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Thread: Capture One 20

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    Capture One 20

    Now the beta is over, and 20 has been released. What do people think of it?

    I have a 12 pro license, but dont have any upgrades available (my lic never came with any)

    I run an IQ3 back but have a few files in CR2 format from canon days.

    I took a look at the upgrade pricing, but its not cheap. Am I going to get any benefit from upgrading? Does it still have a free DB only mode or has that gone now with Pro?

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    Re: Capture One 20

    The Phase One DB version is always free.

    You will need the other versions in order to process camera files generated with other than Phase One MFDBs.

    Ken

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    Re: Capture One 20

    Quote Originally Posted by kdphotography View Post
    The Phase One DB version is always free.

    You will need the other versions in order to process camera files generated with other than Phase One MFDBs.

    Ken
    should do fine with 12 for the other formats and 20 for my P1

    there is nothing missing in DB that;s in pro (when using IQ back/files) right?

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    Re: Capture One 20

    Quote Originally Posted by Massive Si View Post
    there is nothing missing in DB that;s in pro (when using IQ back/files) right?
    Correct!

    Dave
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    Re: Capture One 20

    Quote Originally Posted by Massive Si View Post
    Now the beta is over, and 20 has been released. What do people think of it?

    I have a 12 pro license, but dont have any upgrades available (my lic never came with any)

    I run an IQ3 back but have a few files in CR2 format from canon days.

    I took a look at the upgrade pricing, but its not cheap. Am I going to get any benefit from upgrading? Does it still have a free DB only mode or has that gone now with Pro?
    I got an email saying I am eligible for a free lifetime license of capture one due to owning a phaseone product. Maybe you should get the same ?

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    Re: Capture One 20

    Quote Originally Posted by Boinger View Post
    I got an email saying I am eligible for a free lifetime license of capture one due to owning a phaseone product. Maybe you should get the same ?
    I got the same email, but it's just a license for the DB product--it won't work with non-Phase raw files.
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    Re: Capture One 20

    Quote Originally Posted by Massive Si View Post
    Now the beta is over, and 20 has been released. What do people think of it?

    I have a 12 pro license, but dont have any upgrades available (my lic never came with any)

    I run an IQ3 back but have a few files in CR2 format from canon days.

    I took a look at the upgrade pricing, but its not cheap. Am I going to get any benefit from upgrading? Does it still have a free DB only mode or has that gone now with Pro?
    There are a few feature overviews that cover the full list of what's new. As an enthusiast and not a working pro, new features that effect the final image rather than productivity are what interests me the most. To that end the two biggest improvements for me are:

    1) More flexible HDR tool. Adds "white" and "black" adjustments to the normal "highlight" and "shadow". It also makes all tools bi-directional. From initial use this is very helpful. For example, try bringing down highlights and boosting whites, or boosting shadows and bring down blacks. This helps keep things looking natural when really cranking the highlight and shadow tools.

    2) Significantly improved noise reduction. In particular, one of my main complaints in the past has been the unnatural way in which high ISO files have all of the fine color detail sucked out of them. C1 20 is a large, noticeable step up from past versions on this front. (Maybe an additional 1/2 - 1 stop of noise performance.)

    Dave

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    Re: Capture One 20

    Can someone provide a direct link to the DB version for download? I am always directed to the full Pro version that requires additional payment, annoying.

    I have perpetual licence as a Phase One system owner, but even when I try to upgrade directly from the current C1 12 covered by that licence, I cannot fond the DB version of 20.
    - ErlingMM

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    Re: Capture One 20

    I believe you go ahead and download a the "trial" version of Capture One Pro 20

    When you register or activate the software, you select the version you wish to activate, and I believe here is where you see the DB option (amongst the others).

    ken

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    Re: Capture One 20

    Quote Originally Posted by kdphotography View Post
    I believe you go ahead and download a the "trial" version of Capture One Pro 20

    When you register or activate the software, you select the version you wish to activate, and I believe here is where you see the DB option (amongst the others).

    ken
    Yes you download the trial version but unlike before you also need a serial number to use it as DB version. You get that by registering your Phase One/Leaf/Mamiya back at the Phase One website under "My Profile". If you already have a profile and have registered a DB the serial for C1 should already be there, at least mine were.
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    Re: Capture One 20

    I bought the license and upgraded to v12 because C1 is used for processing different cameras. This came with a free upgrade to C1 20. The process is a bit confusing, as you have to "buy it", then apply a code they sent to make it a $0 purchase (note: this is different than the DB free option). But it all worked, and C1 20 is downloaded.

    Next question: Has anyone used C1 20? Will it disable v12? Am a bit hesitant to be an "early user".

    Thanks!

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    Re: Capture One 20

    Quote Originally Posted by Geoff View Post
    I bought the license and upgraded to v12 because C1 is used for processing different cameras. This came with a free upgrade to C1 20. The process is a bit confusing, as you have to "buy it", then apply a code they sent to make it a $0 purchase (note: this is different than the DB free option). But it all worked, and C1 20 is downloaded.

    Next question: Has anyone used C1 20? Will it disable v12? Am a bit hesitant to be an "early user".

    Thanks!
    After installing 20, 12 was disabled in my laptop. I wonder if it still will launch in my Mac pro that hasnít been updated.

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    Re: Capture One 20

    I upgraded to 20 and C1 Pro 12 is now disabled and placed into "trial mode" on my desktop.

    I had two separate C1 Pro licenses previously. I only upgraded one of them to ver. 12. I should hope the other license remains active for the older versions. I'll have to check, but when I log onto the Phase One website, it now only shows my C1Pro 20 license in my profile.

    I really don't need the multiple licenses now as I am semi-retired, but it does irk me somewhat if I lose my other license----either the ability to use an older version of C1 Pro or the ability to upgrade it since it is now more than a generation out of the upgrade path.


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    Re: Capture One 20

    I have had CaptureOne 6 and 7 Express. When I decided to try DB version on 7 it resetted the licence of version 6 also to DB version. However, I could enter the express licenses in both 6 and 7 and so switch between express and DB. This was so unconvenient that I now have old computer with old CaptureOne and completely separate computers with CaptureOne DB. I would not recommend trying out something if the old versions are absolutely essential.

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    Re: Capture One 20

    Has anyone started using C1 20? Do we like it?

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    Re: Capture One 20

    Quote Originally Posted by Geoff View Post
    Has anyone started using C1 20? Do we like it?
    I have recently installed Version 20 and had been using Capture One Pro 12. The interface has changed somewhat, and finding frequently used functions had required a bit of searching. However, the only questionable, and or problematic issue relates to the previews of recently ingested files, as some of them appear as low resolution images. I have to do further testing to make certain that it was not related to operator error, but I had never encountered a resolution issue with earlier versions.

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    Re: Capture One 20

    Quote Originally Posted by Mexecutioner View Post
    After installing 20, 12 was disabled in my laptop. I wonder if it still will launch in my Mac pro that hasnít been updated.
    To my puzzlement, my C12 was not disabled. In the past when upgrading my Mac would give me a message to the effect "do you want to replace the existing C1" - to which I said yes. No such message this time so I have both C12 and C20.

    Now I'm afraid to uninstall C12 because I'm afraid I'll lose all the settings I've made to my Raw files. Can anybody tell me?

    As far as use is concerned, I haven't done much yet but the noise suppression seems improved. The HDR slider for highlights now works backwards - it starts out at -100 and slides to the right. Not what I'm used to but I'll adapt!

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    Re: Capture One 20

    C20 crashed on me once so far.
    With best regards, K-H.

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    Re: Capture One 20

    Quote Originally Posted by Mexecutioner View Post
    After installing 20, 12 was disabled in my laptop. I wonder if it still will launch in my Mac pro that hasnít been updated.
    After upgrading my license in my laptop the one in my MacPro wouldn't launch, so I upgraded that one to 20 as well.

    I've been using 20 for a couple of days I see it is an evolutionary update and nothing really new or super different from 20. For those with cameras that shoot DNG files this is a nice update.

    Maybe I need to play more with it to find all the Easter eggs.

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    Re: Capture One 20

    Quote Originally Posted by k-hawinkler View Post
    C20 crashed on me once so far.
    Me too. I have an extremely stable build computer

    Yet c20 gave me a nice old blue screen of death while editing.
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    Re: Capture One 20

    Downloaded C1 20 with a new key for it. Didn't open it... went to open C12, and it required using the new key that had been given for the C1 20. Odd, but it worked. I wonder what happens when the C1 20 download is opened.....

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    Re: Capture One 20

    I've been on beta, and the new dynamic range controls are really nice, and masking is faster. However, if you're on a tech cam and an IQ4150 (and possibly other backs), LCC color correction is partially broken. It works fine if you're editing a full-res TIF, but if you're processing to a JPG or (even worse) a resized JPG, you'll get horrible added colour cast in what should be your LCC-corrected areas. Ouch. Also, Copy and Applying geometry settings is still largely broken as well.

    I've put in a support case, and hopefully they'll actually get both of these things fixed in the next release. For the moment, I'm sticking with CO12 until this gets resolved satisfactorily, as 1. is a showstopper and 2. is annoying as **** for the vast bulk of my architectural workflow.

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    Re: Capture One 20

    Having paid for the upgrade and used it a little...I'd say it was a case of too little for a "Major" upgrade. This is like a dot release more than a major move from 12 to 20... Yes, some of the improved tools are nice, but there isn't anything major there. Frustrating issues like missing lens corrections - the Fuji GF 100-200 is one example - are still not addressed. It really feels like "cashflow is lagging a bit, what's the best way to give it a boost before Xmas?" rather than a user focused major improvement.
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    Re: Capture One 20

    Sure had hoped phase would have gotten the 100-200 profile fixed. Really needs to be addressed mainly for vignette issues.

    Paul C

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    Re: Capture One 20

    I emailed them about it. Got the usual "we'll tell our developers, but please remember we don't comment on forthcoming features" kind of BS.

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul2660 View Post
    Sure had hoped phase would have gotten the 100-200 profile fixed. Really needs to be addressed mainly for vignette issues.

    Paul C

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    Re: Capture One 20

    I have been emailing them with offers to send them files to get the Nikon 80-400 added but it never makes the cut. Excellent lens with a lot of vignetting.

    Hope they get it in some day as their profiles are very good.

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    Re: Capture One 20

    I've just shot tethered to Capture One 20 for the first time using the GFX 50R...not very pleasant. This worked seamlessly with version 12.

    With version 20 it was fine for the first 4 shots. After that, each time I took a shot it attempted to spawn a new instance of C1. Capture One threw an error each time "Only one instance blah blah" and the shot was not imported to the initial instance. It was saved to the card however.

    I'll do some more experimenting then I'll file a support case.

    SOLVED: I had installed Fujifilm's Acquire software to back up camera settings. Ditching that fixed the problem!!
    Last edited by Pelorus; 11th December 2019 at 19:45.

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    Re: Capture One 20

    it seems perhaps as a consequence of the capital-fond Axel is a new owner, that cashflow as first priority, has taken over in foreground in stead of solid, confidential and qualitybased development.
    That was my fear
    I think I might let the offer by the upgrade pass for now..

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    Re: Capture One 20

    Quote Originally Posted by Thorkil View Post
    it seems perhaps as a consequence of the capital-fond Axel is a new owner, that cashflow as first priority, has taken over in foreground in stead of solid, confidential and qualitybased development.
    That was my fear
    I think I might let the offer by the upgrade pass for now..
    Yes that is unfortunately pretty obvious. Just look at the IQ4 150 still not up to date.

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    Re: Capture One 20

    But for me the advantages, far outweight the shortcomings.

    If you are user of any of the masking tools, and layers, the issues with 12 on a MacPro 2016 gen fully loaded 6 way with GFX100 or IQ4 files was that once you were into 3 or more layers and wanted to auto mask, 12 really slowed down. With open GL enabled for processing and display.

    NOTE, if you use masks like me I am a huge fan of them, I have yet to find a better software with accurate masking for fine details (example treeline against a blue sky) then C1, adding to the power is the luma masking which I tend to use in combination with auto mask to refine it.

    C1 20 seems to shows less time intensive needs for this in the larger raws with up to 6 to 8 layers. But the hang up for me is the auto mask calibration time (which can take as much as 45 seconds to re calibrate at times) However it does allow for a huge amount of control on a mask.

    IMO C1's masking control is very impressive, LR has come closer with latest releases, but I still find I prefer C1.

    The fact that the division of Phase running C1 (supposedly now a sep division in company) can't step up and take the time to handle lens profiles is disturbing. Especially on main line glass from Nikon and Fuji and others.

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    Re: Capture One 20

    I totally agree with Paul regarding the masking capabilities of C1. However for use outside of Phase files I find C1 lagging behind Adobe Raw for rendering fine details. My Sony 7RM4 files require a lot of extra sharpening in C1 and even with that effort the files never look as detailed as C1. My Fuji 50s files also gain some detail in Adobe Raw with very very little increase in sharpening while C1 requires a lot of increase and still doesn't look as detailed. The magical shadow lifting and highlight attenuation that C1 performs on Phase files is nowhere to be found for other raw formats.

    The real plus is with Phase One files where C1 really shines. There's some magic sauce that goes into those files that is never used for other raw formats. The only other program I have that will process a Phase One 4150 file is Irridient and the resulting file looks nothing like what can be accomplished in C1.

    So for me C1 is a must for Phase files and available for free.

    Victor
    Last edited by vjbelle; 12th December 2019 at 08:38.
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    Re: Capture One 20

    So true, I have noticed for years. Nikon and Fuji Both suffer on the finer details. Adding Structure helps a lot. But the LR conversion will always show a bit more finer details. Does fine on Phase files most of the time.

    However, with the new sharpening software from Topaz and Focus Magic, I feel I can get back alot of it later on.

    I also in C1 will often times add a mask and then reduce flow to around 15% and then sharpen the areas that the main pass of sharpening seems to miss.

    C1 needs a dehaze tool so badly IMO also.

    Paul C

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    Re: Capture One 20

    I find I need to use Nik a lot to reduce high ISO noise once C1 is done.
    With best regards, K-H.

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    Re: Capture One 20

    I attended Phase's Webinar today which was quite useful. I had already noted the improved handling of noise and the better HDR sliders, but the simplification of the color editor and crop tools is icing on the cake. Keeping in mind all my serious shooting is with Phase gear, I'm really happy with C20. Whether it was worth the upgrade price I'm not so sure but it's certainly an improvement over C12, especially the noise handling, important for someone who does a fair amount of hand-held work requiring higher ISOs. .

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    Re: Capture One 20

    I will upgrade to c20 when things settle down with Catalina and I will upgrade to catalina when things settle down with Catalina - the perpetual and yearly loop of frustration...

    On Lightroom V C1 as far as sharpness goes- it is well known that LR starts with higher sharpening levels on import V C1 - simple as that. I can't see the 'better' sharpening outcomes in LR that are being referenced above.
    The difference between C1 and LR for me is:

    1. mainly C1 has better easier and more capability in colour and masking and includes layers V LR doesn't.
    2. tethered shooting is better in C1
    3. Catalogues are actually MORE stable in C1 than LR (eg LR has just destroyed ten years worth of cataloguing for me in the latest upgrade in Lightroom Classic....( file not found file not found file not found )

    LR is better than C1 in integrating Photoshop in workflow ( at the margin)
    LR has a better Library and search capability - until it breaks down

    What I can say is that both Capture One AND Adobe - have forced me to rethink my long term DAM strategies and also to simplify my previous workflow in order to eliminate the now inevitable crapola that these beta ware companies insist on foisting on us - I dont think Apple are making it easier for anyone tbh.

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    Re: Capture One 20

    A warning today about Catalina 10.15.2 in combination with Capture One 12.1.4 and Capture One 20 is below. I believe the tethering being broken is the primary issue. Brad doesn't mention anything else, so if you're only ingesting file imports from non tethered shooting, I don't know that any caution is warranted.

    Also, Brad has written up a nicely comprehensive guide for those who may be considering purchasing the new Mac Pro (especially for those who will primarily be using Capture One/Photoshop).


    https://captureintegration.com/to-up...ot-to-upgrade/

    https://captureintegration.com/do-no...alina-10-15-2/


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    Re: Capture One 20

    Quote Originally Posted by Bill Caulfeild-Browne View Post
    I attended Phase's Webinar today which was quite useful. I had already noted the improved handling of noise and the better HDR sliders, but the simplification of the color editor and crop tools is icing on the cake. Keeping in mind all my serious shooting is with Phase gear, I'm really happy with C20. Whether it was worth the upgrade price I'm not so sure but it's certainly an improvement over C12, especially the noise handling, important for someone who does a fair amount of hand-held work requiring higher ISOs. .
    that might be usefull words to me, even though I'm not in the MF digital area..I'll give the Webinar a try, when need some jump-over-distractions from work later today..

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    Re: Capture One 20

    Hello, How can I get reg key for DB only? Thanks.

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    Re: Capture One 20

    Hi,

    Go to phaseone.com - log in, go to camera system warranty, scroll down, there you find it.

    Frank
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    Re: Capture One 20

    What's the problem with tethering under Catalina and C20? I have tethered with both installed on my laptop without any issues, IQ3100 back...OK, I am on 10.15.1. so the problem is only with 10.15.2.?
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    Re: Capture One 20

    Quote Originally Posted by baudolino View Post
    What's the problem with tethering under Catalina and C20? I have tethered with both installed on my laptop without any issues, IQ3100 back...OK, I am on 10.15.1. so the problem is only with 10.15.2.?
    That seems to be the warning.
    With best regards, K-H.
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    Re: Capture One 20

    Quote Originally Posted by baudolino View Post
    so the problem is only with 10.15.2.?
    Yes, I believe that is correct.
    C1 and Catalina 10.15.2

    Dave
    Last edited by dchew; 14th December 2019 at 09:06.
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    Re: Capture One 20

    Quote Originally Posted by baudolino View Post
    What's the problem with tethering under Catalina and C20? I have tethered with both installed on my laptop without any issues, IQ3100 back...OK, I am on 10.15.1. so the problem is only with 10.15.2.?
    Yes, it appears itís only with the newest update. Iím still on 1.14.something, so everything has been fine so far.

    Hereís the text of an email I got from DT:


    There is a recent discovery that the macOS Catalina 10.15.2 update has make Capture One 12 and 20 tethering function not working properly.

    Capture One Team is working on it as you receive this email, but in the meantime, please make sure that your Mac computer does not automatically update to 10.15.2 until there is a solution.

    If your computer has already updated to 10.15.2, you should be able to use Time Machine Back up to revert it back to 10.15.1.

    If you have any questions or concerns, please contact us at www.digitaltransitions.com/dt-support/ and we will get back to you as soon as we can.
    Bryan @ The Broketographers
    www.TheBroketographers.com | @thebroketographers
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