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Thread: Nikon D6 Possibly 60 megapixels

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    Senior Member DougDolde's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D6 Possibly 60 megapixels

    Interesting - IMHO this does not really fit the D3, D4, D5 line/philosophy of Nikon, which is rather low resolution but with exceptional speed. Also a 8k capable video camera would be better a mirrorless camera - but who knows what Nikon decides????
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    Senior Member DougDolde's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D6 Possibly 60 megapixels

    It would be a beast and hard to pass up

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    Vivek
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    Re: Nikon D6 Possibly 60 megapixels

    What? With a Sony sensor?

    Not Nikon designed from “scratch” ?
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    Re: Nikon D6 Possibly 60 megapixels

    Quote Originally Posted by ptomsu View Post
    Interesting - IMHO this does not really fit the D3, D4, D5 line/philosophy of Nikon, which is rather low resolution but with exceptional speed. Also a 8k capable video camera would be better a mirrorless camera - but who knows what Nikon decides????
    Completely agree with you Peter - but - it looks like the D6 could be a super D850.... curious to see what gives.

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    Re: Nikon D6 Possibly 60 megapixels

    Next generation of Sony sensors is coming for sure, and 60 to 70 would be right. About the limit I feel until optical designs can improve around issues of diffraction on a 35mm sensor.

    D Family as previously mentioned has always been low MP count and high frame rate, with very high ISO range.

    Note the stock ISO range of chip mentioned is 64 to 400, which is very low, and would imply that much past base ISO of 64 noise will be a factor. Reminds me of early Canon 1ds MKI ISO ranges. Even though the 1ds MKI went beyond 400, it was not very useable.

    IMX455
    Effective pixels: 9600×6400
    Recommend recording pixels: 60MP
    11/12/14/16Bit ADC
    Full Pixel 9fps/14Bit ADC
    SLVS-EC 8Lane
    Single ADC in Video Mode
    12-ADC in Still Picture Mode
    Native ISO 64/400

    2019 promises to be interesting for sure.

    Paul C

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    Workshop Member glenerrolrd's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D6 Possibly 60 megapixels

    At least with current sensor technology (and how its applied) this makes NO SENSE . The trend in sports photography is a merger between stills and video ...resulting in images that can be made immediately available for sports news reporting . (there are some exceptions but they are not relevant to the D6 market ). The Sony A9 is the current champ based on specifications but Nikon and Canon may still have superior auto focus systems (focus tracking ) and certainly have more complete long lens systems .

    Nikon on Canon are both targeting lighter and smaller telephoto lenses at exceptionally high prices .

    The challenge in using 60MPS is driving that much data thru the camera itself ..isn t Sony at 30FPS with Nikon and Canon around 12FPS . In fact many Sports photographers shoot jpegs just to get the images out faster .

    However ....using a 60MP sensor with the ability to select smaller file sizes could provide a versatility that might be amazing . Having a PRO body that could capture 60mp files for detail and say 30 or even 15 mp files for speed and maybe reach . Wow !.

    So I take a 400mm lens and shoot a DX size capture giving me what ? 40 Mps at a 600MM equivalent FOV . Or even 20mps at a 800MM field of view .. And to be able to change with a camera button . (I probably have the sizes wrong ). And what about FPS using smaller files .

    The other issue is pixel size and how it impacts high ISO performance ..smaller the pixel (required to get to 60MPS) the worse the high ISO performance .
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    Re: Nikon D6 Possibly 60 megapixels

    My guess on the D6 for sports:

    When phase went to their 65MP sensor, they embedded a "small raw" option that essentially bundled a quad of 4 of the small pixels and made them a new "fat" pixel -- in this mode you were shooting a 16MP cam, not a 65MP cam, but it worked exceptionally well. In addition to 4x faster frame processing, it also gave 4x better noise/high-ISO performance. So my guess is the D6 might well have a 15MP "high ISO Sport" mode.

    The real issue I see, is there are darn few lenses that can even hold up to 45MP let alone 60 -- and speaking frankly, not very many more that even hold up real well at the last gen 36 right now...

    BUT!!! This news does give me pause about "up-grading" my present "old" D810's to D850's... I may just sit back and wait and see what comes out in the way of glass and this new cam over the next year...

    Honestly, I haven't shot a single thing in the last two years where I felt I really needed more than my D810 delivered -- heck, I'm still looking for lenses to use with it ... But admittedly there were a few times I would have loved a super clean ISO 25,000 and gladly taken it even at just 9MP... Oh, and one other wish for my D810's that could easily be implemented on a 60MP sensor (and even on the D850) -- give me 3:4 and 1:1 crop/view frame options in addition...
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    Senior Subscriber Member Steen's Avatar
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    Nikon D6 Rumor possibly clickbait ?



    Hm

    Isn't this so-called 'rumor' just a new "Camera News website" trying to make some clickbait in order to get their brand new website up and running ?

    So far I haven't found one single article on the entire website with just one single comment.
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    Re: Nikon D6 Possibly 60 megapixels

    My three Nikon f1.8 G lenses are super sharp on my D850. 20mm, 28mm, 85mm

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    Re: Nikon D6 Possibly 60 megapixels

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul2660 View Post
    Next generation of Sony sensors is coming for sure, and 60 to 70 would be right. About the limit I feel until optical designs can improve around issues of diffraction on a 35mm sensor.

    D Family as previously mentioned has always been low MP count and high frame rate, with very high ISO range.

    Note the stock ISO range of chip mentioned is 64 to 400, which is very low, and would imply that much past base ISO of 64 noise will be a factor. Reminds me of early Canon 1ds MKI ISO ranges. Even though the 1ds MKI went beyond 400, it was not very useable.

    IMX455
    Effective pixels: 9600×6400
    Recommend recording pixels: 60MP
    11/12/14/16Bit ADC
    Full Pixel 9fps/14Bit ADC
    SLVS-EC 8Lane
    Single ADC in Video Mode
    12-ADC in Still Picture Mode
    Native ISO 64/400

    2019 promises to be interesting for sure.

    Paul C
    Could the ISO be a dual native ISO since it’s 64/400 and not 64-400? This is pretty common on cameras that do video these days. The specs reference a “video mode” and “stills mode”, so maybe native iso 64 for stills, 400 for video?

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    Re: Nikon D6 Possibly 60 megapixels

    Why would Nikon put a 60MP sensor in the D6? The D5 has a 20MP sensor and was introduced in 2016, at a time when the D810 had already had a 36MP sensor in it for two years. Doesn't seem like the right body for Nikon's highest resolution sensor. It has other attributes.
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    Re: Nikon D6 Possibly 60 megapixels

    Quote Originally Posted by faberryman View Post
    Why would Nikon put a 60MP sensor in the D6? The D5 has a 20MP sensor and was introduced in 2016, at a time when the D810 had already had a 36MP sensor in it for two years. Doesn't seem like the right body for Nikon's highest resolution sensor. It has other attributes.
    Sounds more like a D5X to me, and probably a competitor to Fuji medium format.

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    Re: Nikon D6 Possibly 60 megapixels

    Quote Originally Posted by faberryman View Post
    Why would Nikon put a 60MP sensor in the D6? The D5 has a 20MP sensor and was introduced in 2016, at a time when the D810 had already had a 36MP sensor in it for two years. Doesn't seem like the right body for Nikon's highest resolution sensor. It has other attributes.
    Simple answer -- processing speed. Sport shooters want high frame-rates and the in-cam processor needs to keep up. More pixels = slower/longer process times, which in turn = lower frame-rates.

    With the 4x bundled pixels, you'd have a camera that delivered 60MP in still mode, maybe say even up to 5 frames per second. But now in 15MP mode, you get say 20 frames per sec and super clean high ISO; a sport shooters wet dream.

    Combine those two traits and BONANZA, you may just have created the penultimate DSLR. Expensive yes, but it is an all-in-one camera. Add a few new lenses that can (somehow) handle the 60MP, and you'll put MF digital on it's butt at the same time...

    But wait, there's more! And possibly a camera that also does 8K video with relative ease? Now the next 3 years of commercial user potential is probably far greater than the last 20 years of consumer business...

    Interesting times
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    Re: Nikon D6 Possibly 60 megapixels

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack View Post
    ...With the 4x bundled pixels, you'd have a camera that delivered 60MP in still mode, maybe say even up to 5 frames per second. But now in 15MP mode, you get say 20 frames per sec and super clean high ISO; a sport shooters wet dream.....
    Even if Samsung had made great progress, a lot of sensor surface is wiring, sensel for sensel , so more MP decreases the light detecting area, and downsampling 4 pixels to one doesnt remove the wires.
    Loosing ISO for nothing isnt a sport shooters wet dream

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack View Post
    ... And possibly a camera that also does 8K video with relative ease? Now the next 3 years of commercial user potential is probably far greater than the last 20 years of consumer business...
    The commercial user potential is very small compared to photo, 8k is behind the stars and recent 4k segment is full of strong and well established companies and strong contenders like Black Magic Design or some chinese guys.
    Real commercial projects are made with rented RED or ARRI cams, and down via Sony and Canon video cams you come to the world of DSLR or mirrorless where its just en voque to have some video stuff as an add-on, maybe some bloggers will use Nikon, but most of them are happy with small sonys

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    Re: Nikon D6 Possibly 60 megapixels

    Quote Originally Posted by foveon View Post
    Even if Samsung had made great progress, a lot of sensor surface is wiring, sensel for sensel , so more MP decreases the light detecting area, and downsampling 4 pixels to one doesnt remove the wires.
    Loosing ISO for nothing isnt a sport shooters wet dream

    Firstly, it isn't simple downsampling. A traditional Bayer matrix usually looks like this:

    RGBG
    GBGR

    The new quad-pixel Bayer matrix may now look like this:

    RR GG BB GG
    RR GG BB GG
    GG BB GG RR
    GG BB GG RR

    So say you have a 3.8u actual pixel pitch, your single quad-pixel is now 7.6u with the light gathering performance of 7.6u pixels regardless of path needs, but you still have available resolution at 3.8u in single-pixel mode.

    As for commercial uses... We get the sensors in the new cameras that had to have more than XX pixels mapped out, or had to have a correction curve beyond some threshold added to normalize it, but still more than good enough for photographic imaging needs. Industry gets --and pays for-- the best units.
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    Senior Member msadat's Avatar
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    Re: Nikon D6 Possibly 60 megapixels

    the 60 meg sensor is rated at 9fps, not enough to pass for a d6, i think the d6 frame rate will be around 16~20. no 60 meg sensor now can work this fast.

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    Re: Nikon D6 Possibly 60 megapixels

    Quote Originally Posted by msadat View Post
    the 60 meg sensor is rated at 9fps, not enough to pass for a d6, i think the d6 frame rate will be around 16~20. no 60 meg sensor now can work this fast.
    Correct, but a 15meg sensor could scream...
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    Re: Nikon D6 Possibly 60 megapixels

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack View Post
    Simple answer -- processing speed. Sport shooters want high frame-rates and the in-cam processor needs to keep up. More pixels = slower/longer process times, which in turn = lower frame-rates.

    With the 4x bundled pixels, you'd have a camera that delivered 60MP in still mode, maybe say even up to 5 frames per second. But now in 15MP mode, you get say 20 frames per sec and super clean high ISO; a sport shooters wet dream.

    Combine those two traits and BONANZA, you may just have created the penultimate DSLR. Expensive yes, but it is an all-in-one camera. Add a few new lenses that can (somehow) handle the 60MP, and you'll put MF digital on it's butt at the same time...

    But wait, there's more! And possibly a camera that also does 8K video with relative ease? Now the next 3 years of commercial user potential is probably far greater than the last 20 years of consumer business...

    Interesting times
    Even with the present high-end Nikon cameras (new) being way out of reach for me, it is clear that the current D5 is not terribly expensive and can easily be part of a five-year business plan. With the much higher prices of Medium Format, which can not compete with a D5 for sports, weddings, and such, the D5 is a bargain in comparison.

    A new D6 is badly needed and with the performance potential mentioned by Jack above, it would be a "no-brainer" decision to purchase.

    Interesting, indeed!

    One wonders though, has Nikon ever released a road map for their products?
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    Re: Nikon D6 Possibly 60 megapixels

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack View Post
    Combine those two traits and BONANZA, you may just have created the penultimate DSLR. Expensive yes, but it is an all-in-one camera. Add a few new lenses that can (somehow) handle the 60MP, and you'll put MF digital on it's butt at the same time...
    There is more to MFD than MP.

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    Re: Nikon D6 Possibly 60 megapixels

    A new D6 - if it is still DSLR - sounds to me like a homunculus camera from the beginning.

    I cannot see anything than a high professional Z-mirrorless from Nikon as their top of the line camera they should bring next!

    But who knows in times when companies bring out cameras like the Olympus EM1X that is for whom? really? professionals?

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    Re: Nikon D6 Possibly 60 megapixels

    Do amateurs shoot sports? What kind of sports can you shoot without a press pass?

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    Re: Nikon D6 Possibly 60 megapixels

    Quote Originally Posted by faberryman View Post
    Do amateurs shoot sports?
    Yes
    Quote Originally Posted by faberryman View Post
    What kind of sports can you shoot without a press pass?
    Virtually all
    My Pics
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    Re: Nikon D6 Possibly 60 megapixels

    Quote Originally Posted by faberryman View Post
    Do amateurs shoot sports? What kind of sports can you shoot without a press pass?
    Yes and pretty much anything.

    A good specific example that comes to mind though is many shoot pictures of their children playing sports or doing whatever other activities they do.

    The next sports shooting I plan to do is of my own son doing whatever he does. I personally will not be shelling out for a D5 or D6 or anything of that caliber to do so, but will be looking for something with better AF and higher FPS than anything I currently own (and a reasonably fast telephoto) when the time comes.
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    Re: Nikon D6 Possibly 60 megapixels

    Quote Originally Posted by faberryman View Post
    Do amateurs shoot sports? What kind of sports can you shoot without a press pass?
    That was all I did for years including field sports, motor sports and indoor sports. All with the big D bodies. I stil prefer them because there is little that one can not do with them.

    A D6 for me would be incredible, I would absolutely enjoy one and I am quite interested to see where the Nikon flagship is headed.
    Last edited by dave.gt; 28th March 2019 at 08:57.
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    Re: Nikon D6 Possibly 60 megapixels

    Quote Originally Posted by Jorgen Udvang View Post
    Sounds more like a D5X to me, and probably a competitor to Fuji medium format.
    FWIW,

    The larger body is a positive for using huge telephoto lenses. It is all about balance and stability, not to mention power. As much as I love the D850, it is not the same experience with the battery grip.

    Smaller bodies have their place, but larger bodies also have their place in the photographic community. What Jack has mentioned makes perfect sense for me.

    Meanwhile I shall trudge along with the D850, and borrow the H5D-50c when it needs to match up with a project.

    Obviously, weight means nothing to me! Hahahaha, Lol!!! ..
    Dave (GT)

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