Walk me Through: P to IQ, maybe IQ2?

PS: Any recommendations for:

- a carbon fiber tripod and head combo specifically for a Mamiya RZ ProIID
with a digital back, motor drive, handle, heavy lens and filter holder?

- a panoramic head that's rock solid. For stitching with the RZ across a 120degree field of view.
ease of controls for going from stitching, to secure lock off to do double exposure...

thank you.

ocarlo said:

in the act of shooting under pressure

Click to expand...

Only CMOS is good at this. 100MP is not affordable for the most, and 50MP is a crop sensor not suitable for many.

Sorry---but that is complete utter nonsense that "only CMOS is good" at shooting under pressure. What is the world going to do with all these unemployed professional photographers shooting film and CCD sensors? Sorry, but CMOS is just not the answer to world hunger, global warming, etc. although it is very nice to have. If you know your equipment, you can work under pressure, plain and simple.

Going from the P45 to the IQ180 would be a substantial upgrade. You will benefit from the increased resolution. BUT imho the most noticeable benefit will be the change in user interface to the IQ MFDBs, which is substantially better, easier to use, and, *ahem* just wonderful to use when shooting under pressure. With the IQ180, you have focus mask which is very helpful. Much better viewing on screen, and quick zoom to check focus. (I made the upgrades from P30-->P45-->P65+--IQ180-->IQ3 100). I would skip the IQ2 in this situation. IQ1 or IQ3 100 would be wonderful but it sounds like it's not in the budget, though if this really were your "last upgrade" I'd stretch for the IQ1 or IQ3 100. Life is short, and this is Dante's forum....

You might want to consider the XF camera platform. Substantial improvements in AF performance. And Profoto Air integration is a nice benefit to work with your Profoto system. Fast flash sync huge plus with leaf shutter lenses----faster than the RZ.
For tripod---I'm a fan of the RRS TVC 3 series....

Ken

Personally I’m a little curious as to why you would bother with the 120 film. Certainly wouldn’t attempt to stitch it, might as well stitch the p45. My path has been nearly identical to Ken’s, except I started with the original Kodak DCS pro 16mp back, then the p25/45/45+/65/180/3-100.

While you can certainly scan a 6x7 negative to achieve a big file, the limitation is the film itself. As far as resolving detail for a big print, I think the p45+ if shot well with good glass will produce a better or at least equal file. I’m sure you’ve done some testing ... as did I back in the day. (I still have my RZ67 and my Pentax 67).

As a point of reference, this article from 8 years ago by Charles Cramer, a photographer I have tremendous respect for compared 4x5 film to the p45+ ... if you aren’t a subscriber to LuLa, the gist of the article was his conclusion that while 4x5 film had a slight edge over the p45, it wasn’t enough to prevent him from moving from film to digital. (note this was compared to 4x5 film from someone who is highly regarded as a landscape photographer and very experienced with large format cameras).

Just a thought. As Ken said, the 180 is a huge upgrade and the quality jump is dramatic. I have a 84” single shot vertical pano from my IQ180 I just installed in my gallery, and I was shocked at how clean and sharp the image is. I printed it as a test, thinking it might not hold up.

As far as “workflow” i can’t imagine shooting 120 film would be a pleasant task on such an undertaking, no way to check things as you go, no backup in case the film gets nuked in airport scanning/lost/damaged etc. and just the extra labor of working with film ...

Sounds like a huge project, sad to have to compromise it with equipment choices (an XF system with an IQ3 100 would be perfect), but of course, budgets are tough for such an undertaking so I can certainly appreciate you dilemma.

as far as a pano head, the most useful thing I’ve found when shooting a pano isn’t necessarily the head (I use an arca swiss cube) but it sits on top of a pano rotator. Makes shooting a pano series a breeze. simple to use, and can even help manage things like a focus stack panorama.

Actually, Wayne---I too started with the Kodak DCS 645M----that's okay, I won't tell anyone we think alike... :ROTFL:

See you next month at CI in Bluff, UT!

ken

Talk about going down memory lane...my first entry into digital medium format as a Kodak DCS (that Ken sold me!) before moving into a P30+, P45, P65, IQ160, IQ180 and now a IQ1-100. One of my best selling panos come from the P30 and prints at 30x60 (it was a two shot handheld done in a hurry).

As much as I loved film I'd never go back. If you factor the cost of film (not much) cost of developing (more and more cost) the proper scanning (much more money) as well as the overall time factor involved from the instant the shutter closes to the scanned results. So with that in mind, how much is your time worth? What happens if the film is damaged (I actually had a roll damaged prior to development). Who are you trusting to develop what can be one of a kind negatives? Again, I've had damage done in the development stage by a company that has since (thankfully) gone out of business. Then the scanning process - will you have all the negatives scanned? Lots of money and time invested...

The P45 is capable of what you want to accomplish however the IQ180 just might be better suited. If you think about your film budget you might find that using that will go a long ways to upgrading both back and body as there's several used copies available from reputable dealers.

Best of luck with your project.

Don

Wayne, looking forward to seeing you next month in Bluff!

Thank you very much guys.
Granted, this is primarily a landscape forum, and I certainly will never be judgemental
about (pleasurable) discussions on pixels and DR, or just plain ol' gear lust.
However, I do wish for more discussions like these that reflect on process, or the wider experience
of photography.
In this regard, even if I could theoretically surrender to Dante, and go for an IQ3 and the XF camera - it would almost be too perfect.
Budget aside, I choose the RZ for itself.. Its big, clunky and loud, leaf-shuttered, and slow enough for my process.
Actually, a lot of my series' have to do with people jumping, flying in air - but at $2500 for one XF lens,
I'd rather make adjustments to vision and execution. Stay within the comfort zone. Proportion.
I set up studios in conflict areas in the Congo in safe controlled situations,
and having the "best" gear would just screw with my head too much, considering the extreme poverty around me.
So the question for me is: what is the "best" gear for the conditions I work in.
The decision-making is, for me, just as much photography as the actual exposure.

Ken - you nailed it, esp. with the "Ahem" remark. If I can get double the mp, and (esp since I'm directing people)
have the confidence to see a clearer image, then zoom to focus - then that's real pleasure,
when I can forget the mechanics and derive actual pleasure from the flow.
My P45 has been a good soldier, and even has LiveView enabled - but the pleasures you describe make the case for upgrading.
That said, how's the IQ180 with tethering to a laptop?? Is ipad viewing doable?

Wayne - thanks as well, lots of food for thought. To clarify, I would shoot with the P45, then slap on the film back
and repeat. Out of 14 scenarios / setups, I only have two that clearly need mural-sized printing,
AND would benefit from a "film look". Yes, Ive heard about the 4x5 test, and its encouraging. I'll take his word for it.
More encouraging is your pano test. I'll take your word on that.
Thanks for the recommends, will look into it. will upload a pano file later (to explain why I need pano gear).

Dante - here I come babe.
PS anyone got a IQ180 to sell?

Tethering with the IQ180 and USB3 is easy---much better than with Firewire. You can use a laptop with Capture One Pro (DB version is free with Phase MFDBs), but if on location and concerned with portability, it's hard to beat the form factor of the Surface Pro. See, https://kendoophotography.wordpress...s-and-leaf-credo-medium-format-digital-backs/ This is an older article with the Surface Pro 2, and more recent generations of the Surface Pro are more mature yet. See, https://kendoophotography.wordpress...-with-the-surface-pro-evolving-clamp-choices/ which was my last summation of clamping choices with the Surface Pro.

I no longer tether with the Surface Pro (ok, maybe rarely) as the IQ3 100 has HDMI output, and a SmallHD monitor packs smaller than a Surface Pro---and even then, I'm not using the SmallHD monitor nearly as much as I thought I would. But it really is about having options.

I'd give a call over to Capture Integration in Atlanta, see, www.captureintegration.com and ask about available IQ180 MFDBs, and any suggestions they may have for your shooting situation in those "safe" :shocked: areas of the Congo....

ken

ocarlo said:

Ken - you nailed it, esp. with the "Ahem" remark. If I can get double the mp, and (esp since I'm directing people)
have the confidence to see a clearer image, then zoom to focus - then that's real pleasure,
when I can forget the mechanics and derive actual pleasure from the flow.
My P45 has been a good soldier, and even has LiveView enabled - but the pleasures you describe make the case for upgrading.
That said, how's the IQ180 with tethering to a laptop?? Is ipad viewing doable?


Dante - here I come babe.
PS anyone got a IQ180 to sell?

Click to expand...

Not Ken (I'm told we look alike :ROTFL...

Tethering a 180 to a surface pro is very easy and will allow you much more than an ipad. Ken and I tethered both IQ160 and IQ180 using a tech cam and a surface pro for awhile until the newer IQ3/1-100 came out with live view. There's a long thread here somewhere on tethering here and I'm certain someone can provide the link (I would however running out the door).

Check with one of the dealers here regarding a used 180 as they both ship overseas and may even take the P45 as trade. Can't hurt to ask; contact Capture Integration.

This one?

https://www.getdpi.com/forum/medium...do-mfdbs.html?highlight=surface+pro+tethering

thank you guys for the real-world knowledge.
I think that cinches it - a better screen, quicker focus check,
and tethering ability. Should I ever have an art director looking
over my shoulder in the future, I can always rent an XF1 and an IQ3.

Ken - will def look up the blog, and check the 2017 situation with Surface Pro.
A big part of my process is showing my subjects the shots, and having them
make adjustments as we go along....huge plus.
hmmm...gaming while in the bush with the SP would even be cooler.

thanks Don - I had been in touch with the dealers in the past and got gunshy.
cheers guys.

Hi,

I use an RRS (Really Right Stuff) TVC-33 tripod with an Arca Swiss 4D geared head with a levelling base. The levelling base is used for keeping the head level. The D4 has dual pan function one on the bottom and one on the top. I normally use the rotation at bottom for panos. The D4 has gears on tilt and pitch but not on rotation.

https://www.ludd.ltu.se/~torger/photography/arca-swiss-d4-review.html

Best regards
Erik

ocarlo said:

PS: Any recommendations for:

- a carbon fiber tripod and head combo specifically for a Mamiya RZ ProIID
with a digital back, motor drive, handle, heavy lens and filter holder?

- a panoramic head that's rock solid. For stitching with the RZ across a 120degree field of view.
ease of controls for going from stitching, to secure lock off to do double exposure...

thank you.

Click to expand...

Thanks Erik - I don't do landscapes, but just need
to make stitching, with people arranged against a natural backdrop, much easier - hence, maybe just a rotator?
I imagine getting the nodal point down would be the other priority.
cheers.

A pano sample -
panning left to right.
3 shots per subject.

Hi Ocarlo,

Yes, I remember some of your older postings. Shooting the way you do, a nodal slider would be helpful. A rotator would be fine if used with a nodal slider. I use an RRS MPR 192, but I would probably buy an MPR CLII if I would buy now. I have also owned a RRS PC-PRO panorama head but gave it away after getting the Arca 4D.

I like RRS, but recently I have shopped things from Hejnar Photo. Very nice stuff at very good prices.

Best regards
Erik

ocarlo said:

Thanks Erik - I don't do landscapes, but just need
to make stitching, with people arranged against a natural backdrop, much easier - hence, maybe just a rotator?
I imagine getting the nodal point down would be the other priority.
cheers.

Click to expand...

Hi,

I actually made the same reflection. A guy called Tim Parkin has found that scanned film can outperform MFD backs but he does his own scanning up to 6000 PPI and beyond. My experience shooting 67 Velvia that it gave similar results as the 24 MP DSLR-s I have owned.

CMOS has two great advantages:

You can focus using magnified live view. That way of focusing is pinpoint accurate. It may be possible to check focus after exposure, but with live view you see the pixels popping in and out of focus. All the IQ-backs have live view, but it may be that it takes CMOS for really usable live view.

The other great advantage of CMOS is that you can push the shadows quiet a bit more. The reason for that is technical. With CMOS the voltage over the pixel is read out directly with thousands of Analogue Digital Converters (ADCs) integrated into the sensor. With CCDs the charge of the pixels is "popped" along the sensor and is normally fed into external amplifiers and ADC. So, the signal path with the CMOS is much shorter and normally fully integrated into the sensor. That low readout noise also allows for high ISO.

Best regards
Erik

Wayne Fox said:

Personally I’m a little curious as to why you would bother with the 120 film.

Click to expand...

hey Erik - many thanks for the RRS info. Pretty much spot on with what I need.
Lots of googling ahead..
May have to go with RRS since I'm home in NY at present.

I gotta say I'm always amazed at folks that can get that technical.
I realize that even way back (film, Dektol etc) I had a limit to tech info,
beyond which I just blank out. I have a camera platform that slows me down, and will last for years,
and cheap lenses for what you get. My strobes will last forever. I make images, then move on.
Granted, I have the freedom of being serious about the photography, but without the tech demands of say,
a commercial photographer. I certainly assisted enough commercial photographers to respect that.

Though I'd never not shoot digital, I'm also missing the qualities of film, esp the new Type55,
as well as other forms of analogue-ing the image, like cutting up film and taping them together,
then scanning...etc...
What hasn't changed is the photo Industry kinda selling their idea of photography - meaning, their products -
as if that defined image perfection - as opposed to our experience of photography itself.
It's all good. thanks again.

ocarlo said:

That said, how's the IQ180 with tethering to a laptop?? Is ipad viewing doable?
Dante - here I come babe.
PS anyone got a IQ180 to sell?

Click to expand...

As Ken and Don mentioned, tethering to the IQ backs via USB3 and Capture One works really well. I currently tether my IQ160 to the latest Macbook, which is light as a feather and easy to use in the field (I just rest it on my camera pack when I'm futzing, and hold it with one hand when I'm taking the shot or reviewing images). And the Retina display allows me to verify focus with ease.

Your project looks interesting - good luck with it regardless of whether you succumb to Dante's influence!

- John

P.S. Looking forward to Bluff next month!

hey John - agreed. That totally convinced me, and saved me a bunch from having to even think about the IQ280.
It also sounds like checking focus off the LCD is easy as two taps to get to zoom into the eyes.
That's all I need.
I wish the Surface Pro was actually half the size, to really go into Ken's idea of tethering
as an extension of the LCD.
good stuff, all this.