a new question of the electronics travel ban, trying to figure alternatives

msadat said:

does the ban in effect right now (which i am sure it will go worldwide) only for cameras or does it include lenses too. i know the laptops and ipad are out, if we can take lenses with us, then renting a body or arranging for shipment of just a body (ies) won't be as bad. i couldn't find info on this

Click to expand...

Is that the ban that I believe Europe has said no to on the grounds it would require violation of FAA (amongst other groups) rules governing lithium ion batteries which must not be carried in the hold of aircraft?

What electronics ban? the expansion of the electronics ban beyond the few airlines and middle eastern cities was not adopted. Unless something happened in the last few hours, there is no difference from what it has been unless you use a Middle Eastern Airline from one of the cities in those countries.

Seeing things in perspective

Hi,

What I gather from the news is that Israeli intelligence has discovered a plan to put explosives in laptops. US authorities decided that electronic devices larger than cell phones are not allowed on flights originating from ten different airports, all in the middle east.

So, the electronics ban applies to just a few airports.

Obviously, restrictions may expand to other origins, but that is not the case this far.

Best regards
Erik

Waste of time. Nothing will change. Either you are allowed to transport electronics or not. The whole discussion about bringing it on board or checking it is BS. If I would want to blow up a plane I wouldn't care. If your not, well the US will find out that the rest of the world doesn't really need them.

Besides all that. Your not allowed to check batteries, have to demonstrate during security that your camera laptop works, but the other sides wants to check everything? That's just dumb.

Those behind the suggestion must have understood that this was not possible to implement, either that or they are unusually stupid and/or ignorant. I'm sure they did it to make the ban towards certain airports in The Middle East look legit. Now they have created problems for the airlines based at those airports. Target achieved.

Wow some really super responses to a legitimate question. First ...no one cares whether you think any changes are necessary or appropriate . Second ....Nor do they care if you think its eminent or even possible .

DELTA had signage already printed warning travelers to europe that they would have to check all electronics on their return flight . You can find plenty of “News” and “Opinion” on the possibility of a ban . Draw you own conclusions .

The question raised was how to deal with a ban if and when its implemented . For example ...could you ship only the camera bodies thru DHL,FEdEx etc. Another alternative might be to fly from with a connection thru an airport that isn’t restricted .

I have two trips to europe this summer and I have acceptable plans to handle a ban similar to the one already in effect . Knowing I have a workaround should a wide spread ban be initiated kept me from canceling these trips . ( Which I think is the point of the thread ).

so i am also planning a trip and want to plan ahead and don't want to get surprised, after what happened in UK, i am sure the electronics ban will be all over usa and europe (at least UK). i called TSA and the specialist on the phone was clueless , she kept mentioning its upto the airlines and i was telling her its a USA law/restriction. after ten minutes, i thanked her and hanged up.

msadat said:

so i am also planning a trip and want to plan ahead and don't want to get surprised, after what happened in UK, i am sure the electronics ban will be all over usa and europe (at least UK). i called TSA and the specialist on the phone was clueless , she kept mentioning its upto the airlines and i was telling her its a USA law/restriction. after ten minutes, i thanked her and hanged up.

Click to expand...

Again, there is NO electronics ban as long as you aren't using a handful of middle eastern airlines coming from specific middle eastern airports. This is true for the US and the UK:
US and EU reject expanding laptop ban to flights from Europe - BBC News

And then, after I wrote the above I ran across a new Reuters article that basically said that the ban is back on the table:
U.S., EU meet on aviation security as Europe braces for laptop ban | Reuters

But the fundamental issue is that it is unsafe to have laptops or anything with larger LIIon batteries in the cargo hold which could result in banning electronic devices including cameras, not just restricting electronic devices to the cargo hold. this would really hurt a lot of industries, not just the airlines. It would certainly render the 6 international airplane tickets I have for the rest of the year as essentially useless.

msadat said:

does the ban in effect right now (which i am sure it will go worldwide) only for cameras or does it include lenses too. i know the laptops and ipad are out, if we can take lenses with us, then renting a body or arranging for shipment of just a body (ies) won't be as bad. i couldn't find info on this

Click to expand...

Ok, I am going to address the actual question: Would it cover lenses?

I suspect legally this is going to depend on the exact wording of the ban. I also suspect trying to argue fine points of law with the security staff in most airports is not going to get you very far towards your destination. Also, good luck explaining that your manual focus lens doesn't have a motor so isn't an "electronic device" while an autofocus lens has a motor, so is an "electronic device".

Logically, I would have thought, given that many lenses have metal cases, they should actually be covered by the laptop ban because they present the same security risk: The x-ray machine can't see inside a metal case, and they can't reasonably ask you to open a lens for inspection. There really aren't that many commonly carried consumer goods with large cavities wrapped in a metal shell that can't be opened. Laptops and camera lenses are the two main candidates I can think of. Even my camera body I am happy to strip down (AKA take the lens off!) if they want to inspect inside it!

Honestly, in that regard, I have felt for years that laptops presented an enormous security risk, as many have metal cases so short of reaching for a screw-driver you can't tell what is inside.

The ban doesn't include lenses. I flew Emirates from Dubai to SFO about a month ago and it was the laptop, iPad and camera bodies that got packed and put in the hold at the gate. I told them about the lenses and they said it was fine.

I have a photo trek to Iceland this summer and another to Italy in the Fall. Based on current discussions between, the US, EU and the Airlines, it seems more like a WHEN vs. an IF. I'm hoping I get Iceland done before the universal ban and I'm planning on having to ship my gear home for the Italy trip. So I think we all need to prepare for significant disruption. In the brave new world DHL will become your best friend. You can deliver a locked Pelican case to a local DHL office and/or in many cases have your Pelican case picked up at the hotel. From what I read, the ban would include all electronic devices larger than a smartphone. Among us, there will be many debatable points, such as lenses aren't independent electronic devices, they don't power on without a body. There may also be a debate on what constitutes a smartphone. Is an iPhone plus, a smartphone or is it too big? Is an iPad mini with cell service a smartphone? But in the end, I'm guessing that TSA will make it as black and white as possible. I envision, no lenses, no bodies, no laptops, and no tablets. Paper books and magazines may be making a comeback.

thedigitalbean said:

The ban doesn't include lenses. I flew Emirates from Dubai to SFO about a month ago and it was the laptop, iPad and camera bodies that got packed and put in the hold at the gate. I told them about the lenses and they said it was fine.

Click to expand...

This is great info. Could you provide a bit more detail? It sounds like you carried your gear to the gate? Does it get packed and then given back to you at the arrival gate? Or did it get packed and sent to normal baggage claim at SFO? I'm just trying to determine the risk of theft.

mkerouac said:

In the brave new world DHL will become your best friend. You can deliver a locked Pelican case to a local DHL office and/or in many cases have your Pelican case picked up at the hotel.

Click to expand...

I don't think this would work when sending a camera to Europe without paying VAT. Probably, you could get the taxes back once the goods are exported back, but it is going to be a major hassle.

Perhaps we should follow Umberto Eco's example and travel without cameras - and enjoy what we see through our own eyes, not through a viewfinder, without interruption from the picture-taking process. "Travelling with a Salmon" is then a good book by Eco to take on the plane.

Here is a reference to Eco's article on cameras: Umberto Eco "An epidemic of electronic eye" - Rangefinderforum.com

Maybe this is the solution to end the megapixel wars . . . revert back to film

i think a film camera will throw TSA completely off, something they might have not seen at all

atanabe said:

Maybe this is the solution to end the megapixel wars . . . revert back to film

Click to expand...

atanabe said:

Maybe this is the solution to end the megapixel wars . . . revert back to film

Click to expand...

Great idea! I can just see myself trying to enter God's own Country with a couple of GX680 bodies. Might as well hire Jason Statham and Vin Diesel for the transportation out of that detention center...

Maybe I stupid or something but if a bomb is indeed placed in my iPad, it is then checked in as luggage and blows up in the hold, doesn't that have the same result as if it was in my hand in the cabin?

Packing stuff into luggage is not a real hassle is it?