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D700 - Finally a Digital F100! (fun pictures with D700)
- Thread starter jonoslack
- Start date
Lars
Active member
Selling my new D300 tomorrow, at a 15% loss from what I paid for it in May. When I lost my D2X, the D700 was the camera my lenses needed - except it didn't quite exist yet. Had I known, I would never have got the D300.
Somehow this means that Nikon earned a few hundred euros from me, by not declaring a product roadmap. While such corporate behavior is mainstream, it doesn't mean I like it. At all.
Looking back to the film days, what a difference it is wrt product cycles... and we are the ones paying for it. Sure, you can argue that nobody forces anyone to buy a camera - but in this particular case, Nikon has not brought even a remotely affordable camera to market that can properly use lenses such as 85/1.4D and 135/2D DC. So while I do look forward to getting a D700 in a few months, there is a certain bitter aftertaste to the whole thing. Hrmph.
Somehow this means that Nikon earned a few hundred euros from me, by not declaring a product roadmap. While such corporate behavior is mainstream, it doesn't mean I like it. At all.
Looking back to the film days, what a difference it is wrt product cycles... and we are the ones paying for it. Sure, you can argue that nobody forces anyone to buy a camera - but in this particular case, Nikon has not brought even a remotely affordable camera to market that can properly use lenses such as 85/1.4D and 135/2D DC. So while I do look forward to getting a D700 in a few months, there is a certain bitter aftertaste to the whole thing. Hrmph.
jonoslack
Active member
Hi Lars
but they're damned if they do, and damned if they don't. The D2x was announced nearly 6 months in advance, and all that happened was that there was huge bitching about why it took so long. Roadmaps are dangerous anyway, you may get overtaken by events - Olympus pulled the E1 replacement at the last moment - probably because it was 8mp and the rest of the world was more. I suspect that the same thing may have happened with the 5D replacement.
I don't think you should feel bitter - 15% doesn't sound too awful (nothing like the loss I made on my D3 that I bought in April . . I actually lost £1000; the whole price of a D300!!!).
I do hope you like your D700 - I'm loving mine
Stuart Richardson
Active member
Well, I finally got a chance to see and feel the D700 today. To be honest, I was not as impressed as I thought I'd be. I did not like the feel of the grip as much as the D3 (the normal grip, not the vertical grip), and I was not as big of a fan of the viewfinder (I did not like the new focus brackets which are thicker and black). The shutter did not feel the same either -- viewfinder blackout was longer (still very short) and the whole camera sort of lacked the "instant" feel of the D3. It did not feel much lighter to me either, but I did not have much time with it. The CF door feels chintzy too, but I suppose as long as it works and is still weather-sealed. Don't get me wrong, the body still feels extremely rugged and the VF is nice...it just did not feel as "refined" as the D3. I really did not suspect that this would bother me, but it does. I think I am going to wait until I can either rent one or borrow one to get a real feel for it. Even then, I will probably wait until I can find a used one if I decide to make the switch. I was not expecting it to FEEL like 2000 dollars less camera than the D3, but in a way, it does. These are minor issues and if I was buying today from scratch, I would without question get the D700, but given that I have the D3, even selling it and getting 700-1000 dollars back over the cost of it does not really feel like the best plan. I need to give it some more thought.
Stuart Richardson
Active member
Thank you Terry! I may take you up on that at some point. I am out of town for the next day or two, but when I get back I should have my Hy6/54LV, so you are welcome to check that out while I look at your D700!
Just processed the same file in C1 V4 and, as the original shooter who shared his files with me had stated, C1 blows both Nx2 and Aperture away re: shadow detail. Didn't even bother trying them in Cs3.
Images come up, so far, as cleaner, FAR more shadow detail, etc. NX2 just rushed to absolute blacks with Aperture somewhere in between but closer to C1. Seems like the boys at Phase 1 know what they're doing. I would assume the results will be the same for the D700.
Surprised me as in my older D1/H days, the Nikon software tended to yield the best results.
.....
On an interesting point.
Just processed two D3 NEFs of a Bouvier (large black hairy dog for cat lovers). Taken at ISO 1000 with 200-400.
1. Processed the same pic in NX2 (trial) and Aperture.
2. Shot was taken down in both respective packages by 2/3rds of stop to just get so indicated no blown highlights (black dog coming out of pool with white concrete ledge on sunny day did create an exposure problem).
3. USM in both packages dialed to 0, then exported both as 16 bits Tiffs into CS3
4. Sharpened the same in CS3 (am more familiar with USM in that package).
Observations:
- DAMN nice for ISO 1000. When looking at shot initially (with no USM) thought, nice but not stellar, then looked at ISO. Shooter kept ISO high to freeze movement, DoF was thin yet was shot at F7.1 and 280mm, so he must have been close.
- Aperture did a MUCH better job processing the pic for shadow detail. NX2 seemed to want to rush to absolute black vs a myriad of subtle shades of very dark grey. Nose color also went to BLACK vs. the more accurate black-very-dark-grey with a subtle hint of green.
- The 200-400 is a knock-out. Anything more than subtle USM broached the too-much-USM threshold with jaggies in hair, etc.
May try in C4 when get some more time. Original shooter indicates he prefers C4 for D3 shots vs NX2. On other hand, NX2 has d-lighting (nice) and u-point which will work an any tiff, so might still be worth buying if go Nikon route.[/QUOTE]
Images come up, so far, as cleaner, FAR more shadow detail, etc. NX2 just rushed to absolute blacks with Aperture somewhere in between but closer to C1. Seems like the boys at Phase 1 know what they're doing. I would assume the results will be the same for the D700.
Surprised me as in my older D1/H days, the Nikon software tended to yield the best results.
.....
On an interesting point.
Just processed two D3 NEFs of a Bouvier (large black hairy dog for cat lovers). Taken at ISO 1000 with 200-400.
1. Processed the same pic in NX2 (trial) and Aperture.
2. Shot was taken down in both respective packages by 2/3rds of stop to just get so indicated no blown highlights (black dog coming out of pool with white concrete ledge on sunny day did create an exposure problem).
3. USM in both packages dialed to 0, then exported both as 16 bits Tiffs into CS3
4. Sharpened the same in CS3 (am more familiar with USM in that package).
Observations:
- DAMN nice for ISO 1000. When looking at shot initially (with no USM) thought, nice but not stellar, then looked at ISO. Shooter kept ISO high to freeze movement, DoF was thin yet was shot at F7.1 and 280mm, so he must have been close.
- Aperture did a MUCH better job processing the pic for shadow detail. NX2 seemed to want to rush to absolute black vs a myriad of subtle shades of very dark grey. Nose color also went to BLACK vs. the more accurate black-very-dark-grey with a subtle hint of green.
- The 200-400 is a knock-out. Anything more than subtle USM broached the too-much-USM threshold with jaggies in hair, etc.
May try in C4 when get some more time. Original shooter indicates he prefers C4 for D3 shots vs NX2. On other hand, NX2 has d-lighting (nice) and u-point which will work an any tiff, so might still be worth buying if go Nikon route.[/QUOTE]
Thanks Jono... pretty much what I figured. BTW, I've taken worse when in a hurrysorry - shocking picture, done in haste:
A
asabet
Guest
That's the good part as well as the bad part with Apple, no?
I'm pretty familiar with C1, Raw Developer, Lightroom/ACR, and a couple others. For some reason, it's proving a bit more difficult for me to get comfortable with Aperture. The results seem very good though, so I'm going to keep at it for a while longer. Looking forward to joining in on the D700 fun tomorrow
.
A
asabet
Guest
Thanks Terry. Your 58mm party photos were great! I know your CV 40mm photos were mainly test images, but they too put that lens in a very desirable light. I love my little 40mm Zuiko lens, and the CV 40 is a lens I'll continue to follow closely. I hope you'll be posting more with it soon.
It will probably take me a while to get going with the D700. To start with, I need to figure out how to get the camera to understand that I'm putting a 50mm f/2 manual focus computer chip-less lens on it. From the sound of things, my first Nikon DSLR offers an intimidating degree of customization!
It will probably take me a while to get going with the D700. To start with, I need to figure out how to get the camera to understand that I'm putting a 50mm f/2 manual focus computer chip-less lens on it. From the sound of things, my first Nikon DSLR offers an intimidating degree of customization!
Terry
New member
Amin, here is my best piece of Nikon advice. Let auto ISO be your friend. You set your working ISO range (for me 200-6400 unless I want to lock it down at 200 for landscapes) and then minimum shutter speed (if camera wants to go below this speed it bumps up ISO).
So, take my party and the 58mm f1.4 lens. The room had some bright and very dark areas. My only job was deciding on what depth of field I wanted. When I downloaded the 300 plus pictures they ranged from ISO 200 when I had the lens wide open in a bright area to ISO 5000 when I was stopped down in a dark area. 1/60 minimum shutter setting took care of the motion blur. if you are out chasing the kids around, set it to 1/250 or whatever and you are good to go.
It also makes using those voigtlanders which as you say are chipped a sinch!
So, take my party and the 58mm f1.4 lens. The room had some bright and very dark areas. My only job was deciding on what depth of field I wanted. When I downloaded the 300 plus pictures they ranged from ISO 200 when I had the lens wide open in a bright area to ISO 5000 when I was stopped down in a dark area. 1/60 minimum shutter setting took care of the motion blur. if you are out chasing the kids around, set it to 1/250 or whatever and you are good to go.
It also makes using those voigtlanders which as you say are chipped a sinch!
A
asabet
Guest
Auto ISO sounds amazing. It's one of the features to which I'm most looking forward with the new camera. It also seems like a no brainer. Can't imagine why Canon hasn't implemented a similar feature.
jonoslack
Active member
Hi Amin
What Terry said - auto ISO is the dog's doodah.
While you're about it, turn auto white balance off! - sunlight in the daytime and tungsten when it isn't. Why let the camera make wild decisions about the colour you want!
As for the 50mm f2 chipless lens? no problem - find the non-cpu option in the menu, put in the focal length and minimum aperture and you're away.
Please don't tell me it's the Zeiss macro - I want one so bad . . . and I really shouldn't spend another wadge of dosh to duplicate a position I already have!
A
asabet
Guest
Hi Amin
What Terry said - auto ISO is the dog's doodah.
While you're about it, turn auto white balance off! - sunlight in the daytime and tungsten when it isn't. Why let the camera make wild decisions about the colour you want!
As for the 50mm f2 chipless lens? no problem - find the non-cpu option in the menu, put in the focal length and minimum aperture and you're away.
Hi Jono! That does sound pretty easy. One more day to wait...
Please don't tell me it's the Zeiss macro - I want one so bad . . . and I really shouldn't spend another wadge of dosh to duplicate a position I already have!
Okay I won't tell you. I will say that this lens has been staring at me for days waiting for the D700. Fortunately the good folks at Brightscreen were very quick. From what I've gathered, they got the cameras on Friday morning, installed the custom screens, and shipped them out Fed Ex 2-day yesterday. My wonderful wife has agreed to spend most of the day around home tomorrow so that we don't miss the delivery.
What Terry said - auto ISO is the dog's doodah.
While you're about it, turn auto white balance off! - sunlight in the daytime and tungsten when it isn't. Why let the camera make wild decisions about the colour you want!
As for the 50mm f2 chipless lens? no problem - find the non-cpu option in the menu, put in the focal length and minimum aperture and you're away.
Hi Jono! That does sound pretty easy. One more day to wait...
Please don't tell me it's the Zeiss macro - I want one so bad . . . and I really shouldn't spend another wadge of dosh to duplicate a position I already have!
Okay I won't tell you
. I will say that this lens has been staring at me for days waiting for the D700. Fortunately the good folks at Brightscreen were very quick. From what I've gathered, they got the cameras on Friday morning, installed the custom screens, and shipped them out Fed Ex 2-day yesterday. My wonderful wife has agreed to spend most of the day around home tomorrow so that we don't miss the delivery.
Arne Hvaring
Well-known member
Hi Terry,
congrats with new camera and lenses, your initial results are looking very nice!
I'm particularly interested in how the 2/40 Voigtländer lens performs. (Third shot is a gem, btw). I suppose you haven't had time to test it extensively yet. Since I got rid of the 2/35 Zeiss ZF, I've been considering this little lens as a walk around all-purpose alternative for my D3.
congrats with new camera and lenses, your initial results are looking very nice!
I'm particularly interested in how the 2/40 Voigtländer lens performs. (Third shot is a gem, btw). I suppose you haven't had time to test it extensively yet. Since I got rid of the 2/35 Zeiss ZF, I've been considering this little lens as a walk around all-purpose alternative for my D3.
Got my D700 yesterday. But for it's main purpose, I wasn't seeing it as a replacement for my D3 in any way ... it is a replacement for the D300 I just sold. Now I have a companion back-up camera to the main D3 shooter at weddings that delivers the same FF IQ. The D3 shoots to 2 CFs at once, and that feature alone makes it king of the wedding bag.
So far, I like the camera. You pick up a camera and either take to it or not.
In it's second intended purpose for use with manual ZF and other MF optics: it's a little taller than the D300 and feels more substantual ... but begins creeping away from that small, easy to carry everywhere, "almost replacement" for my Leica M that the D300 with Zeiss ZF optics represented. But the gain is that the ZF25 and ZF28 are now wide angle lenses again : -)
For obvious reasons, the viewfinder of the D700 is much better than the D300 ... and I found manual focusing much easier and more accurate than the D300 (which I had to install a BrightScreen magnifier to even use effectively.) After shooting a bit with a manual lens, I do not see the need for a BrightScreen mag on the D700.
I agree that the CF door could be seen as less substantual, but it's the same design as the Canon 5D, which never was a problem and was actually a bit faster to work with. Time will tell.
It's getting it's shake down cruise at a wedding I will be shooting this Saturday. Weddings are a "trial by fire", and weakness rear their head amost immediately.
Terry
New member
Hi Arne,
I am was going to take the D700 and 2/40 to work to go out and play at lunchtime. Im in NYC so no big landscape shots can be done anything you are interested in me testing?
Arne Hvaring
Well-known member
Hi Terry,
oh, just the usual suspects, resolution and flatness of field across the frame at far and close distances, microcontrast, saturation, flare, handling, focusing ease etc. Comprehensive report expected shortly after lunch
Seriously though, if you can look at some of these properties over time, I'd be thankful.
oh, just the usual suspects, resolution and flatness of field across the frame at far and close distances, microcontrast, saturation, flare, handling, focusing ease etc. Comprehensive report expected shortly after lunch
Seriously though, if you can look at some of these properties over time, I'd be thankful.
Oh yeah - and can you cut a couple of MTF graphs if you an extra get 5 minutes? ;>
Like Arne, I've gone the ZF route with less success than the average and while am thinking of a 28/2 as a last test of how long myself and Zeiss/Cosina QC get along, the 40/2 looks like a sweet unit in terms of resolution and color for the $$.
One question (having never used a pancake-esque lens) is how easy to you find such a thin lens to focus?
Like Arne, I've gone the ZF route with less success than the average and while am thinking of a 28/2 as a last test of how long myself and Zeiss/Cosina QC get along, the 40/2 looks like a sweet unit in terms of resolution and color for the $$.
One question (having never used a pancake-esque lens) is how easy to you find such a thin lens to focus?