Phase One P45+ Body Choices

[fotografz]

I agree with Guy; the task of deciding between bodies should start with leaf vs. focal plane shutter. Both bodies are exceptional tools and each has niches where its advantages make it the better choice.

Landscape
Using a leaf shutter lens (the H body) for landscape you will suffer (extra weight, size, cost - slow max shutter speed) without benefit (high flash-sync-speed doesn't ).

Portraits
Portraits taken without flash or studio portraits are largely the same between the two bodies. Portraits taken on sunny days outdoors with flash favor the leaf-shutter in the H-body

Macro
The Mamiya/Phase and Hasselblad Macro lenses are both absolutely stellar; however, there are two bellows systems for the Mamiya/Phase if you ever want to go past 1:1. I don't think (correction anyone?) that the Hasselblad system has any bellows system (leaf shutter lenses make such systems more difficult).

Usually I would list the dozens of pros/cons of each body, but if you're shooting mostly landscape and already have/like the Mamiya body then I wouldn't look much further. In the future you might upgrade to a more recent version of the AFD body, but most of the improvements don't apply to landscape photography. You might also consider a technical body which is dedicated to landscape photography; they are harder to use (generally speaking) but produce unquestionably the highest image quality available when using the latest large format lenses.

Doug Peterson (e-mail Me)
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"IF you want to make the flash the primary light source and not just fill."


Doug, outdoor portraits using 1/800th sync rather than 1/125th allows use of wider apertures to separate subject from background, and the fill can be set to taste. One need not use flash as the primary light source as you state. Use of a longer lens for portrait or environmental photos with some movement @ 1/125th with just a touch of fill is something I personally avoid.

Not advocating one system over the other, the original poster can sort that out based on his needs. Just keeping it balanced.

Here's an example shot @ 1/750th shutter with just enough fill for the back lit subject ... shot in direct sun at water's edge.

 

[fotografz]

Thanks Chris. Really appreciate the clarification on this subject. I agree lot's of rumors on this

Unfortunately the above clarification is partially incorrect.

 

[dougpeterson]

Naughty Hasselblad. They're pretty serious about closing the system.

As far as focal plane goes, for landscape, I was shooting today at midday middle east full blown sun, getting a 1/50th f22 @ iso 100 which is pretty much exactly what it should have been given 'sunny f16'. If you're shooting landscape with medium format you are stopping down and given the iso properties of these backs, using a lower iso. It's probably unlikely that a landscape shooter with a MFDB is going to sweat a max 1/500 or 1/800 shutter speed. Commercial is another kettle of fish. So is lugging heavy leaf shutter lenses in your bag.

The vast majority of landscape is geared towards max DOF. However, there is interesting landscape work isolating things with very shallow DOF. In that situation your example translates from 1/50th f/22 ISO100 to 1/4000th f/2.8 ISO100. On a Hasselblad body limited to 1/800th you have a little more than 2 stops less flexibility to create such imagery (a 2-stop ND filter could fix that, but you'd need to always carry one for each of your lenses and composing/focus becomes more strained).

But obviously this is very minor consideration next to more prominent things like weight/size/cost.

Doug Peterson (e-mail Me)
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[fotografz]

And BTW - just be happy it does not work, because I think a sync cable is not really a great solution

Stone aged actually.

 

[dougpeterson]

"IF you want to make the flash the primary light source and not just fill."

Doug, outdoor portraits using 1/800th sync rather than 1/125th allows use of wider apertures to separate subject from background, and the fill can be set to taste. One need not use flash as the primary light source as you state. Use of a longer lens for portrait or environmental photos with some movement @ 1/125th with just a touch of fill is something I personally avoid.

Not advocating one system over the other, the original poster can sort that out based on his needs. Just keeping it balanced.

Here's an example shot @ 1/750th shutter with just enough fill for the back lit subject ... shot in direct sun at water's edge.

You're absolutely correct. That's a great example of a shot that is much easier with a leaf shutter lens. The focal plane shutter could do it at 1/125 but only with a 2 stop ND filter and then a tripod to keep the long lens steady.

Great shot by the way.

Until Hassy ships a focal plane H2 body or Mamiya gets their Leaf Shutter Lenses on shelves there won't be a system that can do it all. Too bad for everyone except me (I have all the cameras on my shelf ).

I was thinking more along these lines which would likewise be way more difficult with a focal plane shutter:

Shot with a P30+H on an H2 body and SB800s in Vegas (more images). By Doug Peterson.

Doug Peterson (e-mail Me)
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Head of Technical Services, Capture Integration
Phase One, Canon, Apple, Profoto, Eizo & More
National: 877.217.9870 | Cell: 740.707.2183
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[fotografz]

You're absolutely correct. That's a great example of a shot that is much easier with a leaf shutter lens. The focal plane shutter could do it at 1/125 but only with a 2 stop ND filter and then a tripod to keep the long lens steady.

Great shot by the way.

Until Hassy ships a focal plane H2 body or Mamiya gets their Leaf Shutter Lenses on shelves there won't be a system that can do it all. Too bad for everyone except me (I have all the cameras on my shelf ).

I was thinking more along these lines which would likewise be way more difficult with a focal plane shutter:

Shot with a P30+H on an H2 body and SB800s in Vegas (more images). By Doug Peterson.

Doug Peterson (e-mail Me)
__________________
Head of Technical Services, Capture Integration
Phase One, Canon, Apple, Profoto, Eizo & More
National: 877.217.9870 | Cell: 740.707.2183
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yep.

 

[hcubell]

Less options for users is rarely a good thing.

Doug Peterson (e-mail Me)
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Phase One, Canon, Apple, Profoto, Eizo & More
National: 877.217.9870 | Cell: 740.707.2183
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Interestingly, Hasselblad's decision to close up the H series has lead to MORE options, not fewer options. The naysayers just don't want to deal with that reality because it doesn't fit their marketing spin. If Hasselblad had not closed up the H series, Phase would still be exactly where it was 2.5 years ago, sucking up all the profits on its backs and contributing jack s..t to any camera/lens R&D for the medium format "community". Mamiya would be probably be out of business, relegated to the KEH dustbin along with Pentax, Contax and Bronica. Doubtful that the Hy6 would ever have seen the light of day if the H was not closed up.

 

[Steve Hendrix]

Interestingly, Hasselblad's decision to close up the H series has lead to MORE options, not fewer options. The naysayers just don't want to deal with that reality because it doesn't fit their marketing spin. If Hasselblad had not closed up the H series, Phase would still be exactly where it was 2.5 years ago, sucking up all the profits on its backs and contributing jack s..t to any camera/lens R&D for the medium format "community". Mamiya would be probably be out of business, relegated to the KEH dustbin along with Pentax, Contax and Bronica. Doubtful that the Hy6 would ever have seen the light of day if the H was not closed up.

I feel Hasselblad's actions hastened events rather than initiated them. I believe all of the DB makers at the time understood they needed their own digital camera platforms - even Contax and Bronica understood it, they just didn't get it done in time. What Hasselblad did was add a little more urgency to the situation.


Steve Hendrix
Phase One