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Ricoh GR II

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chris_tribble

Guest
" Originally Posted by chris_tribble View Post
Another practical question to you good people. I'm now very seriously considering the GR2, but would like to avoid having to buy another finder. At the moment I use the Leica 21-24-28 on my M8 and am pretty OK with it. Does anyone have experience of using this on the GR2 - or any thoughts? I notice a couple of people have been using the Voigtlander 28 finder - maybe I shouldn't have sold mine!"

Yes, Chris. It's a great match with the GR2.

Cheers,

Sean
Sean - Thanks as ever... Probably picking up mine from RG Lewis in London at the weekend... it'll be fun to play with over Christmas...

On the subject of work rather than play, does anyone have any thoughts on the potential of the GR2 with the 40mm lens attachment for available light concert work where the clunk of the M8 might be an issue... Does the lens attachment seriously drop the f.stop?

Thanks to you all for an illuminating series of discussions,

Best

Chris
--
www.ctribble.co.uk
 
C

chris_tribble

Guest
I've pretty much resolved to buy a GR II, but now seem to have met a stumbling block.

I would like to buy an external viewfinder, but none except the Zeiss at $347 seem to be made to accept diopters which I need.

Anyone with the same problem? Solutions?

Thanks,

Mitchell
Mitchell - I use the Leica 21-24-28 on my M8 for this reason - I use a +2.5 diopter... Got the finder second hand - though I think they're harder to get now.. As you'll see above, Sean confirms that it's OK on the Ricoh...

Best

Chris
 
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Mitch Alland

Guest
...On the subject of work rather than play, does anyone have any thoughts on the potential of the GR2 with the 40mm lens attachment for available light concert work where the clunk of the M8 might be an issue... Does the lens attachment seriously drop the f.stop?...
Chris:

As far as I know the 40mm converter has not hit the stores yet. But if it is like the 21mm converter, which keeps the maximum aperture at f/2.4, then there is no loss in the f-stop.

—Mitch/Bangkok
http://www.flickr.com/photos/10268776@N00/
 
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jorgeAD

Guest
GRD2 @ 1/1600 sec flash sync and first impressions

My GRD2 finally arrived. It brings back memories of my Olympus XA and Ricoh GR1... Its even smaller than those already very small cameras, yet the lens/sensor resolution seems much better than the XA (and I suspect a tad sharper than the GR1 though I still have to run some conclusive tests).

Instead of repeating stuff others have already made clear here, at the leica users forum and at ricohforum, I will concentrate on how this little pocket camera lets me apply some big camera skills. I am coming from a full frame Canon 5D, so please bear with me if I seem to compare peaches to oranges, as I got the Ricoh as a go-everywhere alternative to the Canon. Also keep in mind most of the time I shoot my 5D in manual mode and use zone focusing with wide angle lenses...

I feel at home with the stepped manual focusing in the GRD2... it reminds me of the way rangefinders or the XA were used before all the AF gaga started: setting focus before raising the camera to the eye, in order to concentrate in framing and the decisive moment. Even with a tele lense on the 5D I use the * button on the back to preset focus and forget about it. So manually prefocusing the GRD2 seemed completely natural to me. AF wasnt particularly slow on the Ricoh, it just wasnt instantaneous (neither is it on the 5D) so the last thing I want is to wait for the camera to acquire focus "after" I press the shutter and while the subjects drifts away and the composition get ruined (or those blessed moments when the camera decides to "fix" focus between two consecutive shots).

I love the way the ADJ button on the GRD2 quickly switches between exposure compensation, white balance and ISO setting. I have been using Canon digital SLRs since the D60 and this way of keeping everything under a single dial/button makes so much more sense I am amazed. This is critical since the tiny sensor inside the GRD2 apparently starts to run into diffraction (spread every image forming point so the image looses acutance) around F5.0 ( at least according to Sean Reid GX100 test, I have to run my own tests with the GRD2). In real world usage this means the ISO must be switched very often in order to keep the apertures at F5.0 or wider when moving from shadow to sunlight.

The AutoWB does a great job in the Ricoh, even better than the Canon especially with tungsten, still I dont give it much thought since I only shoot RAW and WB can be decided at the conversion step. "A" MODE did a pretty good job with exposure, except when the subject was backlit or strongly sidelit (my two favorite light directions) so as with every camera I have had for the last 20 years I ended up shooting in M MODE for everything but bland cloudy days or open shade.

I was concerned about dynamic range loss with the GRD2 tiny sensor. Coming from the 5D full frame sensor there is a perceivable detail loss in the highlights (the WHITE SATURATION warning flashes a LOT more often). I'd say as often as it did with the D60... So I'd be wary to recommend this camera to landscape/architectural photographers, often struggling to retain highlght detail and unable to use fill-flash. Still the GRD2 raw seems to have plenty of shadow detail exposure latitude (at least below ISO 400) so when there is a will...

Here's is a little workaround and some unexpected finding: the GRD2 not only works great with an external flash but can Sync up to 1/1600 of a sec! The closest I have been to this high speed flash sync was with my medium format Bronicas that got up to 1/500 of a second :eek::

This shot was taken at ISO 80, F4.5, 1/1600 and lit with a Sunpak 383super and a coiled sync cord. A previous shot set for the shadow detail completely blew the sky detail outside the window. EXIF was stripped by Noiseware, which I was testing as well and isnt required at this low ISO:
 
S

Sean_Reid

Guest
Sean - Thanks as ever... Probably picking up mine from RG Lewis in London at the weekend... it'll be fun to play with over Christmas...

On the subject of work rather than play, does anyone have any thoughts on the potential of the GR2 with the 40mm lens attachment for available light concert work where the clunk of the M8 might be an issue... Does the lens attachment seriously drop the f.stop?

Thanks to you all for an illuminating series of discussions,

Best

Chris
--
www.ctribble.co.uk
Hi Chris,

I should have the 40 to test within the next week. Ricoh is sending it directly from Japan. I don't recall any drop in aperture.

Cheers,

Sean
 

Mitchell

New member
Chris,

Thanks for your reply. I ordered a GRD II from Tony Rose, and he told me the EV 2 Viewfinder does well with glasses so I'm going to try that. I hoping to use the Ricoh mostly for spontaneous people shots so it might be best if I don't have to take off my glasses like I have done with my Leicas.

Of course now I can't wait for the GRD II.

Best,

Mitchell
 
A

arrakis10

Guest
Hi,

I just bought my GRD2.

I'm happy to see the beautiful noise and now i always shoot in 800iso.
I'm very impressed too by the macro.

2 pictures.


 
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jorgeAD

Guest
It looks so clean because it is ISO 100 (check the EXIF)... Still it is beautiful sidelighted photo, most likely channel mixed to produce the equivalent of an orange or red filter BW shot, making great aesthetic use of the clipped highlights... a sad trademark of the GRD II.

I live in the tropics, and every time I have shot the GRD II in the street with the sun out I have gotten clipped highlights, even with a -2/3 EV compensation. I shot Velvia almost exclusively for several years and the GRD II narrow dynamic range IS an issue...

Since I love the GRD II lens, ergonomics and operation I am looking for a way to overcome the dynamic range limitations of this camera (or any small sensor camera for that matter).

Has anyone tried "converting" three different exposure settings from a single RAW file and adding these three images to the HDR (high dynamic range) function of Photoshop CS2 or HDR software like Photomatix or Artizen?:

http://www.hdrsoft.com/

http://www.supportingcomputers.net/Applications/Artizen/Tour/HDREditing.htm

Regards,
Jorge
 
S

Sean_Reid

Guest
It looks so clean because it is ISO 100 (check the EXIF)... Still it is beautiful sidelighted photo, most likely channel mixed to produce the equivalent of an orange or red filter BW shot, making great aesthetic use of the clipped highlights... a sad trademark of the GRD II.

I live in the tropics, and every time I have shot the GRD II in the street with the sun out I have gotten clipped highlights, even with a -2/3 EV compensation. I shot Velvia almost exclusively for several years and the GRD II narrow dynamic range IS an issue...

Since I love the GRD II lens, ergonomics and operation I am looking for a way to overcome the dynamic range limitations of this camera (or any small sensor camera for that matter).

Has anyone tried "converting" three different exposure settings from a single RAW file and adding these three images to the HDR (high dynamic range) function of Photoshop CS2 or HDR software like Photomatix or Artizen?:

http://www.hdrsoft.com/

http://www.supportingcomputers.net/Applications/Artizen/Tour/HDREditing.htm

Regards,
Jorge
You're right that small sensor cameras tend to have more limited dynamic range. And this is another area in which having a lower noise file can help. In photography of dynamic subjects, the only way to hold the highlights with these cameras is to expose for them. That may often later mean digging into the shadows a bit to recover detail. The further down in the shadows the noise floor is, the more flexible the file will be for this process.

Cheers,

Sean
 
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wbrandsma

Guest
In extreme situations I even tend to underexpose by more than -1 EV. I will loose shadowdetails, but I will have much better highlights. Especially with B&W photography this works really well for me.
 
S

Sean_Reid

Guest
In extreme situations I even tend to underexpose by more than -1 EV. I will loose shadowdetails, but I will have much better highlights. Especially with B&W photography this works really well for me.
I tend to sacrifice shadows for highlights myself, if I have to. But, of course, the cleaner those shadows are, the more shadow detail one can recover (if desired).

Cheers,

Sean
 
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wbrandsma

Guest
I guess I prefer blacks in my images. I don't always want details everywhere. I try to preserve the highlights. It is so easy to get blown highlights with these cams (even with my older Olympus C4000z).
 

cam

Active member
In extreme situations I even tend to underexpose by more than -1 EV. I will loose shadowdetails, but I will have much better highlights. Especially with B&W photography this works really well for me.
do you do this in only bright light situations? or flat light as well? i'm going to Normandie next week for the holidays and am happy i have the GRDII for the shots i'm hoping to get. and, yes, i will shoot these RAW! i'm just trying to figure out what would be good settings to start with for brooding seascapes. we're staying at a house that has a beach that exposes mussels at low tide. it can be very dark and, often times, very flat light. i can mess around in manual, but do i still want to under-expose in this situation?
 

Stuart Richardson

Active member
Just check your histogram. If it is significantly clipping the highlights, apply some negative exposure compensation. If the histogram looks good, leave it alone.
 

cam

Active member
Just check your histogram. If it is significantly clipping the highlights, apply some negative exposure compensation. If the histogram looks good, leave it alone.
thank you, Stuart. i just wanted to make sure i was understanding correctly. we're going down tomorrow to make sure the house is in working order so i'll get a dry run with the camera as well. i appreciate the help.
 
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jorgeAD

Guest
Thanks for the "expose for the highlights" bit... That's the way I learned to expose slide film as well, its no coincidence that the work of great documentary photographers such as Alex Webb or Rio Branco makes such frequent use of silhouettes...

Trouble is a normal sunlight scene here in the tropics seems to exceed the dynamic range of the GRD II by over three stops. I mean when I moved from the 20D to the 5D an unexpected blessing was over a full stop gain in dynamic range...

Now moving to the GRD II seems like going back not one but three generations of Canon CMOS sensors... right back to the D60... and trying to shoehorn a seven stop scene into a four stop dynamic range means a three stop underexposure and greatly enhancing shadow noise...

A word of caution for that Normandie trip... dont overtrust the GRD II histogram ! I have been repeatedly deceived by it as it seems to gently roll inside the window yet the highlights arent even there... it is much better to check the WHITE SATURATION blinking highlights warning (one more push of the DISPLAY button after the histogram screen)...

I have to attend other matters for a couple of days... promise to be back on tuesday with some samples of High Dynamic Range magic from a single GRD II DNG file !

Cheers
Jorge
 
W

wbrandsma

Guest
do you do this in only bright light situations? or flat light as well? i'm going to Normandie next week for the holidays and am happy i have the GRDII for the shots i'm hoping to get. and, yes, i will shoot these RAW! i'm just trying to figure out what would be good settings to start with for brooding seascapes. we're staying at a house that has a beach that exposes mussels at low tide. it can be very dark and, often times, very flat light. i can mess around in manual, but do i still want to under-expose in this situation?
The most important thing is to view you histogram, but like said previously it will clip very easily to right. I mostly underexpose therefor by -0.3 to -0.7EV. When the dynamic range exceeds 5 lightstops (very often with bright light situations) I will try to go for -1EV.
Have a nice stay in Normandie and hope to see great pictures from your trip.
 
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