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Thread: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

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    Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    As promised from Leica:

    Press Release


    The LEICA S2: In a class all its own

    Unveiled for the first time at the Photokina 2008 trade show in Germany, Leica is pleased to announce the first shipments of the S2 will be delivered in October 2009. This new system product will set the standard in professional digital photography.

    A perfect synthesis

    The LEICA S2’s excellence is based not only on its high-resolution image sensor but also the unique S format and full range of features, such as autofocus, high-speed MAESTRO image processor, highly durable design and optimal size and ease-of-use for the professional photographer. The S2 achieves a perfect synthesis, combining the highest image quality in a camera with incomparable ease-of-use. It breaks new ground in every way, ensuring that photographers will enjoy perfect results from a camera that is truly easy to handle. The Leica S-system is the only professional camera system to make a clean break from legacy categories such as the “35mm” or “medium format” and was developed solely for the digital domain. This means the S2 has established its own format focused primarily on ease-of-use and optimal image quality - the Leica S format. This format pioneers the optimal quality of all components and embodies easy handling, giving photographers the creative scope they require. The decisive advantage of the LEICA S2 is the sum of its features: flexibility, durability and easy operation combined with industry-leading resolution and image quality. The S2 outperforms other camera systems in the medium-format category, setting a completely new standard for quality.

    A unique image sensor design for unparalleled quality

    The S2’s image sensor was developed especially for the S system by Kodak. With a resolution of 37.5 megapixels, the 30 x 45mm CCD sensor features an aspect ratio of 3:2 and an area nearly 60% larger than that of a traditional 35mm camera, resulting in stunning image quality. In the interest of preserving image sharpness, the camera disregards the standard low-pass filter. Instead, Moiré effects are detected and eliminated by the camera's internal signal processing, thus taking full advantage of the system's high-resolution lenses. A special micro-lens pattern allows complete capture of angled light rays on the image periphery for optimal use of available light. With a sensitivity of up to ISO 1250, low-noise images can be captured under limited lighting conditions.

    Compact design and familiar feel

    The LEICA S2 has the look and feel of traditional 35mm SLR cameras, preserving the handling qualities that have long been appreciated by professional photographers. The integration of electronic components and the very latest design methods have made the S2 remarkably smaller than other medium-format cameras. The number of controls was kept to a bare minimum without limiting the camera’s many features and options. Operation of the S2 becomes intuitive after minimal operation of the camera. The result is a finely balanced camera with a pleasant weight that allows photographers to work fluidly and spontaneously.
    The size and weight are far lower than comparable medium-format systems in a camera that features a high-resolution CCD as well as high-speed operation. The LEICA S2 is not only the right choice for the studio, but also for working on location and capturing images without the use of a tripod.

    Faster results with a high-speed system

    The S2’s high-speed MAESTRO image processor chip and supplemental camera control processor deliver exceptional processing power. Fast signal processing by the MAESTRO chip allows up to 1.5 images per second at maximum resolution. The powerful MAESTRO dual processor allows high-quality JPEG files to be created in the camera, the only medium-format to have this feature. The LEICA S2 has slots for both Compact Flash and SD, with an option for saving RAW format Adobe DNG data onto Compact Flash and JPEG to the SD card, simultaneously. This allows for easy image viewing on the camera while streamlining post-processing. Using Adobe DNG for raw imaging data gives photographers the ultimate flexibility because this open-source data format is supported by almost all major graphic-editing and workflow solutions. Leica supplies the universal Adobe Lightroom workflow solution as part of the camera’s equipment. Leica’s proprietary Image Shuttle software allows all of the S2 features to be controlled remotely from a computer, and image files are written directly onto the hard drive for immediate processing. An HDMI interface allows images to be presented and checked directly on monitors, television sets, and projectors.

    Reference-class lenses

    The highest priority during development of the Leica S lenses was image quality. Their sophisticated design features special grades of glass and aspherical surfaces rarely found in optics of this size. In addition, lenses manufactured to extremely narrow tolerances, with each lens centered by hand, guarantees superior quality and optical performance. The maximum performance of each lens is available even at full aperture setting, or when shooting from a distance or capturing close-up images. Vignetting, distortion and chromatic aberrations have been reduced to the point of imperceptibility, eliminating the need for quality-degrading image corrections and simplifying digital post-processing considerably. The newly developed S-bayonet mount ensures rapid and precise digital exchange of data and commands between the camera and lens.
    Four S series lenses will be launched for the key focal lengths by the end of 2009, including the classic LEICA SUMMARIT-S 70mm F/2.5 ASPH and the LEICA APO-TELE-ELMAR-S F/180mm telephoto lens. The LEICA APO-MACRO-SUMMARIT-S 120mm F/2.5, the solution for close-ups and portraits, and the wide-angle LEICA SUMMARIT-S 35mm F/2.5 ASPH are set to follow in late 2009. By multiplying the listed focal distances by 0.8, the user is given a comparison to corresponding 35mm-format lenses. A selection of the S lenses will also be available in a CS variant with an integrated focal-plane shutter. Leica is planning to prioritize the expansion of its range of S lenses in the near future.

    Technical data LEICA SUMMARIT-S 70 mm f/2.5 ASPH. (CS)

    Lenses/groups: 8/6 + 1 protective filter (1 aspherical surface)

    Optical design: Floating element focusing*

    Image angle (diagonal,
    horizontal, vertical): approx. 42°, 35, 5°, 24°, approx. corresponds to 56 mm
    in 35 mm-format

    Aperture range: 2.5 to 22

    Shortest distance: 19.68 in

    Largest image scale: 1:4.7

    Filter thread size: 82 mm

    Dimensions
    (diameter/length): 3.54 in / 3.66 in

    Weight: 26.1 oz (CS: 31.39 oz)

    *during focusing the relative position of two lens elements changes compared to the rest of the optical system



    Technical data LEICA APO-MACRO-SUMMARIT-S 120 mm f/2.5 (CS)

    Lenses/groups: 9/7

    Optical design: Floating element focusing*

    Image angle (diagonal,
    horizontal, vertical): approx. 25°, 21°, 14°, approx. corresponds to 96 mm in
    35 mm-format

    Aperture range: 2.5 to 22

    Shortest distance: 22.44 in

    Largest image scale: 1:2

    Filter thread size: 72 mm

    Dimensions
    (diameter/length): 3.58 in / 5.03 in

    Weight: 40.03 oz (CS: 45.32 oz)

    *during focusing the relative position of two lens elements changes compared to the rest of the optical system



    Technical data LEICA APO-TELE-ELMAR-S 180 mm f/3.5 (CS)

    Lenses/groups: 9/7

    Optical design: Internal focusing

    Image angle (diagonal,
    horizontal, vertical): approx. 17°, 14°, 9.5°, approx. corresponds to 144 mm
    in 35 mm-format

    Aperture range: 3.5 to 32

    Shortest distance: 59.0 in

    Largest image scale: 1:7

    Filter thread size: 72 mm

    Dimensions
    (diameter/length): 3.46 in / 5.94 in

    Weight: 40.56 oz (CS: 45.85 oz)


    Overview of service packages for S2 body and S2 lenses

    Service package/
    Type of service Warranty Premium package Platinum package

    Validity (validity always
    commences with date
    of purchasing S product: 12 months 24 months 24 months

    1-year extension of
    warranty: yes yes

    Dedicated Leica
    service helpline: yes yes yes

    Product replacement within the
    first 3 months after purchase
    of new product: yes yes

    Replacement parts
    stocked 6 years: yes yes yes

    30% repair discount: yes yes

    Replacement unit free of charge
    for duration of repair (24 hrs): yes

    Free maintenance (including one
    shutter replacement): yes


    For more information, further details and our terms and conditions pertaining to individual service package offers as well as a list of authorized dealers and national Leica organizations, please go to LEICA Camera AG - Aktuell.
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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    Continued:

    Dual shutter system

    The LEICA S2 allows photographers to choose the shutter system which best matches the task at hand. The S2 is equipped with a metal focal-plane shutter with the fastest shutter speed of 1/4000 of a second and a flash synch time of 1/125 of a second. Lenses of key focal lengths will be available in the future with integrated leaf shutters designed by Leica engineers that photographers can activate via the camera’s main switch. The integrated leaf shutter allows flash units to be used at the fastest shutter speed of 1/500 second, giving photographers more options for suppressing unwanted ambient light. Several patents are pending for the Leica leaf shutter, which features an electronically-controlled drive guaranteeing reliable, fast exposure times and low energy consumption.

    Precise, high-speed autofocus

    The autofocus developed by Leica for the S2 is based on a centrally positioned cross-hair sensor for high precision focusing. Each S lens has its own Leica-designed microprocessor for precise autofocus and iris diaphragm control. The integrated focusing drive is a proprietary Leica design that features silent gearing. All S lenses have a generous focus ring with just the right amount of drag, letting the photographer override the autofocus at any time.

    Rugged, durable design

    The camera’s body is made of robust die-cast magnesium with a leather-grain finish for maximum grip. The S2 and all S lenses are extensively weatherproofed and can withstand exposure to rain and dust, and the USB and remote control ports feature rugged bayonet locks with strain relief. The S2 can also be supplied with a highly scratch-resistant LEICA S2-P sapphire glass display cover for the most extreme and demanding conditions.


    Authorized sales and service network

    The LEICA S2 is only sold through authorized dealers who also offer specialized consultation and support. This network of dealers is part of the extended S system service package.
    The S system has its own customer care team with a dedicated helpline, making immediate service accessible for any questions that may arise. Professional photographers who demand absolute reliability from their camera systems can choose from additional service package upgrades to enhance the generous standard warranty coverage. The Platinum service package includes free maintenance in addition to offering loaner equipment for the duration of the service work. Please review the attached warranty table for more details.

    Pricing and availability

    At the end of September 2009, LEICA S2 will be available for $22,995 at select photography dealers. At $27,995 the LEICA S2-P with sapphire display includes the Platinum service package. The LEICA SUMMARIT-S 70 mm f/2.5 ASPH. for $4,495 and the LEICA APO-TELE-ELMAR-S 180 mm f/3.5 for $6,495will also be available when the S2 is launched. The LEICA APO-MACRO-SUMMARIT-S 120 mm f/2.5, also priced at $6,495, and the LEICA SUMMARIT-S 35 mm f/2.5 ASPH, priced at $5,295, will reach the market in late 2009. The CS variant models of the S lenses will be introduced successively over time. The first CS models to reach dealers will be the LEICA SUMMARIT-S 70 mm f/2.5 ASPH. CS ($5,995), the LEICA APO-MACRO-SUMMARIT-S 120 mm f/2.5 CS and the LEICA APO-TELE-ELMAR-S 180 mm f/3,5 CS (the macro and telephoto selling for $7,495 each). The LEICA SUMMARIT-S 35 mm f/2.5 ASPH. CS will follow for $5,995. Many of accessories will also become available with the market launch, including the professional S charging unit that recharges two batteries simultaneously ($399) as well as various components such as alternative viewfinder screens. Specialist dealers will also have many other accessories such as lens caps, cable releases and the LEICA SF 58 flash unit. An S all-purpose grip will be available starting in early 2010 for $1,295. Prices include taxes where applicable.

    Technical data LEICA S2 / LEICA S2-P

    Camera type: Digital single-lens reflex camera for use with Leica S lenses

    Image sensor: low-noise Kodak CCD sensor. Resolution: 37.5 megapixels (7,500 x 5,000).
    Size: 45 x 30mm, pixel spacing: 6µm. Aspect ratio: 3:2.
    Dynamic range: 12 stops, color depth: 16 bits per pixel, low-pass filter: none (Moiré detection and suppression using digital signal processing)

    Sensitivity range: ISO 80 to 1250 (manual or automatic control)

    Data storage (format): DNG (approx. 75 MB per image), JPEG (basic or fine),

    Memory cards: Compact Flash (up to 64 GB), SD cards (HC)

    Maximum frame rate: 1.5 images/s, buffer memory: 1 GB (for a minimum sequence of 8 images in DNG format)

    Control monitor: 3-inch TFT with 460,000 pixels, 16 million colors, cover glass: highly abrasion and scratch resistant sapphire glass (only with the LEICA S2-P)

    Connections: High-speed USB 2.0 (robust connection with strain-relief, cable included), HDMI, remote release, X sync, SCA3002

    Exposure metering: Multi-field metering (5 fields), center-weighted integral metering, spot metering (3.5%)

    Exposure control: Program mode (with Shift function), shutter priority, aperture priority, manual metering

    Shutter: Metal focal-plane shutter integrated in body: 1/4000 s to 32 s (B to 120 s), flash sync time: 1/125 s, optional leaf shutter in selected lenses: 1/500 s to 32 s, flash synch time: All speeds

    Flash operation: Metering method: TTL (multi-field, center-weighted, spot), TTL-HSS rapid synchronization up to 1/4000 s with focal plane shutter, Compatibility: fully compatible with LEICA SF 58 and devices with SCA3002 adapters

    Auto Focus: Central crosshair sensor, focusing drive in lens

    Operating Modes: AF Continuous, AF Single, MF, MF Override

    Viewfinder: High eye-point pentaprism viewfinder

    Magnification: 0.86x, viewfinder field: 96%, diopter compensation -3 to +1,
    focusing screen: Matte with cross-hairs (interchangeable)

    Power supply: Li-Ion battery (7.4 V, 2150 mAh)

    Housing: Die-cast magnesium, size (without lens):
    6.29 x 4.72 x 3.15 in; weight: 49.73oz (including battery) resistant to dust and dripping/splashing water

    Scope of supply Software: Adobe Lightroom, Leica Image Shuttle, one battery, charging unit, USB cable




    Technical data LEICA SUMMARIT-S 35 mm f/2.5 ASPH. (CS)

    Lenses/groups: 11/9 (2 aspherical surfaces)

    Optical design: Rear group focusing

    Image angle (diagonal,
    horizontal, vertical): approx. 75°, 65°, 46°, approx. corresponds to 28 mm
    in 35 mm-format

    Aperture range: 2.5 to 22

    Shortest distance: 21.65 in

    Largest image scale: 1:11

    Filter thread size: 82 mm

    Dimensions
    (diameter/length): 3.46 in /4.80 in

    Weight: 32.8 oz (CS: 38.09 oz)
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    Also Photos will be coming soon but no exact date from Leica on that. Thanks Guy
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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    Also putting up a PDF which maybe easier to read
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    A few thoughts:

    Data storage (format): DNG (approx. 75 MB per image)
    Maximum frame rate: 1.5 images/s, buffer memory: 1 GB (for a minimum sequence of 8 images in DNG format)

    1GB/75MB is more like 12-13 images. I wonder why it doesn't work out that way?

    120s maximum exposure time with Bulb. Not bad, could also be longer.

    Viewfinder: 96%... Hmm, I would have hoped for 100%.

    Other than that, pretty much the expected. I would love to try one, and I would love even more to win the lottery so I could buy into the system. It sounds really nice. For now I will be happy with my Contax 645/Sinar e54LV, but maybe one day in the future?
    Carsten - Website

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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    Quote Originally Posted by carstenw View Post
    Other than that, pretty much the expected
    yes.
    From the first rough reading I noticed this:

    Moiré effects are detected and eliminated by the camera's internal signal processing
    IF it works flawlessly under ALL conditions, that's nice. But I doubt so... by now.

    sensitivity of up to ISO 1250
    that's not that much. But mabe that's the quality Leica defines as "very good" and you still can underexpose... ?

    HDMI interface
    wow!

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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    I was hoping for useable 1600 ISO, but perhaps 1250 ISO with good glass @f2.5 could be better than other brand's 1600 ISO with stopped down glass. We will have to wait for photos to see.

    Mark

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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    Mark I am not sure this has the pixel binning data in it and my guess it is not and with that it could go up to 3200 ISO. Just for reference with the P40+

    P40+ http://www.phaseone.com/Content/p1di...TechSpecs.aspx
    Normal Resolution 40 mpx ISO 50-800
    Sensor + ( Pixel Binning 10 mpx) ISO 200-3200

    I tend to think 37mpx ISO 80-1250
    Pixel binning is usually double here so it MAYBE ISO 160-2500. Not sure but it seems this data is missing in the specs.
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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    Who actually made the Firmware for the S2? Jenoptik?

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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    Mark I am not sure this has the pixel binning data in it and my guess it is not and with that it could go up to 3200 ISO.
    Makes sense 4:1 binning should mean 2 additional stops - in theory ISO 1250 -> 5000?
    Monochrome: http://mochro.com

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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    Just read them again I'm mostly disappointed by the 96% I really have hoped for a full 100%

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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    Quote Originally Posted by thomas View Post
    Who actually made the Firmware for the S2? Jenoptik?
    No it is all Leica except for obviously the sensor and processor which is Fujitsu. But all firmware is in house as well as a complete separate team of S folks from the rest of the company.Leica made some internal changes which maybe for the better overall.
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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    Quote Originally Posted by Lars Vinberg View Post
    Makes sense 4:1 binning should mean 2 additional stops - in theory ISO 1250 -> 5000?
    Depends on which point you do it in the process and how. The 40+ and 65+ uses a very specific type of binning called Sensor+ which provides major benefits compared to traditional pixel binning.

    http://www.phaseone.com/apsis/160409Sensorplus.pdf

    Not neither a patent expert nor a sensor designer it's hard to say how broad Phase's patent on Sensor+ is, but another aspect of the design is that it requires implantation at the sensor, electronics, firmware, and software level.

    I have no idea either way, but if they were doing advanced pixel binning one would think they would have mentioned it in the Tech Specs.

    I'm also anxious to see what the ISOs actually look like in the raw files.

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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    I htink that the the S2 and M9 are going to be killer products for Leica. I am interested in the quality of file that comes out of the new chips. if it has the same or better IQ as M8 /DMR - then it will offer compelling value. Hasselblad and Phase only have to worry about form factor in their camera systems - I do believe that the larger than 35mm /35mm look and ergonomics will be a draw card for many potential 'new' users - combined with claims about weather proofing - this is an interesting and very useful real world development. What a pity they didnt deliver image stabilisation via lens or body tech - that would have been awesome and made a real world useage difference.

    I cant wait for all the stuff to come out!

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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    It all is but I think some of you are forgetting that we are still talking about a 30k+ System here. I wish Leica luck and will buy a M9 when it really comes in November and delivers as promised. For the S2 System, probably never. I mean we will see a new 1Ds and Nikon and Sony sooner rather than later, which will have something like 28+ pixels probably with many other new unique features. Will the S2 be better ? NO will it be different ? YES. I mean I see the point of the S2, I even can imagine that there are a lot of people interested, I get the concept, however I once again think it will be to little to late.

    We will see I hope Leica proves me wrong. Especially at my guess that we won't see a FF M9 before Photokina :-)

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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    Quote Originally Posted by Christopher View Post
    It all is but I think some of you are forgetting that we are still talking about a 30k+ System here. I wish Leica luck and will buy a M9 when it really comes in November and delivers as promised. For the S2 System, probably never. I mean we will see a new 1Ds and Nikon and Sony sooner rather than later, which will have something like 28+ pixels probably with many other new unique features. Will the S2 be better ? NO will it be different ? YES. I mean I see the point of the S2, I even can imagine that there are a lot of people interested, I get the concept, however I once again think it will be to little to late.

    We will see I hope Leica proves me wrong. Especially at my guess that we won't see a FF M9 before Photokina :-)
    too little too late?
    I don't see how they could have packaged more into that body size..and that is just for starts.. too late? how long has kodak had this chip available?.. when did hasselblad's version of this technology ship?
    I think it is enough and in good time.. but then again, I have no canon 1dIII +lenses, no p30 or p45+, so the grass looks different from here.

    I do agree with your disappointment regarding 96% viewfinder image..what is up with that? I think an e3 olympus beats that..spare me the hdmi output and provide a 100% image in the finder.

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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    As I said I hope and think they will sell quite a few, but I'm not sure if they sell enough in the long term. I mean I still would love a S2, I mean there is a reason that I use Leica glass on my Canon and use just three good primes on my Phase One, however I just can't see a way to do it. I have to justify the costs and here lies the problem. I can't afford a fourth camera system. The Leica will never replace the medium format part, because it's not flexible. No movements, no large format camera. Then again it just missing so many things to replace a Canon or Nikon System. ( long lenses, wide lenses, Live view, great high ISO, just one focus point ) Still if I would not have a Phase System I probably would consider it. ( Well as long the IQ proves to be as good as Leica claims)

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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    It's interesting that with issues like moire detection/removal (plus focus-shift correction) Leica is doing it automatically in camera vs. externally as in Phocus under photog control and with benefit of a larger/faster processor (or at least one would hope). The latter of course would require a dedicated/tuned external PP package.

    Will be curious to see the real-life speed/power consumption of the camera (specs are well, just specs - regardless of who publishes them).

    In Jan '09 of LFI they mentioned that during their infamous 'test' shoot, quote:

    "For the time being, however, our young prototype wouldn't have stood a chance (re: real-life endurance test outside of studio). The camera remains a bit too slow, the autofocus is not quite there yet, and the energy saving mode (I assume they mean 'sleep') still needs to be implemented in the firmware."

    That was 8 months ago however. As for ISO, I assume until proven otherwise that the upper end of the quoted range for a new body falls under the category of 'usable' vs. 'clean. the ISO 80- is nice. As for binning - if it isn't mentioned as a feature...

    As for test shots, barring a royal screw-up, they'll be fine. It is after all a typical late-gen MFDB sensor (CDD, no AA) with very sharp glass on the front. At lower ISOs I'd be disappointed at anything less than 'wow' - as I would be with any Phase/Hassy body + sharp lens. That should be an absolute given.

    What I'm MUCH more curious about is reports back from impartial folks putting the body and glass through their paces in real-life: Handling, responsiveness, shot-shot speed, AF speed and lock, power consumption, buffer clearing, WB, noise at ISO 800+ - and the ability to fine tune the end result given are using off-the shelf SW (e.g. LR). Given supposed to be a MFDB/SLR hybrid, it IDEALLY should portray the best features of both camps - to a reasonable limit.

    Looking fwd to late Fall/early winter.

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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    Metal focal-plane shutter integrated in body:
    1/4000 s to 32 s (B to 120 s), flash sync time:
    1/125 s, optional leaf shutter in selected
    lenses: 1/500 s to 32 s, flash synch time: All
    speeds

    Looks like 2 minutes on Bulb. Little bugged by only 1/125 of a second for flash sync without the central shutter lens
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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    Filter sizes

    35mm is 82 mm
    70 mm is 82mm
    120mm is 72mm
    180mm is 72mm

    Some pretty big barrels there
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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    CS lenses hope for in Dec? Or was it early 2010?

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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    Quote Originally Posted by robmac View Post
    CS lenses hope for in Dec? Or was it early 2010?
    70, 120, 180 CS by November.

    35 CS by December.

    David
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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    Metal focal-plane shutter integrated in body:
    1/4000 s to 32 s (B to 120 s), flash sync time:
    1/125 s, optional leaf shutter in selected
    lenses: 1/500 s to 32 s, flash synch time: All
    speeds

    Looks like 2 minutes on Bulb. Little bugged by only 1/125 of a second for flash sync without the central shutter lens
    1/125th for a focal plane shutter on MF seems to be par for the course (Mamiya, Contax).

    Did you notice that it will do hgih-speed sync up to 1/4000th with the SF-58? Not that that helps with studio strobes.

    David
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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    Thanks David

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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    Metal focal-plane shutter integrated in body:
    1/4000 s to 32 s (B to 120 s), flash sync time:
    1/125 s, optional leaf shutter in selected
    lenses: 1/500 s to 32 s, flash synch time: All
    speeds

    Looks like 2 minutes on Bulb. Little bugged by only 1/125 of a second for flash sync without the central shutter lens
    Yes, the 1/125s speed on sync is relatively slow. Most 35mm DSLR systems are at 1/250s and with some fiddling on remote triggers, one can get higher than that. One would think that Leica, with all its precision stuff and experience with shutters could deliver at least 1/250s at this point. Sure the mirror is bigger, etc., but this should be doable for them. The 1/500s on the CS lenses is nice, but also could be higher, as we are seeing with Hasselblad and optics for the "in limbo" Hy6.

    As a number of folks have noted, that one stop of shutter speed can make all the difference in sharpness of images. With the slower sync, it may still cause some issues with hand held shooting, which is supposedly where the S2 is going to excel. Hmmmm.....math and words are not matching again.

    We will have to wait and see how things turn out in real use, but these are some of the issues that were raised way earlier this year or late last year and do not seem to have changed on the Leica side.

    LJ

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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    Hey David what is the word on the 30-90 with regards to aperture and release dates.
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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    Quote Originally Posted by dfarkas View Post
    1/125th for a focal plane shutter on MF seems to be par for the course (Mamiya, Contax).

    Did you notice that it will do hgih-speed sync up to 1/4000th with the SF-58? Not that that helps with studio strobes.

    David
    Well, that HS sync with the SF-58 will help some. That sort of thing works nicely in the Canon system and the Nikon as well, but as you note, does nothing for use with studio flash, where it may be needed the most. That is unless beach shooters and other guys start forgoing their Brons, Hensels, Elinchroms, Profotos, etc., and start loading up on SF-58s. Not sure I see that happening right away or much at all. Just my thoughts.

    LJ

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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    Quote Originally Posted by dfarkas View Post
    1/125th for a focal plane shutter on MF seems to be par for the course (Mamiya, Contax).

    Did you notice that it will do hgih-speed sync up to 1/4000th with the SF-58? Not that that helps with studio strobes.

    David
    Yea we know and would kill for 1/250th.
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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    Hey David what is the word on the 30-90 with regards to aperture and release dates.
    I don't have info on release date yet, but the aperture should be a constant f/3.5 throughout the range.

    My guess is that we'll see a 30-90 by winter/spring 2010. Just a guess, at this point, though.

    David
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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    "The proof of the pudding is in the eating."

    I think I need to skip these posts until someone can give us a first-hand report.

    8-)

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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    Quote Originally Posted by Christopher View Post
    It all is but I think some of you are forgetting that we are still talking about a 30k+ System here. I wish Leica luck and will buy a M9 when it really comes in November and delivers as promised. For the S2 System, probably never. I mean we will see a new 1Ds and Nikon and Sony sooner rather than later, which will have something like 28+ pixels probably with many other new unique features. Will the S2 be better ? NO will it be different ? YES. I mean I see the point of the S2, I even can imagine that there are a lot of people interested, I get the concept, however I once again think it will be to little to late.

    We will see I hope Leica proves me wrong. Especially at my guess that we won't see a FF M9 before Photokina :-)
    Christopher

    You are postulating that the systems from Leica, Nikon, and Canon are equivalent in terms of image quality based upon MP and processing.

    I would argue that the final image quality lies with the lenses and no one does them better than Leica.

    JMHO

    Woody

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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    Woody,

    If "the final image quality lies with the lenses and no one does them better than Leica," why not use those (R) lenses on a Canon or Nikon camera?

    With all due respect, many of the arguments here about why one should or shouldn't want an S2 sound familiar to me: I'm a lawyer, and regularly hear or read what lawyers say we should conlude from the evidence in a case. And here we don't have even any evidence yet.

    Steve

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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    Well it certainly SOUNDS good.

    Guy, I have to agree - those are some BIG barrels. An 82mm filter size for the 70mm lens? Dang...

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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    The IQ surely comes from both lenses and camera unit.
    Carsten - Website

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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    1/125 sync and a 96% viewfinder, 1 focus point. Camera body that an Elan II circa 1995 can beat. When will these people realise that they need to make a camera body that is somewhat part of this century?

    Not having a 100% viewfinder has me gobsmacked. Just can't believe it.
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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    I have NO DOUBT about the IQ which comes out of the S System. My doubts are only related to Leica, their execution over the next years and the support, service for this system.

    As I still did not buy into an MF system so far I will give the S System a try as soon as it hits the streets. I would need a system with 2 - 3 lenses in March 2010 now, so I still could vote for the S System, if I am overwhelmed. Which is what I am still far away from, but I am open to try.

    If it does not work out, my solution is Phase, P45+ and 3 lenses. Should be cheaper also

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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    Quote Originally Posted by stephengilbert View Post
    Woody,

    If "the final image quality lies with the lenses and no one does them better than Leica," why not use those (R) lenses on a Canon or Nikon camera?

    With all due respect, many of the arguments here about why one should or shouldn't want an S2 sound familiar to me: I'm a lawyer, and regularly hear or read what lawyers say we should conlude from the evidence in a case. And here we don't have even any evidence yet.

    Steve
    Hey Steve

    I do use R lenses on a 5D. Love the lenses but don't like the look of Canon sensors. Just a personal bias I guess.

    Woody

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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    Quote Originally Posted by carstenw View Post
    The IQ surely comes from both lenses and camera unit.
    Hey Carsten

    Of course the sensor/body has a component to final IQ........no doubt. But the lenses for these high rez systems are the ultimate determinant. That is why the tech cameras, which use primarily Schneider and Rodenstock lenses, have become so popular. JMHO

    Woody

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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    I think this is only the case because the sensors are uniformly good, but the lenses vary greatly. If the sensors in MF cameras were made by Canon instead of Kodak and Dalsa, this situation would be very different. For the 35mm DSLRs, both sensors and lenses are a huge deal, which is how a camera like the A900 can come in and change the market.

    Your observation about Schneiders and Rodenstocks is only so because there are many disappointing lenses in MF. I doubt strongly that the Leicas will be among those.
    Carsten - Website

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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    Quote Originally Posted by woodyspedden View Post
    Hey Steve

    I do use R lenses on a 5D. Love the lenses but don't like the look of Canon sensors. Just a personal bias I guess.

    Woody
    Hi Woody,

    Me neither BUT I greatly prefer the 5DII files through Capture One. It makes a real difference. Have you tried?

    T

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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    I think 12 stops of DR is a bit limp. These things are subject to different results for different measuring techniques for sure but according to DXO that's not really in the same league as Phase and the Nikon D3X...

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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    Let's see what comes. I doubt that a Kodak sensor in the S2 will perform any worse than in a Phase/Hasselblad back.
    Carsten - Website

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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    Doubt it would. The IQ is really not any of my concern. I still worry about the raw processing though. Yes I did not get what I wanted and freely admit I wanted C1 to be a player
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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    Quote Originally Posted by Ben Rubinstein View Post
    Not having a 100% viewfinder has me gobsmacked. Just can't believe it.
    I never understand why so many cameras come so close yet fail to reach 100%. Why is that? Does it save a huge amount on the mirror or prism size? I agree it's bizarre that a camera striving for such perfection, at a price that should ensure perfection, would do this.

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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    Well it's a big sensor and big image circle

    Quote Originally Posted by Double Negative View Post
    Well it certainly SOUNDS good.

    Guy, I have to agree - those are some BIG barrels. An 82mm filter size for the 70mm lens? Dang...

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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    Quote Originally Posted by tom in mpls View Post
    I never understand why so many cameras come so close yet fail to reach 100%. Why is that? Does it save a huge amount on the mirror or prism size? I agree it's bizarre that a camera striving for such perfection, at a price that should ensure perfection, would do this.
    It's happened more than once, as you point out. My guess is feature creep - a body is designed that can cover 100%, but down the road AF and metering is added or changed, slicing off a fraction of viewfinder coverage. Or there is a decision to make the prism smaller for some reason, or (obviously not with the S2) coverage is reduced to position against a top of the line model.

    Then again, with enough resolution it's not really an issue.
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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    My bet- the 4% was cut, in part, because of the desired ergos and stylists -- as well as feature creep. Prism too large vs body, etc, etc. A lot of effort and verbiage has gone into the look and feel of this beast.

    4% doesn't sound like much, but then the moulding needs to be enlarged to allow everything be larger and to allow the hardware and circuitry around the prism to be shifted, etc.

    It does seem silly that a camera branded as perfection and priced accordingly would skimp on what so many photogs long so much for.

    The IQ in terms of resolution will be good - nice MF standard sensor + top glass, why wouldn't it be? WB, DR, etc - that we shall see.

    However, this is Leica's A900. Their first crack at a new market and lots of new tech for them - here WILL be shortcomings. Items not quite perfected, testing cut back to meet release dates, compromises made by Design Team A to accommodate Design Team B, etc. Every NEW design is a basket of compromises. No one gets 'perfection' 1st time out of the gate. DR, ISO range, noise, speed, power consumption, AF etc.

    If it sells beyond the initial monied devotees and QC, reliability and S&S are there, it will hopefully give them the cash flow needed to moderate their auditors' concerns for fiscal 2010 and allow improvements in an S3, etc in 20__. Personally I expect we'll see great IQ at base ISO, great glass and then a mixed bag of "ooh yeah, baby", "oh", and "#$%!".
    Last edited by robmac; 16th August 2009 at 15:00.

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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    Thanks for getting this to everyone Guy.

    96% viewfinder? USB feed to the computer? Well, we'll just have to wait for first hand reports.

    But if the image quality is a step forward from existing systems, that stuff will be of little consequence and many will put up with it as the price one pays.

    I still contend that it's not necessarily the initial price (which is admittedly breathtakingly high), it's the staggering loss one has to undertake if you already have a MFD system. Most people bought their MF gear long, and now it's all selling way short ... if you can sell it for anywhere near a decent price at all. In effect, this can increase the S2 price by 50% or more.

    No matter to me ... Leica already has a commitment for my money in the near future ... the M9. I think the M9 will sell like oxygen tanks in outer space ... and will take the pressure off the S2 so it can have some breathing room to flourish over time.

    Just my 2,250,000¢ worth

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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    Yea I am having a hard time just thinking of moving up to the P40+ from the P30+ and that is still a concern. Seriously us MF users are looking at low used prices for our stuff
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    Re: Press release: S2 Technical Specs

    Screw the whole S2 system, Screw the whole R system, Just give me a FF M9 this fall ;-)

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