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Thread: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

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    Workshop Member glenerrolrd's Avatar
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    Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    I am set with my D3 and 4 Nikkor zooms but I am considering what direction to go with fast primes. No hurry just something to think about. ISO 25K and f1.4 could do some amazing things with dawn and dusk images. So its it Zeiss and manual focus or the Nikkor 1.4 primes. I am thinking 28,50,85.. Looking for POV s . I could ,of course, just wait for the R10 but..then I wouldn t have anything aquire?

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    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    Like to hear opinions on this myself Nikon Vs Zeiss mainly the 85mm for me
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

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    Senior Member vieri's Avatar
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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    Quote Originally Posted by glenerrolrd View Post
    I am set with my D3 and 4 Nikkor zooms but I am considering what direction to go with fast primes. No hurry just something to think about. ISO 25K and f1.4 could do some amazing things with dawn and dusk images. So its it Zeiss and manual focus or the Nikkor 1.4 primes. I am thinking 28,50,85.. Looking for POV s . I could ,of course, just wait for the R10 but..then I wouldn t have anything aquire?
    I am a prime guy, and besides the 14-24 (that just replaced the 17-35) and the 70-200 (very useful for VR for low light concert stuff, especially with my D2X & D2xs, now with the D3 I am not sure I really would need it) I am using primes only: I have the 35 f2, 50 f1.4, 85 f1.4, 105 f2, 180 f2.8 and they are all very good to really great performers; I'd say, the 50 f1.4 is probably a small step below the rest, the others are all great. I never tried the Zeiss, and were (as Guy) interested in the 85mm f1.4, but nothing I have seen on the net made me feel the urge to switch... as far as the 28 f1.4, all I can say is I wish I could find one!
    Vieri Bottazzini
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    Workshop Member glenerrolrd's Avatar
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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    On the 28 1.4 ..me too..one of my good friends has had one since they were introduced and he rubs it in about the low light capabilities.They are about $3500 on eBay if you can find one. if the lenses follow their pedigree the Zeiss will have better color and higher contrast. (which you may or may not want). Either will be sharper than I deserve or need . The other big difference is the manual verse autofocus. I am struggling a bit with the D3 auto focus alternatives for sports so I naturally favor the Zeiss glass. But I suspect that it would be a close call if I used them both. I think I understood that Sean Reid will be doing this test in the near future.

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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    The Zeiss 50/1.4 is marginally better than the Nikon 50/1.4. I do prefer the Zeiss, but if you really want autofocus in a 50 the Nikon is not a bad lens.

    In the 28 range, go for the old manual focus Nikon if you can find it and don't mind the high cost.

    If you have any interest in a 35mm, that is one of the stars in the Zeiss line-up.

    In the 85mm focal length, I had the Zeiss which was a great lens but not easy to focus using the Nikon screens. It was even challenging on my old D200 with the Brightscreen focussing screen. The focus confirmation light accuracy on both the D300 & D3 is much improved over the D200, but still not enough so that I did not have a lot of misses when using the 85 Zeiss at 1.4 or 2.0. The Nikon 85/1.4 is such a superb lens, I think it should be the choice.

    Just my $.02.

    If a 2.8 max aperture is acceptable to you along with a larger lens, the new 24-70/2.8 Nikon zoom is really a remarkable piece of glass. I sold my Nikon 28/1.4 & Zeiss 35/2.0 due to just how good the new zoom was and its convenience. I did keep the Zeiss 50/1.4 and Zeiss 50/2.0 Macro for primes as I really enjoy the 50mm focal length. The other part of the deciding factor was that if I am going to use primes, I have the M8 and Leica glass - so why double up on that capability with the D3. The D3 is for use with zooms, macro, and telephoto.

    The Zeiss 50/2.0 Macro is incredible for macro work (especially with the new live view on the D3) and really blows away the old Nikon 60/2.8 Macro. I do not have any experience with the new Nikon 60 Macro.

    Another lens that you really need to consider is the 105/2.8 VR Macro. This is another stunning lens in general portrait work and macro. (surprising that is is so good in the normal range - outside of macro work)

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    Administrator Bob's Avatar
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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    After shooting nikon for so many years before I bought into Leica, the one thing that continues to strike me is the Leica low levels of distortion. It is a pleasure to work with straight lines again.
    I value this better than absolute sharpness, better than contrast, better than low vignetting, that is unless you are shooting exclusively curvy subjects, in which case it hardly matters.
    Go Zeiss avoid the zooms.
    -bob

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    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    The zoom for me would be event work which it will not matter to much. The M8 will come to play when i need straight lines , no question there.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

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    Senior Member deepdiver's Avatar
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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    Like to hear opinions on this myself Nikon Vs Zeiss mainly the 85mm for me
    Hi Guy!
    I'm a new member here.
    I own all ZF lens for Nikon, except the ZF 50/1.4 (because the ZF 50/2 macro is a much better lens compare to ZF 50/1.4)
    I use ZF 85/1.4 a lot for outdoor pictorial.
    You can see a lot of samples at my website

    http://digitalxd1.multiply.com

    Best Regard

    Andree

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    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    Andree welcome to the forum. Nice to see more Nikon shooters coming aboard. I will check out those images. One reason i did decide to go Nikon was some of those Zeiss lenses.

    It does have a nice look to them. Reminds me of my 75 lux look. Very nice work BTW.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

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    Senior Subscriber Member Steen's Avatar
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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    Nikon is really behind with AF-S versions in the wide, normal and tele prime departments, as if they at some point decided to make zooms only. Personally I suspect they are forced to change their minds in this regard.
    You have to go to the superteles (200+ mm) or the Micros (60 & 105mm) to find an AF-S prime whatsoever.
    I have a feeling that we will soon (within a year ?) see new AF-S versions of e.g. 85, 50 and 28mm.
    At least that is the development I would like to see.
    As for the ZFs I think Ray is right, the 85mm is too difficult to manual focus wide open with the D300 viewfinder with the born matte screen which unfortunately is only interchangeable by surgery.
    I also agree with Vieri that we haven't seen all that many convincing ZF 85mm captures on the net so far.
    OTOH I think this wide open 85mm on a D3 makes the girl look sweet
    http://www.nikoncafe.com/vforums/sho...4&highlight=ZF
    http://www.nikoncafe.com/vforums/sho...6&highlight=ZF
    http://www.nikoncafe.com/vforums/sho...6&highlight=ZF
    Is it the D3 that makes the 85mm sing ? Nahh, probably the photographer.
    If I was starting from scratch with the ZFs I would look into the 2/35mm, 2/50mm Macro, and the 2/100mm Macro. I haven't really seen so much yet about the new 2/28mm, it will be interesting to see some more about that one too.

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    Senior Subscriber Member Steen's Avatar
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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    Hi Adree, I just realized that it is actually you who has taken those great ZF 85mm pictures I mentioned in my former post. Really nice work, and good to see you here.
    /Steen

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    Super Duper
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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    Guy, take a close look at the Zeiss 100/2 Macro. Pricey, but in a class of it's own even compared to the other Zeiss ZFs.

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    Senior Member deepdiver's Avatar
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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    Hi Bondo, yes it's me
    3 months ago I promised to my self that i will not use any manual lens!
    because i hate using manual focus. However, once I tried ZF 85/1.4 i was shocked with the result... It's really 3D
    Then about 1,5 months ago, I start collection all ZF lenses for Nikon >,<
    Now all my AF-S nikon lenses are sitting nicely on my dry box, including the new 14-24 F2.8 and 24-70 F2.8.
    I just don't have the appetite to use Nikon lens for now ^.^
    I'm still waiting for my ZF 100/2

    Guy: I have a question about Leica M8, is it a good camera? what do you think about the result from Leica M8 compare to Nikon D3
    Which one is better?
    I'm really thinking to buy Leica M8. However, I need to know whether D3 or M8 result is better...
    D3's result both JPG or RAW really impress me a lot

    Thx You
    Andree

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    Senior Member vieri's Avatar
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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    Indeed I forgot to mention the wonderful 105 f2.8 macro VR - a great lens and not only for macro. A couple samples with the D2x:





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    Senior Member deepdiver's Avatar
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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    Wow! Nice pictures Vieri ^^
    Here is another one from Nikon D3 + ZF 85/1.4 @F1.4 Wide Open


    Andree
    I Love the Bokeh and the "3D looks" from this lens

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    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    Yes certainly a nice look from the Zeiss 85mm.

    The D3 Vs M8 well that is a great question , no doubt. No one i know has ran a formal test against each other. Of course these are two completely different beasts. I can only speak of the M8 since i have yet to shoot the D3 which seems like a great camera from what I have seen. The M8 is great but it has it's shortcomings. File wise hard to touch in many ways and reason I use it. The secret is the glass, leica just makes some amazing glass. What I do recommend very highly is go to a store and try it. RF shooting with inaccurate frame lines from a DSLR shooter may not be what you want to deal with. I think even most of the users with both will say the file is nicer on the M8 but the D3 is right there with it. Really a tough call , i would not replace the D3 but instead get a M8 for other things to shoot with. You really have to go out and try this thing and see if it really truly fits your style. i could go on for days about the M8 as well as many here. But come over to the M8 forum and ask some questions and such.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

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    Senior Subscriber Member Steen's Avatar
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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    Whoa Andree - NICE !! And yes, I have noticed the 3-D look in others of your 85mm captures as well.
    You really nail it, even at f/1.4 I use to trash nine out of ten when I try to focus my ZF 85 wide open.
    And you have the whole bunch of ZF focal lengths. I wish you would at some point do a subjective "review" of your impressions with all these lenses, on the D3 and the D300 as well.
    Really impressive. Thanks for sharing.
    Btw, I have the M8 as well and I can tell you that it is much easier for my old eyes to manual focus with the rangefinder system than with the built in matte screen in my D300 viewfinder.
    You seem to have a very sharp eye, is it easier to manual focus the ZF 85 on your D3 than on your D300 ?

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    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    Is Jim at Brightscreen making a better screen for the D300 does anyone know
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

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    GeneW
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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    If you can afford them, the Zeiss lenses are really lovely. If you're on a tighter budget, as I am, the AIS Nikkors may not produce images of quite the same subtle beauty, but they're damned good :-) And, a LOT cheaper, especially used.

    Gene

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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    Guy,

    I don't know about Brightscreen yet, but Katz Eye has theirs available for the D300.

    Ray

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    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    I would not mind a different screen for manual regardless what lenses i use. i like to focus as most of you know . AF is nice but I'm a old fart

    BTW i had to order a Canon hand grip strap since Nikon does not make one. Bummer
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    Quote Originally Posted by glenerrolrd View Post
    On the 28 1.4 ..me too..one of my good friends has had one since they were introduced and he rubs it in about the low light capabilities.They are about $3500 on eBay if you can find one. if the lenses follow their pedigree the Zeiss will have better color and higher contrast. (which you may or may not want). Either will be sharper than I deserve or need . The other big difference is the manual verse autofocus. I am struggling a bit with the D3 auto focus alternatives for sports so I naturally favor the Zeiss glass. But I suspect that it would be a close call if I used them both. I think I understood that Sean Reid will be doing this test in the near future.
    Roger

    I have an absolutely mint 28 1.4 and find it extremely good. IQ similar to the Leica but with the added two stops. My problem is that I rarely shoot with it and that is why it is so mint! At the current selling prices i should probably sell it. So if you are interested give me a jingle.

    Woody

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    Senior Subscriber Member Steen's Avatar
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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    Quote Originally Posted by vieri View Post
    Indeed I forgot to mention the wonderful 105 f2.8 macro VR - a great lens and not only for macro. (...)
    Vieri, those 105 f2.8 macro VR shots are fabulous. Does anyone know of a direct comparison between the Nikon AF-S 2.8/105 macro VR and the ZF 2/100mm Macro, or has any of you owned both ?

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    Workshop Member glenerrolrd's Avatar
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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    Quote Originally Posted by woodyspedden View Post
    Roger

    I have an absolutely mint 28 1.4 and find it extremely good. IQ similar to the Leica but with the added two stops. My problem is that I rarely shoot with it and that is why it is so mint! At the current selling prices i should probably sell it. So if you are interested give me a jingle.

    Woody
    No fair Woody..now I am going to have to take a rest . I am shooting Spring Training in Jupiter FL..game everyday at 1pm. Today I used the 200-400 VR and I was so close ..it was a little long! Normally I alternate games ...D3 for one and M8s for the next. But wow is walking around for 3 hours in the Sun lugging a 200-400 on a monopod ..more than enough. So you are catching me in a weak moment. I will let you know soon. Thanks Roger

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    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    Quote Originally Posted by bondo View Post
    Vieri, those 105 f2.8 macro VR shots are fabulous. Does anyone know of a direct comparison between the Nikon AF-S 2.8/105 macro VR and the ZF 2/100mm Macro, or has any of you owned both ?
    Damn it I just ordered it too. LOL

    Well just placed a order for the 105 macro from Nikon. Ray twisted my arm pretty bad. I also ordered a SB800, no one does flash better than Nikon , I remember that from my past and still holds true.

    One more lens for now Davids 17-35 or the 24-70. I just actually did the math with the M8 i use the 28,35 and 50 for this event stuff right well that is 36, 46 , 75. Okay the nikon 24-70 is 36-105 and exactly in that range. Hmmm i might have to go with the 24-70. For the wider stuff it would be Leica M8 anyway. The PC lens will have to come later.


    I hate this stuff sometimes. LOL
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Senior Member vieri's Avatar
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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    Damn it I just ordered it too. LOL
    Great move Guy, you'll love it

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    One more lens for now Davids 17-35 or the 24-70. I just actually did the math with the M8 i use the 28,35 and 50 for this event stuff right well that is 36, 46 , 75. Okay the nikon 24-70 is 36-105 and exactly in that range. Hmmm i might have to go with the 24-70. For the wider stuff it would be Leica M8 anyway. The PC lens will have to come later.


    I hate this stuff sometimes. LOL
    I'd go for the 24-70 if I were in your position. Range better suits your needs, it seems, and the 24-70 new design & nano-coating apparently does wonder (didn't try it, but I can vouch for the N-coating effect on the 14-24)... and, all things considered, compared to Leica glass this is very inexpensive stuff LOL
    Vieri Bottazzini
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    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    I'm thinking FF down the road just in case too. I may have to scrap a few hundred to throw in the pot though, were is my wife BTW . She standing behind me.



    Now it would be nice if I could use the SB800 on the M8 in A mode than i can finally get rid of the Metz 54. That would be nice
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Senior Member vieri's Avatar
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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    ... were is my wife BTW . She standing behind me.
    ...she is there with or without a knife, that's the only thing that counts...
    Vieri Bottazzini
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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

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    Senior Member deepdiver's Avatar
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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    Quote Originally Posted by bondo View Post
    Whoa Andree - NICE !! And yes, I have noticed the 3-D look in others of your 85mm captures as well.
    You really nail it, even at f/1.4 I use to trash nine out of ten when I try to focus my ZF 85 wide open.
    And you have the whole bunch of ZF focal lengths. I wish you would at some point do a subjective "review" of your impressions with all these lenses, on the D3 and the D300 as well.
    Really impressive. Thanks for sharing.
    Btw, I have the M8 as well and I can tell you that it is much easier for my old eyes to manual focus with the rangefinder system than with the built in matte screen in my D300 viewfinder.
    You seem to have a very sharp eye, is it easier to manual focus the ZF 85 on your D3 than on your D300 ?
    Hi bando
    To be Honest, I'm having a hard time to use ZF lens on D300.
    There is a BIG different between D3 and D300 screen!!
    When I'm using D3 + manual lens, there is a sign on the left corner bottom that "guide" you to get the image focus.
    the sign looks like this " > o < "
    For instant, when you turn you focus ring too much to the right, the sign will blink and give you "<" sign.
    Meaning, you need to turn the focus ring to the left side
    and vise versa....
    Sorry for my poor English, but i hope u can understand what I i wrote here.

    This feature is missing on Nikon D300... which me it a little bit harder to get the image right on focus (when I'm using F1.4)
    I also thingking to get katz eye screen for my D300, however, no one sell that item in Indonesia T__T

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    Senior Member deepdiver's Avatar
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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    Hi Guy
    Later this afternoon, I'm leaving to Jakarta to try out Leica M8 (I hope they will let me try it )
    I never use Rangefinder camera before, so i really have no idea about it at all...
    I should be interesting
    BTW
    here are 2 more example from Nikon D3 + ZF 85/1.4

    @F1.4


    @F2


    Andree

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    Workshop Member glenerrolrd's Avatar
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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    Thanks for the sample images. These are pretty amazing and do look a lot like the 75 Lux wide open. Do you find that the contrast increases as you stop down? These look good but seem to be "medium contrast" ..nothing wrong with that juts trying to understand the character of the lens.

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    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    These do remind me of the 75 lux also
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    I have been using Nikon for 25 over years. I love the cameras, always very well built... but....the Nikon lenses burry the shadows. They can be sharp and all what you want but a simple Pentax, Zuiko, Mamiya and of course Leica and Zeiss would beat them anytime.
    If some of you have both lenses, look into it during a comparison.
    I am surprised nobody is talking about it.
    So to answer the original question of this thread, a Nikon body is a very good idea if you can avoid Nikon lenses.

    Michel

  35. #35
    RONSTAMPS
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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    I have used Nikon since the early 70's.
    The new 14-24 is a fantastic wide, even better than my 17-35.
    Another great wide is the 28mm f/2 ais
    The only Zeiss ZF I have used is the 85mm 1.4.. to me it is much better than the 85 1.4D or the 85 1.4 ais.
    The 85 1.4 ais is better wide open than the D Nikkor lens, but starts loosing it's edge when they are stopped down.
    The Zeiss is better wide open than the Nikkors by an edge, but when stopped down, even a half stop, really starts to shine.
    I have no problems with focus on a D3, D2x, D1x, F3 or F2as with the Zeiss.
    I have used 5 copies of the 85mm 1.4 D Nikkor and every one had a lot of CA.
    The 105 1.8 ais and 105 2.5 ais are great lenses, along with the 180 2.8 ED ais
    The 200 f/2 VR is brillant, but is a tripod or monopod lens.
    I consider the Zeiss ZF right up there with a Leica 80 1.4 Rom if not better by a tad.

  36. #36
    Senior Member vieri's Avatar
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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    Quote Originally Posted by RONSTAMPS View Post
    I have used Nikon since the early 70's.
    The new 14-24 is a fantastic wide, even better than my 17-35.
    Another great wide is the 28mm f/2 ais
    The only Zeiss ZF I have used is the 85mm 1.4.. to me it is much better than the 85 1.4D or the 85 1.4 ais.
    The 85 1.4 ais is better wide open than the D Nikkor lens, but starts loosing it's edge when they are stopped down.
    The Zeiss is better wide open than the Nikkors by an edge, but when stopped down, even a half stop, really starts to shine.
    I have no problems with focus on a D3, D2x, D1x, F3 or F2as with the Zeiss.
    I have used 5 copies of the 85mm 1.4 D Nikkor and every one had a lot of CA.
    The 105 1.8 ais and 105 2.5 ais are great lenses, along with the 180 2.8 ED ais
    The 200 f/2 VR is brillant, but is a tripod or monopod lens.
    I consider the Zeiss ZF right up there with a Leica 80 1.4 Rom if not better by a tad.
    Hello Ron, as a Nikon user since the venerable Nikon F, I feel I must disagree slightly with you on a few of your findings, and share it with the forum for the sake of argument here it goes, of course IMHO:

    - the 85 AF-D is, except at f11 and beyond, way better IMO than the MF version; I never tried the ZF, and it could very well be much better than the AF-D: will have to give it a look;

    - in the 105 focal length, while your suggestions are both great lenses, I'd pick the 105 f2 DC (which you didn't mention) over both your suggested lenses any day; I wouldn't, though, use the DC control: never found the use for it, actually, but the lens is a fantastic piece of glass. I sold the 2.5 one second after trying the DC, while it took me much longer to give the 1.8 up, but in the end I couldn't find any reason except for sentimental ones to keep it over the DC;

    - again, despite its AF shortcomings (MF clumsy, AF very slow), as far as the glass is I'd choose the 180 AF over the AIS; the AF has less CA and better colors IMHO; however, I am talking about the second version of the AF, the one with the larger focus ring, the first one wasn't solid enough (cracked barrel...);

    More generally speaking, all these lenses are very very good, and it probably boils down to personal preference as far as they draw and the like. Just thought I'd add my .02 worth
    Vieri Bottazzini
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  37. #37
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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    I agree with your statements on the 85mm ais vs the 85mm D lens, except my ais version was just as sharp, with color that matched the AF D version wide open. But the manual ais version did not have as much CA wide open, and to me, that is why we buy a fast lens... to use it wide open. Stopped down, as I said, the ais version looses it's edge.
    I did not mention the 105 DC and should have !
    It is a great lens, but I have not used it a lot, but when I have, it gave excellent results. I ended keeping my 105 2.5 and sending the 105 DC back due to the $600 difference in price versus quality..splitting hairs.
    I have used the AF 180 2.8 ED and agree that it has a small edge over the MF version, but I use manual focus almost 100 percent of the time, and the AF lens cannot compare in it's manual focus qualities over the MF 180.
    I honestly could not detect the difference between the two in print.
    Both optics on these two lenses split's hair. Both are top notch.
    If I were a autofocus shooter, I would lean toward the AF.
    You hit the nail on the head...personal preferences in shooting style !
    The 35mm 1.4 ais and the 58mm NOCT are two of the best too!
    I have seen the earlier examples of the 35mm 1.4 ai lens get a yellow cast to the print image, but have not heard of the ais versions having this.
    I am sorry I did not remember to put the 105 DC in my two cents.
    It is a wonderful lens.

  38. #38
    Senior Member deepdiver's Avatar
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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    Hi!
    Just got back from Jakarta ^^
    I took some pictures from the camera exhibitions.
    Here we go (Nikon D3 + Voigtlander Ultron 40/2)

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    Leica stand (which did not let me play with M8 T__T )

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    Senior Member LCT's Avatar
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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    Quote Originally Posted by deepdiver View Post
    Very nice Andree. I would not expect more from a Leica. Any hint about the ZF 28/2?

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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    Quote Originally Posted by deepdiver View Post
    Leica stand (which did not let me play with M8 T__T )
    Nahh, not worth to take the risk that you might actually end up buying one ...

  41. #41
    Senior Member deepdiver's Avatar
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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    Quote Originally Posted by LCT View Post
    Very nice Andree. I would not expect more from a Leica. Any hint about the ZF 28/2?
    ZF 28/2 i just pick up mine last sunday
    It's a very nice lens, very sharp even at wide open F2.
    I still dont have a change to try it for outdoor pictorial. I would love to see how it's perform.
    Hopefully the weather is nice this weekend, therefore i can try it out

    Andree

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    Senior Subscriber Member Steen's Avatar
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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    Hi Andree, looking so much forward to read about your impressions with the ZF 2/28mm, and especially whether it is on par with the ZF 2/35mm which everybody is highly praising, and also I have seen some very impressive ZF 2/35mm images, I think they were taken by Jorge Torralba.
    So if it is not too much to ask for, it would be great if you would show us a couple of comparable shots followed by 100 % crops from the 35mm and the 28mm ? Otherwise please just tell us about your findings.
    If the 28mm is as great as the 35mm I might prefer the 28mm focal length for my D300 since I already have the 1.4/50mm.
    Of course I could have all the three above mentioned focal lengths covered by the new Nikkor 24-70mm zoom ? Decisions, decisions. Not easy to be someone ...

  43. #43
    Senior Member deepdiver's Avatar
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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    Alrgiht Bondo!
    I will be out for 2 days, to do pre-wedding pictorial.
    I will use 28/2 and i will crop 100% for you
    just give me a bit of time, i will post some example over here
    Andree ^^

  44. #44
    Subscriber Member kit laughlin's Avatar
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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    Hello Guy, yes I was talking to Jim at Brightscreen only yesterday. He has most of the different designs available for the D300, and he has included a Proscreen for the D3 in my latest order (got one of the 24 TS lenses coming, probably early next week).

    as the D3 is a pro camera, I expect that the AF and MF paths will be accurately calibrated (like the !Ds series, and not like the 5Ds!). I will let you know how the Proscreen goes in the D3.

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    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    Great Kit looking to hearing reports on that. Nice to see you have a moment to drop in and give a helping hand my friend. Always a pleasure to hear from you, we have been down a few paths together.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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  46. #46
    Subscriber Member kit laughlin's Avatar
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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    Guy, that cracked me up!!!! I still remember the first lens I bought from you (that incredible Apo 90/2). And there have been one or two other great moments!

    I do have more time now; I have had the most amazing 18 months with my teacher (including him living with me here in Canberra for six months; talk about being under the blowtorch!) and it was fantastic. And to think that in the same timeframe Nikon released the D3, D300 and the two zooms—makes you believe in Santa Claus.

    Good times ahead, despite the madness everywhere. Warm regards to all, Kit

  47. #47
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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    If you want afs, zf is out.

    My experience is as follows:

    50mm zf = nikkor

    50mm zf makro > nikkor 50/1.4 or 60mm micro/2.8
    35mm zf > nikkor 35/2
    25mm zf > nikkor 24 ( zf 25 not as good as the zf 35 )

    85mm Zf <= nikkor 85/1.4

    100mm zf makro is superb

    105mm , i prefer the nikkoe 105/2 dc

    while the 105 nikkor vr is excellent, i still prefer my 105/2.8 nikkor

    28mm: zf ( i do not have ), I have the nikkor 28/1.4...try an old nikkor 30/1.4 manual instead. the 28/1.4 is not sharp wide open on my system
    and really shines at slightly further distances.

    Regards

  48. #48
    Workshop Member glenerrolrd's Avatar
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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    This is still an open issue IMHO but needs to be evaluated in a contact of the D3. Why would Leica "fan boys and girls" convert to a Nikon system? Maybe the DMR just doesn t cut it against a modern design. But IMHO for pure image quality ..its not even close..the DMR blows away everything short of MF. Whats missing in the Leica alternative....(1) auto focus (2) high quality lower cost zoom lenses and long telephotos (3) great flash solutions. The best in class noise management is really helpful with sports and low light event photography. And the image quality is exceptional ...my guess is that with an excellent raw conversion...you might not even miss the Leica file. But thats not why photographers are converting to Nikon..its the autofocus/VR capabilities. So did I answer my own question...no because you can have both ...3 fast primes (either Nikkors or Zeiss ZF s ) can be had new for around $2500 less than a 28 Summicron. And they are necessary to really take advantage of the high ISO capabilities . Since cost is about equal ....its two factors ..(1)image quality ..which is primarily the "look factors" ..sharpness is excellent across the board and (2) auto focus verse manual in low light . If I want brilliant images in good light or with flash ...the 24-70 should cover it. So this is really pretty subjective and not based on absolute lens performance. Just one point of view.

  49. #49
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    Roger part of the issue is there is no DMR anymore readily available. The R10 is a year out and Leica is giving us no clues as to what that is. Only game in town new at the moment is Nikon. Oh and some toys just showed up, need to play
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

  50. #50
    Subscriber Member kit laughlin's Avatar
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    Re: Zeiss or Nikkor Primes?

    Comments on the post above, from my POV, having owned all the lenses mentioned:

    My experience is as follows:

    50mm zf = nikkor
    IMHO, the ZF 50/2 is better than the Nikko 50/1.4 stopped down to ƒ2

    50mm zf makro > nikkor 50/1.4 or 60mm micro/2.8
    Agree

    35mm zf > nikkor 35/2
    Agree

    25mm zf > nikkor 24 (zf 25 not as good as the zf 35 )
    Agree, but ZF 25 has different look and very close focussing despite no floating element—but not different enough to keep, for me.

    85mm Zf <= nikkor 85/1.4
    I bought yet another copy of the 85/1.4 (Nikkor) recently and to be honest, it really is not as good (these days) as it has been seen to be, in the past. I will sell this and get the Nikkor 85/1.8. DOF and bokehdifference is trivial, IMHO. When I shot film and available light, I used a MF Nikkor 85/2, and it was razor sharp wide open, which is how I used it 95% of the time.

    I have not owned the current ZF 85/1.4 I did buy the hugely expensive Contax RTS system when I was shooting the dance and theatre stuff all those years ago, just to be able to use the Zeiss 85/1.4, and I was very disappointed in it. Might have been sample variation (and no one then would head of swapping my copy for another to test) and the Nikkor was noticeably sharper at ƒ2 than the Zeiss at the same aperture. I do not know if the current ZF is a different lens, but it looks very similar to me. Others may assist here.

    100mm zf makro is superb
    No one can say too good things about this lens: it is the best I own on the D3. cheers, kl

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