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Cambo Actus + Canon EF Lenses (TS to be precise)

ericstaud

New member
@Audii-Dudii

So are you saying that the dumb lensplate (ACB-CM) works? And the smart lensplate (ACB-CA) doesn't work because it's 5 mm thicker?
Cambo advertise the ACB-CA to be working with Sony A7 backs. This is so confusing for me.

You don't need the smart lensplate to change aperture on Canon lenses. Unless you're doing field work and change aperture several times per hour then it might have a value.

See my previous comment.
Regards,
Cristian
I don't know if you sorted this out yet. I'm using an A7R3 on an Arca-Swiss Universalis. There is only about 3mm of clearance between the handgrip on the camera and the front standard when using Canon Lenses. Sony added 5mm of depth to the A7R4 handgrip, so it is no longer compatable with the Universalis and Canon lenses moving forward.

It may be the same issue with the Actus, where older Sony bodies work with Canon lenses, but the newer Sony Bodies have bigger grips. What you may be finding are some older references on the web that say yes and the ones that say no are based on the newer Sony grip.

And can I just say a sarcastic "Thank you" to everyone who complained about the Sony grip being too small, and reuning the party for those who want to use newer Sonys on view cameras.
 

Audii-Dudii

Active member
I don't know if you sorted this out yet. I'm using an A7R3 on an Arca-Swiss Universalis. There is only about 3mm of clearance between the handgrip on the camera and the front standard when using Canon Lenses. Sony added 5mm of depth to the A7R4 handgrip, so it is no longer compatable with the Universalis and Canon lenses moving forward.

It may be the same issue with the Actus, where older Sony bodies work with Canon lenses, but the newer Sony Bodies have bigger grips. What you may be finding are some older references on the web that say yes and the ones that say no are based on the newer Sony grip.

And can I just say a sarcastic "Thank you" to everyone who complained about the Sony grip being too small, and reuning the party for those who want to use newer Sonys on view cameras.
I don't know if you were referring to me or the OP, but for the record, I am finally moving on from my Actus and my complete outfit will be for sale shortly. I've taken many good photos with it and recommended it to many other photographers, who have likewise taken many good photos with their Actii, but I've decided there are better options for me to pursue going forward.

Because I rarely need or use rear shift and front tilt and swing movements, only rear rise and fall, I have fabricated a camera around the rear standard of my Toyo VX23D medium-format view camera that provides only rear rise / fall movements:



It's compact and lightweight -- a mere 1 lb., 5.9 ounces as shown in the photo above! -- has a generous 10 mm of rear fall and 22 mm of rear rise available, and there is zero chance of any tilt or swing movements being accidentally applied and ruining photos because it doesn't have them ... lol.

Best of all, I didn't have to modify any of the Toyo bits at all, so I can strip away the modifications I made and reassemble the original VX23D view camera in maybe 15 minutes, if / when the need should ever arise.

Although I have the camera setup to use Contax / Yashica lenses, which have an FFD of 45.5 mm, I can reconfigure the camera's lens panel setup slightly so the lens panel is recessed into the standard by 1.5 mm and therefor accommodate Canon EF lenses as well.

The downside of this camera is there is no way I can accommodate the larger grips of the A7RIII and IV, although I think with some custom machine work (which I'll have to farm-out, because I don't have access to machine tools other than my drill press and disk and belt sanders), I believe I can (just barely) accommodate the A7RII's grip.

For now, though, this is a non-issue for me, because my testing confirms that, to my eyes, the A7R performs better for the type of photography I do (late night, low-light, urban and suburban street and alley scenes, captured using long exposures at base ISO) than all of the subsequent generation cameras do hence swapping to one of these cameras won't necessarily be an upgrade for my purposes.

Fortunately, this camera will readily accommodate a Fuji GFX 50R body and its 8.67 mm longer FFD (26.7 mm v. 18 mm for the A7R) and should work well in combination with various medium-format SLR lenses from the film era. As such, this will likely be my upgrade path if/when I decide to resume photographing during daylight hours, where using a medium-format camera isn't the liability it is for my nighttime photography. :)

Having now successfully completed four shakedown outings with this camera since I completed it last week, I'm confident it's going to serve my needs well, both now and into the future. So much so, in fact, that I've started work on a second camera based on the VX23D's front standard, which is ~5 mm thinner than its rear standard. This means I can either accommodate lenses having FFDs as short as ~39 mm or bodies having FFDs longer than Sony's 18 mm, such as the Samsung NX500 body I converted to use for infrared photography.

This second camera is slightly smaller still than the first one, but also slightly heavier and it will have a slightly shorter range of rear rise / fall movements (i.e., 8 mm of rear fall and 21 mm of rear rise.) As of this afternoon, I still need to fabricate a few parts, but I expect to have it up and running by the middle of next week ... cross your fingers for me! :D
 

Kuky

Member
I don't know if you sorted this out yet. I'm using an A7R3 on an Arca-Swiss Universalis. There is only about 3mm of clearance between the handgrip on the camera and the front standard when using Canon Lenses. Sony added 5mm of depth to the A7R4 handgrip, so it is no longer compatable with the Universalis and Canon lenses moving forward.
I did not sort it out as I did not yet order the upgrade kit. I was thinking also about the bigger grip of the A7RIV being a problem. I guess I will have to go the dealer to check this. But in the end I will still have to order the upgrade kit. The only solutions I can think of are:
1. Chop the front lensplate, ie do a custom one. Don't know if it is possible.
2. Let's hope the Canon RF high resolution coming next year does not have a bigger grip. RF flange is 2 mm more than Sony E but I think with the wide angle bellows should work.
3. Spend some bucks and switch to a digital back.



It may be the same issue with the Actus, where older Sony bodies work with Canon lenses, but the newer Sony Bodies have bigger grips. What you may be finding are some older references on the web that say yes and the ones that say no are based on the newer Sony grip.
I don't think it is the case. What is funny is that Cambo has also a special rear standard designed specially for A7R series and wide angle lenses - https://www.cambo.com/en/actus-series/actus-b-mini-view-camera/acb-310/ although it seems to be only for the Mini version. It's not clear if it can be used on Actus-XL.

I emailed Cambo USA about that document but they did not bother to respond.
 

Audii-Dudii

Active member
I don't think it is the case. What is funny is that Cambo has also a special rear standard designed specially for A7R series and wide angle lenses - https://www.cambo.com/en/actus-series/actus-b-mini-view-camera/acb-310/ although it seems to be only for the Mini version. It's not clear if it can be used on Actus-XL.
Note that the special rear standard does not rotate, so the camera body is always mounted in landscape format, which (IMO) is not an optimal solution.
 

vjbelle

Well-known member
I don't know if you sorted this out yet. I'm using an A7R3 on an Arca-Swiss Universalis. There is only about 3mm of clearance between the handgrip on the camera and the front standard when using Canon Lenses. Sony added 5mm of depth to the A7R4 handgrip, so it is no longer compatable with the Universalis and Canon lenses moving forward.

It may be the same issue with the Actus, where older Sony bodies work with Canon lenses, but the newer Sony Bodies have bigger grips. What you may be finding are some older references on the web that say yes and the ones that say no are based on the newer Sony grip.

And can I just say a sarcastic "Thank you" to everyone who complained about the Sony grip being too small, and reuning the party for those who want to use newer Sonys on view cameras.
I have the Sony A7R4 and an Actus and the extended grip does not interfere with the front standard. I do not have the Canon lens plate so I cannot address whether or not FFD can be obtained with certain lenses. The width of the Canon lens plate is same as the Copal 0 (97mm). I believe the Arca is somewhat wider resulting in the grip hitting the lens plate for very short FFD lenses.

Victor
 

Kuky

Member
This is what I got from Cambo:

"The - now discontinued - AC-310 enabled the use of the Digaron-32 on an Actus-B with Sony A7. It’s not suitable for use on the Actus-XL. And we discontinued it for the Actus-B as well, because Sony made the hand grip bigger with every new version of the A7.
EF lenses do focus to infinity when used on an Actus or Actus-XL paired with a Sony. However, with the more recent versions the hand grip severely limits shift movements when the camera body is in portrait orientation."
 

Audii-Dudii

Active member
I have the Sony A7R4 and an Actus and the extended grip does not interfere with the front standard. I do not have the Canon lens plate so I cannot address whether or not FFD can be obtained with certain lenses. The width of the Canon lens plate is same as the Copal 0 (97mm). I believe the Arca is somewhat wider resulting in the grip hitting the lens plate for very short FFD lenses.
A friend came to dinner Monday night and brought his A7RIV along with him so I could test-mount it on my Actus B. With my camera setup for my C/Y lenses (an FFD of 45.5mm) using a customized Copal 0 lens panel, the A7RIV will just *barely* clear using the standard three-pleat bellows.

Unfortunately, the bellows is compressed as completely as it can be and while it's possible to use the rear rise / fall movement with some effort so long as the A7RIV is oriented horizontally, there is zero ability to apply any tilt and/or swing movements and the shift movement is severely restricted.

With the bellows removed, there was enough clearance that the A7RIV's grip did not contact the lens panel at its forwardmost extension and actually had a few millimeters to spare in both directions. When I took a closer look, though, I realized the clearance issue isn't with the lens panel, but the steel ring around the opening on the front of the bellows, which has a 4 mm larger diameter than the lens panel, and this is what prevents the bellows from being pushed forward and out of the way by the grip.

Perhaps this won't be a problem with the thinner single-pleat bellows, as least so far as focusing and rise / fall movements are concerned?

Although I do have both of Cambo's Canon EF lens panels (i.e., smart and dumb), I don't have any Canon-mount lenses on hand so didn't bother checking the A7RIV's clearance with either of those. But since the FFD for Canon EF lenses is 44 mm, which 1.5 mm less than the FFD for the C/Y lenses, and the back of the dumb lens panel projects only .35 mm less than the Copal 0 panel (hence only partially compensating for the 1.5 mm difference in FFDs between the Canon and Contax lenses), I believe the clearance issue will be even worse when the A7RIV is used with Canon lenses focused at infinity.

Of course, all of the above also applies when lenses having FFDs even shorter than 44 mm are used, which includes most wide-angle view camera lenses. :(
 

vjbelle

Well-known member
A friend came to dinner Monday night and brought his A7RIV along with him so I could test-mount it on my Actus B. With my camera setup for my C/Y lenses (an FFD of 45.5mm) using a customized Copal 0 lens panel, the A7RIV will just *barely* clear using the standard three-pleat bellows.

Unfortunately, the bellows is compressed as completely as it can be and while it's possible to use the rear rise / fall movement with some effort so long as the A7RIV is oriented horizontally, there is zero ability to apply any tilt and/or swing movements and the shift movement is severely restricted.

With the bellows removed, there was enough clearance that the A7RIV's grip did not contact the lens panel at its forwardmost extension and actually had a few millimeters to spare in both directions. When I took a closer look, though, I realized the clearance issue isn't with the lens panel, but the steel ring around the opening on the front of the bellows, which has a 4 mm larger diameter than the lens panel, and this is what prevents the bellows from being pushed forward and out of the way by the grip.

Perhaps this won't be a problem with the thinner single-pleat bellows, as least so far as focusing and rise / fall movements are concerned?

Although I do have both of Cambo's Canon EF lens panels (i.e., smart and dumb), I don't have any Canon-mount lenses on hand so didn't bother checking the A7RIV's clearance with either of those. But since the FFD for Canon EF lenses is 44 mm, which 1.5 mm less than the FFD for the C/Y lenses, and the back of the dumb lens panel projects only .35 mm less than the Copal 0 panel (hence only partially compensating for the 1.5 mm difference in FFDs between the Canon and Contax lenses), I believe the clearance issue will be even worse when the A7RIV is used with Canon lenses focused at infinity.

Of course, all of the above also applies when lenses having FFDs even shorter than 44 mm are used, which includes most wide-angle view camera lenses. :(
I just don't have your experience with lenses on the short side so I'm sure/positive that your observations are very accurate.

I am more concerned with just being able to use my shortest lens (60mm Digitar) with my Sony and able to have all the movement I want in any direction. Granted it's not even standard Sony focal length but those are the cards I'm dealt.

I also don't know how much movement is available with any Canon lens other than their TSE lenses which I have never used.

My goals for the Sony are to have an environment where I can have lots of movements and still remain inside of the 'Really' sweet spot of LF lenses. This is very different from using Canon lenses on an Actus.

Sorry for being a little off topic......

Victor

Happy Thanksgiving......
 

rdeloe

Well-known member
I am more concerned with just being able to use my shortest lens (60mm Digitar) with my Sony and able to have all the movement I want in any direction.
I don't think you're getting all the movement you want in any direction with this lens. The 60mm Apo-Digitar f/4 has a 60mm image circle at f/11. Max shift before you run out of image circle is 12mm if a landscape rise, and 10mm if a portrait rise. Image quality at the edges of the image circle might not support even that much; only your own testing can say for sure.

I don't use this lens because it just barely covers a GFX sensor, but when I asked in another thread about the image quality, responses were very positive. I'm really happy with my Apo Digitar 80/4, so if it's in that league it's a nice lens.
 

vjbelle

Well-known member
I don't have the F4.0 version..... Mine is the XL f5.6 which has a larger image circle. It's a very nice lens which is hard to find these days.

Victor
 

rdeloe

Well-known member
I don't have the F4.0 version..... Mine is the XL f5.6 which has a larger image circle. It's a very nice lens which is hard to find these days.

Victor
You are good to go! That's a rare one indeed. If it came in a barrel (and if I didn't have to sell an organ to buy it), I'd love to have one.
 

ericstaud

New member
This is what I got from Cambo:

"The - now discontinued - AC-310 enabled the use of the Digaron-32 on an Actus-B with Sony A7. It’s not suitable for use on the Actus-XL. And we discontinued it for the Actus-B as well, because Sony made the hand grip bigger with every new version of the A7.
EF lenses do focus to infinity when used on an Actus or Actus-XL paired with a Sony. However, with the more recent versions the hand grip severely limits shift movements when the camera body is in portrait orientation."
That's what I was thinking, the portrait orientation is an issue.

I've recently started using a GFX 50r on the universalis. There's is ample space to acheive FFD with Canon lenses. I'm hoping Fuji will update the 50r with the 100 mp sensor and NOT make the grip bigger.
 
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