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Thread: GRD2 v GX100, shootout or an ideal pair?

  1. #51
    Senior Member nostatic's Avatar
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    Re: GRD2 v GX100, shootout or an ideal pair?

    it is interesting to see, because I got my GRD2 yesterday and after taking about 100 photos last night I'm going to sell it. I prefer the look of my DLux3 images, and also find the interface on the Panaleica to be better for my use. That is likely due to the fact that I am used to it though...

    Could be that I just haven't spent enough time fiddling but I actually have been pretty happy with the DLux3. Other people here get amazing shots with the GRD2, but everyone is different I suppose. One thing I notice is that for me, IS makes a *big* difference.
    Last edited by nostatic; 24th May 2008 at 13:00.

  2. #52
    Senior Member nostatic's Avatar
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    Re: GRD2 v GX100, shootout or an ideal pair?

    hmm, maybe I spoke too soon. I shot a few comparisons and it is interesting. The colors on the GRD2 indoors are more accurate (using auto WB) than the DLux3, and while the image from the Leica looks a tad "cleaner", it is at the expense of nice grain. It looks like there is some NR going on in the Leica raw file. As Jack noted above, when you "push" the GRD2 file it looks quite nice, the DLux3 less so.

    I'm going to a show reception tonight (two of my Yosemite pieces are in it) and I figure I'll take the GRD2 and see what I can get. The shots last night at the Dodger game didn't thrill me, but likely that was more operator than tool


    grd2


    dlux3

    Last edited by nostatic; 24th May 2008 at 15:40.

  3. #53
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    Re: GRD2 v GX100, shootout or an ideal pair?

    Quote Originally Posted by nostatic View Post
    hmm, maybe I spoke too soon. I shot a few comparisons and it is interesting. The colors on the GRD2 indoors are more accurate (using auto WB) than the DLux3, and while the image from the Leica looks a tad "cleaner", it is at the expense of nice grain. It looks like there is some NR going on in the Leica raw file. As Jack noted above, when you "push" the GRD2 file it looks quite nice, the DLux3 less so.
    That's pretty much the conclusion I came to as well, and one of the main reasons I sold my D-Lux 3. Added to that was the RAW speed of the GRDII, the "gripability" of the body, the superb controls and handling compared to the Leica. I'm quite happy with the Ricoh grain with the sort of shooting I do!

  4. #54
    Sr. Administrator Jack's Avatar
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    Re: GRD2 v GX100, shootout or an ideal pair?

    Okay, had LOUSY weather all weekend at Tahoe for doing any kind of constructive comparison of these two cameras. Here is one image from the GRD2 anyway, ISO 100 but processed to add noise, desaturate colors and increase contrast to accentuate the ominous sky -- and this is as good as it got. Most of the time, was just plain gray, no visible clouds...



    In addition, I did shoot the GRD2 indoors during evening game sessions -- or when the kids were acting up. Here are my three girls playing with their flatware after an evening meal. Taken at ISO 800 with on-camera flash, spot AF (I have the AF helper light turned off and it nailed focus in this low light) and AWB. In post I used ACR standard settings, exposure brought up a stop, fill and blacks brought up a little for an effective ISO 1600+, color was as-shot and no added NR was run. Note that ISO 800 pushed one stop has superior noise character than ISO 1600 native:



    then,



    ~~~

    All in all, I have reached my bottom line conclusions about these cameras, offered IMO/FWIW only...

    1) I find I almost always grab the GRD2 if I want a small camera. First it's very fast and intuitive to shoot with, and next I find the fixed 28mm focal freeing and not restrictive as it removes one other decision factor from the image making process; it forces me to see 28mm images with it. I step in if I need tighter, step back if I need looser, of make a composition that fits what I got if I can't do either of those. Next I can click once and can click a follow up instantly if I need to; neither the GX100 or D-Lux3 allow the fast follow shot in raw mode.

    1a) IMO the GRD2 may be the ideal evening-out/dinner-table camera when you don't want to lug a DSLR or the M8

    2) If you need a zoom, then the GRD2 is out. But if you want to push yourself, then the single focal restriction may be an asset...

    3) For a zoom camera, IF the GRD2 is already in your stable and you love it, then the GX100 is the answer IMO. It offers a nearly identical control layout and similar enough UI that it is the logical choice for user convenience and I'd choose these over the slightly better IQ and color advantages of the D-Lux3.

    4) However, if you are looking for a SINGLE small camera with zoom, then my leaning would be to the D-Lux3 over the GX100. Here I feel the D-Lux3's better native color and image quality along with being touch smaller and better looking (yes, I think the Leica version almost qualifies as evening-attire accessory jewelry ) win this decision.

    5) However both are very good in their own right, and there are some other considerations: The GX100 has a 24-72 focal equivalent while the D-Lux has a 28-90 range -- probably significant if you prefer wide or long. The Leica is 16:9 native for convenient playback on most modern television sets while the GX100 is 4:3, a more useful aspect ratio for most imaging, especially if you go vertical. At the end of the day though, I would not necessarily move to one if you already owned the other.

    Cheers,
    Jack
    home: www.getdpi.com

    "Perfection is not attainable. But if we chase perfection, we can catch excellence."

  5. #55
    Administrator Bob's Avatar
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    Re: GRD2 v GX100, shootout or an ideal pair?

    I think that the one single GRD II benefit over ANY other P&S I have handled is the very low time from pocket to shot and negligible shutter delay capability. For that alone it is a great walkabout pocket camera.
    -bob

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    Re: GRD2 v GX100, shootout or an ideal pair?

    I also have both cameras and find they work well paired. Typically, I have the GRD2 with the 21mm lens mounted, and the GX100 set to 72mm with a CV 75mm VF on it. I have the 50mm CV VF also as well as the CV 28/35 minifinder so you can tell I love shooting with the finders. I prefer the file quality of the GRD2, but the GX100 is nice to have for the longer focal lengths.

    I will be finishing up a multipage article on the GRD2, GX100 and DLUX2 (hopefully soon) which will be submitted to Amin's Serious Compacts website (as well as on my own site). We just got back from a month-long driving trip from Vancouver down the coast to SF then on as far as Morro Bay then over to Yosemite and finally back home, I've got over 2000 pictures to go through, (they were all shot with the D300s I bought before leaving) so the article may not be finished as quick as I'd like!

    Cheers,

  7. #57
    Senior Member nostatic's Avatar
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    Re: GRD2 v GX100, shootout or an ideal pair?

    I didn't want to clutter up this thread with too much of the DLux3 talk so I started another (with legal disclaimer ). My bottom line so far is that the GRD2 and Dlux3 are just different cameras with different looks. To my eye the iso800 performance of the GRD2 is a particular strength. I can shoot the DLux3 high iso, and the shake reduction helps out in low light. But I prefer the look of the GRD2 files at higher iso.

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    Re: GRD2 v GX100, shootout or an ideal pair?

    Quote Originally Posted by nostatic View Post
    To my eye the iso800 performance of the GRD2 is a particular strength. I can shoot the DLux3 high iso, and the shake reduction helps out in low light. But I prefer the look of the GRD2 files at higher iso.
    I would agree totally, and add that IMO ISO performance between the GX100 and D-Lux3 are not significant; the GRD is superior to both of them.
    Jack
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    "Perfection is not attainable. But if we chase perfection, we can catch excellence."

  9. #59
    Senior Member JimCollum's Avatar
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    Re: GRD2 v GX100, shootout or an ideal pair?

    Quote Originally Posted by TEBnewyork View Post
    I'm captivated by Jim's less than pleased expression in contrast with his "happy" penguins.
    i'm surprised that Jack, who so often is captured with 'less-than-pleasing' expressions and poses, would so fool-heartily throw such a gauntlet into the ring.

    So Jack.. just when you think there can't possibly be a camera around for miles.....'snap'...

    Last edited by JimCollum; 27th May 2008 at 11:45.

  10. #60
    Sr. Administrator Jack's Avatar
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    Re: GRD2 v GX100, shootout or an ideal pair?

    FTR, it was so dark in that restaurant, I could not even see your face until I processed the images. Seriously, you looked to me just as you do in the first image.
    Jack
    home: www.getdpi.com

    "Perfection is not attainable. But if we chase perfection, we can catch excellence."

  11. #61
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    Re: GRD2 v GX100, shootout or an ideal pair?

    Quote Originally Posted by JimCollum View Post
    i'm surprised that Jack, who so often is captured with 'less-than-pleasing' expressions and poses, would so fool-heartily throw such a gauntlet into the ring.

    So Jack.. just when you think there can't possibly be a camera around for miles.....'snap'...

    I am sooooooo looking forward to this!

  12. #62
    Senior Member JimCollum's Avatar
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    Re: GRD2 v GX100, shootout or an ideal pair?

    Quote Originally Posted by TEBnewyork View Post
    I am sooooooo looking forward to this!
    this is looking very cost-effective at the moment

    http://www.usa.canon.com/consumer/co...&modelid=16358

  13. #63
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    Re: GRD2 v GX100, shootout or an ideal pair?

    Jim,

    The 2x tele converter is my treat.

  14. #64
    Sr. Administrator Jack's Avatar
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    Re: GRD2 v GX100, shootout or an ideal pair?

    I thought you guys were supposed to be my friends
    Jack
    home: www.getdpi.com

    "Perfection is not attainable. But if we chase perfection, we can catch excellence."

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    Re: GRD2 v GX100, shootout or an ideal pair?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Flesher View Post
    I thought you guys were supposed to be my friends
    We are your friends. Just not the boring ones, we like to have fun. Hey someone got me at Moab Diner either in MF or 1DsMIII detail with a mouth full of pancake (and posted it).

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    Re: GRD2 v GX100, shootout or an ideal pair?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Flesher View Post
    Here are my three girls playing with their flatware after an evening meal.
    Hmm . . . nice to see that you have their table manners so well under control.

    Our three boys are, of course, a completely different kettle of fish.

    Maybe we should get them together (how old are your girls?) our boys are: 25, 22, 20

    I WOULD post pictures, but much research failed to find a picture of them with cutlery on their noses.

    Just this guy you know

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    Re: GRD2 v GX100, shootout or an ideal pair?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Flesher View Post
    Here are my three girls playing with their flatware after an evening meal.
    Quote Originally Posted by jonoslack View Post
    Our three boys are, of course, a completely different kettle of fish.
    I WOULD post pictures
    I would post pix too; but they would show our daughter with our three boys after a total body painting session...I fear I would be banned..
    Sláinte

    Robert.

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    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: GRD2 v GX100, shootout or an ideal pair?

    Keep that damn GRD surprise me shots away from my ugly mug. Enough ugly pics in the world
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

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    Re: GRD2 v GX100, shootout or an ideal pair?

    So I get a sense no clear winner here. Okay maybe a heavy lean to the GRDII
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

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    Re: GRD2 v GX100, shootout or an ideal pair?

    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Campbell View Post
    I would post pix too; but they would show our daughter with our three boys after a total body painting session...I fear I would be banned..
    Hi Bertie
    I think it unlikely (that you'd be banned). Just post away.

    Just this guy you know

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    Re: GRD2 v GX100, shootout or an ideal pair?

    The owner can be bought with a GRDII, trust me. LOL
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

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    Re: GRD2 v GX100, shootout or an ideal pair?

    My three blowing out the candles on their 14th birthday cake.

    GRD2 ISO400 1/9s

  23. #73
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    Re: GRD2 v GX100, shootout or an ideal pair?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Flesher View Post
    Despite the weather this one is fantastic IMO with a great dynamic sky.

    Ricoh GX100, f2.7, 1/40 sec, ISO 800, -1.3 EV, handheld

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    Re: GRD2 v GX100, shootout or an ideal pair?

    Quote Originally Posted by jonoslack View Post
    Hi Bertie
    I think it unlikely (that you'd be banned). Just post away.
    Body painting as an art form.
    You are responsible for anything that happens to me, Jono!

    Balancing cutlery looks quite tame by comparison.
    Sláinte

    Robert.

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    Re: GRD2 v GX100, shootout or an ideal pair?

    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Campbell View Post
    Body painting as an art form.
    You are responsible for anything that happens to me, Jono!

    Balancing cutlery looks quite tame by comparison.

    I'll stick up for you through thick and thin! Say, aren't we missing a boy?
    You will be able to support yourself in your old age by blackmailing them with this photograph!
    It does look a little tamer than cutlery balancing.

    Will - do you have triplets . . . nice photo, if it's true, then you really are a man to conjure with!

    Just this guy you know

  26. #76
    Senior Member Robert Campbell's Avatar
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    Re: GRD2 v GX100, shootout or an ideal pair?

    Quote Originally Posted by jonoslack View Post

    I'll stick up for you through thick and thin! Say, aren't we missing a boy?
    I'll hold you to that, Jono. And yes, memory was playing tricks...the youngest was too young to indulge.
    Sláinte

    Robert.

  27. #77
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    Re: GRD2 v GX100, shootout or an ideal pair?

    That is just too damn funny. LOL

    Bertie your safe. LOL
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

  28. #78
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    Re: GRD2 v GX100, shootout or an ideal pair?

    What a riot. They were certainly having fun!

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