Site Sponsors
Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast
Results 1 to 50 of 63

Thread: 28mm for D800(e)?

  1. #1
    Member
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Posts
    32
    Post Thanks / Like

    28mm for D800(e)?

    Hello everybody,

    I have been reading through posts of this forum a bit and recently decided to register. From what I have read so far I am afraid there is no ideal solution to my first question, but I would like to hear your recommendations nevertheless. Similar topics have been discussed here before but maybe somebody has had some new experiences, so here it goes.

    As many others I am looking for a good wideangle lens for my d800e.
    I am looking for a 28mm, if there is a much better alternative in 24mm (or 35mm) I might consider it as well. (I am currently using a 50mm 1.4G which I am very happy with.)

    - I need this lens mainly for landscape photography
    - I am fine with not using the lens below f5.6
    - I am fine with manual focus

    The Nikon 28mm f1.8 would be nice but it has the problem with uneven (shakey/blurry) areas in most of the images I have seen up to f.11 (where they seem to disappear(?)), as well as focus shift issues reported by some.

    The Elmarit-R 28mm (version ii ?) with leitax conversion is often mentioned as pretty good, but some seem to have problems with the mirror hitting the back of the lens. I am not sure I want to dremel a leica lens, but if this is the way to go I might consider it. Can anybody provide full resolution landscape images of a d800 / d800e with said lens? I'd be very interested in these.

    The results I have seen of the Voigtländer Ultron 28mm slII didn't seem too impressive, but if anybody can provide landscape (or cityscape) images at around f8-f11 (or f5.6), I'd be interested as well.

    Same goes for the Zeiss 28mm.

    The Sigma 35mm seems to be a common choice but I the overwhelming evidence about its problems with the d800(e) found across the internet disturbs me.

    So, I'd appreciate if you could share your experiences with the D800/d800e
    and wideangle lenses, especially in 28mm focal length.

    Thanks a lot and best regards,

    Harald

  2. #2
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    23,623
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    2555

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    Hmmm in regard to the Nikon 28mm. I just finished a huge project and used the 28mm a lot. It's actually the only thing I shot with it so far but it seems like a nice lens. The shaky blurry stuff I have not seen. Now my whole shoot was with lights so things are a little softer lighting wise by the soft boxes but all my images look the same and shot with the Sigma 35, Nikon 50 1.4 and Nikon 85 1.8. Now its not as good as the Sigma 35 but its pretty close.
    Here is one shot at F10 at a 1 or 2 second exposure. I'm focused pretty much on the front two people and the rest is background.

    Ill post some more when I get a chance but this is client work so I have to be careful

    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com
    Likes 1 Member(s) liked this post

  3. #3
    Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Varese Italy
    Posts
    226
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    2

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    Full size, focused on gray concrete wall (elmarit 28 type 2 usually does not require shaving, but there are exceptions as you noticed)
    _DSC1322 | Flickr - Photo Sharing!

    Right click over the photo, than ORIGINAL

  4. #4
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    23,623
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    2555

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    I'm going to post this and it is off topic no question. But it's great data for all of us to know and learn.

    A fine member PM'd me about posting a image of all these kids without a released and its a excellent excellent question and hopefully this will keep folks out of trouble. In this shot with the kids they are all minors obviously and with that you absolutely need a release that is signed by there parents or guardians so his question is absolutely correct without a release I can get in serious trouble, lawsuits and all that.

    Now my answer to him is here.


    Actually that is a excellent question and your correct they should not be published anywhere without being released. They are all released though as my client here is the charter school and we released all the kids in all 4 schools we shot. Interesting out of all the schools only about 4 parents would not sign off on the release, so we left those kids out on the shoots. Great question and you are dead on with the release. These are certainly things every shooter should be aware off. I'm going to post this as its great data.

    So lesson here folks don't ever take risks on stuff like this , get a release they are readily available on the net. In this shoot we actually drew up a very specific release for the parents to sign as we needed to cover worldwide distribution. This job is a national ad campaign so we need to cover everything that these images can be used for.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com
    Likes 1 Member(s) liked this post

  5. #5
    Member
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Posts
    32
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    Hello Guy,

    thanks for the feedback on the Nikon 28mm. The image quality in this shot looks great, no doubt. It is only at 100% that I see the blurry areas in the test shots I have examined. As an example I hope it is ok if I link to a full size file on the cameralabs flickr page.

    All sizes | Nikon AF-S 28f1.8G @f5.6 52880 | Flickr - Photo Sharing!

    If you scroll to the very bottom left of the image, then scroll right until you see the lilac flowers and then go up until you see the house+trees just above lilac flowers - there you can see it. it looks like camera shake, but most other parts of the image are fine.

    I have witnessed this in many pictures by a few different people, the shakey area(s) are always roughly in the same spots though.

    I am sure I am guilty of pixel peeping here, but I would like to to print at a maximum size and then this will show.

    What I see (and sometimes stronger than in this image) is probably the field curvature that was mentioned by some in the earlier topic about the 28mm 1.8g by Tim Ashley.

  6. #6
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    23,623
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    2555

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    We do need to understand this lens does certainly have field curvature so this maybe exactly what you are seeing and most lenses will have this in the wides. A great lens is the Zeiss 25mm F2 which unfortunately I just sold so i can get a Leica 19mm but I would like to get that lens back again soon when more money comes in. I found it maybe the best wide in that focal length. Now you are running into the same issues we all are having is wide angles in 35mm specifically Nikon mounts. All the zooms are okay and at 28mm the 24-70 is pretty good and my bet so is the 16-35 but if your picky like me especially for landscape type work when detail is important than we have to dig deeper into the quality issue. I bought the Nikon 28mm more for PR type work like we see here where corners are less meaningful. Now when I hit the road for landscape this lens may stay home as the Leica 19mm and Sigma 35mm are better. I kind of have two sets of lenses. The Zeiss 28mm F2 was a okay lens but the 25mm F2 is actually better than the 21mm , yea i know going against the great 21mm but its is a newer design and I found just lovely of a lens. But your asking great questions here as we are all running into this as pixel peepers. LOL

    The Zeiss 35mm F2 is also good but again I think the Sigma is better and at 1.4 just outstanding for a lens wide open. That right there is hard to beat. The Zeiss 35mm F2 is excellent though. You may want to think about 24/25 and the 50 kit as a option. The Nikon 24mm 1.4 is also a very good lens. Unfortunately you just may have to gap like this 24/25 , 50mm. Hell if you can swing it financially the Zeiss 25mm and Sigma 35mm would be a great setup.

    I'm going to go eventually to the Leica 19mm, buy the Zeiss 25 again, Sigma 35mm, 50 1.4 and 85 1.8 as my landscape, high quality kit. Right now I need something over 85 and I may just buy the Sigma 150 again. Im spoiled I had the 200 F2 and there is nothing out there like it in that area . I am not a big zoom guy
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

  7. #7
    Member
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Posts
    32
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    Hello Sergio, thank you for the example shot, it looks good.
    Do you have one with say f8-f11 as well? Maybe something more landscape-ish (without objects in close distance), so I can relate to how it would look in the way I want to use it?

    Guy, that's good advice to be careful, I wonder how this is handled over here in europe.

    Best regards,

    Harald

  8. #8
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    23,623
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    2555

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    I also been thinking about the Leica R 28mm as well as i shot that years ago and really liked it.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

  9. #9
    Member
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Posts
    32
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    Guy, I will look for samples of the 25mm Zeiss. I would prefer to go wider than 28 rather than towards 35, so this might be interesting. I see the price is „zeissy“ as well, but I assume it is an absolute bargain compared to the new generation of zeiss lenses coming soon for probably something around twice-thrice that much..

    Do you (or does anybody) have an example shot in full res of the 25mm zf.2 f/2 ? Landscape would be great or something like it.

    Thanks for the replies!!

  10. #10
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    23,623
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    2555

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    See if I can find some
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

  11. #11
    Member Y Sol's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Netherlands/Germany
    Posts
    164
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    I had the Elmarit 28mm V2 and used it on the D3x.
    Unfortunately I sold the lens 2 years ago.
    I would love to use it on the D800. It's a fantastic lens.
    Here is a shot with the D3x @ f8 and some details at 100%.
    There was no lens correction in this shot.





    Likes 3 Member(s) liked this post

  12. #12
    Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Varese Italy
    Posts
    226
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    2

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    Harald,
    not exactly what you asked for...

    _DSC1331 | Flickr - Photo Sharing!

    _DSC1398 | Flickr - Photo Sharing!

    This elmarit has a slight field curvature, that can be seen at 2,8/4, but it is
    not, as often happens with wides, concave, but convex. Convex is much easier to compensate, as it is enough to slightly front focus the center, and than stop down.
    Likes 1 Member(s) liked this post

  13. #13
    Senior Member BSEH's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    Copenhagen
    Posts
    290
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    this is my old 28 / 2.8 Zeiss C/Y leitax .. on D700 not tested on my D800 yet..

    Likes 2 Member(s) liked this post

  14. #14
    Member
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Posts
    32
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    Thank you all for posting these pictures, much appreciated and very helpful. Indeed these show off the quality of the elmarit-r on the d800. Will do some research on how to get around field curvature next as well as trying to find some more 28mm elmarit-r images taken with the d800(e) as well as 25mm zf.2 images.

    From the first impression both of these lenses seem to work very well on the d800(e) and will much likely satisfy my needs. I'll see if I come across one of them in the near future. (hunting mode: switched to on.)

  15. #15
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Brooklyn, NYC
    Posts
    333
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    Guy, I'm almost 100% certain there is no issue with photgraphing minors for this sort of use. The laws for model releases are the same for minors as for adults, with the exception of who needs to sign. The law concerns commercial purposes, not editorial or artistic.

    New Jersey is considering a law banning the photographing (not just publishing) of minors without parental consent. This is similar to the crazy French law prohibiting photographing anyone anywhere with out permission. But unless this law passes, you don't have to worry.

    That being said, you can sue anyone for anything. The laws can be stacked against the plaintif; it doesn't stop them for causing defendants an expensive and ugly headache.

  16. #16
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    23,623
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    2555

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    Actually these are for commercial use. They are not editorial in nature.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

  17. #17
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Doug from East TN
    Posts
    482
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    I can't wait to try a 28mm 1.4d I have coming soon, on a D800E I have coming soon as well, it may take me 1-2 weeks to get everything in here. To me, the IQ of the 28 1.4 was always superb. I owned one, and then sold it, like an idiot. I am correcting two wrongs I did, selling that and my 58mm 1.2 noct. I have the noct replaced now with a very nice copy, and now the 28 1.4 has fallen into place. Unexpectedly I might add. I cannot wait.

    Doug

  18. #18
    Member
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Posts
    32
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    Hello Doug,

    a couple of full res shots of the 28mm 1.4 on the d800e would be greatly appreciated, once you get the lens and the camera. With distant subjects, if possible, this would be very interesting! Sounds like an excellent setup that you will have there, quite sought after as well.

  19. #19
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Doug from East TN
    Posts
    482
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    It will be interesting to see. I actually just accidentally found a deal I could put together for one. Oh, it's not the perfect one, no box, it's an import vs a US lens. But I am hopeful, that it will function well for a long time. It has the crack on the focus selection ring as well, like my last one did. I sold my last lens, regretably along with a Noct about the same time. I have recently already corrected the wrong of selling the Noct. In a week or two, hopefully the second mistake will be corrected. lol.

    Oh, there will be test shots for sure. I will try and post back results.
    I always loved the 28 1.4 rendering. Such a fine lens. and how good were Nikon's 2nd generation pro bodies, the D2X series camera? Well, pretty darn good.

    This brings back memories, my first 28 1.4 on a D2Xs series camera:
    .8 sec @ F9


    I actually have a 2nd version of below I like the framing better, but the water looks best in this shot, so I showed it for the detail up front with the rocks and dead tree. I always thought it was amazing. Tri-pod and release used for sure.

    .45 seconds @ F9


    Doug

  20. #20
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Costa Rica, central america
    Posts
    319
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    Quote Originally Posted by Photojazz View Post
    It will be interesting to see. I actually just accidentally found a deal I could put together for one. Oh, it's not the perfect one, no box, it's an import vs a US lens. But I am hopeful, that it will function well for a long time. It has the crack on the focus selection ring as well, like my last one did. I sold my last lens, regretably along with a Noct about the same time. I have recently already corrected the wrong of selling the Noct. In a week or two, hopefully the second mistake will be corrected. lol.

    Oh, there will be test shots for sure. I will try and post back results.
    I always loved the 28 1.4 rendering. Such a fine lens. and how good were Nikon's 2nd generation pro bodies, the D2X series camera? Well, pretty darn good.

    This brings back memories, my first 28 1.4 on a D2Xs series camera:
    .8 sec @ F9


    I actually have a 2nd version of below I like the framing better, but the water looks best in this shot, so I showed it for the detail up front with the rocks and dead tree. I always thought it was amazing. Tri-pod and release used for sure.

    .45 seconds @ F9


    Doug
    Nice good old days. I remember back then, the progress from one camera to the other was amazing , and I dreamed and dreamed about a good 24mp full frame camera as I struggled with a point and shoot, after my analog camera was stolen. Good art was done with digital, but resistance remained high.

    Good capture.

    Back on topic. I have been pondering about the new Nikon 24mm (my Nikon is a D600 prosumer). I like that is very lineal compared to the zooms (14-24 and 24-70). Why the inclination towards the 28mm?. I also love that is a good tool for street photography as it is fast.

    I have zero experience with the 28 so it's not a suggestion, but a simple question.

    Thanks,

    jduncan

  21. #21
    Super Duper
    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    3,676
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    Quote Originally Posted by Photojazz View Post
    I can't wait to try a 28mm 1.4d I have coming soon, on a D800E I have coming soon as well, it may take me 1-2 weeks to get everything in here. To me, the IQ of the 28 1.4 was always superb. I owned one, and then sold it, like an idiot. I am correcting two wrongs I did, selling that and my 58mm 1.2 noct. I have the noct replaced now with a very nice copy, and now the 28 1.4 has fallen into place. Unexpectedly I might add. I cannot wait.

    Doug
    The Nikon 28mm f1.4D was always a favorite of mine but there is a tremendous amount of variability in performance between samples. I've written about it in a past Getdpi post. It has very film like qualities and a rendering that's both sharp and pleasing to the eye.

    Dave (D&A)

  22. #22
    Super Duper
    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    3,676
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    I'm going to post this and it is off topic no question. But it's great data for all of us to know and learn.

    A fine member PM'd me about posting a image of all these kids without a released and its a excellent excellent question and hopefully this will keep folks out of trouble. In this shot with the kids they are all minors obviously and with that you absolutely need a release that is signed by there parents or guardians so his question is absolutely correct without a release I can get in serious trouble, lawsuits and all that.

    Now my answer to him is here.


    Actually that is a excellent question and your correct they should not be published anywhere without being released. They are all released though as my client here is the charter school and we released all the kids in all 4 schools we shot. Interesting out of all the schools only about 4 parents would not sign off on the release, so we left those kids out on the shoots. Great question and you are dead on with the release. These are certainly things every shooter should be aware off. I'm going to post this as its great data.

    So lesson here folks don't ever take risks on stuff like this , get a release they are readily available on the net. In this shoot we actually drew up a very specific release for the parents to sign as we needed to cover worldwide distribution. This job is a national ad campaign so we need to cover everything that these images can be used for.
    Excellent advice regardless of the laws that exist in a particular locale, especially when it concerns minors. I often have to watch the same issues when photographing well known recognizable public individuals and performers and that's why as much as I'd like to post some of my more desirable material here and elsewhere, I don't. If in doubt, it's best to err on the conservative side. Often times even when it might appear to be OK to post certain images, it's sometimes appropriate to defer out of courtesy to a client or known individual.

    I've often photographed in similar type settings as Guy and even when releases and permission is obtained, I proceed with caution.

    Dave (D&A)

  23. #23
    Super Duper
    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    3,676
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lightleak View Post
    Hello Guy,

    thanks for the feedback on the Nikon 28mm. The image quality in this shot looks great, no doubt. It is only at 100% that I see the blurry areas in the test shots I have examined. As an example I hope it is ok if I link to a full size file on the cameralabs flickr page.

    All sizes | Nikon AF-S 28f1.8G @f5.6 52880 | Flickr - Photo Sharing!

    If you scroll to the very bottom left of the image, then scroll right until you see the lilac flowers and then go up until you see the house+trees just above lilac flowers - there you can see it. it looks like camera shake, but most other parts of the image are fine.

    I have witnessed this in many pictures by a few different people, the shakey area(s) are always roughly in the same spots though.

    I am sure I am guilty of pixel peeping here, but I would like to to print at a maximum size and then this will show.

    What I see (and sometimes stronger than in this image) is probably the field curvature that was mentioned by some in the earlier topic about the 28mm 1.8g by Tim Ashley.
    Although not always appearing the same as in the example you posted with the 28mm f1.8 lens, the zone of blurriness reminds me of something similar I've seen in some modern moderate wide angle fixed focal length and aspherical lenses. Most notable of these was one of the first wide angle to telephoto zooms, the Tamron 35-105 f2.8 lens. It often had zones of blurs randomly in the images it produced. It may be due to the pouting of the resin of the aspherical element.

    Another strange example of random zones of blurriness (often seen at 100%), derived from Pentax's 35mm f3.5 645 lens. I've seen this in quite a few samples of this lens and wrote about it in length in the comprehensive lens tests of Pentax 645 lenses here on Getdpi. Again it may be attribued to the pouring of resin for the aspherical element.

    Dave (D&A)

  24. #24
    Member
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Posts
    32
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    Hi Dave, yes, the blurry areas are indeed located very randomly across the image. I have no real idea of how lenses nowadays are produced, but I have heard about problems due to the resin coating on lenses.

    I guess one has to be really deep into this topic to understand why a lens manufacturer would pour plastic over their glass.

  25. #25
    Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    SF Bay Area
    Posts
    55
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    Let's see:
    - You're okay with manual focus
    - You're okay with stopping the aperture down

    Did I miss it? No one recommended the 28mm f/2.8 Ais?
    The 28mm f/2.8 Ai is good also, but doesn't have CRC (Close Range Correction).

  26. #26
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Doug from East TN
    Posts
    482
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    I like the 28 1.4 rendering, as mentioned. I'm not sure how much I will like it on the D800E, we'll see. I don't even know that my copy will be up with what I had. All is variable. I saw it as a very artistic tool, so having it, if I get a good one, in addition to the 24 1.4G is not a bad thing. The day when having to much fast glass is a problem, is a day I look forward to. lol.

    The sharpness of the rocks, the wood, in my shot above amaze me. That was one of the things I always felt the 28 1.4D was very good at. I've also seen some very artsy stuff with it. So, that's the appeal for THAT 28, I can't say about the others in Nikon.

  27. #27
    Workshop Member glenerrolrd's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Jupiter FL/Atlanta GA
    Posts
    2,279
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    The 28mm FOV is my most used lens in both my M and D800E kits . My applications are primarily street and travel and I am rarely looking for the absolute best for landscape . But I do appreciate the differences in lens design. Most of my work has the subject inside 20 Ft often near 6ft ...but the wide angle provides necessary context . Required DOF is always a consideration .

    The faster lenses rarely provide a flat field ..but I draw a distinction between field curvature and edge sharpness ...I don t shoot much of anything "flat" but I do use the edges .

    The best 28 that I ve found for the D800E is the Leica R 28/2.8 V2 . It does suffer from some field curvature but it has the advantage of floating elements making sharpness inside 5ft just excellent . It handles beautifully on the D800E (without a battery pack) . Built in hood ,small form,short throw . I place a large emphasis on color rendering and to my eye the Leica R has the most universally pleasing .

    I ve tried the 28/2 ZF and the 28/1.8 Nikkor both have different signatures ...the zeiss could work but is an older design with plenty of aberrations ...the 28/1.8 has been discussed . The 24/1.4 Nikkor was better than either the 28/2 zf or the 28/1.8 by a noticeable margin in my tests . I just acquired Guy s 25/2 ZF.2 as the limitations of the 28/2.8 R are (1) speed ...I need a f2 or F1.4 lens and (2) 24 is a little better for street than 28 .

    I don t know of any 28 for the Nikon mount that is known for producing a flat field .

  28. #28
    Subscriber Member Jorgen Udvang's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Pratamnak
    Posts
    9,347
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    2157

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    I'm using the 28mm f/2.0 AIS, but haven't posted on this thread until now for one reason: The OP mentions landscape photography, and this lens, or at least my copy, isn't ideal for that. It's in no way ultimately sharp, and the more modern 28/1.8 AF-S runs circles around it. For other purposes, like environmental portraits, it's excellent. It has a very "charming" rendering and a bokeh that borders to fairytale soft, particularly in the transitions. Must be said though that I haven't tried it on more than 12MP (D700). Here's a sample wide open at ISO 6400:


  29. #29
    Subscriber Member tashley's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    South of England
    Posts
    3,295
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    The 28 1.8g has a wavy field of focus, which is why some areas can appear blurry even if you get the edges and centre sharp. It is inherent in the design of a fast wide which is light and moderately inexpensive. It generally doesn't show up in tests because most tests re-focus for each part of the frame. Nikon only publishes F1.8 MTF data for this lens so this is conjecture but I am pretty certain I am right. But it isn't unusual: even the 35mm lens on the Sony RX-1, a truly brilliant lens, has the same thing. So does the Leica 35 Lux FLE, depending on how you focus it....
    Likes 1 Member(s) liked this post

  30. #30
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    23,623
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    2555

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    For me the Nikon 28mm 1.8 will be more my PR lens than anything else. Great for grip and grin crap which pays the bills around here. I have the Leica 19 and the Sigma 35mm but my next lens for real type work is the Leica 28mm if I can find one for good money or get my Zeiss 25 f2 again. I honestly hated selling it but the Leica 19 came up and as usual I was caught with my pants down with immediate money to get the 19 so the 25 had to go. I think its the best in that 24/25 range.

    The 28mm helped me do that big gig and I'm mostly pleased with the results but I know there are better lenses. It's hard to sneak a decent lens by me when I usually have the best I can get my hands on.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

  31. #31
    Subscriber Member tashley's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    South of England
    Posts
    3,295
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    I agree with Guy: this is an incredibly good lens for many sorts of work and it seems to AF well too. The problems are related to its use for things such as landscape and architecture, where the soft zones will show up and where the wavy field makes it hard to focus of-centre subjects using F&R and where the camera in question might not be very good with anything but the central bank of AF sensels. The one qualification I would add is that despite a wavy sub-shape, the field of focus is fundamentally cone-shaped and this can make for a really useful landscape lens when used in portrait orientation or when photographing things such as alleys of trees or buildings in landscape orientation.

    It's a good default assumption that we want flat field lenses but in the real world, subject shapes very often are better served by other 'shapes' of lens.

  32. #32
    Subscriber robsteve's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    1,202
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    496

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    If you just want it for landscape, the Leica 21-35mm is probably the best lens on a digital sensor. Since it is a modern design, it doesn't have the field curvature that the Leica 28mm has and performs as well, maybe better across the frame. It is also better than all the fixed R lenses in its range. On the D800E it will hit the mirror from about 23mm, but you can zoom to the 24mm setting, go to live view and with the mirror up, shoot in the widest focal lengths.

    Here is the 21-35mm in the 21mm setting. What looks like red vignetting, is just the red brick underneath the white paint. This was Guy's lens originally.



    Cropped in to show the detail.


  33. #33
    Member
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Posts
    32
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    The wavy field of focus really disqualifies the 28mm 1.8 for my intended use as landscape lens. As nice the weight and price, however unpleasant are the smeary areas appearing occasionally. As you have shown it will work nicely as a lens for different tasks, but since I am looking for something to photograph landscapes this will not satisfy me.

    So I guess I will be looking at something a bit wider, say 24mm or 25mm.
    So far the Zeiss 25mm looks good, I would love to see more full res samples though.
    The nikon 24mm 1.4 doesn't do too well on a d3x, if we are to believe photozone.

    Is there any other good 24mm lens for the d800e I am not aware of?
    Maybe the 24mm pc-e in unshifted position? How does that compare to the zeiss 25mm at around f8- f11, does anybody have any experiences with that?

    Thank you all for your great input to this thread.

  34. #34
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Doug from East TN
    Posts
    482
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    not really good lighting in the sky, I left polarizer in the car, might have helped a bit. 28 1.4D on D800E: Had a break in the rain, so went down to the quarry lake to shoot a little. But it was just to humid to stay out long.

    /M-TP240/MM+Luxious trinity(24:35:50) + 75 2.0 APO ASPH Cron + Nikon D3X/D700, 58 1.2 noct, 28 1.4d,200VR + Zeiss 35/50/100 + 135mm 2.0 DC, 17-35/24-70/70-200VRII, Einstein studio...

  35. #35
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    23,623
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    2555

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    Quote Originally Posted by robsteve View Post
    If you just want it for landscape, the Leica 21-35mm is probably the best lens on a digital sensor. Since it is a modern design, it doesn't have the field curvature that the Leica 28mm has and performs as well, maybe better across the frame. It is also better than all the fixed R lenses in its range. On the D800E it will hit the mirror from about 23mm, but you can zoom to the 24mm setting, go to live view and with the mirror up, shoot in the widest focal lengths.

    Here is the 21-35mm in the 21mm setting. What looks like red vignetting, is just the red brick underneath the white paint. This was Guy's lens originally.



    Cropped in to show the detail.

    Lol I want it back
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

  36. #36
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Doug from East TN
    Posts
    482
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    I think this shot through my back yard may show the 28 1.4 on the D800 even better. Great definition on the trees:

    /M-TP240/MM+Luxious trinity(24:35:50) + 75 2.0 APO ASPH Cron + Nikon D3X/D700, 58 1.2 noct, 28 1.4d,200VR + Zeiss 35/50/100 + 135mm 2.0 DC, 17-35/24-70/70-200VRII, Einstein studio...

  37. #37
    Sr. Administrator Jack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Los Altos, CA
    Posts
    10,486
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    1031

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jorgen Udvang View Post
    I haven't posted on this thread until now for one reason: The OP mentions landscape photography, and this lens, or at least my copy, isn't ideal for that. It's in no way ultimately sharp, and the more modern 28/1.8 AF-S runs circles around it.
    Great answer! Speaking for myself, I am tired of searching for "perfection" in optical performance. Crap -- excuse me, aberrations -- we see at 100% in the very corners of our D800 files very often won't even go noticed in a print, and if they do, it often is in a place that doesn't matter to the image at all. Heck, I have pinhole images hung in my office and get as many comments as my optically perfect ones do. My current Nikon 28 is the lowly 17-35/2.8 zoom OR the 24-120 -- neither are what I'd call stellar, but they get used a lot. In fact, they are clearly my two WORST lenses, and just as clearly are both my MOST OFTEN USED lenses. Go figure.
    /rant
    Jack
    home: www.getdpi.com

    "Perfection is not attainable. But if we chase perfection, we can catch excellence."

  38. #38
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Brooklyn, NYC
    Posts
    333
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    Perfection is spelled P-A-R-A-L-Y-S-I-S, as Winston Churchill said.

    Nevertheless, there are different degrees of imperfection, and some crap/aberrations are more annoying than others.

    The challenging thing for me with wide angle lenses is they tend to be prone to astygmatism, which reveals itself as smeared detail in the corners. I find this visually jarring. Detail that is symmetrically soft (but soft to the same degree) might not call attention to itself at all.

    My most used lens bugs me with astigmatism unless I'm careful about the aperture when I certain kinds of detail in the corners. I often accept a little diffraction in order to get rid of a lot of smearing.

  39. #39
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    23,623
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    2555

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    My extreme wide is probaly my most concerned lens to the corners. Right now I have the Leica 19mm but I'm viewing more as a 20 or 21 mm lens. I knew that going in my deep corners will have some trouble. To me that's perfectly fine as its better than both the Zeiss 21 and 18 plus a lot less disortion issues. After that I'm not really stressing over perfect corners but more after the look of the lenses. To me that is more my concern. I do have to work slightly harder on the same project using the various brands of lenses on it but its not a lot of work given these lenses I view as my best solutions. Today I shot the 85 1.8 g lens than added some 135Mm DC lens shots which come up just slightly more yellow but I just balance them out to match. Both lenses are about identical in optical quality which is extremely good. In this case with 28mm the 1.8 is a capable lens but like any lens test it know its traits and work its pluses when shooting. All these years I still test every lens and figure out how it preforms so I know exactly what I have in my hands. As someone that works for pay I owe that to my clients. But I agree corner sharpness is really overrated as really most of the time in a lot of shooting it mostly is not even a factor but having one or two you can count one when needed is just fine for me
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

  40. #40
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Doug from East TN
    Posts
    482
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    The 17-35 2.8 was no slouch on my D2X series cameras. I miss that lens, it was always a favorite. I tried to buy a mint one recently, but he backed out at the last minute. I'm not sure how well it will keep up with the demands of the D800E, but I thought it would be fun to try it, and use on my D700 even. I'll keep my eye open later for one. I'm spent right now.

  41. #41
    Super Duper
    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    3,676
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    Photojazz, quite some time ago I did a write-up (on Getdpi) of my initial test and impressions of the Nikon 17-35mm f2.8 on the D800e. I don't have the link at the moment but a search might find it.

    We all should keep in mind that some of the many lenses we're describing that have soft/smeared corners on the D800/E don't necessarily have quite the same degree of softness when used on a lower pixel density DSLR. I mention this as sometimes a lens is described as being soft on the corners, when it's not so much the lens as the senor it's used on. Thats why so many wide angle lenses these days seem to fail what some would consider the ultimate test when used on the D800/e...namely corner sharpness.

    Dave (D&A)

  42. #42
    Member
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Posts
    32
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    I agree with all of you that it doesn't make sense to look for perfection, but maybe for the best compromise. Of course that compromise will be based on the priorities of the user, for me and evenly spread relative sharpness without random blurry areas are important.
    Corner softness /abberation is a reality and I am fine with it. I would gladly sacrifice the fastness (as well as the lack of vignetting) for a good landscape lens. Say something starting at f4 or f5.6. I believe Tim has wished for something similar.

    Photojazz, these images look really impressive. I only wish I could look at one in 100% size, because at the size shown I think most of the lenses will shine. I would be very thankful if you could share an example of that combination (d800+24f1.8) at original size and something around f8 - f11. I wouldn't mind if it only shows an ugly street or anything really if it barely resembles something like landscape distance-of-subject-wise.

    24mm would be a wonderful focal length. At the moment I think I would even prefer it to 28.

    Best regards!

  43. #43
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Doug from East TN
    Posts
    482
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    Lightleak,

    If I get a FTP client on this machine, maybe I can pop one up on my server for a day or two. I'll let you know when that happens.

    I sent Zenfolio a sizzling message about what they are doing to us as photographers to share our craft. If we cannot show someone an image at original size, no way you can see the detail. I even just tried a crop, what do they do? They base the image on the same screwy idea of blocking the two largest images of the crop!!! That means blocking an image less than 1000 pixels wide.

    If you are a Zenfolio customer, please complain as I did.

    Doug
    Last edited by Photojazz; 4th June 2013 at 18:06.
    /M-TP240/MM+Luxious trinity(24:35:50) + 75 2.0 APO ASPH Cron + Nikon D3X/D700, 58 1.2 noct, 28 1.4d,200VR + Zeiss 35/50/100 + 135mm 2.0 DC, 17-35/24-70/70-200VRII, Einstein studio...

  44. #44
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    23,623
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    2555

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    Happened to test the Nikon 28mm 1.8 this morning while doing another lens test. Full image than center crops













    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com
    Likes 1 Member(s) liked this post

  45. #45
    Super Duper
    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    3,676
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    Although it's a bit like comparing apples to oranges (due obviously to different focal lengths, camera to subject distance etc.) it's interesting to compare (f-stop for f-stop) these latest Nikon 28mm f1.9 shots with similar ones you took with the Leica 19mm.

    Dave (D&A)

  46. #46
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    23,623
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    2555

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    The Leica 19mm is far better. I have more images to compare and post but the 28 is a little disappointing compared to the 19mm.

    Okay here is the upper left crops and these are not too bad. Im more disappointed in the center crops. I shot another scene and the center does not look anything like the Leica 19mm until F8 and the Leica at 2.8. Yea not sure what that is about . I did live view and focused manually but I could feel elements shifting when focusing manually. It was a bit odd because on AF i did a big job with this lens and my results where good not Sigma 35mm 1.4 good but nice.

    Maybe I have a weird copy. Seriously I am getting sick and tired of bum lenses that show up at my door and need 3 copies to get a good one.











    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com
    Likes 1 Member(s) liked this post

  47. #47
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    23,623
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    2555

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    F5.6 is respectable.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

  48. #48
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    23,623
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    2555

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    Okay this test is pretty much the same framing just moving back for the 28mm. These are at 5.6







    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com
    Likes 1 Member(s) liked this post

  49. #49
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    23,623
    Post Thanks / Like
    Images
    2555

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    Yea the Leica 19mm just smokes it. Which in a way is awesome. I spent a lot of money on the 19mm and I'm thrilled at the results but on the same hand the 28mm should be better here. I dont like hanging my hat on one test but I shot 2 tests this morning one in this scene and the other at the furniture store wall. Same center results.

    Why I have not recommended this lens for landscape. PR work okay but its not as critical as some others in this class. Now I will stand corrected if there is a better copy out there. My rant here

    Nikon wake the **** up. You can't be sending Pros out the door with **** lenses. I'm tired of going through three just to get one.

    Rant off and sorry for my cursing, Im from Jersey its just my vocabulary. LOL
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

  50. #50
    Super Duper
    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    3,676
    Post Thanks / Like

    Re: 28mm for D800(e)?

    Guy Wrote--->>>>"The Leica 19mm is far better. I have more images to compare and post but the 28 is a little disappointing compared to the 19mm."<<<<

    That's what I was getting at Guy. Although we're comparing a 19mm lens with a 28mm focal length (hence my comments about comparing apples and oranges), my initial impressions from your earlier postings was that the 19mm was clearly superior to the Nikon both centrally and in the corners. It was quite obvious. Whether it's your particular Nikon sample or not, my gut tells me many samples of Nikon's 28mm f1.9's have weak areas.

    Dave (D&A)

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •