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Hasselblad X1D II review

vieri

Well-known member
Is the new Hasselblad X1DII still lacking a live Histogram?

I've read through the available manual (online) and while there is mention of luminosity and RGB histograms, the manual suggests that they are available in review mode, since they are stored with the images. This was the case with the original X1D, and IMO was a major omission. And in this regard, I have yet to find a modern day camera that does not offer a live, histogram visible either in the LCD or EVF. OK, maybe there is one, but I haven't stumbled across it.
Hello Ron,

yes, at the moment that is still the case, as you can see in my review which I am linking again for you here: https://www.vieribottazzini.com/2019/08/a-first-impression-hasselblad-x1d-ii-review.html, see the conclusions if you don't want to read it all. However, the camera I reviewed is a Demo unit, and firmware is very likely not final, so this can change. If we take the X1D as an example, Hasselblad has shown their commitment to constantly improving the camera via FW updates, and I hope this will continue to be the case with the X1D II. So, even if Live View histogram will not make it into the launch version of FW, I am hopeful it will make it into future updates.

One more thing that makes me hopeful is that it has been said that, for the X1D, the absence of LV histogram was a hardware limitation. Many understood this to be a limitation of the sensor, mistakenly in my opinion since the GFX 50 had LV histogram with the same sensor. What it could have been instead is a limitation of the surrounding processors, something that should have been solved now with the new processors of the X1D II, so I am hopeful that we'll see LV histogram eventually.

Let's wait and see. Best regards,

Vieri
 

ron787

Member
Hello Ron,

yes, at the moment that is still the case, as you can see in my review which I am linking again for you here: https://www.vieribottazzini.com/2019/08/a-first-impression-hasselblad-x1d-ii-review.html, see the conclusions if you don't want to read it all. However, the camera I reviewed is a Demo unit, and firmware is very likely not final, so this can change. If we take the X1D as an example, Hasselblad has shown their commitment to constantly improving the camera via FW updates, and I hope this will continue to be the case with the X1D II. So, even if Live View histogram will not make it into the launch version of FW, I am hopeful it will make it into future updates.

One more thing that makes me hopeful is that it has been said that, for the X1D, the absence of LV histogram was a hardware limitation. Many understood this to be a limitation of the sensor, mistakenly in my opinion since the GFX 50 had LV histogram with the same sensor. What it could have been instead is a limitation of the surrounding processors, something that should have been solved now with the new processors of the X1D II, so I am hopeful that we'll see LV histogram eventually.

Let's wait and see. Best regards,

Vieri
Hi Vieri,
Thank you for your reply.
I guess we'll have to wait and see what develops, but I'd been disappointed by the X1D and suspect that the newest iteration will be, or is a tweaked version of the original—BTW, nice review of same. Rather than reinvest in the system, however, I have decided to move on and wait for a preordered Fuji GFX100.
Best regards,
Ron
 

vieri

Well-known member
Hi Vieri,
Thank you for your reply.
I guess we'll have to wait and see what develops, but I'd been disappointed by the X1D and suspect that the newest iteration will be, or is a tweaked version of the original—BTW, nice review of same. Rather than reinvest in the system, however, I have decided to move on and wait for a preordered Fuji GFX100.
Best regards,
Ron
Hello Ron,

you are welcome. The new X1D II, sensor aside, is a completely new camera IMHO, with new processors and electronics, new EVF and new LCD. Also IMHO, it's now better than the Fuji GFX 50R/S, if you like leaf-shutter-based cameras. If you prefer focal plane shutter, obviously, the Fuji GFX 50 is your best choice. The GFX 100, of course, is a completely different story, not only resolution-wise, but for all the tech that it contains and, if you need that, is without equal.

Best regards,

Vieri
 

Ikarus

New member
Hello Ron,

you are welcome. The new X1D II, sensor aside, is a completely new camera IMHO, with new processors and electronics, new EVF and new LCD. Also IMHO, it's now better than the Fuji GFX 50R/S, if you like leaf-shutter-based cameras. If you prefer focal plane shutter, obviously, the Fuji GFX 50 is your best choice. The GFX 100, of course, is a completely different story, not only resolution-wise, but for all the tech that it contains and, if you need that, is without equal.

Best regards,

Vieri
That, and someone smacked the GFX100 with an ugly stick! Held one at a camera shop a week or so ago - not much subtlety or elegance wasted on that camera ...
 

ron787

Member
That, and someone smacked the GFX100 with an ugly stick! Held one at a camera shop a week or so ago - not much subtlety or elegance wasted on that camera ...
Perhaps, but beauty and elegance do not always bring home the bacon, and form doesn't always equate with function.

I guess if you take away the 102mp sensor, the IBIS and the need for a heat dissipating enclosure to accommodate the pixel dense sensor, as well as all of its technological goodies, you could assemble a more attractive camera, but then we'd be sacrificing function for form. And cameras are designed for imaging, not beauty contests. When was the last time a client said, "Your camera is ugly?"
 

ron787

Member
Hello Ron,

you are welcome. The new X1D II, sensor aside, is a completely new camera IMHO, with new processors and electronics, new EVF and new LCD. Also IMHO, it's now better than the Fuji GFX 50R/S, if you like leaf-shutter-based cameras. If you prefer focal plane shutter, obviously, the Fuji GFX 50 is your best choice. The GFX 100, of course, is a completely different story, not only resolution-wise, but for all the tech that it contains and, if you need that, is without equal.

Best regards,

Vieri
Ciao Vieri,
Often times it's not a matter of need, but desire. I don't need 102mp, but I can no longer do without IBIS. In the past, a steady hand had been a requirement of my trade (physician) but tincture of time has taken its toll and the advent of IBIS has brought with it a breath of fresh air. I've been involved in photography both as a hobbyist and, for a brief interval professionally, for the past 60 years, and have owned more cameras than I can count. But this new stabilized breed is an eye opener, and I find that I can not do without IBIS ergo, the GFX100. I had owned a GFX50s and sold it due to its, IMO, odd ergonomics and the absence of stabilization. I have winnowed my collection of cameras down to a Panasonic S1R, G9, and Sony A7rIII ... all with IBIS.
Tanti cari saluti,
Ron
BTW, parlo Italiano
 

vieri

Well-known member
Ciao Vieri,
Often times it's not a matter of need, but desire. I don't need 102mp, but I can no longer do without IBIS. In the past, a steady hand had been a requirement of my trade (physician) but tincture of time has taken its toll and the advent of IBIS has brought with it a breath of fresh air. I've been involved in photography both as a hobbyist and, for a brief interval professionally, for the past 60 years, and have owned more cameras than I can count. But this new stabilized breed is an eye opener, and I find that I can not do without IBIS ergo, the GFX100. I had owned a GFX50s and sold it due to its, IMO, odd ergonomics and the absence of stabilization. I have winnowed my collection of cameras down to a Panasonic S1R, G9, and Sony A7rIII ... all with IBIS.
Tanti cari saluti,
Ron
BTW, parlo Italiano
Ciao Ron,

I am sorry to hear that IBIS is now a requirement for you, and I am happy that the Fuji GFX 100 - despite is lack of beauty, as many pointed out - offer you a solution for that allowing you to keep using MF, besides FF, even now that your hands are less steady than what they used to be. Yours is a classic example of what I always say about choosing a camera: evaluate your requirements and needs, and choose accordingly. For me, photography is something that happens on a tripod 90% of the times, and when I am handholding a camera I much prefer to have something small, light and nimble. More, I hike long distance, so I much prefer a smaller and lighter solution. So, the GFX 100 is out, and the X1D is in. While of course I would welcome more resolution, I am more than happy with 50 MP for now, and I am in no rush for Hasselblad to release a X2D with a 100 MP sensor - it will happen eventually, and when it will, I will definitely evaluate it and consider it. And even assuming it won't happen, ever, I will keep using the X1D II for the foreseeable future unless something drastic happens in the market.

Buona giornata e buon Agosto!

Vieri
 

ron787

Member
Ciao Ron,

I am sorry to hear that IBIS is now a requirement for you, and I am happy that the Fuji GFX 100 - despite is lack of beauty, as many pointed out - offer you a solution for that allowing you to keep using MF, besides FF, even now that your hands are less steady than what they used to be. Yours is a classic example of what I always say about choosing a camera: evaluate your requirements and needs, and choose accordingly. For me, photography is something that happens on a tripod 90% of the times, and when I am handholding a camera I much prefer to have something small, light and nimble. More, I hike long distance, so I much prefer a smaller and lighter solution. So, the GFX 100 is out, and the X1D is in. While of course I would welcome more resolution, I am more than happy with 50 MP for now, and I am in no rush for Hasselblad to release a X2D with a 100 MP sensor - it will happen eventually, and when it will, I will definitely evaluate it and consider it. And even assuming it won't happen, ever, I will keep using the X1D II for the foreseeable future unless something drastic happens in the market.

Buona giornata e buon Agosto!

Vieri
Ciao Vieri,

Thank you for your thoughts.
I agree, the GFX would not make a good hiking companion. As for tripod use, for my purposes it is relegated to the studio, as I cannot imagine lugging a reasonably sturdy tripod around town.
In regards to a future, 100mp X1d, I would imagine that, given the physical and heat dissipation requirements, any future iteration of the camera would result in a significant alteration of its form. But in its current state, it is indeed an attractive option, just not a workable solution for my needs.
Buona giornata
 

drunkenspyder

Well-known member
And cameras are designed for imaging, not beauty contests. When was the last time a client said, "Your camera is ugly?"
Um, last week, when they called my Phase a “beast,” (I love the beast, but it is a cacophony of lines and angles), and the same person praised my X1D’s elegance. So, yeah, it may or may not affect the image, but the gratification a tool creates in one’s hands matters to me. Same with my cars (to some, Point A—>Point B is not an emotional experience; to me it is) and espresso machine (who wants to look at and put hands on “ugly” at 4:30am?).
 

vieri

Well-known member
Ciao Vieri,

Thank you for your thoughts.
I agree, the GFX would not make a good hiking companion. As for tripod use, for my purposes it is relegated to the studio, as I cannot imagine lugging a reasonably sturdy tripod around town.
In regards to a future, 100mp X1d, I would imagine that, given the physical and heat dissipation requirements, any future iteration of the camera would result in a significant alteration of its form. But in its current state, it is indeed an attractive option, just not a workable solution for my needs.
Buona giornata
Ciao Ron,


you are welcome, thank you for your reply.

About a possible X2D with 100MP: sensor size is exactly the same, and as far as heat dissipation I am not sure it will need a different body. Technology evolves, see for instance the new X1D II vs X1D: same sensor, but the X1D II's new processors are much - MUCH - faster and yet the new camera doesn't get any warmer than the old one. So, I am pretty sure that - assuming that the 100 MP sensor gets warmer than the 50 MP one, which is not a given in the first place - it will be possible to use processors that keep the heat problem down to a reasonable body. If what I have heard from Hasselblad has to be believed, they have no intention of changing the X1D's body for future iteration, and in my opinion this could have been a very good reason for not having a 100 MP X2D yet. If you think about it, everything is there, sensor, processors, tech, etc etc. The only reason for not releasing a X2D with 100 MP is that the available technology doesn't allow for fitting everything in the X1D body - with a body change, they could have done it easily.

I guess we'll just have to wait and see :)

Best regards,

Vieri
 

vieri

Well-known member
Um, last week, when they called my Phase a “beast,” (I love the beast, but it is a cacophony of lines and angles), and the same person praised my X1D’s elegance. So, yeah, it may or may not affect the image, but the gratification a tool creates in one’s hands matters to me. Same with my cars (to some, Point A—>Point B is not an emotional experience; to me it is) and espresso machine (who wants to look at and put hands on “ugly” at 4:30am?).
I definitely agree. If I'd have to choose between form and function, of course I'd choose function - I need my tools to work, first and foremost. But, the working experience, the feeling I have when I photograph, my relationship with my tools, all are also very important to me, and so is the UI. So, if the choice is between any of the GFX 50 and any of the X1D, I'll choose the X1D any day, no question about it. None. The X1D inspires me to pick it up and go to work, while the very idea of having to pick up the GFX 50 makes me lose any joy.

That said, of course if I'd need something that is only available in a less visually inspiring camera, so to speak, such as i.e. 100 MP and IBIS, then I'd go for it. Luckily I don't need to do that :)

Best regards,

Vieri
 

tjv

Active member
Excuse my blunt response, but when I picked up the GFX100 it felt about as ergonomic as a 1980’s microwave oven with a heavy lens glued on it. Files are beautiful and to some that’ll be all that counts. Indeed others might find it fits their hands well AND produces great files - as opposed to produces great images, which is solely up to the person behind the camera. Technology is not the limiting factor and hasn’t been for eons.

And don’t get me started on the Fuji interface and menu structure. Even Sony could teach them a lesson or two about menu hierarchy and logic... Even Sony... (My personal opinions of course.)

Anyway, at the end of the day people buy what suits and works for them. That’s all that matters. Judging by the amount of chopping and changing of gear of all sorts people do on here and other forums however, there may be no magic bullets...

I’m going to load some more 8x10” film AKA set fire to my bank account. (That Fuji and Hasselblad are looking better by the minute!)
 

Godfrey

Well-known member
I know there are no magic bullets.

I've been slowly trying and forming my 'ideal system' to my likes and needs. I'm pretty much done with my FF and smaller search, and am very happy with what I've acquired and use there. I've felt a need for a larger format for a while, and the step up from APS-C to FF just never played out to much advantage far as I could see, so I've settled on APS-C and now want the larger format to be 33x44 MFD.

I looked at the Fuji cameras at the shop and was immediately turned off ... they have a lot of options, most of which I don't need and clutter up the camera more than I want. The X1D appealed to me even before they shipped it when I played with it at a demo event, and it's only gotten better since. The X1D II looks even better ... I haven't completely finished reading Vieri's review yet (I've been traveling since he posted it) but it all sounds just as I expected.

But. Much as I like the X1D/II, the form factor of Hasselblad's other recent announcement (the 907x/CFV50c II) just appeals to me much more, and the way the CFV50c II can be used with my 500CM and then with my other lenses as well with the 907x body: It just make more sense for what I want out of this equipment.

Time will tell, but I expect I'll be using that kit for a long time to come. I'm very glad I didn't sell the 500CM system a year or so back when I thought I might. :D

G
 

ron787

Member
Excuse my blunt response, but when I picked up the GFX100 it felt about as ergonomic as a 1980’s microwave oven with a heavy lens glued on it. Files are beautiful and to some that’ll be all that counts. Indeed others might find it fits their hands well AND produces great files - as opposed to produces great images, which is solely up to the person behind the camera. Technology is not the limiting factor and hasn’t been for eons.

And don’t get me started on the Fuji interface and menu structure. Even Sony could teach them a lesson or two about menu hierarchy and logic... Even Sony... (My personal opinions of course.)

Anyway, at the end of the day people buy what suits and works for them. That’s all that matters. Judging by the amount of chopping and changing of gear of all sorts people do on here and other forums however, there may be no magic bullets...

I’m going to load some more 8x10” film AKA set fire to my bank account. (That Fuji and Hasselblad are looking better by the minute!)
There have been many statements regarding the unsightly nature of the GFX100, as well as numerous Leica lovers claiming that the Leica SL is "beautiful." However, the appearance of the Leica SL with battery grip is not much different than that of the GFX.
(I've tried to attach photos of both, but I an experiencing difficulty with same.)

The GFX may still be larger but its appearance is not much different. As for the comments made by many, the absence of the characteristic Fuji top plate dials appears to be where the industry is headed, with an obvious eye towards cost containment. This trend is seen with the GFX100, the Leica SL and likely the SL2, as well as the X1DII. One can argue that a simplistic interface is a philosophical feature, but the nature of everything is ultimately determined by the money factor, and less dials and buttons boils down to cost containment. And if that approach pleases the buying public, so much the better.

Do I think that the GFX100 is attractive? NO, but I didn't think that the Leica SL was a beauty either.
 

pegelli

Well-known member
For me it's function over form any day and for me the joy of using a tool comes from functioning well and not because it is "beautiful". Obviously it needs to fit in my hand well which is a very personal experience, with no "right" or "wrong" in a general sense.

In my mind no cameras, and certainly not the MF ones, are "beautiful", they're mostly big, shaped like a brick or pavement tile and won't be mistaken for art like a pair of sunglasses left on a museum floor https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/may/27/pair-of-glasses-left-on-us-gallery-floor-mistaken-for-art

Saying one is more beautiful vs. another is a valid personal opinion (beauty is in the eye of the beholder) but no more than that.
 

ron787

Member
For me it's function over form any day and for me the joy of using a tool comes from functioning well and not because it is "beautiful". Obviously it needs to fit in my hand well which is a very personal experience, with no "right" or "wrong" in a general sense.

In my mind no cameras, and certainly not the MF ones, are "beautiful", they're mostly big, shaped like a brick or pavement tile and won't be mistaken for art like a pair of sunglasses left on a museum floor https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/may/27/pair-of-glasses-left-on-us-gallery-floor-mistaken-for-art

Saying one is more beautiful vs. another is a valid personal opinion (beauty is in the eye of the beholder) but no more than that.
I agree in totality!
 

hcubell

Well-known member
The GFX may still be larger but its appearance is not much different. As for the comments made by many, the absence of the characteristic Fuji top plate dials appears to be where the industry is headed, with an obvious eye towards cost containment. This trend is seen with the GFX100, the Leica SL and likely the SL2, as well as the X1DII. One can argue that a simplistic interface is a philosophical feature, but the nature of everything is ultimately determined by the money factor, and less dials and buttons boils down to cost containment. And if that approach pleases the buying public, so much the better.
Unfortunately, a simplistic interface and relatively few buttons and dials in cameras apparently doesn't please the buying public at all, because the only camera manufacturers producing cameras that follow that design philosophy are made by Phase One, Hasselblad and Leica. Whatever their differences, they all share a similar design philosophy, and together, they make VERY few cameras. Almost all cameras are made by the Japanese, and they have an unrequited passion for dials, buttons, options, features, and deep menu systems that boggle the mind (or at least mine). Can you imagine what the iPhone and the Google Pixel would look like and how they would work if the Japanese designed them? This is a very different issue from the physical beauty of a camera. It's about how smooth and enjoyable the process of USING a camera is in practice.
 

MGrayson

Subscriber and Workshop Member
Why is it necessary to denigrate another camera in order to justify buying one’s own?

Camera X appeals to me. Full stop. There are cameras I wished that I liked, just how I wish I liked exercise.

The rest confuses me.

Best,

Matt
 

mristuccia

Well-known member
Unfortunately, a simplistic interface and relatively few buttons and dials in cameras apparently doesn't please the buying public at all, because the only camera manufacturers producing cameras that follow that design philosophy are made by Phase One, Hasselblad and Leica. Whatever their differences, they all share a similar design philosophy, and together, they make VERY few cameras. Almost all cameras are made by the Japanese, and they have an unrequited passion for dials, buttons, options, features, and deep menu systems that boggle the mind (or at least mine). Can you imagine what the iPhone and the Google Pixel would look like and how they would work if the Japanese designed them? This is a very different issue from the physical beauty of a camera. It's about how smooth and enjoyable the process of USING a camera is in practice.
I don't follow this very well.
I think it's good to have more buttons, menu options and levers than having less. But having more does not mean that we have to use them all. In a fully featured machinery we can always pre-set most of the parameters to a good default and operate only the two or three we need. This turns the complex device into a simple one. Doing the opposite is not possible.
 

MGrayson

Subscriber and Workshop Member
I don't follow this very well.
I think it's good to have more buttons, menu options and levers than having less. But having more does not mean that we have to use them all. In a fully featured machinery we can always pre-set most of the parameters to a good default and operate only the two or three we need. This turns the complex device into a simple one. Doing the opposite is not possible.
What's hard to follow? Some people like external controls. Some don't. There are lots of arguments for both sides, but it comes down to preference. If my camera does not "spark joy", as Marie Kando would say, it doesn't get used. Even if you use the "it's just a tool and get's the job done, who cares what it looks like" argument, that's still a reflection of your own values. And they are yours. And that's fine.

My own experience handling the Fujis is that I liked the 100 much more in the hand than either of the 50's. It doesn't satisfy some of my other personal requirements (size and weight), so I didn't get it. But it satisfies many others. The X1D is a better match for Vieri than it is for me, but it's still the best compromise for me right now.

Matt
 
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