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Thread: Nikon D800 First Blush

  1. #651
    Contributing Editor ustein's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    I have an old 17-35mm from 2001 and will live with it. Not a range I use that much (rare actually).
    Uwe Steinmueller
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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    Also the 24 has great F2 look to it for the creative stuff.
    Very true. Shallow depth of field IMHO is so mice at times with a wide angle.
    You get the space and environment of wide angle, but the focus on the subject.

    You are going to be much happier with the 24 1.4 it will ad atmosphere to your even work too. It's weird how you actually end up telling more of a story by "showing less" with shallow depth of field.

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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    I own a 16-35 (as well as the 14-24 & the 24), it is one of my most used lenses on the D700. I am waiting for my D800e. I find the 16-35 sharp, even wide open and also in the corners even though the corners do improve when stoppped down somewhat.

    The distortion at 16mm is quite pronounced but it is corrected very well in ACR by one tickbox, making it easy. Yes, it should degrade the image quality but not that far that it was a showstopper for me. Actually I did not notice it at a glance, I have not been looking really hard for it. If it would have been really obvious I would have noticed it.

    This was all on the D700 which is probably much more forgiving than the D800e will be.

    The way I use the 24/1.4 is more for its shallow DoF with people but I often find it a tad too wide (I like to get very close but I find myself almost on top of people). I grab the 35/1.4 most of the time. If there will be an actual AFS 28/1.8G I just might get that one...

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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    A lot of information. thanks.

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    Sr. Administrator Jack's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    the 28/1.8 is on my short list if it becomes a reality

    Re the 24/1.4. I personally do not see any viable reason for the 24/1.4 -- it's bigger and heavier than it needs to be, and I personally cannot see any benefit to f1.4 in a lens that short, UNLESS/EXCEPT you are using it on a crop sensor camera where it's effectively a 35.
    Jack
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    Workshop Member glenerrolrd's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    I have the 24/1.4 and the 14-24/2.8 . I can not imagine using the 14-24/2.8 for work on the street or even travel . Its front element is huge and is difficult to protect . The lens is front heavy and awkward to carry . On a tripod or in a studio its superb but thats not me .

    The 24/1.4 AF is as Jack points out maybe too big for a d700/d800 sized body . It balances nicely on the Pro sized D3/D4 bodies . I like this lens but agree that a smaller 28/1.8 AF with asph elements is a must have. The debate amoung the photojournalists is 24 or 28 and the younger guys like the 24 better . They care a lot more about the speed because they need it for night shooting . You also get a lot less clipping of body parts when shooting in close . I can live with 1.8 and a really good 28/1.8 would be perfect . But this is a constant debate 24 or 28?

    One thing thats not discussed is the need for AF . With a 24 you have to be really good with using the movable focus points on a Nikon to make any difference . The subjects not in the middle most of the time . Above 100mm you can actually use the full screen focus method and let the camera pick out the subject (most Pros swear by this ) . But below 100mm you need to pick the plane of focus and that requires moving the spot focus .

    However the real question is do you need AF on a 24 ? If you shoot events ..yes ..but for most work the MF Zeiss glass is not that hard . I used the 28/2 Zeiss on one body for a wedding and had no problem shooting wide open .

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    Sr. Administrator Jack's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    Roger, if I were a PJ, a fast 28 would be glued to my main body
    Jack
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    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    I shot for the press many moons ago a 24 is like heaven since usually your so tight to a ongoing story with video and still cams all around you and up front and personal with the subject that you need a 24mm. Just no getting around a fast wide. For me a 24mm would be glued if I was still doing that type of work which on occasion i do . Its also the best hail mary lens around. LOL

    BTW the 24 is as long as the 35 which i don't think that is that big and 1.4 lenses equals big anyway no getting around it.
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    Sr. Administrator Jack's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    So we find a difference between us finally! I like the 20 as my "Hail Mary" lens Seriously though, a 20, 28, fast 35, fast 50 and reasonably fast 85 or 105, makes a pretty killer set of PJ primes, and in my case the 28 would be bolted to a dedicated body since I know it would see regular work in probably 90% of my shoots. But I would not chastise the 24, 35, 50, 85 choice either -- just wouldn't need to be a fast 24 for me LOLOL!
    Jack
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    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    Im right your wrong so there. ROTFLMAO

    Just kidding. Okay have portraits to shoot 85 or 180. Lol

    No I don't have your 105 . Lol
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Sr. Administrator Jack's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    On the upside, none of shots would look the same
    Jack
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    Workshop Member glenerrolrd's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack View Post
    Roger, if I were a PJ, a fast 28 would be glued to my main body
    Agree but I meet a lot of street photographers and I am the exception using my 28/2 summicron ......most prefer the 24/1.4 summilux . The argument is pretty simple the 24 allows just a little more room in the frame to avoid clipping (a real issue when framing close and doing it quickly on a moving subject ) and the 1.4 because they are always getting caught with low light problems . The same applies to weddings,events etc . But the widest you can go and consistently avoid distortion of faces is a 28 .

    I am hopeful Leica will introduce a 28 1.4 summilux maybe at photokina . Its becoming a most requested lens . The last time I heard this was when Guy was giving them the business in Germany and they came out with the 21/24 summiluxes .

    The Nikon Rumor of a 28 1.8 asph Nikkor is pretty exciting .

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    Sr. Administrator Jack's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    It's the face distortion thing for me -- and why I jump to the 20 if I feel there is clipping issue. Did this back in M film days -- my regular combo was a 35 lux and 21 Elmarit. Then when the 28 Cron came out (the old 28 Elmar was not great) I was all over it and my 35 Lux saw a lot less use, but I still used the 21 when I needed to get in close.
    Jack
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    Workshop Member glenerrolrd's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack View Post
    It's the face distortion thing for me -- and why I jump to the 20 if I feel there is clipping issue. Did this back in M film days -- my regular combo was a 35 lux and 21 Elmarit. Then when the 28 Cron came out (the old 28 Elmar was not great) I was all over it and my 35 Lux saw a lot less use, but I still used the 21 when I needed to get in close.
    Agree 100% ....I use the 21/3.4asph on the M s when I am really too close (unheard of ) . But the face distortion requires that I use the middle 50% of the frame . So I am old school preferring the 21/28/50 mix over the 24/35 alternative.

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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    Quote Originally Posted by glenerrolrd View Post
    Agree but I meet a lot of street photographers and I am the exception using my 28/2 summicron ......most prefer the 24/1.4 summilux . The argument is pretty simple the 24 allows just a little more room in the frame to avoid clipping (a real issue when framing close and doing it quickly on a moving subject ) and the 1.4 because they are always getting caught with low light problems . The same applies to weddings,events etc . But the widest you can go and consistently avoid distortion of faces is a 28 .

    I am hopeful Leica will introduce a 28 1.4 summilux maybe at photokina . Its becoming a most requested lens . The last time I heard this was when Guy was giving them the business in Germany and they came out with the 21/24 summiluxes .

    The Nikon Rumor of a 28 1.8 asph Nikkor is pretty exciting .

    Hey it's never too late for giving them the business again. I remember both of us kind of down there throat. Lol
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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    Well like I said i do a lot of different types of shooting and my money that is usually made is corporate work with that comes executive portraits. So great chance to see the D800 under profoto lighting. Shot here with 3 lights 3 ft Octagon soft box for main no fill but a nice hair light and a background light . Shot at F10 ISO 100 with my 85 1.4 G lens. Went with a nice easy sharpening setting nothing to heavy and tried to keep it a little on the soft side but with detail. Basically tame this beast down which i am quite used to with the IQ 160. Portraits need a soft touch and many overkill it. I used a Color checker and this is the exact WB coming from it and honestly tried all the profiles in ACR and many of them in the highlight areas tended to go much brighter , not something I wanted as i did have some reflection in his forehead which i airbrushed down but I did use camera standard added a touch of fill and recovery. To me its just about dead perfect, I need to maybe crop a touch but the D800 nailed it. Very pleased here. I will go back in and airbrush a touch more but I did work on his bags under his eyes, pimples, birth marks and forehead plus the tip of his nose. pretty normal stuff



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    Sr. Administrator Jack's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    Great detail in the black sport coat. (And it didn't turn purple! ) Skintone looks good too.
    Jack
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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    I will have models in about 10 days and will post them. I had to be a little flat in lighting here to match a existing image but with the models i can do what I want as far as lighting. The good news here and reason for posting it is things look good and the D800 is looking like a really nice all around cam.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    The DR here is what counts considering no fill.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    Guy, that picture is pretty sharp at 100% crop, so how much sharper would be the d800e, which was my first option.
    And what do you think about the dof with your new d800?
    Gustavo.

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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    Well you can never buy to sharp a camera as you can always tune it down without degradation. Goin up is the issue. Now obviously the E would be a bit more but here in portrait/ fashion land maybe the last thing you want plus here is where moire will become more the issue with fabric. But hey I shoot a MF back and have to deal with it without to many headaches. The DOF is great now on my 160 with effectively the same focal length I would have had to go to about F14 and get his ears in. MF is a diffrent beast that takes a lot of care on portraits you can easily blow it a lot easier.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    I just stumbled onto some early side-by-side comparisons of the 800 and 800E. Not the best, but will have to do for the moment.

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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    Okay I need to go shoot this new lens more the 24 1.4 G but it does work great on the D800 so that is the good news and like many lens reviews on it I think maybe actually better in the corners. At 1.4 yes it does have that veiling look and the detail is pretty good but when you hit F2 it lights up a lot. Very nice in the center with still nice creamy bokeh. At like 6.7 or F8 on the same focal plane the corners are very good and F9 excellent so pretty excited about it. Nice punch to the files . Overall a very very nice lens on the D800 I'm keeping it but I do want to get better images to back my words. Not that you folks don't trust me but makes me feel better. Lol

    So I'm taking it with me on my trip the D800 and 24/50 1.8 along with my tech cam kit. So hopefully if I get some time I can get some decent images with the 24 to post. I also went in and AF tuned all my lenses surprisingly all my G glass are dead on but my 180 went to -10.

    So just FYI in G all 1.4 = 24, 35 and 85 and in 1.8 my 50.
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    Contributing Editor ustein's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    The 50mm 1.8G just arrived.
    Uwe Steinmueller
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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    Sharp at every aperture you watch Uwe . Mind blowing a 229 dollar lens no less.
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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    Thats what I heard.
    Uwe Steinmueller
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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    Yea you will love the little thing. Have fun
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    Yea you will love the little thing. Have fun
    I have one coming when my d800 comes. Very curious. I'm surprised by how mixed the reviews are on this little lens. I don't need it to be great, but it will be a nice surprise if it is.

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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    Uwe Steinmueller
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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    I've read quite a few good reviews, but almost as many middling ones. DXOmark did one of them. I forget the others.

  31. #681
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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    DxO brings their scores down to one number. That is not really helpful. I e.g. would use it mostly between f/5.6-8. If you read their detailed measurements then it looks a lot better. If you expect top performance at f/1.8 then it may look much worse.
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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    Quote Originally Posted by ustein View Post
    DxO brings their scores down to one number. That is not really helpful. I e.g. would use it mostly between f/5.6-8. If you read their detailed measurements then it looks a lot better. If you expect top performance at f/1.8 then it may look much worse.
    I wasn't just looking at the number, but at the overall review. What's interesting is that among reviewers that do a systematic job, some of them find the 1.8g to be significantly better (by most sharpness measures) than the 1.8d, and some of them (like DXO) find it to be significantly worse.

    Glancing through some reviews now, the negative ones seem to be in the minority, but their existence is interesting. It seems like a lot to explain with sample variation (especially for such a simple lens), and makes me wonder if there's been some tweak in the design or manufacturing since the g was introduced.

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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    Okay I need to go shoot this new lens more the 24 1.4 G but it does work great on the D800 so that is the good news and like many lens reviews on it I think maybe actually better in the corners. At 1.4 yes it does have that veiling look and the detail is pretty good but when you hit F2 it lights up a lot. Very nice in the center with still nice creamy bokeh. At like 6.7 or F8 on the same focal plane the corners are very good and F9 excellent so pretty excited about it. Nice punch to the files . Overall a very very nice lens on the D800 I'm keeping it but I do want to get better images to back my words. Not that you folks don't trust me but makes me feel better. Lol
    Guy,

    Glad you're quite impressed with the 24mm f1.4 G. It's a lens when used in place of the 14-24mm f2.8 lens, offers equally impressive performance with a some tradeoffs when compared to the zoom

    As I mentioned in a previous post, by f2, the 24mm f1.4 sides/corners sharpen up to the point where they are almost a match for the zoom and beyond f2, can certainly compare to it (the zoom). What you loose in zoom versitility, is a bit better linear performance and a faster lens that can do well even wide open if one is careful what they shoot at this aperture, especially into the corners.

    With the 35mm f1.4 G and one of the new 85mm's, a exceptionally fast and impressive performing kit is achieved.

    Very nice portrait...straight forward yet effective and when you first said it was taken with the 85mm f1.4 G, I thought "that's not the 85mm f1.4 G I know"..but once I saw your your explanation regarding post processing, it all made sense.

    Dave (D&A)

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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    Thanks Dave yes the 85 is one sharp lens and at F10 way to sharp for a portrait but it's all about control as you know and WHY we shoot raw. So far I have been pretty dang impressed with the D800 and these new G lenses which I never shot before and a big kudos to Nikon. I mean I hated 35mm for a long time and why I went MF but coming back was a risk on my end and I had a good feeling on the D800. I won that guessing game. Only thing left on my agenda is getting this into C1 a program thats been with me a long time. Honestly this means nothing until you have your workflow and you know precisely what your raw converter can do.

    Admittedly you all saw me stumble around here a little getting ACR to work better. This is all good it really is and hopeful some lessons learned here for folks. I don't quit until it's perfect. I hope this thread has really shown what this Nikon can do. I'm impressed and that says a lot but still some work to be done. Again thanks to all of our great members that put time in here to help us all.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    Got the 50mm 1.8G and it works fine for me.

    This shot would not have been possible with any zoom or even the 1.4 because I shot through a fence. The camera feels much lighter with it too.

    Uwe Steinmueller
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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack View Post
    It's the face distortion thing for me -- and why I jump to the 20 if I feel there is clipping issue. Did this back in M film days -- my regular combo was a 35 lux and 21 Elmarit. Then when the 28 Cron came out (the old 28 Elmar was not great) I was all over it and my 35 Lux saw a lot less use, but I still used the 21 when I needed to get in close.
    Quoting myself here for context only. I took delivery of my 35/1.4 the other day and while I've only done some informal testing, my initial reaction was extremely positive. Given I do not do exacting street or reportage work anymore and I lean more toward travel, with this 35 for general low-light and the 20, I don't think I'll be needing the 28 anytime soon. Wants are another story though
    Jack
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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    Jack if you want to try the 135DC next to your 105 then I have one.

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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    Lars,

    Next time you are down in my area bring your kit and we'll go shoot! (Been too long since we've done that anyway!)

    Jack
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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    Very quick reprocessing of these 2 images in Capture One 6.4 in the next couple days I will going back and looking at this compared to ACR but so far it looks really good. I like the red better already and I'm half asleep. LOL



    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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  40. #690
    Senior Member Antonio Chagin's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    Looks very good Guy. Did you have to do much twicking to get it that way? Is so clean.

  41. #691
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    Did nothing except WB
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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  42. #692
    Senior Member Antonio Chagin's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    Compare to ACR is a lot cleaner. ACR being yellowish greenish in comparison. Thanks for the post. ACH

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    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    Thanks I will try that portrait today as well. It does look cleaner have to say just from the one example here. It also looked more detailed but again have to compare.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Subscriber Member TRSmith's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    I must be a C1 junkie or something. That test shot you just posted Guy is the first sample image from the D800 where I actually thought: "whoa!". With no criticism intended to others (all of which were probably processed in ACR) I am now officially impressed.

    Thanks!
    Tim

  45. #695
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    Lol I'm a certified C1 junkie and not afraid to admit it either. The only real bias I have in all of this gear stuff. This is it
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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  46. #696
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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    Thanks, Guy!

    All the colors I recognize look great. I still can't get used to what passes for vegetation out there.

    --Matt

  47. #697
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    Unfortunatly it is yellow green which makes this impossible to see a true Kentucky style bluegrass.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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  48. #698
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    well this is interesting and I say C1 for sure . Less red in the skin tones which has been a Nikon/Canon battle forever.

    First one is C1 than ACR all I did was WB and get exposure to match. No airbrushing



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  49. #699
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    C1 looks to have more DR in the file as well. Hmmm
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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  50. #700
    Super Duper
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    Re: Nikon D800 First Blush

    Guy, a quick look does shows skin tones looking more natural and most definitely less red in the C1 adjusted file...as seen in the image size posted, yet it does look like the center forehead hot spot is a bit overblown resulting in less detail? The resulting adjusment (exposure) of each file looks different too (with C1 being brighter), judging by the sports jacket and hair. Is this due to increased DR or simply exposure adjustment of the file? Am I noticing this correctly? How does it look on your monitor with the full size file?

    Now after going back to both posted images for a second look, the C1 skin tones are preferable in my opinion but it's just barely boarding on being a smigin too yellow. Close call. Unfortunately I'm at a different location than normal and the monitor I'm looking at hasn't been calibrated in quite some time...so I'll have to defer to your observations/comments. The posted C1 outdoor shots though look exceptionally good and I think C1 did a better job of representing some of the colors, especially the reds!

    Dave (D&A)
    Last edited by D&A; 23rd April 2012 at 08:57.

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