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Nikon Flash for dummies

Chris C

Member
......otherwise useless popup flash.........
This cannot go unchallenged. I would recommend Nikon for it's easy flash above any other virtues, and the pop-up flash is an important link in the flash set-up providing you use it as a Commander control for one [or more] 600/800/900 flashguns.

Here's my recommendation; get the flash off the camera, preferably on a light stand, have the flash firing through a 'shoot through' umbrella, and control the flash exposure from the camera using the rear thumbwheel. For this way of controlled flash shooting [I like gentle flash, use it in addition to ambient light] the pop-up is a fantastic resource; fabulous rather than useless.

.............. Chris
 

etrigan63

Active member
Chris,
I find it a mite difficult to to mingle and shoot in an informal setting dragging around a flash umbrella. Tends to poke people in the eyes. Sometimes even using a flashgun (600/800/900 or, in my case, Metz 58A-1) can get a little obtrusive.

In my case, I have two choices:
  1. Use my M8 - which is fine if I am not shooting moving objects (I am not quick on the manual focus) or
  2. Take the MB-D10 off of my D300, slap on my 35mm f2 and use the popup flash. The Puffer makes it quite usable.

It's use in Commander mode is unquestionable - utterly priceless. As a light source by itself, not so much without help.
 

Lars

Active member
I have an SU-800 Commander that I got for my D2x. The D2x got replaced by a D300, so I had a chance to test the range of the SU-800 against the D300 popup in commander mode. Range was roughly equal.

The SU-800 is essentially a flash with an infrared flash cover. I also tested the SU-800 range with the infrared cover removed - got perhaps 10-15% more range but not more than that.
 

Chris C

Member
.....It's use in Commander mode is unquestionable - utterly priceless. As a light source by itself, not so much without help.
Carlos - I think we mostly agree. It's true of course that 'remote' firing is more work; but boy is it easy compared to shooting film with off-camera flash. Being able to thumb-wheel control flash output from the viewfinder readout is fabulous too. Perhaps, on reflection; poking people in the eye with an umbrella prong is best avoided.

..... SU-800 against the D300 popup in commander mode. Range was roughly equal...... SU-800.. perhaps 10-15% more range......
Lars - I'm grateful to you for stating this, it's the first time I've seen the comparison in print and I would have expected the SU-800 to give more.

............. Chris
 

Lars

Active member
Lars - I'm grateful to you for stating this, it's the first time I've seen the comparison in print and I would have expected the SU-800 to give more.
Yes it's a bit underwhelming considering the price tag on the SU-800. However, it does have it's niche: on D2/D3 series without popup flash, plus it's much less blinding if you're shooting portraits. I can't help wondering why Nikon hasn't produced an RF system though - IR line of sight can be a bit of a limitation especially outdoors in strong sunlight. Apart from that it's a remarkably good flash system considering the cost and portability.
 
R

Ranger 9

Guest
One point in favor of the SU-800 vs. using the built-in flash as a CLS controller is that if you're shooting at wide apertures and close distances, the built-in flash will make a visible contribution to the light in the scene. You'll notice extra catchlights, shadows, and reflections in shiny objects. This is true of any flash-controlled wireless TTL system, not just Nikon's, and there's no way to avoid it: the "start" pulse happens before the shutter opens, but the "stop" pulse to terminate flash exposure has to happen while the shutter is still open.

I don't have an SU-800 yet, but I've had this problem often enough that I plan to get one eventually.
 

etrigan63

Active member
For the record, you can set the popup flash not to fire and still control off camera flashes. I did this for a photo shoot of a cabin up in North Carolina last November.
 
R

Ranger 9

Guest
For the record, you can set the popup flash not to fire and still control off camera flashes. I did this for a photo shoot of a cabin up in North Carolina last November.
No, it still fires even if it's set to be used only as the controller. The way it controls the off-camera flashes is by emitting short flash bursts that act as control pulses; the spacing and timing of the control pulses transmits the info to the off-camera units.

The pre-exposure control pulses are sent just before the camera shutter opens, so have no effect on the exposure. But the pulses that tell the off-camera units to terminate their output happen while the shutter is open; there's no way to avoid that, because the shutter has to be open while the off-camera units are firing, and it's the termination pulse that tells them to stop firing.

Super-crude ASCII representation of what's happening:

******************************************[open]
Camera shutter: ---------| |------------

Remote units: _______/---------------\__________

Commander: ____^^___________^____________
[start] [stop]

The control pulses are very short and very low in power, so it's true you won't notice them in most moderate-aperture, medium-distance shooting. But if you're shooting at wide apertures and close distances, the control pulses can still contribute enough to the exposure to be visible.

But don't take my word for it; prove it to yourself. Set up a shot with remote flashes and your on-camera flash set to commander-only mode. Include a mirror in the scene, angled so the camera will be visible in the shot. (Don't have the camera pointing straight into the mirror or it'll throw off your exposure.) Then take the shot and look at the result. You'll see the on-camera flash is firing during the exposure; what's showing up in the picture is the control pulse that tells the off-camera units to stop firing.

Incidentally, don't blame Nikon for this; all manufacturers' off-camera TTL systems work the same way, via control pulses emitted from the commander unit. (If I recall correctly, Minolta invented this concept and Olympus, under license, was the first to use it in a camera system.)


The SU-800 works exactly the same way; the only difference is that it's got an IR filter over its flash tube so it doesn't emit visible light. As Chris said, putting an IR filter over the built-in flash does the same thing. The remote units are IR-filtered (that's the dark plastic lens over the sensor "eye") so there will be little or no effect on range.

Old trick: If you've still got a box of Kodachrome slides somewhere with the black leader still stuck in the box (labs used to include the cut-off leader in case there were partial exposures on it) the black piece makes a pretty good IR filter; Kodachrome dyes were formulated to stop visible light but pass infrared, so they wouldn't heat up as quickly in the projector.
 
R

Ranger 9

Guest
Sorry, my ASCII picture didn't turn out too well because the spaces got truncated. The picture should show that the camera shutter remains open until AFTER the remote units have received the termination pulse from the controller and stopped firing.
 
O

Oxide Blu

Guest
I can't help wondering why Nikon hasn't produced an RF system though - IR line of sight can be a bit of a limitation especially outdoors in strong sunlight.
Part of the problem is the freqs available. Different countries have diff freqs reserved for diff applications. Apparently there is no one universal freq that can be used. Reference the Radio Popper.
 

etrigan63

Active member
O.B. is correct. The use of radio frequencies is controlled by the government Communications Bureaus. Aside from international military channels, how a country use radio frequencies is entirely up to them. No one has succeeded in allocating a certain frequency range for remote control operation because there is no money in it. Or more correctly, no one is willing to fork over enough cash to get everyone to agree on a standard.
 
P

peby

Guest
The caucasian fellow looks like the "Predator" has a lock on him.
 
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etrigan63

Active member
Except that I ran out of hands at holding the camera and controlling the zoom. I'm all for economizing, but sometimes folks can go too far...

 
O

Oxide Blu

Guest
If you want to save a few bux, take a piece of that white foam packing material that's used for damage control in shipping and place a layer or two over the flash.
Makes a great diffuser. :)
You need to be really careful about what you out over the output of a strobe. I took a sheet of Lee 87 or 89 infrared gel and laid it over the top of my flash, pointed up at the ceiling. I wanted to see if any visible light would get past it.

Popped the flash -- in TTL mode -- and it lit off at full power for the longest duration. I guess the filter blocked the light output -- :D -- and of course the strobe is looking for light coming back, not seeing it, and keeps pumping power to the flash.

Oh, that infrared filter, it flew off the strobe about 3 or 4 feet into the air. The part that was over the strobe output was instantly fried, melted, looked like a rejected potato chip. That just from the energy of absorbing light.

For homemade strobe diffusion I like to use the heat resistant theater gels designed specifically for diffusing light. You can get about 1-sq yard of the stuff for around $5 to $8. Buy it in 1-stop, 1/2-stop, or 1/4-stop. Use multiple layers of the stuff if needed.

See the light defusing gels near the bottom of this page:

http://www.rosco.com/us/filters/roscolux.asp#colors
 

Lars

Active member
Another Don't try this at home:

I once fired my SB-26 by accident while it was standing upside down on a laser-printed paper sheet. The text on the paper fused with the clear cover on the flash. Now everytime the flash is fired the fused text on the front emits a puff of smoke and there is an ozone smell. Still, after ten years. Weird.
 

David K

Workshop Member
Terry,
Glad you posted this as I've learned something from the responses. Interesting that Gary Fong has a different take on using the Nikon flash system. If you're interested here's the link to his video tutorial (click on Canon vs Nikon flash at the top left of the page)

http://flashdiffuser.com/
 
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