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Thread: dp1 and sigma photo pro

  1. #1
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    dp1 and sigma photo pro

    is it my imagination or does the sigma 2.5 photo pro give a lot more detail and richer color than lightroom 2? it should, saving tif files as 80mb!

    wayne
    www.pbase.com/wwp
    Last edited by smokysun; 3rd February 2009 at 18:23.

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    Subscriber Member Streetshooter's Avatar
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    Re: dp1 and sigma photo pro

    How do you run that software in your workflow?
    I haven't loaded it yet as I convert to dng.
    shooter

  3. #3
    ddk
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    Re: dp1 and sigma photo pro

    Quote Originally Posted by smokysun View Post
    is it my imagination or does the sigma 2.5 photo pro give a lot more detail and richer color than lightroom 2? it should, saving tif files as 80mb!

    wayne
    www.pbase.com/wwp
    I think that photo pro does a better job than LR at converting sigma raw files too but its a bear to use, I hated it. Anyway I don't see why even bother with photo pro when you process the files to this extent.

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    Re: dp1 and sigma photo pro

    this is the first time i've used it (just loaded it myself, after someone else had written the conversion seemed better) usually i download everything with lr 2 and then convert the ones i like to tiff. then i use paint shop pro with plugins. this time i picked a few to convert with the sigma.

    as i said, the tiff files huge this way, 80mb, but with a lot of info. i have the psp on a separate 64 bit hard drive so it handles the files fairly fast (4gigs of ram).

    yes, the sigma a bear to use. i would suggest simply converting them without processing in the sigma. the reason to do so is the information. i don't really post-process that much, i merely try to pull out all the color and detail i can.

    here's an 84% crop from the third picture. maybe that shows what i mean.

    wayne
    www.pbase.com/wwp
    Last edited by smokysun; 3rd February 2009 at 18:23.

  5. #5
    ddk
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    Re: dp1 and sigma photo pro

    Quote Originally Posted by smokysun View Post
    this is the first time i've used it (just loaded it myself, after someone else had written the conversion seemed better) usually i download everything with lr 2 and then convert the ones i like to tiff. then i use paint shop pro with plugins. this time i picked a few to convert with the sigma.

    as i said, the tiff files huge this way, 80mb, but with a lot of info. i have the psp on a separate 64 bit hard drive so it handles the files fairly fast (4gigs of ram).

    yes, the sigma a bear to use. i would suggest simply converting them without processing in the sigma. the reason to do so is the information. i don't really post-process that much, i merely try to pull out all the color and detail i can.

    here's an 84% crop from the third picture. maybe that shows what i mean.

    wayne
    www.pbase.com/wwp
    I don't have my Sigmas anymore and at the time, 2 months ago, photo pro was still the only game in town, and using it was like pulling teeth for me and one of the major reasons for not keeping them. I don't know what settings you're using here but I know that photo pro is very heavy handed with sharpening but this image still looks like it has gone through some kind of post processing, either hdr or some sort of contrast enhancing plug-in.

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    Senior Member simonclivehughes's Avatar
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    Re: dp1 and sigma photo pro

    Wayne,

    I'm curious about your processing too. Would you be willing to give a general overview of your workflow?

    Ciao,

    Simon

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    Subscriber Member Streetshooter's Avatar
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    Re: dp1 and sigma photo pro

    Ditto what Simon Sayz....hmmmmm

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    Re: dp1 and sigma photo pro

    I guess my situation is different. I have never been a fan of LR/ACR conversions, and I don't find SPP to be hard to use at all. However, all I use it for is to convert the DP1 raw files to tiff that I then process in CS4. I use Auto in SPP, and it produces a rather flat looking tiff file that retains lots of information in the shadows and highlights. That gives you lots to work with in Photoshop, or whatever PP software you use. To me, the conversions done this way are much better than converting in LR or ACR. IMHO.

    Bill

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    Re: dp1 and sigma photo pro

    Holy moly, images posted in here all look quite abstract looking! Very nice works, hehe

    The images here all look like some sort of HDR have been implemented, hence why the noise levels are so high in the shadow areas, which can be seen easier on the cropped in bus shot.

    The HDR technique used looks like some sort do "detail enhancer"

    Am i right or wrong?

    Mazor

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    Subscriber Member Streetshooter's Avatar
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    Re: dp1 and sigma photo pro

    Mazor,
    Good point and I wouldn't use that for my own work. I am interested in hearing opinions about the Sigma SW. I use LR & CS3 and am happy but there seems to be a movement that finds better results the other way. The HDR stuff is not photographic to me, it looks like acrylic or oil.....Maybe cause I work with many artist...but that's what I see in it.....
    shooter

  11. #11
    ddk
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    Re: dp1 and sigma photo pro

    Quote Originally Posted by Streetshooter View Post
    Mazor,
    Good point and I wouldn't use that for my own work. I am interested in hearing opinions about the Sigma SW. I use LR & CS3 and am happy but there seems to be a movement that finds better results the other way. The HDR stuff is not photographic to me, it looks like acrylic or oil.....Maybe cause I work with many artist...but that's what I see in it.....
    shooter
    Photo Pro will give you different looking tiffs than those produced with PS or LR. The images will look sharper and seem to have more resolution and tonality. Sharpness is due to Photo Pro's very heavy handed sharpening algorithms which you can't completely turn off, the tonality is a matter of taste but like any other dedicated the system that I've tried, Sigma's own software will give you a more unique look than generic converters, you have to decide for yourself if you like it or not. It doesn't cost anything just download a copy and give it a whirl!

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    Re: dp1 and sigma photo pro

    interesting observations. i find dedicated (and classical) photographers don't like the hdr look. but the general public (friends, etc) find it more 'real'. irony of ironies. "all art is transformation." yes, i'm increasing the tonal contrast, which i suppose is the equivalent of tone-mapping in hdr. that's after the conversion, perhaps removing some noise (which i did not do in the bus one), warming a bit, and so on. it's simple, but you need a file which provides lots and lots of information.

    hope that clarifies a bit.

    wayne
    www.pbase.com/wwp

    ps. here's a re-post of some taken with the digilux 2. of all the pictures i've ever taken these got the most positive responses for emotional impact. and that seems to me what we all ultimately want, however we get it.
    Last edited by smokysun; 3rd February 2009 at 18:23.

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    Re: dp1 and sigma photo pro

    thx smokysun for that confirmation. Indeed the RAW files have to hold alot of information!

    I find my 5D can do alot more HDR extreme range from a single RAW file when compared to my LX3's RAW files.

    What would be good if someone could compare DP1's full HDR tone mapping against the LX3 tone mapping HDR all from RAW files of course

    MAzor

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    Re: dp1 and sigma photo pro

    you're very welcome. and that comparison would be interesting for me. the lx3 seems a lot more responsive, better in low-light, etc., but i shot so many with the d-lux 2/lx 1 that i thought "i've done that." the panasonic look would still be the same.

    wayne
    www.pbase.com/wwp

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    Re: dp1 and sigma photo pro

    Wayne,

    Norman Rockwell would have been a photographer if he met you and saw your images....

    It's not just the Americana vision but the sensitivities and sensibilities that the images evoke. It's not my style but I like looking/feeling them.....
    There's something about the last image that brings more of you to the front.....Like you were just seeing and not being a photographer....(Love the Bear head in the sky...)

    Don

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    Re: dp1 and sigma photo pro

    Yes the "Panasonic look" would be pretty similar to the LX1/d-lux 2 but the Lx3/Dlux4 is meant to offer that much more than the previous models in terms of noise at higher ISOs as well as overall dynamic range.

    Since the DP1 is supposed to be the king in dynamic range, one would expect it to outclass the LX3 still in these kind of tests right?

    Mazor

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    Re: dp1 and sigma photo pro

    Smoky sun - cool look, very much like photorealistic paintings of the 70's. I see them as pushing the edge of illustration actually. Works best on certain images and not others though (for me at least). Like the second and last in the fire outlook (?) series. I would tread lightly with the heavy post for everyday images but then use it when apropo and you could have a unique series.

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    Re: dp1 and sigma photo pro

    I have to agree with Don about images that are obviously HDR, they tend to leave me Cold.
    Wayne, I love these images, you have a unique eye. Always look forward to your new work. The work crew series with the digilux are remarkable. I did a double take about the bear head Don mentioned then saw it.

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    Re: dp1 and sigma photo pro

    thanks, everybody. i agree about these methods working with some kinds of pictures and not others (subject matter). after the mention of the 5d i thought i'd try a couple of its files. here they are. and a 100 % crop.

    wayne
    www.pbase.com/wwp

    ps. conversion done in the canon software. the tiff files 74mb, almost the same as the dp1.
    Last edited by smokysun; 14th February 2009 at 20:35.

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    Re: dp1 and sigma photo pro

    wow, this HDR thing is pretty awesome! The 5d shots have so much dynamic range. Especially the ones with windows looking outside. Lots of grain though, did you not use any form of noise reduction?

    MAzor

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    Re: dp1 and sigma photo pro

    yes, i used a mild dose of neat image on the chrome only. thought the noise not really a distraction, more a part of the pattern. just got the 5d before xmas and haven't really explored it. would love to have the new one!

    wayne
    www.pbase.com/wwp

    ps. here are two more. the first converted in the canon pro foto and then worked in paint shop pro. the second both converted and worked in psp can you tell any difference? the steps all the same.
    Last edited by smokysun; 14th February 2009 at 20:35.

  22. #22
    ddk
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    Re: dp1 and sigma photo pro

    Quote Originally Posted by smokysun View Post
    yes, i used a mild dose of neat image on the chrome only. thought the noise not really a distraction, more a part of the pattern. just got the 5d before xmas and haven't really explored it. would love to have the new one!

    wayne
    www.pbase.com/wwp

    ps. here are two more. the first converted in the canon pro foto and then worked in paint shop pro. the second both converted and worked in psp can you tell any difference? the steps all the same.
    Yes there are some differences but I still think that they're moot with this type of post processing. To prove the point here are few quickies processed in PS from small Ricoh jpgs, if you can't even tell which camera they came from when the files are processed to this extent you can forget about the differences in raw processors. I'm displaying them in order of processing strength from least to most amount applied;





















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    Re: dp1 and sigma photo pro

    [QUOTE=ddk;68210]Yes there are some differences but I still think that they're moot with this type of post processing. To prove the point here are few quickies processed in PS from small Ricoh jpgs, if you can't even tell which camera they came from when the files are processed to this extent you can forget about the differences in raw processors. I'm displaying them in order of processing strength from least to most amount applied;





    here are the two similar ones side by side, the ricoh and dp1. to my eye the the dp1 raw has more detail, smoother transitions, fewer crude edges. on the other hand, it's pretty difficult to compare small jpgs on the monitor with the larger files. depending on how much you want to process, i suspect you could tell which camera used.

    however, your point is well taken. these small sensors can give a painterly look. alas, most people are impressed by detail. yet many of the most famous pictures don't have that much, hcb's puddle-jumper, for example.
    Last edited by smokysun; 14th February 2009 at 20:35.

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    Re: dp1 and sigma photo pro

    ddk, some amazing angles you are getting there with the ricoh. Really taking advantage of wider angles and embracing it.

    I have never seen HDR images pushed to extremes and yet have worked out so well.

    kudos to all

    Mazor

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