Nodal point panoramas - required?

[narikin]

Hi - making some 3 way panoramas (3x vertical of course)
wondering how important it is to try and rotate on the nodal point with a 150mm lens?

It's mostly trees in mid distance. about 30m/100ft. There's phone wires etc that Photoshop auto-stitching struggles with.

If I do go down that route, is there any easy way to find it with a 150mm Phase lens. And, what would be needed on my tripod head - a long rail, or is there a nodal kit? I'd rather avoid this whole thing, but...

thanks

 

[cerett]

I have also struggled with this issue. My understanding is that if there is nothing close to your lens you wish to capture, the lens nodal point makes no difference and there should be no problem with stitching. More importantly, I have found this to be true in practice. You should be okay with objects 100 feet away.

 

[ejpeiker]

If nothing is closer than half the distance of your mid distance trees you won't have a problem. But if you do want to mitigate things a bit without actually figuring out the exact nodal point, most lenses have their nodal point relatively close to the front element so if you slide your camera/lens rig so that the rotation point is near the front element you can generally have things even closer without too much trouble. That said, finding the nodal point, even in the field isn't that hard.

 

[tcdeveau]

You would need a head with a panning function and a nodal slide (aka a rail). I use this and this attached to my head. There are some tutorials out there that how you how to find the nodal point of the lens too.

As cerett mentioned, if you subject matter is mainly in the distance, parallax is not really an issue and you don't need to use the nodal point. If your subject matter is close up, then it helps.

You do get better results overall with using a nodal slide setup, but just panning and stitching with photoshop is good enough for me for 90% or more of my work, and most of the time my nodal slide just sits in the bag. Most of my panos involve subjects in the distance FWIW.

 

[Shashin]

I have not found this to be a big issue. I even make panos handheld. The only time I have found that I need to take care is in a situation that has close foreground elements, like branches and bush in a forest. I did get a nodel rail, but I have not really used it, even in forests. It has not been in my bag for years.

You could just try it and find out for yourself. I am sure you can find something nearby to test with.

 

[Don Libby]

I've shot panos on and off tripod. While on tripod I used to (make reference to the past tense) spend extra time to get as close to the nodal point as possible. I've also shot handheld forgetting the nodal point. In either case what I've learned is to shoot much more than I want and crop to what I want in post. This being done with just about all my lenses. The great thing about shooting on a tech camera is the ability to flat stitch while shooting on my old P1 system and now on the GFX I "wing it". Just remember to overshoot in order to crop into the scene you want to display.Don

 

[bab]

I would suggest a 100mm lens instead of a 150mm simply because you can shoot at F11 and bring acceptable focus from 47m to infinity a comparative with a 150mm lens would force you to use F18. Using the 150mm would also require much lower shutter speed and high ISO to stop movement.

To answer your question regarding the nodal point or (entrance pupil) I personally shoot that way overlapping my stitching it is with the right tools a very simple and rewarding process when you get to PP, especially with a 50-100mp back. Pixels just line up magically.

 

[narikin]

Thanks all for the useful tips. Sounds like its not really worth it, but I might investigate still.

I'm using shallow focus deliberately, hence the 150mm at around f4.5-5.6 (would go lower, but too distracting longitudinal aberrations at f2.8-4 even with an 'Apo' lens)

Appreciate all the help. Thank You.

 

[Frankly]

Thanks all for the useful tips. Sounds like its not really worth it, but I might investigate still.

I'm using shallow focus deliberately, hence the 150mm at around f4.5-5.6 (would go lower, but too distracting longitudinal aberrations at f2.8-4 even with an 'Apo' lens)

Appreciate all the help. Thank You.

I won't say this approach is impossible but it will probably be very difficult. Perhaps if you were photographing in a situation like an amphitheater and your focus point could be in an arc it would make sense to shoot with shallow focus but otherwise good luck stitching things in a believable manner.

I bought a full RRS Nodal Point kit and used it a few times until I realized that everything I wanted a panoramic of was middle distance to infinity. And even with the fancy gear, something close up in the foreground was going to be distorted and uncomfortable/unrecognizable in the end. And I do have to crop the telephone lines as I would in a single photo anyway, they really cause the stitching software fits.

 

[thompsonkirk]

Definitely a try-it-and-see situation. If results are unsuccessful, try the RRS gimbal with the long nodal slider.

I'v never had trouble stitching panos made on a tripod, and rarely when hand-held. LR/PS stitching does a fine job now – no need for more advanced software.

You should have no trouble making shallow DOF panos – I did a whole series with Noctilux wide open and hand-held on A7r2 (example attached).

Nevertheless – being a cautious or wimpy sort of guy – I always use the RRS nodal gear with GFX just to avoid possible stitching glitches. I never use lenses longer than the 32-64 zoom, so I can use the short nodal slider, extended to the max. That's the nodal point for this lens (regardless of zoom extesion/focal length). If you use lenses longer than 64mm, you'll need the longer RRS slider.

As someone mentioned above, just google to find tutorials on establishing nodal point. It's easy even for the technologically impaired.

Kirk