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Thread: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

  1. #1
    Senior Member Swissblad's Avatar
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    Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    Although the new D600 was rumoured to have a entry price of $1500.-, the latest reports put it closer to $2700.-

    Guess we'll have to wait and see - but at that price it is not very tempting.

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    Workshop Member Bryan Stephens's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    Why would one opt for the D600 over the D800 for a mere $200?

    If this is indeed the case, Nikon may have shot themselves in the foot.
    Bryan

    “You don’t take a photograph, you make it.” — Ansel Adams

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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    I think it is actually 2100.00 US street price. Let's wait on further details but there math is kind of weird from what I read.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Senior Member johnnygoesdigital's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    Quote Originally Posted by Bryan Stephens View Post
    Why would one opt for the D600 over the D800 for a mere $200?

    If this is indeed the case, Nikon may have shot themselves in the foot.
    For me, strictly as a backup camera, and fatter pixels, but i'm guessing the price will be much lower...

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    Workshop Member Bryan Stephens's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    I think it is actually 2100.00 US street price. Let's wait on further details but there math is kind of weird from what I read.
    I would hope that it would be no more than that, and perhaps even a little less. If they could manage to keep the list at just under $2,000. (say $1,995)then there would be a large market of photo enthusiasts who would spend about $1,000 less than the D800 for a camera that will do them justice for several years.
    Bryan

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    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    If its at 1800 than I'm buying it as my second body. More than that not so sure it makes any sense for me and buy used instead.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    I have no inside information, but find both guesses ($1500 and $2700) unrealistic. My guess is $2000-2200.

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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    Speaking for myself, I think equally important to the price point and how close or not it is price wise to the D800 is what type of camera it is and what priorities Nikon has set for this camera.

    For example, just as the D700 was in essence a near clone in many respects to the capabilities of the original D3 at a lower price point....many would like to see a similar camera to the D4 but in a smaller less expensive package. For some this would be the ideal companion to their D800 and for others, simply the prefered desired camera (even if their only DSLR) for low light and/or fast shooting work, with a smaller file size than the D800.

    Another group would be happy with a compromise camera, having higher resolution than say the D4 but a more manageable file size than the D800 with the tradeoff being that for it's clearly superior for low light, and/or faster shooting than the D800. Sort of right in-between some of the capabilties of a D4 and D800, which places both those two cameras on the extremes, so to speak.

    This in-between camera could also be a companion camera to both D4 users as well as D800 users.

    What I and some others fear is a $2400 body that is neither here nor there...sort of a scaled back D800 ...where it does have a smaller # of pixels (say 24mp), but higher ISO shooting isn't all that different nor is the FPS. Just simply a chance to save a few hundred $$ and in return get essntially a 24mp downsized D800 sort of camera (but with a reduced file size and not quite as robust build.

    If given the choice, I would much prefer one of the 1st two choices I mentioned, not the last (3rd) choice.

    Dave (D&A)
    Last edited by D&A; 12th September 2012 at 19:01.
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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    The apparent $2100 price (so £17-1800 UK retail) pushes me back towards the D800. While I lean towards smaller bodies, £4-500 (or much less if I go for a secondhand D800) in exchange for better AF, better metering (and hence tracking) and the shutter/sync speeds looks good (especially as that £400 difference is likely to hold through resale). I hope the price is a pessimistic estimate.

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    Sr. Administrator Jack's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    High framerates and stellar high ISO performance could drive the pricing. Depending on what those are, I could be a buyer as high as $2500, doubtful I would be, but certainly could be. If framerates and ISO are on par with the D800, then I'm probably not a buyer even at $1500...
    Jack
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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack View Post
    High framerates and stellar high ISO performance could drive the pricing. Depending on what those are, I could be a buyer as high as $2500, doubtful I would be, but certainly could be. If framerates and ISO are on par with the D800, then I'm probably not a buyer even at $1500...
    Framerate will likely be 5(maaaaaaaaaaaybe 6, but highly unlikely) FPS full frame, no higher in DX.

    High ISO might be a little better than the D800, but it's going to be marginal. The D800 is already the 2nd-4th best DSLR at high ISO (depending on exactly how high you're talking), having the D600 beat this would mean going to a non Exmor sensor, trashing (relatively) the low ISO advantage.

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    Sr. Administrator Jack's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    ausemmau,

    I agree 100% with your assessment -- and assuming we're correct, I'm not going to be interested, rather have a pair of D800's
    Jack
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    Senior Member Lars's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    My guess is $1700. It has to be quite a bit lower than the $3K of the D800. We'll know in a few hours (minutes?).

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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    i realize it's almost a vestigial tail these days with pocket wizards and such getting better all the time...but i was really hoping for a pc sync (assuming the camera even has FP flash mode). it's a super easy way to severely cheat the flash sync speed (transmitter in pc terminal, flash in FP mode on the hotshoe, and go. i routinely shot my d300 over 1/1250 with my ABs without more than a couple stops light loss...and with the silver PCB paras, you gain that back anyway, so it's a wash).

    i'm also not thrilled about the 39pt AF. i've been spoiled by the d300 and d700 the last 4+ years.

    at $2000+ it's a no go for me, i'd rather just bite the bullet and move up. at $1700ish, it's gonna take some hard thinking. the lower price is welcome though, since i'm strongly considering updating my midrange zoom this year as well (hafta see how to optimize the ol' taxes). not the most exciting lens, but it's my bread and butter.

    thank heavens the sony rx1 doesnt have a built in evf, or i'd be out turning tricks on the corner instead of typing this message. lmao
    --David

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    Contributing Editor ustein's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    At $2100 quite attractive I say:

    24MP full frame CMOS sensor
    max 5.5 fps
    39 focus points
    1080p 30p,25p, 24p video
    Optional WiFi adapter
    Estimated price $2099
    Available 18th September 2012

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    Super Duper
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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    For sample images from the D600 and additional specs:

    Nikon | Imaging Products | Still Images - Nikon D600

    Dave (D&A)

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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    Quote Originally Posted by D&A View Post
    For sample images from the D600 and additional specs:

    Nikon | Imaging Products | Still Images - Nikon D600

    Dave (D&A)

    Thanks,

    They look good but there is something that catch my attention, and concern me a little.
    It seems that the skin of the model of the first picture has no texture on it.

    It could be the combination of distance, makeup, age of the model and resolution, but it has this "Canon" look to it (lack of texture, beautifully render eyes).
    The issue is not the Canon part, but the indication of heavy processing. If we look at the out of focus part of her hair it looks funny too.

    I am aware it's too early to tell, but just venting.

    For the people that have never used a D7000 /D90 etc series: The difference in terms of autofocus performance is very big, so I will suggest playing with it before buying it.

    As a second body that may not be a concern.

    Best regards,
    James

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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all


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    Subscriber Member tashley's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    Just a caution. It seems that, unbelievably, there is no AF fine tune on the 600...

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    Subscriber & Workshop Member GrahamWelland's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    Not to be outdone, B&H already have the pre-order pages up:
    B&H D600 Page
    Remember: adventure before dementia!

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    Subscriber & Workshop Member GrahamWelland's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    Quote Originally Posted by tashley View Post
    Just a caution. It seems that, unbelievably, there is no AF fine tune on the 600...
    Nikon want you to buy the D800/D4 ... product marketing 101 says that you don't offer all the features of the higher end model on the base model, especially if everything is else is so close in specification.
    Remember: adventure before dementia!

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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    Quote Originally Posted by tashley View Post
    Just a caution. It seems that, unbelievably, there is no AF fine tune on the 600...
    Nikon Europe B.V., go to "Specifikationer"
    Under Autofocus, it says "fine-tuning", so I guess it's included or..?
    Thorkil

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    Subscriber Member tashley's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    Yeah, my bad, there was apparently a glitch at DPreview that implied there wasn't but the specs say there is...

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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    The Nikon UK site also mentions "fine-tuning", so dpreview's "bad" i.m.o..

    Looks like WEX have it at the high/pre-order price of £1955 with the incensive that if you buy it before October 31st you get an extra battery and the chance to win a Nikkor to the value of £2000 ... or you could get it at the more reasonable price of about £1595 if you wait until November (based on D800 prices at pre-order and current at WEX).

    I'll wait and pay less, even if I don't get the chance to gamble on getting a free lens as I'm never that lucky!

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    Subscriber Member tashley's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    I have to say that with much of my Nikon gear in constant circulation between me and Nikon service, I have totally stopped buying their stuff (bodies, glass) until such time as I get at least one successful repair to indicate that the game is worth the candle...

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    Sr. Administrator Jack's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    Tim,

    Have you ever owned any piece of camera kit that didn't need to be returned for repairs?
    Jack
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    Workshop Member Bryan Stephens's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    I am still of the mindset that Nikon should have kept the pricing at $1,999. as it is a psycological factor in play.

    Seeing the D600 at $2,099 and the D800 at $2,999 doesn't appear to be as much of a difference from a marketing perspective. Perception is a big factor in sales as many of us know too.
    Bryan

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    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    I agree. 1999.00 I might not think twice but I am now.

    I'm also bummed no REAL lenses being introduced.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    The one thing in its favor is it is small. After walking all around NY both Manhattan and Brooklyn last week with the D800e with the Tammy zoom I would have enjoyed the D600 more from a weight and bulk perspective . I'm no wimp either when it comes to carrying gear but it did wear me out some.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Super Duper
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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    I still feel as I stated in my previous post yesterday, that Nikon could or should have gone two ways with this:

    1. A real entry level D600 size full frame camera at a sub $2000 price point, maybe closer to $1795.00 . Resolution, since tech has moved on since the days of 12mp bodies, would be in the 18-24mp range. Sort of the D600 they introduced but at a price point that is as much as a value purchase as the D800/e was.

    2. A real successor to the D700 . A full frame robustly built D800 sized camera that also has 18-24mp, at least 6 FPS without grip (and optional 7 FPS or greater frame rate with optional grip), same AF array and metering of the D800 and then stick a price of $2395.00-2695.00 . High ISO performance would exceed that of a D800. Yes, sort of a mini D4.

    This body would attract D800 users desiring a body with alternative performance feature set to complement their D800 or those who simply want a camera that does everything well with a balanced approach to both resolution, high ISO performance and shooting speed. It would of course use the D800 grip and battery.

    I feel with the upcoming D600, they missed the mark in designing this camera for a well defined traget group of users.

    Dave (D&A)
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    Workshop Member Bryan Stephens's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    The one thing in its favor is it is small. After walking all around NY both Manhattan and Brooklyn last week with the D800e with the Tammy zoom I would have enjoyed the D600 more from a weight and bulk perspective . I'm no wimp either when it comes to carrying gear but it did wear me out some.
    I used to lug my D3s around with the 24-70 or even the 70-200 so the D800 is a dream to me.
    Bryan

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    Workshop Member Bryan Stephens's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    Quote Originally Posted by D&A View Post
    I still feel as I stated in my previous post yesterday, that Nikon could or should have gone two ways with this:

    1. A real entry level D600 size full frame camera at a sub $2000 price point, maybe closer to $1795.00 . Resolution, since tech has moved on since the days of 12mp bodies, would be in the 18-24mp range. Sort of the D600 they introduced but at a price point that is as much as a value purchase as the D800/e was.

    2. A real successor to the D700 . A full frame robustly built D800 sized camera that also has 18-24mp, at least 6 FPS without grip (and optional 7 FPS or greater frame rate with optional grip), same AF array and metering of the D800 and then stick a price of $2395.00-2695.00 . High ISO performance would exceed that of a D800. Yes, sort of a mini D4.

    This body would attract D800 users desiring a body with alternative performance feature set to complement their D800 or those who simply want a camera that does everything well with a balanced approach to both resolution, high ISO performance and shooting speed. It would of course use the D800 grip and battery.

    I feel with the upcoming D600, they missed the mark in designing this camera for a well defined traget group of users.

    Dave (D&A)
    You and I agree on both points.
    Bryan

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    Super Duper
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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    Quote Originally Posted by Bryan Stephens View Post
    I used to lug my D3s around with the 24-70 or even the 70-200 so the D800 is a dream to me.
    You me and I'm sure many many other (did the same thing). Not only the D800 but even the D700 always seemed like an ultra light weight alternative to the large pro oriented bodies. Of course as time marches on, one sort of gets used to these newer bodies (D800 etc.) as being the new standard in size and weight and anything smaller seems like a featherweight. Its of course all relative in terms of what one is used to.

    Dave (D&A)

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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    The one thing in its favor is it is small. After walking all around NY both Manhattan and Brooklyn last week with the D800e with the Tammy zoom I would have enjoyed the D600 more from a weight and bulk perspective . I'm no wimp either when it comes to carrying gear but it did wear me out some.
    That is why I have an OMD and no Nikon body right now.

    Kept the 24-70, 2.8 and the 120-300 2.8 sigma as I when I am birding or some sports, and some events, I like zooms. The frame rate is a bit of a let down.

    I'd really have preferred a baby D4, not a baby D800.

    Dave

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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    As far as I know this is the lowest priced FF DSLR by a margin. So I don't think much is wrong with it and it is right on target (these are not the D800 users).
    Uwe Steinmueller
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    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    Yea it will most likely out sell the D800 buy a large margin too.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    For most lenses the D600 maybe a better choice and I guess also better at higher ISO.
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    Senior Member viablex1's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all


  39. #39
    Super Duper
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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    Uwe, the D600 may indeed have a target audience but then I personally fine there is still a gap for a body as I've described in paragraph below;

    What I find a bit ironic is the camera many would like to see is an amalgam of the D800 and D4....D800 body and metering & AF sensors, 18-24mp, 6+ FPS, robust D800 build quality. A camera sort of placed in the line-up between the D600 and D800 in many ways and the perfect name could be D700....oops wait, that name has already been used...LOL!

    Dave (D&A)

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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    Quote Originally Posted by D&A View Post
    . . .

    1. A real entry level D600 size full frame camera at a sub $2000 price point, maybe closer to $1795.00 . Resolution, since tech has moved on since the days of 12mp bodies, would be in the 18-24mp range. Sort of the D600 they introduced but at a price point that is as much as a value purchase as the D800/e was.

    . . .

    Dave (D&A)
    I think they had a lower price point in mind but the exchange rate being what it is probably drove the price up. They can always have a rebate program in the future, much easier to move the price down than up.
    Al Tanabe my website https://www.altanabe.com

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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    It had my attention at 1500.00 as a possible move back to Nikon, with the lure of a small full frame, but for a body that seems to be even lower specked than the D90, for over 2 grand, I think I will pass. It is exciting watching all this new stuff come out though.

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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    I'm surprised about all the hairsplitting over specs and price here. As far as I can see, Nikon has delivered exactly what the rumours said, a medium level, 35mm, 24MP DSLR for around $2,000. While our wishes and hopes may differ (I wouldn't mind a D5100 body with the D4 sensor for under $1,200, but that's probably a few years into the future), the D600 is a big step forward with regards to size, specs and price.

    The only thing that surprised me a bit was the fact that it doesn't share the vertical grip with the D7000. Maybe that indicates that there'll be a D400 after all, a sports/telephoto camera with a DX sensor and 30-36MP/8fps (my guess) in a similar body to the D600.
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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    I was just in Japan and I was amazed how weak the dollar was. It is almost half of what it was worth during my first visit to Japan about 10 years ago or so. Of interest, I went into a discount electronics and camera store. They had a good selection of Nikon, Canon, Panasonic, Olympus (even Zeiss). Interestingly, the camera gear from the Japanese companies were about 20 or 25% higher than what you can buy them in the USA. Zeiss lenses were just a tad higher than USA prices.

  44. #44
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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    Hello,

    IMHO the entry price for the D600 is quite keen and I can see the market price may be around US$ 1800 soon if I ask my glas ball. If we also don't look through our "Nikon specs", there is a main competitor named Canon out there which still has the 5D MkII in its portfolio and probably a 7D MkII to come. If we just stick to Nikon, there is still the D700.....just my thoughts.

    Greetings, Jurgen

  45. #45
    Workshop Member Bryan Stephens's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    Jorgen

    While I would love for there to be a D400 with the specs you mentioned (I shoot a lot of sports), I dont think it would happen as Nikon has their sports camera out there in the D4, and I'm not sure they want to bastardize the sales of their flagship.

    I currently have the D3s and was hoping that there would be another alternative than the D4, but it appears that at least for now, this is it. I tried to use the D800 but the frame rate is way too slow for my taste (5fps compared to 10fps in the D3s)
    Bryan

    “You don’t take a photograph, you make it.” — Ansel Adams

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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    My plan was to wait for the release of the then rumored D800 and D600 and after that buy a cheaper D700. I believe Nikon even told around the D800 releasing time that D700 will remain in production as long as there's buyers. Well, what do you know, it did not seem to go that way. Suddenly D700 is almost nowhere available and the price is not going down. And now that D600 was announced with a slower flash sync, fewer AF points and a lesser build quality, I think the remaining D700s will never get cheaper. But I guess D600 would really suit me just fine as I want to give FF a try having bound myself to a brand which has not released one (despite all the rumors that tend to move the expected release date 6 months further every 6 months...).

  47. #47
    Contributing Editor ustein's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    >I'm surprised about all the hairsplitting over specs and price here. As far as I can see, Nikon has delivered exactly what the rumours said, a medium level, 35mm, 24MP DSLR for around $2,000. While our wishes and hopes may differ (I wouldn't mind a D5100 body with the D4 sensor for under $1,200, but that's probably a few years into the future), the D600 is a big step forward with regards to size, specs and price.

    My take too. If the quality is there this is a great deal.
    Uwe Steinmueller
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  48. #48
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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    I cannot understand all the price discussion around the D600

    It is a great FF camera for a very low price (actually the cheapest as per to date) and incorporates latest state of the art technology. And gives 24MP, which was considered impossible some few years ago.

    Just buy it and shoot it ...
    Life is an ever changing journey
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  49. #49
    Workshop Member glenerrolrd's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    This entire thread is skewed from a D800 or better view point. The d600 is a very compelling upgrade coming from a D7000 or D300S (remember the D700 was more $$$ than this most of it life ). My wife Carolyn shoots events and maintains galleries and web pages for two large organizations . She produces probably 6-8 books for groups each year. The D7000 with a good flash and diffuser is all thats necessary . Better technique and use of balanced artifical and strobe are all thats required . She needs AF,AE,Auto ISO and the 24-85zoom.

    This is the market for the D600(the next step up) ..not as a alternative to the D800 ..and certainly not at a price point of $2000 . Consider that a 32GB 1000X Lexar card runs over $200 and a lot more outside the USA.

    Likewise I would like a mini D4 for half the cost ...and a 24MP that splits the difference between the d800 and the d4 would be ideal ....but it should be built on a solid chassis (pro build) and have the benefits of a smaller (D800 size) form and better ISO . Ok lower volume and its the same $3k as the D800. Price in this range is not relevant if it does the job. Its the capabilities of the camera thats disappointing but logical from a business standpoint .

    Great camera for a different set of users at a price that blows away the competition ..at least until next week.

  50. #50
    Subscriber Member Jorgen Udvang's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D600 may not be so "budget" after all

    Quote Originally Posted by Bryan Stephens View Post
    Jorgen

    While I would love for there to be a D400 with the specs you mentioned (I shoot a lot of sports), I dont think it would happen as Nikon has their sports camera out there in the D4, and I'm not sure they want to bastardize the sales of their flagship.

    I currently have the D3s and was hoping that there would be another alternative than the D4, but it appears that at least for now, this is it. I tried to use the D800 but the frame rate is way too slow for my taste (5fps compared to 10fps in the D3s)
    I don't think they worry too much about the D4 sales. Most of those who needed it urgently have already bought, the D4 has high ISO and burst capabilities that a D400 won't match and it's full frame. Nikon still has a big following of sports shooters who want a DX format camera, many as an addition to a D3 or 4 and many because they want or need the extra reach. Remember the D3/D300 combo? That was highly successful. A $2,000 D400 will probably sell umpteen times as many as the D4, generating much more profit for Nikon. Many freelance sports photographers simply can't afford a D4, not to speak about the expensive glass needed to get enough reach with full frame.

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