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Thread: D800 v D800E, chapter 6

  1. #101
    Workshop Member kuau's Avatar
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    Re: D800 v D800E, chapter 6

    Dave I ordered a Sigma 150 from amazon today to try out.
    I sent my Nikon 180/2.8 back to B&H.
    In the mean time I picked up a used Nikon 200/4 AI-S lens for $175.00 so far at F8 it runs circles around my now sent back to B&H 180/2.8
    Go figure

    Steve
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    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: D800 v D800E, chapter 6

    My 180 was pretty darn nice but I'm a gear slut and got the 200. Shooting a corporate portrait here in a few. Thing is a freaking laser and AF fine tune was-5 so worked out nice. The hood is a monster. Thinking of collapsible one instead. Oh lens cap for it a Dynalite head cover in fashion yellow. Priceless
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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  3. #103
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: D800 v D800E, chapter 6

    Best of all fits in a Domke FX5b without hood. Nice just sling over shoulder and go. Thrilled
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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  4. #104
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    Re: D800 v D800E, chapter 6

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    My 180 was pretty darn nice but I'm a gear slut and got the 200. Shooting a corporate portrait here in a few. Thing is a freaking laser and AF fine tune was-5 so worked out nice. The hood is a monster. Thinking of collapsible one instead. Oh lens cap for it a Dynalite head cover in fashion yellow. Priceless
    Hey, is that my yellow Dynalight head cover I lost on a shoot not all that long ago? LOL! Guy I forgotnthe name of the brand for the moment, but there is a brand of neoprene covers that B&H sells, where different avaialble sized fits over the lens or the hood (inverted or not inverted). this was what I used with the 200 f2. Of course it wasn"t as fashionable as the one you're using

    Dave (D&A)

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    Re: D800 v D800E, chapter 6

    Quote Originally Posted by kuau View Post
    Dave I ordered a Sigma 150 from amazon today to try out.
    I sent my Nikon 180/2.8 back to B&H.
    In the mean time I picked up a used Nikon 200/4 AI-S lens for $175.00 so far at F8 it runs circles around my now sent back to B&H 180/2.8
    Go figure

    Steve
    Steven, I hope you get a good sample. Did you getbthe more compact Sigma 150 without OS (just discontinued) or the much more expensive bulkier OS version? Both also are exceptionally good with Sigma's own 1.4x . Keep us posted on how it goes.

    Dave (D&A)

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    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: D800 v D800E, chapter 6

    Quote Originally Posted by D&A View Post
    Hey, is that my yellow Dynalight head cover I lost on a shoot not all that long ago? LOL! Guy I forgotnthe name of the brand for the moment, but there is a brand of neoprene covers that B&H sells, where different avaialble sized fits over the lens or the hood (inverted or not inverted). this was what I used with the 200 f2. Of course it wasn"t as fashionable as the one you're using

    Dave (D&A)
    Yea I ordered one of those a couple days ago. Hoodie or sOnething like that. I'll shoot some shots of it all next week. BTW have I mentioned how sharp thIs lens really is . It's eating mpx for a snack. Holy ****
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Workshop Member kuau's Avatar
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    Re: D800 v D800E, chapter 6

    I got the newer more expensive version. Should have it next Tuesday, It's coming from Amazon so if it's a bad copy very easy to return and they pickup the return shipping also.
    Wish I could afford the Nikon 200/2 on one hand yet at the same time it's enormous and would hate to hike around with it.
    I hope Nikon comes out with a new 180 at some point or a 200/4 AF-S G lens would be great also for my needs.
    Oh well in the mean time here is my Nikon D800 setup, Zeiss 35/2, Nikon 50/1.8g, Voigtlander 90/.8 which btw is fantastic, and my cheapo Nikon 200/4 AIS.
    I will see how the Sigma 150 performs, I was hoping that ther new 180/2.8 OS macro was shipping but there is no eta yet on this lens.

    Oh yeah on a separate note that is what this thread started off with,
    I tried the latest version of C1 which I also own and used Jack's USM numbers that bring the D800 to D800/E lever of sharpness, and for me, using my images I have taken so far, I like the results better from LR4, with sharpening set at:
    amount 60
    radius .7
    detail 80
    Mask 20
    Clarity +15

    Lastly I have to decide on whether to get a Series 2 Carbon Fiber tripod or just keep using my series 3 Carbon tripod, with a RRS BH55, nice setup but again heavy to carry.

    Steven

    Quote Originally Posted by D&A View Post
    Steven, I hope you get a good sample. Did you getbthe more compact Sigma 150 without OS (just discontinued) or the much more expensive bulkier OS version? Both also are exceptionally good with Sigma's own 1.4x . Keep us posted on how it goes.

    Dave (D&A)
    Steven Kornreich
    www.kuau.com

  8. #108
    Subscriber & Workshop Member GrahamWelland's Avatar
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    Re: D800 v D800E, chapter 6

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post

    BTW have I mentioned how sharp thIs lens really is . It's eating mpx for a snack. Holy ****
    We told you so
    Remember: adventure before dementia!

    As Oscar Wilde said, "my tastes are simple, I only like the best"
    Likes 1 Member(s) liked this post

  9. #109
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: D800 v D800E, chapter 6

    I can't tell you how much of a laser this really is . I got hours of airbrushing. Show you later but I wanted this the day i grabbed the D800. Never let up on it and I'm drooling
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Re: D800 v D800E, chapter 6

    Guy,

    We're excited for you in getting what is arguably one of Nikon's finest and no doubt you're going to love and be impressed by it. Yet at the same time, Graham, myself and others have experienced what I guess might be termed "lugaphobia"...a new term for those that owned this lens but eventually beacme exhaused lugging the darn thing around for extended periods of time. Graham left it in the truck...me in my car and no telling where everyone else left it...LOL...but many eventually end up selling it. Maybe one can say the 200 f2 is both a blessing and cursed. My advice like good medicine...take it in moderate doses and don't overdo it....and it will serve you well. Seriously though....have fun and keep drooling!

    Dave (D&A)
    Last edited by D&A; 18th May 2012 at 22:32.

  11. #111
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    Re: D800 v D800E, chapter 6

    Quote Originally Posted by kuau View Post
    I got the newer more expensive version. Should have it next Tuesday, It's coming from Amazon so if it's a bad copy very easy to return and they pickup the return shipping also.
    Wish I could afford the Nikon 200/2 on one hand yet at the same time it's enormous and would hate to hike around with it.
    I hope Nikon comes out with a new 180 at some point or a 200/4 AF-S G lens would be great also for my needs.
    Oh well in the mean time here is my Nikon D800 setup, Zeiss 35/2, Nikon 50/1.8g, Voigtlander 90/.8 which btw is fantastic, and my cheapo Nikon 200/4 AIS.
    I will see how the Sigma 150 performs, I was hoping that ther new 180/2.8 OS macro was shipping but there is no eta yet on this lens.

    Oh yeah on a separate note that is what this thread started off with,
    I tried the latest version of C1 which I also own and used Jack's USM numbers that bring the D800 to D800/E lever of sharpness, and for me, using my images I have taken so far, I like the results better from LR4, with sharpening set at:
    amount 60
    radius .7
    detail 80
    Mask 20
    Clarity +15

    Lastly I have to decide on whether to get a Series 2 Carbon Fiber tripod or just keep using my series 3 Carbon tripod, with a RRS BH55, nice setup but again heavy to carry.

    Steven
    Nice Steven! Hope you're impressed with the Sigma's performance. I wouldn't lament that the new 180 isn't available yet...whereas the 150mm has univesal acclaim for its performance, the previous 180 didn't. So until there is feedback regarding the 180...hopefully you picked up a lens that will perform well at infinity.

    Dave (D&A)

  12. #112
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: D800 v D800E, chapter 6

    Quote Originally Posted by D&A View Post
    Guy,

    We're excited for you in getting what is arguably one of Nikon's finest and no doubt you're going to love and be impressed by it. Yet at the same time, Graham, myself and others have experienced what I guess might be termed "lugaphobia"...a new term for those that owned this lens but eventually beacme exhaused lugging the darn thing around for extended periods of time. Graham left it in the trunk...me in my car and no telling where everyone else left it...LOL...but many eventually end of selling it. Maybe one can say the 200 f2 is both a blessing and cursed. My advice like good medicine...take it in moderate doses and don't overdo it....and it will serve you well. Seriously though....have fun and keep drooling!

    Dave (D&A)
    Lol thanks Dave and the 1.4 converter is like no loss of IQ. Very nice my offset is diffrent but that's okay. So glad they put AF fine tune on these things.

    Now I need a second body for backup. Not getting the E version either. Wish the D 600 was out. I honestly just need a emergency backup so even a D7000 would be fine.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

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    Re: D800 v D800E, chapter 6

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    Lol thanks Dave and the 1.4 converter is like no loss of IQ. Very nice my offset is diffrent but that's okay. So glad they put AF fine tune on these things.

    Now I need a second body for backup. Not getting the E version either. Wish the D 600 was out. I honestly just need a emergency backup so even a D7000 would be fine.
    Guy,

    The 1.4x is fantastic with the 200 f2 and the current 2x will surprise you (providing 400 f4 if necessary).

    As for a back-up body, no telling what the D600 will be like as of yet, but I never "clicked" with the D7000. Maybe a personal thing with me, but a bunch of things I wasn't all that thrilled about with regards to its use in relationship to my own particular needs. Subsequently, the files I felt could have been better. Exposure in direct sunlight is a common complaint but thats just one of a number of things.

    Dave (D&A)

  14. #114
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: D800 v D800E, chapter 6

    Thanks Dave good to know. I liked having the same batteries as the D800. I do have a V1 but not really a backup. Maybe a used D700 cheap
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Subscriber Member tashley's Avatar
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    Re: D800 v D800E, chapter 6

    Quote Originally Posted by D&A View Post
    Guy,

    The 1.4x is fantastic with the 200 f2 and the current 2x will surprise you (providing 400 f4 if necessary).

    As for a back-up body, no telling what the D600 will be like as of yet, but I never "clicked" with the D7000. Maybe a personal thing with me, but a bunch of things I wasn't all that thrilled about with regards to its use in relationship to my own particular needs. Subsequently, the files I felt could have been better. Exposure in direct sunlight is a common complaint but thats just one of a number of things.

    Dave (D&A)
    Dave I second that: my 7000 got sold after a few months. Pardon the pun but it never really clicked.

  16. #116
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    Re: D800 v D800E, chapter 6

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack View Post
    RG posted nefs from the D800 and D800E, best direct comparison shots we can process from raw up that I've seen so far: Rob Galbraith DPI: Comparing detail and moire in the Nikon D800 and D800E

    ...

    I downloaded the first set (image above) with the shoes and motorcycles and been playing with them in C1. He used the excellent 85/1.4 at optimal f5.6 aperture for both captures, conditions remained almost the same for both.

    Cheers,
    Hi Jack.

    I'm new around here. Seems like a great resource, I really enjoyed reading through the forum the last couple of days.

    Your findings are very interesting. I currently have a D800E on order and you got me wondering... .

    However, one thing that came up elsewhere is that you can basically always sharp with software up to a certain degree.

    For example, where is the real difference between a 100$ 50mm 1.8D and a 500$ 50mm 1.4G at f/1.8? Isn't the added contrast, detail and sharpness you get with an 1.4G is something you can also achieve with a little tweaking in Lightroom 4?

    I could have easily gone to a more extreme example, like comparing a 18-55mm kit lens @ 21mm with a Zeiss 21mm prime. Distortion? Chromatic Aberrations? Sharpness? Resolution? All of these can be corrected in post.

    The obvious answer to these questions is that playing with these values in post will never be able to bring back information that is not there. And of course, this tweaks can also present artifacts and noise to the image, so it's always best to "get it right" with a distortionless, CA-less, sharp lens.

    We'll, isn't that the exact same thing with the D800 vs D800E? In the end, the E rarely suffers from the moire issue, so isn't it better to get the sharpest data possible from the sensor itself?

    Looking forward to your comments, and just a quick thanks for everyone chiming in with their remarks and especially those excellent images!

    Oded S.

  17. #117
    Sr. Administrator Jack's Avatar
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    Re: D800 v D800E, chapter 6

    Quote Originally Posted by odedia View Post
    SNIP
    We'll, isn't that the exact same thing with the D800 vs D800E? In the end, the E rarely suffers from the moire issue, so isn't it better to get the sharpest data possible from the sensor itself?
    Welcome to the forum!

    While a comparison to lens anomalies sounds good in theory, the reality of working at the pixel level to begin with is different -- so no, they are not the same.

    A soft lens may have artifacts that span 4 pixels, or in the case of distortions, 4000 -- difficult to process those out without loosing data. By contrast, the pixel pitch of the D800 and D800E are identical; moreover, the absolute maximum resolution they can render is equal per Nyquist, so we begin from a different place -- they have equivalent capability in an ideal environment. Since an ideal OLPF trims data near Nyquist and the resulting "blur" is based on a known constant, it can be reversed to null with proper deconvolution. It's why I said what I said, why Lloyd said what he said, and why the engineers over on LuLa said what they said -- the difference between the two cameras is nominal with ideal processing on each. Since nothing is perfect, including the D800 OLPF, the test engineers even came up with a delta for "nominal difference" --- 1%...

    So, the bottom line is unless you have a specific application for a naked sensor -- like deep space imaging -- then the gains are probably moot for most shooters, and for most of those it won't be worth dealing with the added processing when moire does show. Don't know how else to say it without repeating myself again.

    But, do not let any of these findings dissuade you from purchasing one. If you believe it's significantly better, then you may have more confidence using it, and confidence can count for a lot for some folks! And the downside is small.

    Cheers,
    Jack
    home: www.getdpi.com

    "Perfection is not attainable. But if we chase perfection, we can catch excellence."

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