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Thread: D800

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    Senior Member Lars's Avatar
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    D800

    Announcement should come in a few hours, Nikon Brazil already leaked and unleaked the press release. 36 Mpx seems certain.
    Monochrome: http://mochro.com

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    Re: D800

    We Live In Interesting Times!

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    Re: D800

    Seems to be considerably smaller than the D700. Suits me fine


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    Re: D800

    Great, was worth waiting!

    Seems to be sillier size and ergonomics as the D7000, which is also more than welcome!

    Will be soon my main shooting device

    Peter

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    Re: D800

    It may well become my first Nikon in 20 years
    Eduardo

    Quote Originally Posted by ptomsu View Post
    Great, was worth waiting!

    Seems to be sillier size and ergonomics as the D7000, which is also more than welcome!

    Will be soon my main shooting device

    Peter

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    Re: D800

    I guess this is where we find out how good our lenses are. I can see their repair facilities getting inundated with both lens and body re-alignment requests. Tonight I sacrifice my 55mm f/2.8 micro to the gods of Tolerances and Precision, I just hope that's enough to placate them.

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    Re: D800

    At the very least, it should send some lens designers back to the drawing board again - which is good for us photographers.
    Monochrome: http://mochro.com

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    Re: D800

    It's official: Nikon D800 and D800E 36MP full-frame DSLRs announced: Digital Photography Review

    $3000 / $3300 w/o AA filter. Not too shabby if it's up to Nikon's hype.
    Monochrome: http://mochro.com

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    Re: D800

    Interestingly, it's the same size as the D700 but considerably lighter.

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    Re: D800

    The D800E without AA filter maybe really interesting.

    Video may also be very interesting. As I understand it can be also be used in 1.5X mode. This means you need fewer lenses.
    Uwe Steinmueller
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    Re: D800

    I'm ordering as soon as someone starts taking preorders... Probably tomorrow. W/o AA filter.

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    Re: D800

    Yes, the 800E seems very appealing. The DX mode is now useful. If the lowlight is like the D7000 then this would be very useful to me shooting ballet. Hopefully the shutter won't sound like a .38 being fired.
    Carlos Echenique | Carlos Echenique Photography |Olympus OM-D E-M1 MK II | Olympus Pen-F - M.Zuiko 17mm f/1.8, M.Zuiko 25mm f/1.8, M.Zuiko 45mm f/1.8, Rokinon 12mm f/2 NCS, M.Zuiko 75mm f/1.8, M.Zuiko 12-40mm f/2.8 PRO, M.Zuiko 40-150mm f/2.8 PRO

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    Re: D800

    WANT

    the timing couldn't be worse.

    i'm closing on a house in the next couple weeks...and they get all kinds of persnickety about making large purchases before closing. the worst part, is that i actually have sufficient cash to do both right now. LAME

    of course, it would mean unloading the d700, but that ought to be easy as pie.

    i would love to see what the 85/1.4G does on this beast. i bet it's jaw-dropping.
    --David

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    Re: D800

    I am wondering if the moire and false color effects they mentioned can be mitigated in post. Lightroom/Aperture/AfterShot Pro?
    Carlos Echenique | Carlos Echenique Photography |Olympus OM-D E-M1 MK II | Olympus Pen-F - M.Zuiko 17mm f/1.8, M.Zuiko 25mm f/1.8, M.Zuiko 45mm f/1.8, Rokinon 12mm f/2 NCS, M.Zuiko 75mm f/1.8, M.Zuiko 12-40mm f/2.8 PRO, M.Zuiko 40-150mm f/2.8 PRO

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    Re: D800

    The D800E it seems to be!

    Cannot wait to get one and see how it performs. Great news WRT lenses is, that I almost start from scratch, so I hopefully can choose the ones which perform.

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    Re: D800

    Quote Originally Posted by etrigan63 View Post
    I am wondering if the moire and false color effects they mentioned can be mitigated in post. Lightroom/Aperture/AfterShot Pro?
    capture one does an awesome job on moire.
    --David

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    Re: D800

    Quote Originally Posted by etrigan63 View Post
    ...Hopefully the shutter won't sound like a .38 being fired.
    it will get a quiet mode like the D3s - I hope Nikon make it this time a real bit quieter

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    Re: D800

    The quiet mode shown is for single shot. I need quiet burst mode for the ballet.
    Carlos Echenique | Carlos Echenique Photography |Olympus OM-D E-M1 MK II | Olympus Pen-F - M.Zuiko 17mm f/1.8, M.Zuiko 25mm f/1.8, M.Zuiko 45mm f/1.8, Rokinon 12mm f/2 NCS, M.Zuiko 75mm f/1.8, M.Zuiko 12-40mm f/2.8 PRO, M.Zuiko 40-150mm f/2.8 PRO

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    Re: D800

    Quote Originally Posted by etrigan63 View Post
    The quiet mode shown is for single shot. I need quiet burst mode for the ballet.
    ok, in this case I think that could be problem...

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    Re: D800


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    Re: D800

    Quiet would be nice for a change. The D800 does have a Q setting for 'quiet' mode as well as different mechanisms driving the shutter, mirror and aperture, unlike the D700, so maybe.. Shouldn't be too long before someone posts a comparison on youtube. It'd be great if decibels were among the specs! : P

    Regardless, it's got a long list of improvements I"m drooling over.

    Galbraith has some samples posted from both models.

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    Re: D800

    Quote Originally Posted by Jan Brittenson View Post
    They even offer a price reduction of 0.95 cents!

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    Re: D800

    "With the D800E, moiré and false color may be noticeable when there are repetitive and fine patterns on a subject such as kimono fabric. To avoid this, it is necessary to take measures, for example, changing the focusing point or shooting distance."
    [Text taken form the Nikon D800/D800E website]

    How do you guys feel about this? I know those who shoot medium format will probably have more experience about this, but since this is a Nikon product, I felt safer to post my related question here.

    What is the advise for the landscape shooter who also shoots fashion with fabric and architecture? How to you shoot to avoid moiré and false colors?

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    Re: D800

    Nikon is correct you would to avoid moire is change the focusing point slightly but hard to tell your getting moire many times until you get to post. Than it's a correction with software. Given the sensor pitch of this sensor it should be less of a issue than the warning. Nikon has to spell it out clearly that it can happen. There warning is smart on there end as it will stop the.4 million complaints about moire that can happen.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Re: D800

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    Nikon is correct you would to avoid moire is change the focusing point slightly but hard to tell your getting moire many times until you get to post. Than it's a correction with software. Given the sensor pitch of this sensor it should be less of a issue than the warning. Nikon has to spell it out clearly that it can happen. There warning is smart on there end as it will stop the.4 million complaints about moire that can happen.
    HI Guy
    I quite agree - this is likely to be much less of an issue than the warning (which is likely just to cover their backsides). Two years with an M9 and no significant moire is testimony to that, and the smaller pixel pitch means that it should be even less of a problem with the D800.

    . . . . I reckon most of those Nikon lenses will act as an AA filter anyway

    Seriously, it sounds like a fantastic camera - tempting (Oh Yes), but everything is changing so fast right now.

    I think it's a very smart move to offer it in two flavours as well (although why you have to pay more for less is an interesting point - AA filters are not cheap things as far as I'm aware).

    all the best

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    Re: D800

    Quote Originally Posted by jonoslack View Post
    I think it's a very smart move to offer it in two flavours as well (although why you have to pay more for less is an interesting point - AA filters are not cheap things as far as I'm aware).
    Beats me as well.

    BTW, Nikon glass is not cheap (if that is what you meant by AA filters).

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    Re: D800

    Brilliant move to offer in 2 flavors. Finally after years of hearing we want no AA filter someone jumped to the plate and offered it. Good for Nikon. I'm getting one but I'm not selling my back and tech cam. This is something I could really use in 35mm cam and to me this is a game changer. About freaking time we see something in 35mm that really counts in the IQ
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Re: D800

    Yea pretty funny you pay more for ripping out a part of the camera. Lol
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Re: D800

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    Yea pretty funny you pay more for ripping out a part of the camera. Lol
    The Achromatic+ folks spin/claim that back without Bayer dyes and without an UV/IR cut filter is a 3 in 1 back. That also appears to cost "a bit" more.

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    Re: D800

    Actually I was thinking one of each. I mean I would want a backup anyway. This is going to be fun to watch how this all works out.

    I suspect we may see a lot of Canon in the B&S area.

    When I get home from this workshop I am going to look into this more for sure. Keep the data coming folks. Checking out we have a sunrise to go shoot.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Re: D800

    I Think it looks fantastic - but I'm trying to be grownup - I have always had a personal problem with Nikon colour for nature (I understand that this is my problem). Added to which, everything is changing so very fast at the moment, talk of organic sensors next year etc. etc. Changing systems from Sony seems to be a big step to take . . . So I'll wait (I think!).

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    Re: D800

    Well, I'm buying one too! As a companion to my D3x VERY good company!

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    Re: D800

    I have to say for what I shoot I havent run into any problems with the M9 and S2 regarding moiree.
    I wonder if there is any reason to expect more of a moiree problem in the D800 compared to MF backs.
    There must be a reason that they offer both versions?
    Right now I feel I should wait and see how the D800 and the D4 work in real until I would consider to replace my D700.
    Also if one uses one of those additional to MF gear (for sports/action/low light) a faster high ISO "machine" might make more sense than a high MP low ISO DSLR.
    If one thinks it could replace MF than on the other hand the D800 might be the more flexible solution, doing high MP and acceptable (maybe not great) higher ISO.
    I am also quite interested how those compare color and DR wise (D800 vs D4 vs MF vs older Nikons)

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    Re: D800

    Canon better get their act together, the 5Dx will not have full pro AF, weather sealing, dual cards, 100% viewfinder, etc. It will be a 7D with a 36 or so megapixel FF sensor and because of that the price better be in line given how cheap the D800 is for what it is.

    I downloaded the jpgs from their site including the samples from the D800E, still think the Leaf Aptus II 28/33/40 megapixel RAW files I've been playing with have more detail/sharpness although they were taken using Schneider lenses, not sure if that's a fair comparison to Nikon zooms and cheap primes. Of course they ain't in one of the most advanced DSLR bodies ever made, neither can they honestly be a full jack of all trades like this camera. Not going to change my order for the Aptus II -8 for still life studio but if it was anything where I had to hold the camera to shoot or use in multiple locations, I'd be thinking very very hard about it. I wonder if this will do anything to the MF prices, especially the 40 megapixel packages, in the near future.
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    Re: D800

    If the D800E is treated the same way as a MFDB (ie., tripod mount) and with proper lenses, it will no doubt be very good.

    I have an APO El-Nikkor 105/5.6 (IIRC, Stuart Richardson had one but sold it) that would do well on it along with a few other lenses.

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    Re: D800

    I need more paying customers.
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    Re: D800

    Quote Originally Posted by Ben Rubinstein View Post
    . I wonder if this will do anything to the MF prices, especially the 40 megapixel packages, in the near future.
    Not unless they make the 12 bit D-800 into a 16 bit camera and increase the film-gate by 2X ... the 16 bit, 40 meg MFDs will still produce tonal gradations, dynamic range and resolution-to-size ratio that 35mm DSLRs can't get to.

    -Marc
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    Re: D800

    Quote Originally Posted by jonoslack View Post
    I Think it looks fantastic - but I'm trying to be grownup - I have always had a personal problem with Nikon colour for nature (I understand that this is my problem). Added to which, everything is changing so very fast at the moment, talk of organic sensors next year etc. etc. Changing systems from Sony seems to be a big step to take . . . So I'll wait (I think!).
    Hmm, I'd bet that Sony will deliver what we want in a FF sensor Alpha Jono ... then we get to keep using those delicious Zeiss optics rather than do a systems swap ... again.

    Patience my friend, patience.

    -Marc

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    Re: D800

    Am I missing something here ? The D800 has essentially 2+x the Mp than the D7000 but at the pixel level aren t the sensors the same ? So when I look at a file at 100% don t I know what to expect at the pixel level.

    Then I know that for a given print/screen size I need less magnification of the pixels . This results in a much smoother rendering like a D3x file .

    At the pixel level the D7000 files provide more detail and generally nicer rendering than the D3s or the D3X ......but of course we use the entire file . Doesn t seem to be too hard to forecast the D800E ability to render fine detail ....it should be better than the D3x at less than half the cost . No AA filter and it should be spectacular .

    But the color is a different issue and this seems to be determined by the in camera processor , the glass and the raw conversion (sony is making the sensors right?) Glass still matters and I can easily see the differences in color between even the newest Nikkors and my Zeiss or Leica glass on the same body. The new Nikkors have cleaner whites and bluer blues and have lost some of the yellow tint of the older designs . They don t have the macro contrast of the zeiss or the micro contrast of the leica R but they are nice and pair pretty well with the Zeiss. (unlike the older designs).

    If color rendering is the same as the D7000 ..you will get much improved landscapes but skin tones will be just OK . I expect they will be better as some of the beta testers were fashion photographers and this should be nikon s offering for fashion. (unless a D4X is coming which I doubt).

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    Re: D800

    Quote Originally Posted by glenerrolrd View Post
    Am I missing something here ? The D800 has essentially 2+x the Mp than the D7000 but at the pixel level aren t the sensors the same ? So when I look at a file at 100% don t I know what to expect at the pixel level.

    Then I know that for a given print/screen size I need less magnification of the pixels . This results in a much smoother rendering like a D3x file .

    At the pixel level the D7000 files provide more detail and generally nicer rendering than the D3s or the D3X ......but of course we use the entire file . Doesn t seem to be too hard to forecast the D800E ability to render fine detail ....it should be better than the D3x at less than half the cost . No AA filter and it should be spectacular .

    But the color is a different issue and this seems to be determined by the in camera processor , the glass and the raw conversion (sony is making the sensors right?) Glass still matters and I can easily see the differences in color between even the newest Nikkors and my Zeiss or Leica glass on the same body. The new Nikkors have cleaner whites and bluer blues and have lost some of the yellow tint of the older designs . They don t have the macro contrast of the zeiss or the micro contrast of the leica R but they are nice and pair pretty well with the Zeiss. (unlike the older designs).

    If color rendering is the same as the D7000 ..you will get much improved landscapes but skin tones will be just OK . I expect they will be better as some of the beta testers were fashion photographers and this should be nikon s offering for fashion. (unless a D4X is coming which I doubt).
    Given the fact that I used the E5 which has a very weak AA filter and also given the fact that all MFDs use NO AA filter (as does the M8/M9) and all offer much more detail than cameras with AA filter, the answers seems to be straight forward IMHO:

    No AA filter, much sharper images with much more details.

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    Senior Member biglouis's Avatar
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    Re: D800

    Quote Originally Posted by Jorgen Udvang View Post
    Interestingly, it's the same size as the D700 but considerably lighter.
    I hope so. A serious contender if it is lighter by a lot. I may just sacrifice my Leica kit...

    Louis

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    Re: D800

    Good stuff.

    Besides the things mentioned I'm glad to see the Eye-fi support, a 16mp dx mode with 5fps for action shots (wasn't too long ago that 16mp was an $8K landscape camera), ability to start/stop video with a pocket wizard (kids's performances).

    After 2 years with the M9 I consider the moire to be a non-issue for what I shoot, and with the NX2 tool specifically designed with the D800e in mind I expect this won't be a big deal.
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    Re: D800


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    Re: D800

    Quote Originally Posted by fotografz View Post
    Not unless they make the 12 bit D-800 into a 16 bit camera and increase the film-gate by 2X ... the 16 bit, 40 meg MFDs will still produce tonal gradations, dynamic range and resolution-to-size ratio that 35mm DSLRs can't get to.

    -Marc
    Question is whether enough people care to pay the extra. The DR of the D7000 sensor which this is based on is already said to be better than MFDB's. I wonder whether the tonal graduations and look alone will be enough to pursuade people to pay such a huge difference in price and for such a huge degredation in useability anymore?
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    Workshop Member ptomsu's Avatar
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    Re: D800

    Quote Originally Posted by Ben Rubinstein View Post
    Question is whether enough people care to pay the extra. The DR of the D7000 sensor which this is based on is already said to be better than MFDB's. I wonder whether the tonal graduations and look alone will be enough to pursuade people to pay such a huge difference in price and for such a huge degredation in useability anymore?
    +1

  46. #46
    Workshop Member kuau's Avatar
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    Re: D800

    I hope Nikon has "fixed" there LV MLU shooting process meaning when in LV and take a picture the mirror will no longer flop up and down.

    UPDATE
    I read over at Rob Gaibrath dpi

    "Officially, the D800's mirror also stays up throughout the capture of a sequence of still pictures in Live View. But, for a reason we haven't yet figured out, the shutter activity and noise associated with each Live View exposure is more than the D4 when set to do the same thing."

    This is a good thing !!

    IMHO LV will be an absolute must for accurate focus.
    I'm like Guy, I am for sure not selling my tech view camera anytime soon, though I may sell my Rollei HY6 system and pick up a D800E, and some Zeiss MF lenses
    Steve
    Last edited by kuau; 7th February 2012 at 08:18.
    Steven Kornreich
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    Re: D800

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    Yea pretty funny you pay more for ripping out a part of the camera. Lol
    That's because Nikon is not removing the AA as per say, they are cancelling the effect of stage 1 by using a different filter in stage 2 of a 2 stages optical system. Scroll down on this link to get a nice diagram of it:
    Rob Galbraith DPI: Announced: Nikon D800 with 36.15 million image pixel sensor
    Francois B.

  48. #48
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    Re: D800

    Quote Originally Posted by fotografz View Post
    Hmm, I'd bet that Sony will deliver what we want in a FF sensor Alpha Jono ... then we get to keep using those delicious Zeiss optics rather than do a systems swap ... again.

    Patience my friend, patience.

    -Marc
    Hi Marc
    Thank you for a little moral support! I've actually had my first EVF disappointment up in the mountains with snow and high altitude sunshine (i.e. you couldn't really see it).

    But, as you say - I'll wait until the real thing comes along!

    Just this guy you know

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    Re: D800

    Looks like a good product for Nikon shooters. More than makes up for the 1 series.
    SONY A900
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  50. #50
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    Re: D800

    Quote Originally Posted by pophoto View Post
    "With the D800E, moiré and false color may be noticeable when there are repetitive and fine patterns on a subject such as kimono fabric. To avoid this, it is necessary to take measures, for example, changing the focusing point or shooting distance."
    [Text taken form the Nikon D800/D800E website]

    How do you guys feel about this? I know those who shoot medium format will probably have more experience about this, but since this is a Nikon product, I felt safer to post my related question here.

    What is the advise for the landscape shooter who also shoots fashion with fabric and architecture? How to you shoot to avoid moiré and false colors?
    Jono and I (amongst others) became very used to dealing with colour artifacts and such like when we both owned the now forgotten Kodak 14n cameras some years back

    The 14n had a 13.5mp full frame sensor with no AA filter (mainly to save the cost of the filter). Over time you use various strategies to remove the occasional "sparkles" on fine details. I remember that distant tree branches coud cause quite a problem with the 14n.

    However, critically the absence of an AA filter did aid sharpness and I preferred dealing with the false colour artifacts to loosing detail. My preferred software fix was Quantum Mechanic Pro.

    Most medium format cameras have no AA filter and it is rarely an issue. It might be more of an issue for some studio photogs shooting fine fabric etc

    Get the 800e

    Quentin
    Quentin Bargate
    Director of Bargate Murray, Law Firm of the Year 2012 - 2017, ”leading individual”, Chambers HNW guide, 2017, Photographer
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