "While stocks last"

Perhaps that X2D really is imminent.
 

JeRuFo

Active member
WOW

That must be a mistake. That's way less than everyone else. Does it include VAT?
I don't think it is. It has been on there for quite a while now (days, not hours). And yes, all prices include VAT unless specifically stated otherwise (usually only for wholesale over here.)
 
V

Vivek

Guest
If anyone buys from outside of the EU then they will get the VAT off!

There is a branch, a stone throw away from where I live. It is a chain.
 

OleBe

Member
Actually I think H decided to adjust the body only pricing to the theoretical one represented in the field kit. :cool:
 

satijntje

Member
I received my 4116 kit yesterday from Kamera Express.
It is a brand-new one, no demo or so.
There is no seal on the box but as there was absolutely no dust inside the box, I assume that it has never been opened
For shipments outside the EU prices have to be devided by 1.21.

Good luck
John
 
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