The GetDPI Photography Forum

Great to see you here. Join our insightful photographic forum today and start tapping into a huge wealth of photographic knowledge. Completing our simple registration process will allow you to gain access to exclusive content, add your own topics and posts, share your work and connect with other members through your own private inbox! And don’t forget to say hi!

Sigma DP1

Daniel

New member
To get back on-topic, I'm most curious as to how the DP1's files will work in B&W. It seems like the Foveon is almost a dedicated color sensor and that it might not work well for B&W.

It'd be nice to have an M8-like compact for backup.
maggie, does it matter? i thought it's simply a matter of converting the color file into black and white. no?
 
S

Sean_Reid

Guest
If one is converting the file from color to B&W after the fact, it shouldn't matter much so long as the file has the color information one wants (as the base for the tonal interpretations).

Cheers,

Sean
 
S

Sean_Reid

Guest
Regarding the so called "storm" on the other thread there is something I would really like to comment and hope won´t bother anyone, just my opinion.

I feel very sad about members having to be "removed" from any forum. But I must say regarding members like "lucridders": Well, he certainly was allways moaning about the crappy results he was getting from his Ricoh and to be honest I never read a positive comment from him, but in any case, he was (and is) entitled to have whatever opinions he wants, and if the guy wasn´t capable of producing acceptable images from his machine, well, sorry for him, but i don´t think that is a reason to ban a person from a public space like this one. I failed to find a post from him that was unrespectfull or rude (please if he was rude at any point, excuse me for not finding such posts), and I don´t think he deserved being punished just for giving an unpopular opinion..

I understand that moderating a quickly-growing place such as this is not easy, and I know I wouldn´t do it any better than Guy or Jack, but such decisions need to be taken very carefully..

Now, back to photography and light-capture devices!!

Erik.
Hi Erik,

This is one tangent I hope doesn't gather much steam but, to clarify, this isn't a public space. It's a private set of web forums with two owners - Jack and Guy. They've taken a brave, unusual and admirable stand in saying that everyone on these forums will respect the rules set out or be booted. I'm *not* going to debate the specific conduct of any particular person here but the fact is that, on these private forums, one either respects the rules of conduct or leaves.

Taking that stance has at least two consequences:

1) We get to enjoy a real rarity; a set of forums where discussion is civil and respectful. Most forums are neither and are often dominated by trolling, rudeness, childishness, etc.

2) Jack and Guy have to take the heat now and again for sticking to their guns and enforcing the rules. I'm glad that they both have the cojones to do that. Fortunately, this is their place and they can set and enforce whatever rules they like. In doing that that are creating a really unique space for grown-ups to discuss photography.

Specifically, because of the stance they've taken, this has become my personal favorite set of forums on the web. I think there may be some others who feel the same way. Whether or not I agree with every ban, per se, I very much support their efforts to enforce the rules if needed.

Cheers,

Sean
 
Last edited:

Robert Campbell

Well-known member
Well, if the file in B&W only has 4.something usable MP then it matters.
Don't forget that in the usual Bayer array, any pixel's colour information is an average of its surroundings; so you could say that any Bayer sensor's resolution should be divided by 8. [or is it 9]
 

Maggie O

Active member
Hi Maggie,

But it doesn't because the final file is a blend of the channels.

Cheers,

Sean
So would the final file have dimensions closer to a 10-14MP file?

I'm still fuzzy on how that sensor works and what sort of files it will produce.
 

Brian Mosley

New member
Hello folks! thanks for the heads-up Jono, I do have these forums on my favourite's list, and revisit every day or so...

I took the E-400 as the next logical step up from the Panasonic LX1, in the endless balancing act between image quality, portability and flexibility.

The Hexanon AR fit lenses can be modified to fit the 4/3rd mount by removing the auto-aperture leaver, and adding a spacing ring.

Scroll down this page for the best conversion method I've seen so far :
http://www.snaar.co.uk/lenses/

Amin is correct - you need a KatzEye split prism focusing screen ideally, and you have to accept the short telephoto range for shallow dof shots. I find that acceptable though, for portraits like these :

E-400, Hexanon 57mm f1.2 @f1.2


The Hexanon 40mm f1.8 pancake is very sharp, and the most compact option - very close to the size of the Sigma DP1, but of course 80mm EFL. The E-400 Kodak CCD is pretty special too...

Some example shots :



and here's a shot taken by my son... just gave him the E-400 set to f5.6 and ISO 800 :)


All we need is for Olympus to give us a 14mm f2.8 prime lens!

Kind Regards

Brian
 

Lili

New member
Brian,
Thank you for that information!
Lovely pics too!
I know the sensor in the e400 differs from the e410 which is available here.
What is your view on the e410?
 

Robert Campbell

Well-known member
I'm still fuzzy on how that sensor works and what sort of files it will produce.
What are you 'fuzzy' on? The sensor works sort of like colour film in 3 dimensions, rather than the 2 of the usual CCD/CMOS. Theoretically 'better', but harder to achieve in practice.
 
S

Sean_Reid

Guest
Hi Maggie,

If you're really curious, I'd recommend downloading a couple RAW files from the Sigma SD14 (or one of the earlier Sigma DSLRs) and see what you think. Also, Phil Askey's review of the SD 10, http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/sigmasd10/, might be interesting to read as background on the Foveon. Also check imaging-resource.com for Sigma SLR reviews. I think the principle is the same with all of these Sigma cameras.

Cheers,

Sean
 
S

Sean_Reid

Guest
Also...I haven't tested a Sigma yet but, based on what I've seen so far, I suspect that the files will up-res much better than their MP size might suggest. Obviously, I'll know more when I have the actual DP1 in my hands.

Cheers,

Sean
 

Terry

New member
To get back on-topic, I'm most curious as to how the DP1's files will work in B&W. It seems like the Foveon is almost a dedicated color sensor and that it might not work well for B&W.

It'd be nice to have an M8-like compact for backup.
Maggie,
Way back when (oh about a year ago) when Sigma said it was coming I spent a long time looking at the Sigma Forum at DP Review. From what I have seen and the questions I've asked the Foveon sensor can give some stunning B&W results.

terry
 

Maggie O

Active member
Sean, thanks for the links! I'll play around and read up some more.

Or, better yet, I'll just go shoot with the M8 a bunch!
 
S

Sean_Reid

Guest
That's a good idea too. In a couple of weeks, I'll start one of my most intense extended periods of photographing and I'm looking forward to it. The M8 is still the M8.

Cheers,

Sean
 

Photon-hunter

New member
This is one tangent I hope doesn't gather much steam
Sean and everybody else, this is certainly the last post I am dedicating to this issue( I certainly prefer to discuss photography, and there is a lot to learn from some of you guys here..).

to clarify, this isn't a public space. It's a private set of web forums with two owners - Jack and Guy
That is a good point, it already is difficult enough to try and write my thoughts in english, but I think you all "sort of" understand what I meant by "public space".

They've taken a brave, unusual and admirable stand in saying that everyone on these forums will respect the rules set out or be booted.
I have nothing but respect for Jack and Guy (who by the way I have known for years from posting in other places) for providing this space. My activity in other forums had decreased to the point of nearly desapearing, and as I stated on my first post this place seems really special and it is strange how familar you can feel with the comunity only a couple of days after joining.


I'm *not* going to debate the specific conduct of any particular person here but the fact is that, on these private forums, one either respects the rules of conduct or leaves.

Taking that stance has at least two consequences:

1) We get to enjoy a real rarity; a set of forums where discussion is civil and respectful. Most forums are neither and are often dominated by trolling, rudeness, childishness, etc.

2) Jack and Guy have to take the heat now and again for sticking to their guns and enforcing the rules. I'm glad that they both have the cojones to do that. Fortunately, this is their place and they can set and enforce whatever rules they like. In doing that that are creating a really unique space for grown-ups to discuss photography.

Specifically, because of the stance they've taken, this has become my personal favorite set of forums on the web. I think there may be some others who feel the same way. Whether or not I agree with every ban, per se, I very much support their efforts to enforce the rules if needed.

Cheers,

Sean
I have nothing against or in favour of any particular members here. As said before I am new here and maybe my post was a bit "out of beat", but I just wanted to show my concern. I ignore past issues and will try not to interfere with the moderation of functioning of this place any more (though knowing my nature I will "drop" my opinion from time to time...just for the health of it all..). I hope not to bother anybody with my personal concerns..

Now back on photography. After a long time I re-subscribed to Sean´s reviews recently. I had forgotten how unique his approach to reviews and equipment is, and would like to recomend anybody who hasn´t to give it a try, really worth it. Thanks Sean. And by the way...WHAT´S NEXT???;)

Good light to all..

Erik.
 
G

gropec

Guest
Also...I haven't tested a Sigma yet but, based on what I've seen so far, I suspect that the files will up-res much better than their MP size might suggest. Obviously, I'll know more when I have the actual DP1 in my hands.

Cheers,

Sean
I confirm this : I have done some 16x23 inches prints from the Dpreview Las Vegas samples gallery, and it's really impressive !! With or whithout up-sampling, the results in terms of details are widely better than the Bayer 8Mp of the Ricoh GR (and also the 10MP of the GRII, from which I have made some print tests). The up-sampling is even not inevitable, and the only artefacts on this print sizes are some jagged lines with high contrast (but imperceptible at 0,5 feet , average distance of observation for this sizes of prints)

Please pardon my vague English..
Christophe
 

Brian Mosley

New member
Hi Lili,

Brian,
Thank you for that information!
Lovely pics too!
I know the sensor in the e400 differs from the e410 which is available here.
What is your view on the e410?
I posted a reply earlier, but it got lost when I was interrupted by a pm... so here goes again!

The E-410 is simply a mainstream version of the E-400 with a Panasonic NMOS sensor, which is a better performer above 400 ISO - although some E-400 owners (myself included) romanticise about the Kodak CCD in the E-400 having better colour character at base ISO. I don't think there's enough of a difference to worry about... especially if you shoot RAW (which I recommend)

On the subject of RAW, the E-410 compresses RAW to <10MB which is very welcome. It also provides a form of live-view which can be very useful for tripod based work (i.e. macros).

The twin kit lens version of the E-410 is excellent optical quality, and superb value for money, but I suspect there will be an E-420 announced in the next couple of months, hopefully with an even better sensor - perhaps derived from the E-3.

I find the ergonomics of the E-400 series to be excellent, and surprisingly close to the DP1 in size, with the added quality and flexibility of 4/3rd lens choice...

E-410 compared with DP1

Hope that helps,

Kind Regards

Brian
 
Top