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Thread: Ultra wide for D800e

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    Ultra wide for D800e

    Thinking of getting an ultra wide. My choice boils down to the Nikon 14-24 f2.8 or the Zeiss 21mm f2.8 zf.2. Initially, I also considered the Nikon 24 1.4 and the Zeiss 25 f2.0. Which one would you get if you we're buying?

    Mostly for landscape and architectural shots

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    Senior Subscriber Member Steen's Avatar
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    Senior Member RVB's Avatar
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    Re: Ultra wide for D800e

    The Zeiss 15mm is worth a look if you want ultra wide...

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    Subscriber Member tashley's Avatar
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    Re: Ultra wide for D800e

    Get the Samyang 14mm. It is simply brilliant, and costs almost nothing. Sold in some countries as Rokinon I think. It has a fair bit of distortion but that does correct very well and there is so much sharpness to begin with that even a corrected file looks great.

    Look at this: on a D800 it is sharper than the Zeiss. I think mine is brilliant and I am very fussy about lenses, for example I find the Zeiss 21 a little disappointing.

    DxOMark - Compare lenses

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    Senior Member RVB's Avatar
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    Re: Ultra wide for D800e

    Quote Originally Posted by tashley View Post
    Get the Samyang 14mm. It is simply brilliant, and costs almost nothing. Sold in some countries as Rokinon I think. It has a fair bit of distortion but that does correct very well and there is so much sharpness to begin with that even a corrected file looks great.

    Look at this: on a D800 it is sharper than the Zeiss. I think mine is brilliant and I am very fussy about lenses, for example I find the Zeiss 21 a little disappointing.

    DxOMark - Compare lenses
    Pretty impressive considering the price Tim,it would be impressive at a much higher price, I have the Zeiss 15mm but it's canon mount and my 1DX is gone so no chance to really try it out recently.. (although when I did try it I thought the TSE-17mm was better,,)

    What do you think of the 14-24nikkor,it cost a lot less than the zeiss and has A.F. I only use it for the 14mm F.L when I want to shoot tight spaces or interiors.

    I also have the nikkor 24mm 1.4G which is very good at F4-F8 but it also costs a lot and I am not sure it's worth the money over the Zoom unless you need to shoot in low light hand held or simply want the DOF of a fast prime..

    Robert

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    Senior Member KeithL's Avatar
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    Re: Ultra wide for D800e

    The Samyang may well be suited for landscape but life is too short to have to correct every shot for that complex distortion when used for architectural work.

    Good luck with your search. I can only say the lack of an excellent ultra-wide is keeping me from buying into Nikon.

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    Subscriber Member tashley's Avatar
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    Re: Ultra wide for D800e

    Quote Originally Posted by RVB View Post
    Pretty impressive considering the price Tim,it would be impressive at a much higher price, I have the Zeiss 15mm but it's canon mount and my 1DX is gone so no chance to really try it out recently.. (although when I did try it I thought the TSE-17mm was better,,)

    What do you think of the 14-24nikkor,it cost a lot less than the zeiss and has A.F. I only use it for the 14mm F.L when I want to shoot tight spaces or interiors.

    I also have the nikkor 24mm 1.4G which is very good at F4-F8 but it also costs a lot and I am not sure it's worth the money over the Zoom unless you need to shoot in low light hand held or simply want the DOF of a fast prime..

    Robert
    Hi Robert,

    I went with just the Samyang rather than the short trinity zoom because from the reviews I read it's just as good (possibly better) and a fraction of the price - and I don't really need the other focal lengths in the zoom. Also, if I am going to have a vulnerable front element on which I can't put filters, I'd rather it was a cheap one! Also the Samyang is smaller and much lighter. And we all love a bargain, right?

    ;-)
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    Workshop Member glenerrolrd's Avatar
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    Re: Ultra wide for D800e

    I found a Leica R 19/2.8 and had DAG convert it for Nikon using the chipped Leitax mount . What a fun lens to use on a D800E . It has floating elements and if you can risk using it without the hood(no filter protection is possible ) ..small form and great handling .

    It does have some of the wave distortion similar to the Zeiss 21 ZF but less . LR4 has a profile for the lens that corrects most of the distortion . I found the edge sharpness to be impressive .

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    Smile Re: Ultra wide for D800e

    Quote Originally Posted by glenerrolrd View Post
    I found a Leica R 19/2.8 and had DAG convert it for Nikon using the chipped Leitax mount . What a fun lens to use on a D800E . It has floating elements and if you can risk using it without the hood(no filter protection is possible ) ..small form and great handling .

    It does have some of the wave distortion similar to the Zeiss 21 ZF but less . LR4 has a profile for the lens that corrects most of the distortion . I found the edge sharpness to be impressive .
    Agree, fantastic lens. (but not a bargain for sure )
    Corrected with Adobe profile, full on flickr.


    _DSC2013crop by sergio lovisolo, on Flickr
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    Re: Ultra wide for D800e

    I had a 14-24 for some years and now use a 21/2.8 Zeiss on my Canon 5dIII.
    So far I prefer the Zeiss lens. But I also knew that 21mm is "my" focal length.
    I like the smaller size of the Zeiss better. Just recently I compared soe images from the 5diii+Zeiss21/2.8 vs M9+21/3.4SA and found both lenses to be excellent.
    I also like the color the Zeiss lens renders and its a nice "3d"-look.
    I have used various 24mm lenses but I just seem to prefer 21mm over 24mm when I want to go wide.

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    Re: Ultra wide for D800e

    Owned the 14-24, not as impressed as some. Used on 800e and D3s. Was using for interior images in small offices, etc. Flare was a problem, but not unsurprisingly.

    Biggest issues were focus shift and performance (wide open) that wasn't up to 'the legend' (or at least my expectations thereof) vs. what had known from an adapted (Canon) Leica 19 V2, or even the Nikon 28/2.8 AiS (in the center) etc.

    Now gone, and have yet to replace it, but top candidate(s) are a combo of the 14 Rok/Sam (WTH at $300) and the 21 Zeiss.

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    Senior Member johnnygoesdigital's Avatar
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    Re: Ultra wide for D800e

    I've come to find that one lens for landscape and architecture may not always be a good choice if absolutes are required for interiors. Yes, lots of convergence can be corrected, but cropping an image might defeat the purpose of the "wide". Landscapes imo, are easier to adjust for distortion, and a little harder for convergence, but probably need to be cropped too. I shoot landscapes with the ZF.2 21mm f/2.8 because of its amazing micro contrast and resolution. The 14-24mm was never a consideration simply because of the lack of protection to the front element, especially if shooting near the ocean. The 24mm f/1.4 G is an outstanding lens with AF, but the corner edges were not as good as the Zeiss. A good copy of a PC 24mm, might be useful. The upcoming 17mm PC will be welcomed and hopefully a decent performer. I agree to use prime lenses for landscape and interiors.

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    Re: Ultra wide for D800e

    I've been using the Leica 19 2.8 (latest ROM version), for years on my Canon's and have changed the mount for my Nikon D800E a few months ago. It is and has always been an excellent lens. I use it for architecture and landscapes and it's sharp edge to edge with minimal distortion that is easily corrected. I was really pleased to see Lightroom has profiles for all my Leica lenses now. The 14-24 has a great reputation as the finest WA zoom ever made. I've rented it for one job when I had a D800 (non-e), so I can't judge it against my Leica fairly. I would also like to try the new Nikon 16-35 f4 which is stabilized and can take filters. But I truly doubt either of these zooms will perform as well as the best primes. What I really need is my Canon 17 and 24 shift lenses in a Nikon mount!

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    Re: Ultra wide for D800e

    Right now I have the Samyang 14mm and people keep overlooking the Zeiss 25mm F2 which BTW is rated better than the 21mm.

    From Photozone on a Canon

    The Zeiss lens produced very high resolution figures in the MTF lab. The center quality is nothing short of stunning with extremely high resolution combined with snappy contrast straight from f/2. The lens is certainly easily capable of exceeding the quality of the sensor (EOS 5D II) here. The border quality is a bit weaker with very good results and the corners are softer still. Stopping down to f/2.8 has no major effect but there's a more substantial boost at f/4. The peak performance is reached around f/5.6 with a very sharp image quality across the image frame. The quality level is kept at f/8 whereas diffraction reduces the potential from f/11 onward.
    Below is a simplified summary of the formal findings. The chart shows line widths per picture height (LW/PH) which can be taken as a measure for sharpness. If you want to know more about the MTF50 figures you may check out the corresponding Imatest Explanations.


    Samyang thread i started a while back. http://www.getdpi.com/forum/nikon/41...yang-14mm.html

    Im still holding out for Nikon to give us a 17T/S

    Nikon did come out with a more consumer grade 18-35 that might be worth checking out. It could be good or bad , I have not looked at anything on it yet.


    Now If I could get my hands on a Leica 19mm version II with a Nikon leitax mount. I would like to have it. What i would really like to do is test one. If it turned out to be killer than it may change up my whole wide setup wider than 35mm.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Senior Member RVB's Avatar
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    Re: Ultra wide for D800e

    https://www.yousendit.com/download/U...U1A5NVZwdmNUQw

    The above link is for the S30mm compared to the nikkor 24mm 1.4G,it might be useful it anyone wants to see how the 24mm performs at 5.6...

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    Re: Ultra wide for D800e

    I see no mention of the 16-35mm lens, I'd be interested to hear how this lens fairs on the D800e with it's zoom versatility.
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    Re: Ultra wide for D800e

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post

    Now If I could get my hands on a Leica 19mm version II with a Nikon leitax mount. I would like to have it. What i would really like to do is test one. If it turned out to be killer than it may change up my whole wide setup wider than 35mm.
    I'll let you know the next time I come to Phoenix and you can test my 19 Leica and I'll test your Samyang 14

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    Senior Member KeithL's Avatar
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    Re: Ultra wide for D800e

    Quote Originally Posted by johnnygoesdigital View Post
    The upcoming 17mm PC will be welcomed and hopefully a decent performer.
    You know something we don't?

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    Re: Ultra wide for D800e



    I like the Zeiss 17mm f/3.5 and Nikon 24mm f/1.4 although I also have the Nikon 14-24mm which has always been in my bag. Horses for courses!
    The above picture was taken by a Nikon D800E and Nikon 24mm f/1.4 in New Orleans.
    ISO 1600/f 1.4/1/40 sec. Handheld with autofocus.
    The Nikon 24mm f/1.4 is great for night photography especially handholding and freezing the stars.

    Pramote
    Last edited by Landscapelover; 17th March 2013 at 11:01.
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    Re: Ultra wide for D800e

    When people are talking about the Leica 19, most I guess are referring to version 2. Any big difference with version 1? I see that the price difference is quite substantial.

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    Re: Ultra wide for D800e

    Quote Originally Posted by VINCET View Post
    When people are talking about the Leica 19, most I guess are referring to version 2. Any big difference with version 1? I see that the price difference is quite substantial.
    Erwin Puts says:
    At f/5.6 the 20 Lp/mm are now above 80% contrast from centre to corner and the 5 Lp/mm are close to 100%. This performance is of a very high order indeed. We may appreciate the quality if we reflect on the fact that the previous 19mm at aperture 5.6 was as good as the current one at 2.8. At aperture f/8, the usual drop in contrast can be seen (see image 2 and 3).

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    Re: Ultra wide for D800e

    Quote Originally Posted by pophoto View Post
    I see no mention of the 16-35mm lens, I'd be interested to hear how this lens fairs on the D800e with it's zoom versatility.
    +1

    Would love to hear if anyone here has expeience of the 16-35mm.
    I have heard some great reports on it but it never gets any love here.....
    Anyone tried it?

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    Senior Member vieri's Avatar
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    Re: Ultra wide for D800e

    If you are shooting also architecture, I'd say get the 14-24. It's the best corrected of all, while the Zeisses have strange wave distortions to deal with. Or, if you need that capability, get the 24 PC-E (and hope for Nikon to release the long-expected 17mm PC-E)...
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    Re: Ultra wide for D800e

    I have a 16-35 and really love it. A very useful lens. I use it a lot handheld to shoot at low shutterspeed, a bit higher ISO. In software it is well corrected and my copy is also really good in the corners (i use it stopped down somewhat 5.6-8.0). This way I can work fast and still have enough quality. Try doing 20 showrooms in a retail center within an hour and a half and come back with images that can be used in a magazine. This is something I cannot do with the 14-24.

    I can screw a protective filter on it when I get very close in kitchens to boiling stuff. Cleaning off grease from a filter is something I rather do than removing it from the front element.

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    Re: Ultra wide for D800e

    Back when I used to shoot magazine work even the Canon 1D I had was overkill at 4MP, but a 4MP JPEG out of the camera still wasn't so huge as to be a problem in itself. It could easily do full pages and even spreads in a pinch, though 6MP would have been better for a 2-page spread. Those I shot for always specially commissioned spreads though, so it wasn't an issue. I also shot raw but rarely needed them.

    Today I'm confident you could shoot the D800 and get whatever in-camera JPEG is close to 4-6MP at ISO 6400 and possibly 12500 and it would be for all practical purposes flawless. Save raws too though, just in case. Lens also won't matter. If you like the 16-35, use it. If you prefer the 14-24, use that. It will make absolutely no difference.
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    Re: Ultra wide for D800e

    Quote Originally Posted by vieri View Post
    If you are shooting also architecture, I'd say get the 14-24. It's the best corrected of all, while the Zeisses have strange wave distortions to deal with. Or, if you need that capability, get the 24 PC-E (and hope for Nikon to release the long-expected 17mm PC-E)...
    +1! I could make a case "for" and "against any # of ultra wide angle lenses and/or zooms when used on a higher resolution DSLR like the D800/e. Even the best of them has something that can be improved. Besides finding a good sample it also depends on ones intended use.

    After all is said and done, I too feel the 14-24 has far more strengths than negatives and is quite versatile...except for the ability to use filters easily with it.

    I personally was not a fan of the 16-35mm for my particular use which I outlined in depth on a number of occasions (and threads) here on getdpi.

    Dave (D&A)

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    Re: Ultra wide for D800e

    The 14mm comes in a 3 diff brands: Samyang, Bower & Rokinon. Which one to get? I see Guy has the Samyang but am not sure why he got that one. Is one of these brands like the 'parent' company perhaps? Would appreciate some insight as I want one too! Bob

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    Re: Ultra wide for D800e


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    Re: Ultra wide for D800e

    anybody tried the 18-35/3.5-4.5 ?

    From SLRgear.com:
    http://www.slrgear.com/reviews/zsamp...8f80_d800e.jpg

    Thorkil

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    Re: Ultra wide for D800e

    Here are a couple with the Nikon 14-24/2.8G @ 14mm.
    The post in the foreground of the second shot is close enough I could touch it.


    These are scaled at 10% of original size. The original JPG files are ~28Mb.
    No manipulation whatsoever except resizing. Otherwise straight from the camera JPEGs.

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    Re: Ultra wide for D800e

    Here are some crops I have on hand already for the ZF.2 18 on the D800E. It's beyond reproach in the center, even so slightly soft on the edges and a little more so in the corners. The 14-24 at 18mm is slightly better. However, they're so close that the only consideration IMO in which to grab is whether the benefit of the zoom outweighs the benefit of the smaller prime.

    The chair is a little OOF I think, but it also illustrates why I think the extreme corners are relatively unimportant on a lens this wide - it's not someplace you'd put anything that matters. (Longer lenses are a different matter entirely.) But the corners really aren't as bad as some would make them out to be.

    You could probably sharpen these a little more (I only applied a little input USM sharpening at r0.5 using my standard LR settings for the D800E).



    center


    edge


    corner

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    Re: Ultra wide for D800e

    I actually miss my ZF.2 18mm, I preferred it over the 21mm. I'd love the 14-24 Nikon, but without any filter threads, I would never buy it.

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    Re: Ultra wide for D800e

    Quote Originally Posted by johnnygoesdigital View Post
    I'd love the 14-24 Nikon, but without any filter threads, I would never buy it.
    Why not?

    GetDPI is a digital Forum.
    Anything you can do with a filter can be done in Photoshop.

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    Re: Ultra wide for D800e

    Quote Originally Posted by Leigh View Post
    Why not?

    GetDPI is a digital Forum.
    Anything you can do with a filter can be done in Photoshop.

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    Except for ND.

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    Re: Ultra wide for D800e

    Quote Originally Posted by Leigh View Post
    Why not?

    GetDPI is a digital Forum.
    Anything you can do with a filter can be done in Photoshop.

    - Leigh
    The name of the forum is irrelevant to the use of filters, besides, I'm not a photoshop user.
    Photoshop does not protect the lens element from water or objects.

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    Re: Ultra wide for D800e

    THe more I use it, the more I like my 17-35/2.8. Yes, the extreme corners never get crisp, but then I rarely have anything worthwhile in the extreme corners to look at. It is very sharp in the central 2/3rds, even wide open. It is a very useful ultra-to-moderate wide zoom, covering 5 reasonably fast prime wides in a relatively compact unit.
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    Re: Ultra wide for D800e

    I agree with Jack, the 17-35 has easily correctable distortion, low flare and is crisp in everything but the extreme corners. It takes a standard 77mm filter, I use it on both my d800e and d700 and think it is an admirable lens. I would compare its resolution favorably with a micro nikkor. It is an unfussy piece of equipment. I like the 21mm focal length a lot and this lens delivers, at f/8 you have to really be a pixel peeper to see the slight extreme corner softening, it is not a reason not to get the lens. Joe

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    Re: Ultra wide for D800e

    I just replaced my venerable 17-35mm with the new lightweight 18-35mm G, it beat my old lens at every setting except wide open at 35mm end.

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    Re: Ultra wide for D800e

    That 18-35 G looks like a very nice little travel item actually...

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    Re: Ultra wide for D800e

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack View Post
    THe more I use it, the more I like my 17-35/2.8. Yes, the extreme corners never get crisp, but then I rarely have anything worthwhile in the extreme corners to look at. It is very sharp in the central 2/3rds, even wide open. It is a very useful ultra-to-moderate wide zoom, covering 5 reasonably fast prime wides in a relatively compact unit.
    +1! I've been singing the praises of this lens here on Getdpi and elsewhere for quite some time (and posted an overall general review)...whether it's used on a D800 or a 12MP body. All the wide angle zooms have their pluses and minuses but when it comes to one in particular that in my opinion has the best series of compromises for overall strength in as many areas as possible (good central sharpness and contrast, low distortion, overall good performance throughout most of its range, reasonably compact and good handling, easily take filters)...it's hard to beat this one.

    Dave (D&A)

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    Re: Ultra wide for D800e

    Quote Originally Posted by Leigh View Post
    Why not?

    GetDPI is a digital Forum.
    Anything you can do with a filter can be done in Photoshop.

    - Leigh
    Can never duplicate polarization with photoshop or anything else. Nice to see the new fotodiox filter set that has a polarizer and allows simultaneous use of NDs or ND grads. Also allows protective clear filter, and also operates as a beautiful metal lens protector when you add the metal cap. I have decided to go for the 14-24 because of this, as it seems really head and shoulders above the other wide zooms.

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    Re: Ultra wide for D800e

    I use the Zeiss 21. I find the lens correction in ACR completely takes care of the wave distortion. Also Zeiss glass is terrific with colors compared to Nikon alternatives, imo.
    However, if I had the patience to deal with acquiring a Leica 19 R and having it converted for Nikon mount, I would do it. A friend mostly used his Leica 19 on a Canon but wowee that thing was awesome.

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    Re: Ultra wide for D800e

    Quote Originally Posted by thedruid View Post
    I just replaced my venerable 17-35mm with the new lightweight 18-35mm G, it beat my old lens at every setting except wide open at 35mm end.
    I own both lenses and go to the 18-35G more often. Light and compact, great for travel and is as good or better optically than the 17-35. I recently did a shoot for US Dept of Energy up on the Alaska tundra near Barrow and took the 17-35 for its rugged build.

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    Re: Ultra wide for D800e

    Two interesting Nikon / Zeiss 21 comparisons.

    One in which the Zeiss 21 Spanks the 14-24. (The Nikon looks strangely bad in this one ... I've never seen any softness or CA in the center)

    And one in which the 14-24 does the spanking.

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    Re: Ultra wide for D800e

    Quote Originally Posted by Leigh View Post
    Why not?

    GetDPI is a digital Forum.
    Anything you can do with a filter can be done in Photoshop.

    - Leigh
    Let me know if you have a 830nm IR filter plugin.

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    Re: Ultra wide for D800e

    Another Nikon/Zeiss 21 comparison. This one leaning slightly toward Nikon.

    Based on these comparisons, I think optical quality is the least significant distinction between these lenses.

    Zeiss pluses:
    size/weight
    simplicity/robustness of a prime
    less prone to flair
    easy to use filters

    Nikon pluses:
    all the other focal lengths
    less/simpler distortion
    AF

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