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Thread: Sigma sd Quattro H

  1. #51
    Senior Member Hulyss Bowman's Avatar
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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    Quote Originally Posted by ptomsu View Post
    After having seen the size comparisons, I am definitely out.

    This thing is even larger than the Leica SL ...
    This is understandable. The only serious parameter who can sold me will be the rendering of the H. If it is not mesmerizing then I'll pass too. I think it is a transitional camera. The next DPs might be APS-H too and in this case not need to invest into lenses.
    Kind regards - Hulyss - hulyssbowman.com
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  2. #52
    Senior Member The Ute's Avatar
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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    This is an exciting development.
    Always been in love w Foveon image quality (the Merrill version).
    Some of the finest captures I have ever taken were made w these cameras.
    The combination of either the 18-35 Art or 24 Art plus the H might work extremely well together for Landscape work.
    They've added an EVF which was a huge complaint.
    I anxiously await the pricing info. hoping as others do that it comes in under 2K.
    The focus stacking option should take care of dynamic range issues.
    I have a really fast computer so I don't care about file size although I hope the new version of SPP is greatly improved and they get w the program on w Adobe, etc.
    Since my move away from the Sigmas I have become invested in the latest Sony gear.
    I would gladly give up my RX1R for the H if it checks out.

  3. #53
    Senior Member Tim's Avatar
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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    Here's the only sample pic I can find from the SD Quattro

    http://www.sigma-global.com/en/camer...ries/products/







    Be keen to see more and bigger..

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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    They stole at least one good idea from Sony: The battery grip adds two batteries in addition to the internal one for three batteries in total.

    This accessory boosts the battery capacity of the camera by holding up to two dedicated batteries. In combination with the battery inside the camera, this accessory makes it possible to enjoy up to 200% more shooting time. Offering outstanding usability in both the horizontal and vertical positions, the grip incorporates an ON/OFF button, two command dials, an AF/AEL button, and a FUNC button. It is designed for an exceptionally comfortable grip and is dust-proof and splash-proof.
    This is how the A99 does it.
    Carlos Echenique | Carlos Echenique Photography |Olympus OM-D E-M1 MK II | Olympus Pen-F - M.Zuiko 17mm f/1.8, M.Zuiko 25mm f/1.8, M.Zuiko 45mm f/1.8, Rokinon 12mm f/2 NCS, M.Zuiko 75mm f/1.8, M.Zuiko 12-40mm f/2.8 PRO, M.Zuiko 40-150mm f/2.8 PRO

  5. #55
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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    Quote Originally Posted by Hulyss Bowman View Post
    This is understandable. The only serious parameter who can sold me will be the rendering of the H. If it is not mesmerizing then I'll pass too. I think it is a transitional camera. The next DPs might be APS-H too and in this case not need to invest into lenses.
    Let`s hope Sigma listens and is already working on DPs with APS-H sensor and EVF.

  6. #56
    Senior Member ggibson's Avatar
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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    One thing that concerned me about the H model was how fast the camera could handle those even larger files, but it appears Sigma has beefed up this model a bit:

    In addition, by using two separate TRUE III engines, the camera is able to process data from the Foveon X3 Quattro direct image sensor at extremely high speed.
    The DDR III high-speed, high-volume memory is approximately twice the capacity of that of the SIGMA dp Quattro.
    So 2 CPUs and double the buffer should help quite a bit. The DP2 Q in my experience was reasonably responsive to handle, but previewing images took a while and the camera was obviously using a huge buffer already to process its large files.

    On the thought of a new "DPs" or DP H" with a larger sensor, I would love to see a new version. Just redesign the thing so it more resembles the old DP lineup, and not this weird J-shape that they've concocted. Oh, and hopefully they tack on that 30/1.4 lens while they're at it.

  7. #57
    Senior Member biglouis's Avatar
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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    Stone me!

    I didn't think the camera actually existed - I assumed it was an advanced mock up and we'd see something some time this year - probably later than sooner - but...

    CP+ 2016: Hands-on with new Sigma SD cameras and lenses: Digital Photography Review

    ... it actually exists!

    Now, if we can only have some news on pricing...

    LouisB
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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    I must admit that if this was a real Merrill I'd be all over it, warts and all, but as a Quattro??

    I'll have to think long and hard and see quite a few samples first.
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  9. #59
    New Member swartzfeger's Avatar
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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    early reports -- SD-Q in June, SD-QH end of 2016.

    [email protected]!$%*!
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  10. #60
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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    Still curious which zoomlenses will cover the H sensor. Sigma has some interesting new APC size zoomlenses, but do they cover the H sensor!

  11. #61
    Senior Member biglouis's Avatar
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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    Quote Originally Posted by Michiel Schierbeek View Post
    Still curious which zoomlenses will cover the H sensor. Sigma has some interesting new APC size zoomlenses, but do they cover the H sensor!
    Yes, it intrigues me too. I can only assume we will be drip fed with the information over the next few months.

    LousiB
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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    This camera needs some (fast) pancake lenses.
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    Senior Member Quentin_Bargate's Avatar
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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    Quote Originally Posted by swartzfeger View Post
    early reports -- SD-Q in June, SD-QH end of 2016.

    [email protected]!$%*!
    Ridiculous delay for the H. Interesting concept, but the boat has left the dock.
    Quentin Bargate
    Director of Bargate Murray, Law Firm of the Year 2012 - 2017, leading individual, Chambers HNW guide, 2017, Photographer
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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    To me, the major downsides of this system (so far) are its size, and the horrid Sigma Photo Pro software that you must use as Sigma has not shared their secret sauce recipe with anyone. If they price it like the SD1 Merrill, that will be the final nail in the coffin. Sigma used to have a lens that would make this look normal sized:


    Bigma - APO 200-500mm F2.8/400-1000mm EX DG by Carlos Echenique, on Flickr
    Last edited by etrigan63; 26th February 2016 at 13:45. Reason: grammatically challenged
    Carlos Echenique | Carlos Echenique Photography |Olympus OM-D E-M1 MK II | Olympus Pen-F - M.Zuiko 17mm f/1.8, M.Zuiko 25mm f/1.8, M.Zuiko 45mm f/1.8, Rokinon 12mm f/2 NCS, M.Zuiko 75mm f/1.8, M.Zuiko 12-40mm f/2.8 PRO, M.Zuiko 40-150mm f/2.8 PRO
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  15. #65
    Senior Member biglouis's Avatar
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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    The news, the articles and now the film... next, the t-shirt

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fL-0AEdF7wc

    LouisB

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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    Quote Originally Posted by foveon View Post
    this EVF thing means they dont use a mirror, so why keep the flange distance. Bringing the camera with shorter flange distance and an adapter to SA Flange opens the field to use 3rd party lenses with adapters.
    Couldn't agree more. Sigma missed the point of going mirrorless entirely by keeping the SA mount. They could've released an SA adapter along with the camera, and opened up the possibilities of using other lenses, and perhaps making a new series of smaller lenses. Would have made this a much more attractive value proposition. Once again Sigma's camera division shows how truly clueless they are on the marketing side. I'm guessing it's a division entirely run and operated by engineers.
    -Dragos
    Panasonic GH1/G1, Canon FTb(n)/F-1, Mamiya C330F/RB67 Pro SD, Chamonix 45N-2, Nikon F5 + Assorted Lenses

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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    Name:  10271481_10153416876189149_3886424911792428334_n.jpg
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    Honestly I can't wait for the SDQ.

    Foveon sensor with more DoF control and on sensor focus? count me in.
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  18. #68
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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    more a "foveon" sensor^^

  19. #69
    Senior Member Hulyss Bowman's Avatar
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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Monaghan View Post
    Name:  10271481_10153416876189149_3886424911792428334_n.jpg
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    Honestly I can't wait for the SDQ.

    Foveon sensor with more DoF control and on sensor focus? count me in.
    You are lying to yourself. The Quattro H is more close to APS-C than APS-H thus the Dof thing will be at best marginal. Having used an 1DMK4 for years with a real APS-H sensor ... the dof thing isn't that much pronounced compared to real FF.

    So, for delicious bokeh and transitions it isn't in Sigma land one should look for.
    Kind regards - Hulyss - hulyssbowman.com

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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    Quote Originally Posted by Hulyss Bowman View Post
    You are lying to yourself. The Quattro H is more close to APS-C than APS-H thus the Dof thing will be at best marginal. Having used an 1DMK4 for years with a real APS-H sensor ... the dof thing isn't that much pronounced compared to real FF.

    So, for delicious bokeh and transitions it isn't in Sigma land one should look for.
    I'm used to using the DP cameras with fixed f2.8 lens, the SDQ-H with the 18-35 and 50-100 f1.8 (assuming the coverage is ok) is going to give me much more DoF control than the DP's and the on sensor AF should help with focusing at such apertures which I found difficult at times on the SD1M.

    Not that shallow DoF is always something that I am after, the DP's have leaf shutters which I find invaluable when doing strobe work but who knows I'm going to inquire to see if it would be possible to get a replacement IR glass that also has some ND element

    *note* I had FF years ago with the d3, and again now with an a7rII (going to be my bayer body backup for SA lens).

  21. #71
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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    in my experience the problem with DOF was allways not enough DOF, not to much.^^

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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    Quote Originally Posted by foveon View Post
    in my experience the problem with DOF was allways not enough DOF, not to much.^^
    I have that too some times

  23. #73
    Senior Member Hulyss Bowman's Avatar
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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    The SD Quattro will be at 842 US VAT included. It will be announced tomorrow.
    Kind regards - Hulyss - hulyssbowman.com

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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    And who will buy?^^
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  25. #75
    Senior Member biglouis's Avatar
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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    Interesting.

    I was blown away by the Hasselblad announcement. In an ideal world - where the UK economy is not about to tank - it would be my next camera.

    Then I remembered the forthcoming SD Quattro and Quattro H.

    Just saying.

    LouisB
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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    Sigma announces pricing and availability for sd Quattro and EF-630 flash: Digital Photography Review
    www. dpreview. com/news/7456364718/sigma-announces-pricing-and-availability-for-sd-quattro-and-ef-630-flash
    Note: Not sure how to get the forum to properly link the above URL, anyways, head over to dpreview.com to get the press release.

    Seems it is a bit cheaper than I expected at $799 USD body only for the SD Q.

    B&H Photo is indicating:
    Dimensions (WxHxD) 5.8 x 3.7 x 3.6" / 147.0 x 95.1 x 90.8 mm
    Weight 22.05 oz / 625 g without battery and card

    Sigma Appears to have issued a Usage Notice regarding lens compatibility, remove the space in the URL
    www .sigma-photo.co.jp/english/new/new_topic.php?id=593



    And very oddly they are saying some of the native Sigma lenses will have AF accuracy issues or they recommend using manual focus... uh oh. This seems to negate the reason for retaining the SA-mount and perhaps partly explains the low pricing.
    Last edited by capital; 24th June 2016 at 00:03.

  27. #77
    Senior Member Hulyss Bowman's Avatar
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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    The low pricing is explained by the low price of a Quattro sensor batch. If the H is around 1k it will be cool but... I was commissioned yesterday on an add photo-campaign. The weather was bad, contrasts was high and I used some kinds of fireworks and multiples exposures (long and short) ... a real mess in a very short time. I did this with a D810 and got some key files underexposed, impossible to reshoot because limited fireworks. Hopefully, recovering those files was just as easy as possible with NO loss of IQ so the job is done. There is no way actual Foveon tech can shoot such work (merrill or quattro). I do not think that the H will bring much more latitude and it is a bit sad for pros who BEG to use such tech on stage but CAN'T.

    Will be attentive of this AF issue and hope some art lenses will work good on the H. Might be, AGAIN, a good landscape only camera.

    Ho... just seen the list ... It is a SHAME for macro work ... what the hell are they doing ??
    Kind regards - Hulyss - hulyssbowman.com

  28. #78
    Senior Member Hulyss Bowman's Avatar
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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    Some samples. The good old time of the Merrill samples (whoooo!!! haaaaa !!! damnnnn !!!) is definitively gone. Not even at the modern Xtrans level ...

    http://www.sigma-global.com/jp/camer...es/impression/
    Kind regards - Hulyss - hulyssbowman.com

  29. #79
    Senior Member biglouis's Avatar
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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    Quote Originally Posted by Hulyss Bowman View Post
    The low pricing is explained by the low price of a Quattro sensor batch. If the H is around 1k it will be cool but... I was commissioned yesterday on an add photo-campaign. The weather was bad, contrasts was high and I used some kinds of fireworks and multiples exposures (long and short) ... a real mess in a very short time. I did this with a D810 and got some key files underexposed, impossible to reshoot because limited fireworks. Hopefully, recovering those files was just as easy as possible with NO loss of IQ so the job is done. There is no way actual Foveon tech can shoot such work (merrill or quattro). I do not think that the H will bring much more latitude and it is a bit sad for pros who BEG to use such tech on stage but CAN'T.

    Will be attentive of this AF issue and hope some art lenses will work good on the H. Might be, AGAIN, a good landscape only camera.

    Ho... just seen the list ... It is a SHAME for macro work ... what the hell are they doing ??
    Hulyss

    Surely it is "horse for courses". I shoot mainly landscape and urban landscape. Tripod or handheld. The Merrills and Quattros are fine for that. Anything that requires hi-iso or speed - they are not the right camera.

    Does this mean you are not interested the SD? or the SD-H?

    LouisB

  30. #80
    Senior Member Hulyss Bowman's Avatar
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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    The SD Q is useless in my book. I'm waiting pplbuying the SD H and if it is better and "good" I might buy it but the might come with a big "M".
    Kind regards - Hulyss - hulyssbowman.com
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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    Now with the SD Q release, would be good to know if the sd Q has the one stop noise improvement over the dp Q, as was indicated in the prior CP+ coverage.

    I have tried the dp2Q and the dp0Q but SPP does not reveal as much highlight and detail from the Q files versus the third party converter called "kalpanika." That has me concerned about buying into the Q system if Sigma does not want to commit enough resources towards the software processing side of things.

  32. #82
    Senior Member Malina DZ's Avatar
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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    Quote Originally Posted by Hulyss Bowman View Post
    Some samples. The good old time of the Merrill samples (whoooo!!! haaaaa !!! damnnnn !!!) is definitively gone. Not even at the modern Xtrans level ...
    インプレッション | sd Quattro | カメラ | SIGMA GLOBAL VISION
    Thanks for a link, Hulyss. That image gallery is loading painfully slow as if a preamble to SPP. And I agree with you, there is no longer any Merrill-Foveon magic in Quattro files.
    It seems to me as if Sigma does not care how well SD Quattro will sell. The company just wants to have a modern stylish mirrorless body in its arsenal for lens ad campaigns.
    Hope, my dp2M lasts till an announcement of a Foveon X3 36x24mm or larger sensor.

    SD Q first impressions from Reviewed.com: Sigma sd Quattro and sd Quattro H First Impressions Review - Reviewed.com Cameras

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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    Quote Originally Posted by Malina DZ View Post
    Why I am not surprised?^^

  34. #84
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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    The sd QH will be available in Asia for about $1200 on Dec 20.
    Carl
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  35. #85
    Senior Member biglouis's Avatar
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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    Quote Originally Posted by scho View Post
    The sd QH will be available in Asia for about $1200 on Dec 20.
    Cheaper than the existing SD Q? That doesn't make sense.

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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    Quote Originally Posted by biglouis View Post
    Cheaper than the existing SD Q? That doesn't make sense.
    No, the H is about $400 more than the Q ($799 at B&H). Also on Photo Rumor site
    Last edited by scho; 5th December 2016 at 07:59.
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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    I haven't seen this before - H will come out with a DNG recording format (No compression RAW Data 12-bit) and Q will get a FW update for this feature in future!
    http://sigma-global.com/en/cameras/s...pecifications/

    BTW, are there any other cameras with EVF featuring custom overlay like 21:9?
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  38. #88
    Senior Member biglouis's Avatar
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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    Somewhere else someone made the claim that existing crop sensor lenses by Sigma will not cover the entire area of the APS-H sensor.

    Does anyone know if this is true? I only ask because wide-angle is pretty important to me but most of the UWA/WA lenses in Sigma mount (even if you can find someone selling them) for full frame are pretty big.

    My ideal would be to use the 10-30 f3.5.

    Not serious about owning a Quattro H, or at least not until I see the output and especially what the new DNG format (which would finally open up Lightroom) is like.

    LouisB

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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    Quote Originally Posted by biglouis View Post
    Somewhere else someone made the claim that existing crop sensor lenses by Sigma will not cover the entire area of the APS-H sensor.

    Does anyone know if this is true?

    LouisB
    Hello Louis,

    It's not a yes/no subject unfortunately, i.e. do they cover the entire area or not? From what I've read on the other site (DPR) the inevitable vignetting of some DC lenses is less significant than others; additionally, some zooms are said to be OK at some zoom settings, but not all.

    So, even though their 'H' sensor is quite a bit smaller than the defined APS standard, your decision to wait makes good sense to me.

    best,

    Ted

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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    Quote Originally Posted by Malina DZ View Post
    I haven't seen this before - H will come out with a DNG recording format (No compression RAW Data 12-bit) and Q will get a FW update for this feature in future!
    http://sigma-global.com/en/cameras/s...pecifications/

    BTW, are there any other cameras with EVF featuring custom overlay like 21:9?
    But from the spec they DNG will be only 12bit, standard compressed raw is 14bit, so you might lose some dynamic range.....

    I wish Sigma would do what Fuji does and upgrade the stand alone Quattros with the DNG output, but those are pretty much dead products I am afraid.

    Alan
    Alan Smallbone
    Orange County, CA
    https://www.flickr.com/photos/aps-photo/

  41. #91
    Senior Member biglouis's Avatar
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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    Quote Originally Posted by apsphoto View Post
    I wish Sigma would do what Fuji does and upgrade the stand alone Quattros with the DNG output, but those are pretty much dead products I am afraid.

    Alan
    I'm intrigued - are they dead products? Did I miss something? Just asking.

    LouisB

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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    Quote Originally Posted by apsphoto View Post
    But from the spec they DNG will be only 12bit, standard compressed raw is 14bit, so you might lose some dynamic range.....
    If posts on the other forum are anything to go by, Alan, those two bits will not be sadly missed . .

    I wish Sigma would do what Fuji does and upgrade the stand alone Quattros with the DNG output, but those are pretty much dead products I am afraid.

    Alan
    The other day I was quite surprised how long the Quattros have been out. How time flies . . ..

    Ted
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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    Quote Originally Posted by biglouis View Post
    Somewhere else someone made the claim that existing crop sensor lenses by Sigma will not cover the entire area of the APS-H sensor.
    Sigma makes APS-C and Full frame lenses. They don't make APS-H lenses. Why should they? Nobody makes APS-H sensors, except them selves, but they don't make money with Sigma-mount lenses. So every APS-C lens on the sd Quattro "H" is a compromise with strong vignetting and mediocre sharpness.
    Sorry for the broken links to my photographs due to Dropbox policy changes.
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  44. #94
    Senior Member Hulyss Bowman's Avatar
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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    Our constant whining made SIGMA progress over the past months. There is a long way to go to make it usable as a 2016 "mirror less" camera. I used one normal Quattro some days ago and it was not exciting. The guy was not sure if he should keep it or not but I was the final nail in the coffin, so he returned it.

    Nothing will change in the H experience. The IQ will be what should have been normal SDQ IQ, so less noise at base iso due to higher photo sites density.

    Of course only FF lenses will take advantage of the sensor, APS-C lenses will force a crop mode.

    The DNG thing is a good move to get rid of useless X3F but still... it is not that good yet.

    In one/two years we might see new DP iterations more in line with what was a DP, at first ...

    Hope they'll abandon prehistoric EVF and make a real APS-H rangefinder and full 14 bit DNG output.
    Kind regards - Hulyss - hulyssbowman.com

  45. #95
    Super Duper
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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    A few sample sd Quattro H images are showing up now on Flickr. Here is one generated in Lightroom from an OOC DNG file.

    Another one
    Carl
    Gallery

  46. #96
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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    Quote Originally Posted by Stoneage View Post
    <> So every APS-C lens on the sd Quattro "H" is a compromise with strong vignetting and mediocre sharpness.
    Why mediocre sharpness? What causes that?

    regards,

    Ted

  47. #97
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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    Quote Originally Posted by biglouis View Post
    I'm intrigued - are they dead products? Did I miss something? Just asking.

    LouisB
    Just my opinion but if you look at Sigma when a new product comes out all the upgrades go to the new one. They never go back and work on the older cameras. If there was a critical bug they might, but since the SDQ is out and the SDQH there will no improvement in the plain Quattros. Just like the Merrills have faded into the closet...

    It does not mean that the cameras stop working just Sigma does nothing else to improve them.

    Alan
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  48. #98
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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    Quote Originally Posted by xpatUSA View Post
    Why mediocre sharpness? What causes that?

    regards,

    Ted
    I meant the corners of an APS-C lens, used on a 1.3x crop sensor.
    Sorry for the broken links to my photographs due to Dropbox policy changes.
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  49. #99
    Senior Member biglouis's Avatar
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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    First SD Quattro H review I've seen:

    http://giclee-art.my/sd-quattro-h-review-part-1/
    -----
    My new book "Whitechapel in 50 BUildings", Flikr Stream, www.louisberk.com
    Thanks 1 Member(s) thanked for this post

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    Re: Sigma sd Quattro H

    Thanks, Louis! Small world dept: noticed that the reviewer is master printer for Ming Thein.

    Looking forward to the next installment(s)...
    Last edited by Oren Grad; 20th December 2016 at 09:50.

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