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Thread: New 39mp CFV back

  1. #101
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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    The HC-3/70 also has a full metal ring around the bottom and requires modification to work with the 200-series.

    The RM-2 is supposed to have a more generous exit pupil (better for everyone, especially eyeglass wearers), so you may want to go with the latter, since both will require modification.

    If someone can confirm the PM90 will physically fit with the CFV backs mounted on a 500 or 200-series V-body (above, it's implied that it will), I will pick one up and see how much trouble solving the interlock problem is.

    -Brad

    Quote Originally Posted by tetsrfun View Post
    Will the older HC3/70 (52043) work with the 200 series. Nordin specifically says that he RM-2 won't work but make no mention of the HC 3.

    Steve
    Last edited by BradleyGibson; 12th July 2009 at 14:25.

  2. #102
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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    If someone can confirm the PM90 will physically fit with the CFV backs mounted on a 500
    *********
    Paul Claesson
    Hasselblad USA

    "The PM-90 and PME90 viewfinders are incompatible with the CFV back."

    http://luminous-landscape.com/forum/...st=40&start=40

    In the same thread, there is a picture of a PME-90 mounted with an A12 mag. There is a curve on the prism that wraps over the top of the mag. The CFV is said to be too deep for the curve.

    Steve

  3. #103
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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    Hi Steve, thanks.

    Yes, I asked that question of Paul over at LL.

    But fotografz (Marc?) seemed to imply in this thread that the finder and CFV back and finder may fit, albeit with issues. If the reason Hasselblad's official line that the two are incompatible is due to the interlock issue, that may be solvable. If they physically can't be attached at the same time, that would be quite different.

    Anyone tried, first-hand?

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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    speculating that it might be the cfv back is deeper than a regular A12 and the pm90 finder wraps around the back somewhat. It also has a mechanical interlock thing to access the A12 back release so that may be the other part as you point out. You might get the back on but never get it off!

    edit: duh. read the whole thread rob. asked and answered!

    Quote Originally Posted by BradleyGibson View Post
    Hi Steve, thanks.

    Yes, I asked that question of Paul over at LL.

    But fotografz (Marc?) seemed to imply in this thread that the finder and CFV back and finder may fit, albeit with issues. If the reason Hasselblad's official line that the two are incompatible is due to the interlock issue, that may be solvable. If they physically can't be attached at the same time, that would be quite different.

    Anyone tried, first-hand?

  5. #105
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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    Quote Originally Posted by BradleyGibson View Post
    Ok--I've gone ahead and purchased one. It appears that this one can be disassembled and modified. It may take a couple of weeks to put together a test 203FE system, but I will let folks here know of the outcome (RM-2 + 203FE), if there is interest.



    So are you saying that it is physically possible to mount a PM90 and a CFV at the same time (if one ignores the interlock issue you point out?) I am curious if the eyepiece blocks the CFV display at all?

    Thanks,
    -Brad
    Please do let us know of your RM-2 modification. Photos please : -)

    I don't think the PM/90 will even fit. Even if it did, the way the CVF has to be removed with two buttons at once would be a real PITA to figure out and rig something.

  6. #106
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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    KEH has a number of these finders for sale.

    I believe these are units that would do the job......certainly on a 500 series body.

    http://www.keh.com/OnLineStore/Produ...&GBC=&GCC=&KW=

  7. #107
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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    fotografz:
    The RM-2 is on its way. Both the 203FE and viewfinder should be here sometime this week. No problem posting photos of the mod. shortly thereafter.

    All indications are that the PM90 won't fit as well. I guess I'll stick with the RM-2 until I either hear otherwise, or get my hands on a CFV so I can make some measurements.

    Seascape:
    Yep, I saw 'em. But I don't want to buy one unless i can "make it work" on a 203FE. I don't mind a little hobby project, but grinding down the eyepiece or some other major modification wouldn't be worth the trouble.

    Thanks, guys,
    -Brad

  8. #108
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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    If people are going to work on "modifying" right angle finders, do the prototype work on an HC-4 (RM-1), they seem to be fairly common. The RM-2 finders are much less common.

    Steve

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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    I don't think I'll ruin the RM-2, since the metal ring is removable (famous last words). It appears to be the only part that needs modification. But you're right--if there's any risk, I'll pick up an HC-4 to 'practice' on.

    Good thought.
    -Brad

  10. #110
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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    I for one I am very glad Hasselblad developed this back and I hope they continue creating a CFV-50 or CFV60. After all the requests they got from us they finally listened. Unfortunately for me it came out too late. Tired of waiting I made the jump to P45+ and Mamiya 4 months ago. You guys are making me drool, in particular, that modification for the 503CW winder is very sweet! Who knows, I might get one of these backs in a couple of years. My 203FEs are not getting much of a workout lately, but I am not thinking of getting rid of them any time soon.

  11. #111
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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    Yes, it is great that Hasselblad is bringing out this back, and lets hope there's more in the future (maybe one with a large square sensor).

    But does anyone really think that this back, at this price, would have happened without the introduction of the Leica S2 ??

    I don't think so, Hasselblad did not seem too interested in producing backs for the V system, when they have no bodies or lenses to sell to the public.

    I guess selling a 39MP DB to people who already own bodies and lenses, is better than selling nothing......to what is probably a pretty large market, even today.

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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    Is there any reason to use the CW winder other than the ergonomics? It is .8FPS versus 1.3FPS in the FE winder, right? I am still very curious to see who designed the shape of the FE winder, especially since everything else in the 203FE falls to the hand so nicely.
    If Arrested Development was not a tv show, I would think that maybe Buster designed it:
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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    In addition to ergonomics, the CW winder has a shutter release, and will respond to a wired or infrared remote control.

    I'm also baffled by the F-winder--whose idea was that??

  14. #114
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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    I guess selling a 39MP DB to people who already own bodies and lenses, is better than selling nothing.
    ***********
    My guess is that the R&D for the CFV and for the 39 MP sensor and electronics is paid off and the profit margin at a price point of $13,995 is quite good.

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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    Quote Originally Posted by Seascape View Post
    I don't think so, Hasselblad did not seem too interested in producing backs for the V system, when they have no bodies or lenses to sell to the public.
    No bodies? Last time I checked, a new 503CW was still available. No lenses? Not many available new, that's for sure...which is disappointing. Maybe if there is a strong demand for the CFV-39, Hasselblad will commission Zeiss for another run of lenses. We can only hope and pray. In any case, it's better than the Leica R system....which is dead, dead, dead.

    Gary
    Alaska
    Still hoping for a 9 micron full frame 6x6cm sensor (someday)

  16. #116
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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    I believe that Hasselblad is only selling remaining stock of the 503CW.
    Carsten - Website

  17. #117
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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    Quote Originally Posted by BradleyGibson View Post
    I don't think I'll ruin the RM-2, since the metal ring is removable (famous last words). It appears to be the only part that needs modification. But you're right--if there's any risk, I'll pick up an HC-4 to 'practice' on.

    Good thought.
    -Brad
    I received an RM-2 and an HC-3 today. I have not had much time to compare but the difference in magnification is noticeable. In doing a little research on hoods and prisms, the standard WLF mag. is 4.5 as baseline. The PM-90 is 2x, the PM45 is 2.5x, RM-2 is 3x and the HC-3 is 4x (the highest mag. prism)..The DBS mag hood is 5.5 (the highest hood).

    I was not happy with add on mag. for my PME-45...The 4x HC-3 may stay on my 503. With a 39 MP back focusing is likely to be more critical than the 16 MP. The HC-3/70 may be the best prism for the CFV39.

    Steve

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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    Thanks for the update, Steve. Good to know about the HC-3/70's magnification, too.

    My RC-2 arrived today, and I took a look at it and was successful in modifying the silver ring at the base to be 203FE compatible. By taking a look at the PM-51 (a finder that is 200-series compatible) there may not be enough clearance just by modifying the ring (another 1-2mm may be required). One solution would be to grind it from the front of the finder (this is how the PM-51 is built), but a simpler solution might be to reattach the metal ring with 1-2mm of offsets (such as a small washer underneath each screw).

    My 203FE is expected to arrive tomorrow, and I'll test it with what I've got so far before going any further. If it works, I'll post a step-by-step how-to with photos. If not, I'll have to figure out the most sensible way to get the extra clearance--which likely won't happen until next week.

    Best regards,
    -Brad

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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    Quote Originally Posted by BradleyGibson View Post
    Thanks for the update, Steve. Good to know about the HC-3/70's magnification, too.

    My RC-2 arrived today, and I took a look at it and was successful in modifying the silver ring at the base to be 203FE compatible. By taking a look at the PM-51 (a finder that is 200-series compatible) there may not be enough clearance just by modifying the ring (another 1-2mm may be required). One solution would be to grind it from the front of the finder (this is how the PM-51 is built), but a simpler solution might be to reattach the metal ring with 1-2mm of offsets (such as a small washer underneath each screw).

    My 203FE is expected to arrive tomorrow, and I'll test it with what I've got so far before going any further. If it works, I'll post a step-by-step how-to with photos. If not, I'll have to figure out the most sensible way to get the extra clearance--which likely won't happen until next week.

    Best regards,
    -Brad
    Take photos as you go Brad. Lots of interest in this!

  20. #120
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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    Quote Originally Posted by carstenw View Post
    I believe that Hasselblad is only selling remaining stock of the 503CW.
    How do you know this?

    Not that it would be an issue since there are a billion of them out there and a fair amount of qualified repair people all over the globe ... one advantage of an all mechanical interchangable parts system.

  21. #121
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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    Quote Originally Posted by Stuart Richardson View Post
    Is there any reason to use the CW winder other than the ergonomics? It is .8FPS versus 1.3FPS in the FE winder, right? I am still very curious to see who designed the shape of the FE winder, especially since everything else in the 203FE falls to the hand so nicely.
    If Arrested Development was not a tv show, I would think that maybe Buster designed it:
    The advantage of the CW winder on a 503CW is that the viewfinder doesn't go black on you when shooting a sequence. Without it you (usually) have to take the camera from your eye and wind the camera to recock the lens shutter and drop the mirror back down. It's not a motor drive, just a winder.

  22. #122
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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    Quote Originally Posted by fotografz View Post
    The advantage of the CW winder on a 503CW is that the viewfinder doesn't go black on you when shooting a sequence. Without it you (usually) have to take the camera from your eye and wind the camera to recock the lens shutter and drop the mirror back down. It's not a motor drive, just a winder.
    I interpreted Stuart's question as asking about the advantages of the CW winder versus the FE winder. Marc, I assume you are describing the experience of hand-winding?

    Apologies if I'm misunderstanding--I've not used the FE winder.

    -Brad

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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    Quote Originally Posted by BradleyGibson View Post
    I interpreted Stuart's question as asking about the advantages of the CW winder versus the FE winder. Marc, I assume you are describing the experience of hand-winding?

    Apologies if I'm misunderstanding--I've not used the FE winder.

    -Brad
    Oh, I get it now.

    Hmmm, I think the 203 can be set to continuously shoot with mirror up and the 503 mirror has to be manually done each shot. I don't have a 503/CW winder anymore to check that for sure.

    So if I'm right, doing a sequence of images for dead-on register the 200 winder may have the advantage in that you wouldn't have to touch the camera. But if you alter a CW winder to work on a 200 camera, then it's not an advantage.

    I'm sure I'll be corrected on this if wrong

    BTW, the 200 winder is actually quite nice to use ... the design is such that you hold and shoot the camera as you would with no winder except you hook your thumb into the space between the winder and body. So like with no winder, both hands are holding the camera from below. Works better with a WL finder.

    For holding the camera on it's side using a prism finder, I think the CW would be better because of the grip strap.
    Last edited by fotografz; 17th July 2009 at 07:34.

  24. #124
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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    Just picked up a HC3/70 prism. Thought I should jump on it before everyone wants one. It is 4x magnification, which is the highest of all Hasselblad prisms I believe.

    Very well made, it not only has the diopter adjustment, there is also a lock so that the diopter setting does not move.

    Made in Wetzlar BTW.

  25. #125
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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    It is 4x magnification, which is the highest of all Hasselblad prisms I believe.
    *********
    Correct.. The newer RM-2 is 3x mag.

    Steve

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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    Quote Originally Posted by fotografz View Post
    Oh, I get it now.
    Hmmm, I think the 203 can be set to continuously shoot with mirror up and the 503 mirror has to be manually done each shot. I don't have a 503/CW winder anymore to check that for sure.
    So if I'm right, doing a sequence of images for dead-on register the 200 winder may have the advantage in that you wouldn't have to touch the camera. But if you alter a CW winder to work on a 200 camera, then it's not an advantage.
    I'm sure I'll be corrected on this if wrong
    BTW, the 200 winder is actually quite nice to use ... the design is such that you hold and shoot the camera as you would with no winder except you hook your thumb into the space between the winder and body. So like with no winder, both hands are holding the camera from below. Works better with a WL finder.
    For holding the camera on it's side using a prism finder, I think the CW would be better because of the grip strap.
    Hello Marc

    Please note , that the auto-bracketing function of the 203FE will not successfully work with the CFVI/II , because the camera is faster than the data transfer from the sensor to the CF-Card .
    In other words , the second shot will be done , before all data from the first shot are stored .
    This was discussed in the camera-info.com forum quite some time ago .
    I don't know , if it will work with the CFV-39 back .
    If the CFV-39 would be fast enough , then it would be very easy to create a series of images to be used for HDRI imaging .

    Jürgen

  27. #127
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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    Quote Originally Posted by jotloob View Post
    Hello Marc

    Please note , that the auto-bracketing function of the 203FE will not successfully work with the CFVI/II , because the camera is faster than the data transfer from the sensor to the CF-Card .
    In other words , the second shot will be done , before all data from the first shot are stored .
    This was discussed in the camera-info.com forum quite some time ago .
    I don't know , if it will work with the CFV-39 back .
    If the CFV-39 would be fast enough , then it would be very easy to create a series of images to be used for HDRI imaging .

    Jürgen
    Thanks Jurgen ... yes it will depend on the capture rate of this new back.

    However, I wasn't thinking of it as a rapid sequence, as much as the ability to shoot a series without touching the camera to put the mirror up ... and having to wait for the mirror lock vibration to dissipate. But maybe the winder introduces vibration anyway.

  28. #128
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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    Looks like it's now listed on B&H:

    http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produc...l_Digital.html

  29. #129
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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    Quote Originally Posted by MFnLF View Post
    What is most interesting about the B&H listing is that a 3 year FULL coverage protection plan is available for less than 1/2 the price of just a one year service only plan from Hasselblad.

    Drop the camera and they fix it or give you all your money back including sales tax if applicable.

    Interesting.

  30. #130
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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    I love the 392 MP. Hell of a deal
    Carsten - Website

  31. #131
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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    Drop the camera and they fix it or give you all your money back including sales tax if applicable.
    ********
    Anyone here have experience with that company? The coverage sounds too good to be true...especially when Hasselblad is the only point of service for their digital backs, as far as I know.

    Steve

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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    Quote Originally Posted by tetsrfun View Post
    Drop the camera and they fix it or give you all your money back including sales tax if applicable.
    ********
    Anyone here have experience with that company? The coverage sounds too good to be true...especially when Hasselblad is the only point of service for their digital backs, as far as I know.

    Steve
    That is a good question Steve. When you think about it, any high end digital camera can probably only be fixed by the maker unless it's really a simple repair.

    So, it would be interesting to know the track record of the Sagemax Insurance. I have a 3 year on my Sony A900 from B&H ... but it's still under factory warranty if something goes wrong ... however, if I dropped the camera, Sony certainly would not fix it under warranty.

  33. #133
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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    That is a good question Steve.
    **********
    The description of the coverage just reads like coverage for "high-end" cars which can be "iffy" when needed. I would assume that B&H would be cautious with recommending coverage, so who knows??

    Steve

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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    Well you can be sure of one thing -- they make money from the coverage. So either the backs don't break much (likely), they are inexpensive to fix or replace (unlikely), or they don't cover them well when they do (also likely). Figuring out the interplay between these factors is the crux of the issue.
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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    Quote Originally Posted by Stuart Richardson View Post
    Well you can be sure of one thing -- they make money from the coverage. So either the backs don't break much (likely), they are inexpensive to fix or replace (unlikely), or they don't cover them well when they do (also likely). Figuring out the interplay between these factors is the crux of the issue.
    All speculation on our part. For something like a DB, I'd ask a lot of questions.

    I think these are all based on volume and they just refund the money ... the hassel probably isn't worth it to them. It's all a number's game.

  36. #136
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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    HASSELBLAD Germany has shipped the first lot of CFV-39 digital backs to the dealers today .
    Mine is among that first lot .
    I expect it to arrive till the end of the coming week .

    Jürgen

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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    Quote Originally Posted by jotloob View Post
    HASSELBLAD Germany has shipped the first lot of CFV-39 digital backs to the dealers today .
    Mine is among that first lot .
    I expect it to arrive till the end of the coming week .

    Jürgen
    Shall look forward for your first hand review ...

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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    Jürgen, mind if I borrow it?

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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    i just started paying attention...may have to part with my CFV back and the rollei, keeping the 205 and going to the CFV-39

    much more economical than trying to put the P45 on the rollei

  40. #140
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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    One reason for the insurance being cheap may be that coverage for anything included in the manufacturer's warranty doesn't being until that warranty ends. So if Hassy gives you one year, the back-up coverage covers the following two years. I suspect that most non-accident failures occur early.

    Also, the policy does not cover "DAMAGE FROM ABUSE, MISUSE, INTRODUCTION OF FOREIGN OBJECTS INTO THE PRODUCT, UNAUTHORIZED PRODUCT MODIFICATIONS OR ALTERATIONS, FAILURE TO FOLLOW THE MANUFACTURER’S INSTRUCTIONS." You'd really want to know that the company was construing this term in a reasonable manner. I think Marc's right: the most important issue is whether the company is reputable.

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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    Quote Originally Posted by BradleyGibson View Post
    Jürgen, mind if I borrow it?
    mmmmmmmm ? ? ?

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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    The CFV-39 is shipped to me , but has not arrived yet .
    I will hopefully have my first shootings on saturday .

    Jürgen

  43. #143
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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    Wow, new CFV-39 is on eBay already ...

    http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...m=230361463253

    BTW, I have no connection with the seller.

  44. #144
    espressogeek
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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    The price for this back is fantastic but how does Hasselblad justify keeping their CFII 39mp back so much more expensive?

  45. #145
    Super Duper
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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    If they make the CFII too cheap, they might sell more H2F+CFII kits than H3DII kits, which would be problematic for their chosen direction. IMO ultimately the customer decides what they want anyway. If Hasselblad doesn't give people what they want at a good price, people will go elsewhere, and I think this is why Phase One is so strong.
    Carsten - Website

  46. #146
    espressogeek
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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    Fair enough of a comment. I have a P21 today and it appears to work with finders that this back can't accommodate.

    I do have a question that is half way off topic. I have a Hasselblad brightscreen in my 501c and a waist level finder. I used to use the PM90 finder. Do you guys think with a finder with more magnification and a top of the range accutematte that I could learn to focus relatively quickly? I could focus with my Nikon FE all day long but I can't focus in a timely manner to save my life with this thing. I would be interested in keeping my Hasselbald if this sounds feasible.

  47. #147
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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    What makes focusing slower on the Hasselblad? Is it the throw of the lens, or the screen isn't crisp for you?

    FWIW, I do find it easier to focus with the RM-2 (3x magnification) than I do with the PM-51 (2x magnification), using the same screen and same lens.

    -Brad

  48. #148
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    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    I was planning to get Hasselblad 500 series or even Mamiya RZ, but i will go with Phase One DB over Hasselblad DB.

  49. #149
    tetsrfun
    Guest

    Re: New 39mp CFV back

    I used to use the PM90 finder. Do you guys think with a finder with more magnification and a top of the range accutematte that I could learn to focus relatively quickly?
    **********
    An Acute-Matte D screen should make a big difference. The micro prism/split image (42215) is easy to focus even with low mag. PM prism. The WLF mag is 4.5, the highest mag prism finder is the HC-3 at 4 x.

    Steve

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