Recommendations sought from Sony [i]cognoscenti[/i]

[douglasf13]

Iliah Borg does the color transforms for Andrey's (hardloaf) program, RPP, so he would certainly be a good guy to ask about color differences, if any. The sensor hardware is probably the same. If there is a color difference, it could be down to something like white balance preconditioning, but I have no idea.

 

[peterv]

Hi Dave,

I used the CZ 85 mm f1.4 against the pre-asph 90 'Cron.
The Zeiss gave me the look typical for what I get from my other CZ lenses, 16-35 and 135 on the A900.

I guess I expected the Zeiss to do better against the pre-asph 90 'Cron.

Peter

 

[dhsimmonds]

You know, I've been wanting to 'test' this myself for a long time so today I finally took the time and went to my dealer and took about 80 shots on both the A900 and the M9.
I still have nice Leica glass from my M8-days and I've been thinking about the M9 for quite some time now.

Here are my notes, YMMV, this is a very personal thing.


Leica

- Lightweight but hard to handle
- Expensive
- Difficult to handle: push this while turning that buttons (ISO) / I inadvertently pushed buttons (on-off) / less display information / exp. comp. and WB takes time to change
- Rangefinder window too small for me with long lenses and no accurate composition
- No image stabilization (but no mirror)
- Difficult focusing with MF, slow
- better color (with good Leica glass)
- better micro-contrast (with good Leica glass)
- better sharpness (if I get the MF set correctly, but for close to medium range this is difficult for me)
- fine (small, filmgrain-like) noise
- Feels good for me to work with a Leica


Sony

- Heavyweight but easy to handle
- Cheap
- Easy handling: quick and easy to reach all buttons / good ergonomics / clear display with good information / exp. comp. and WB easy to change
- 100% Excellent bright viewfinder
- Image stabilization (and mirrorslap)
- easy to focus by AF, relatively fast
- less deep and less saturated colors (though with Zeiss glass)
- less micro-contrast (though with Zeiss glass)
- less sharpness (but always in focus)
- blotchy noise
- Sony does not not give me special feelings...


I decided to stay with my two A900's because of ergonomics. Maybe wait for a mirrorless FF Leica that can take new M quality Leica AF glass - and S lenses ;-)

Note: these are merely my personal thoughts, not trying to start a looooong discussion :salute:

Peter I totally agree, although my own similar test of over two years ago was with the A900 v Leica R9/DMR at 10mpx, 16bit colour. The quality of the files were undoubtedly superior to the Sony's 12 bit , 25mpx files. But I decided to keep the Sony and sell the Leica and I have never regretted that decision.

Leica glass has a certain something that is difficult to describe but the Zeiss glass has nice colour and is consistent. Overall I get many more keepers with my Sony than I ever did with my Leica and what's more I just love the ergonomics of the A900. Taking photographs is as much about enjoying using the tools as producing a good result IMHO.

 

[edwardkaraa]

I was very interested with the M9 and have visited the Leica forum regularly during that period. The impression I had was that the posters had to work quite extensively with the files. Results out of the camera were not that good color wise. I found that I much prefer the colors from the A900, which coincidentally are already great out of the camera with little to no PP.

Regarding IS, I have also experienced occasional blurry images caused by it, even at high shutter speeds. My observation is that one has to keep an eye on the shake indicator in the VF. If I shoot before the meter settles the image is going to be most probably not so sharp. That's why I only use it when I know I will be shooting at Low shutter speeds and keep it off when not needed. Admittedly I have gotten only a few frames out of 13000 that I could attribute their blurriness to IS.

 

[Quino Terceño]

Sony, read this:

Make it so we can choose a shutter speed range were the IS will kick in without further user intervention, sort of what happens with the auto ISO. The icing on the cake will be an option where the camera detects that a tripod is attached and turns IS off. Please to achieve this do not come out with a propietary tripod head, iISO kind of thing.

 

[Braeside]

Sony, read this:

Make it so we can choose a shutter speed range were the IS will kick in without further user intervention, sort of what happens with the auto ISO. The icing on the cake will be an option where the camera detects that a tripod is attached and turns IS off. Please to achieve this do not come out with a propietary tripod head, iISO kind of thing.

+1 Would be a neat option.

 

[Rand47]

+1 Would be a neat option.

Or, allow SSS "off" to be a selection in the 3 presets as is focus status regardless of switch position. That way one of the presets could be configured for tripod shooting.

My "high-tech" solution below

 

[Braeside]

LOL, I like the SSS OFF label.

I need another one to remind me to switch it back on again afterwards, maybe under the dovetail?

 

[douglasf13]

An issue with the auto-tripod-SSS-switch solution is that, depending on your shutter speed and tripod stability (including environmental factors like wind,) it is occasionally good to leave SSS on when using a tripod (and even moreso with a monopod.) Someone did a test of this years ago, but I don't have the link

 

[peterv]

Peter I totally agree, although my own similar test of over two years ago was with the A900 v Leica R9/DMR at 10mpx, 16bit colour. The quality of the files were undoubtedly superior to the Sony's 12 bit , 25mpx files. But I decided to keep the Sony and sell the Leica and I have never regretted that decision.

Leica glass has a certain something that is difficult to describe but the Zeiss glass has nice colour and is consistent. Overall I get many more keepers with my Sony than I ever did with my Leica and what's more I just love the ergonomics of the A900. Taking photographs is as much about enjoying using the tools as producing a good result IMHO.

Dave,
Thanks for the reply. Indeed this is for a large part about enjoying the tools. The keeper rate with the a900 (and even with my NEX 5, that I use as a point and shoot) is much higher than with my M8, mainly due to focus issues, I'm just not fast enough with MF.

BTW, today I took another look at my test and I think my judgement on the Zeiss colors might have been a little too harsh; I think I overexposed Sony a bit more than the Leica. And let's not forget that the Sony has more AA filtering going on than the Leica.

So all in all I say yes the M9 has the edge but at 3 times the price the IQ is certainly not that much better. Value for money, ergonomics and IQ wise I'm happy with my Sony's, for now...

Cheers, Peter

 

[Quino Terceño]

An issue with the auto-tripod-SSS-switch solution is that, depending on your shutter speed and tripod stability (including environmental factors like wind,) it is occasionally good to leave SSS on when using a tripod (and even moreso with a monopod.) Someone did a test of this years ago, but I don't have the link

Agreed Douglas. I think that in your reply the keyword is occasionally and that is why I think that this function should be an option. I find myself needing SSS off on a tripod more often than not.

As we know we are shooting with computers and I would find nice if the did the silly things that I can forget or err at, like the tripod function we are talking about or many others i.e: why no camera -that I know- goes off when you open the card door? wouldn't be handy to have an AF hyperfocal function with all D encoded lenses?

I will like to find things like these instead of smile detectors, creative styles, eye starts and the like ... sorry, I digress

 

[kit laughlin]

Well, kept the D3s and D2x—and got a near-new A850.

I am looking for a 50/1.4, but not finding any right now. If someone reads this and wants to part with theirs for a decent price, let me know.

Cheers to all, KL

 

[edwardkaraa]

Kit, the Sony 50 is really a great little lens. I sold mine some months ago, only to buy one again last week. It currently stays on my A900. Make sure you get the made in Japan one if you can.

 

[kit laughlin]

Thanks Edward. Is this one on BH's site the one you are talking about—I can't see a "made in Japan" mark on this one.

I have posted on the B&S pages here and over at Fred's but no replies yet—I might have to buy a new one!!!

 

[edwardkaraa]

Yep, this is the one. Both the Japanese and Chinese ones have the same model name and price, and sold by Sony as the same item. The only way to know is to look at the box or the lens itself. Good luck in finding one. Did you check at Dyxum?

 

[dbogdan]

Purchased the 50 1.4 from B&H just 3 weeks ago. I was shipped the Japanese version.
db

 

[edwardkaraa]

Two pics from this afternoon of my other half taken with the 50/1.4.

I really like the way it draws.

View attachment 40095

View attachment 40096

 

[kit laughlin]

Thanks Edward and dbogan. The Adorama one comes with the hood for the same price; I have emailed them with the question. Cheers, KL

 

[dbogdan]

B&H shipped with hood, if it makes a difference. Both are safe and reliable.

 

[kit laughlin]

But with B&H, you have to buy the hood as an extra, ~$17 from memory