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Thread: Full frame lens options?

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    Full frame lens options?

    Hi All,

    I'm in the fortunate position to get some new glass for my sony kit. I'm thinking of setting up a travel kit (with my a850) with the following lenses:

    - Voiglanter 20/3.5
    - ZA 24-70
    - ZA 135

    I feel like this will give me a great everyday range in the 24-70 with the option to go wider without adding a lot of weight (the 20/3.5). The 135 is a must as it is the best medium telephoto I've ever used and as it focuses down to 1:4 it can double for some closeup work in a pinch. Is there something I'm missing that would make this kit problematic? Any and all suggestions very much appreciated.

    Cheers,
    Simon

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    Senior Member edwardkaraa's Avatar
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    Re: Full frame lens options?

    If you don't mind changing lenses and appreciate the extra character you get from primes, I would suggest a three lens set up: 24/2, 35/1.4, 85/1.4. All of these have special drawing styles and will give you inspiration for great photos.

    The 135 is no doubt an extraordinary lens, but it is quite heavy for travel, and the FOV makes it a bit of a speciality lens. I rarely use it when I take it on a trip, it sees more use for portraits and stage photography.

    The 24-70 that I used to own is a great compromise, and very versatile and practical. Sometimes I wish I didn't sell it, for the same purpose as yours, but I feel the lenses I'm suggesting will give you something extra.
    M262 ZM 25/2.8 35/1.4 50/2 85/2

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    Re: Full frame lens options?

    Edward - thanks for the prompt reply and suggestion. A 24-35-85 set up could be a great set up that I hadn't considered yet. I'm off traveling later this week with a 20/2.8, 50/1.4, and 100 macro so that should give me an indication of if I can make an all prime kit work (and if I will miss the reach of the 135).

    I've heard very mixed reviews of the sony 35mm - how does it perform stopped down and at infinity vs. wide open at 2-3m?

    Thanks again for the suggestion.

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    Senior Member Braeside's Avatar
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    Re: Full frame lens options?

    For travelling consider the inexpensive and lightweight, but optically great, Sony 85/2.8 SAM. I use it on my A900.
    David Anderson

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    Senior Member douglasf13's Avatar
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    Re: Full frame lens options?

    I agree with Edward, although I would personally choose a fast 50 over a fast 35, and the Sony 50/1.4 is good and cheap.

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    Re: Full frame lens options?

    Quote Originally Posted by edwardkaraa View Post
    ...I would suggest a three lens set up: 24/2, 35/1.4, 85/1.4. All of these have special drawing styles and will give you inspiration for great photos.
    If I may expand the options just a bit, what might you all think of having the Minolta 35/2 and 85/1.4 as two of that three lens package? I'm wondering about image quality in comparison with any Sony and Zeiss offerings and about their particular drawing characteristics.

    Thanks, and best wishes,

    Irenaeus

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    Re: Full frame lens options?

    Thanks all for the suggestions so far. I've found the gap between 20 and 50 large, this is why I was considering the 24-70.

    The three lens kit with 24/2, 35/1.4, and 85/1.4 sounds nice - I'll have to see if I find the gap between 35 and 85 problematic. I suppose I could also include the 50/1.4 if it was...

    Thanks for all the opinions. I'll have to get out and find away to test these options now.

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    Senior Member edwardkaraa's Avatar
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    Re: Full frame lens options?

    Quote Originally Posted by douglasf13 View Post
    I agree with Edward, although I would personally choose a fast 50 over a fast 35, and the Sony 50/1.4 is good and cheap.
    Totally agreed. The 50 is an excellent option too, and it seems the OP owns it already
    M262 ZM 25/2.8 35/1.4 50/2 85/2

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    Re: Full frame lens options?

    Quote Originally Posted by Simon M. View Post
    Thanks for all the opinions. I'll have to get out and find away to test these options now.
    You can either rent or buy from somewhere with a good return policy (I like B&H and Amazon.com).

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    Re: Full frame lens options?

    Yep I've got the 50. Thinking this over I could probably fill what I feel is an awkward gap for travel (between the 20 and 50) by adding the 35/1.4 - then I could configure the kit a couple of ways:

    1. 20/2.8 + 35/1.4 + 100 Macro (or ZA 135)
    2. 20/2.8 + 35/1.4 + 50/1.4 +100 Macro (or ZA 135)

    I could then replace the 100 macro with an 85 and the 20 with the 24 at my leisure if I thought the changes (mostly the speed) would be worthwhile.

    Around here the 35/1.4 is about the same price as a 24-70. I'd pay a weight and speed penalty with the 24-70, but it gives me a range I wouldn't otherwise have. I'll have to see if I can find a 35/1.4 to test out and see if I fall in love with the rendering style. If I do it's an easy decision, otherwise things are a little more complicated.

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    Re: Full frame lens options?

    Quote Originally Posted by wyip View Post
    You can either rent or buy from somewhere with a good return policy (I like B&H and Amazon.com).
    Very true. I'll first try my local camera dealer (love the support I get from them) and see if they have some lenses I can try.

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    Senior Member edwardkaraa's Avatar
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    Re: Full frame lens options?

    Quote Originally Posted by Simon M. View Post
    Edward - thanks for the prompt reply and suggestion. A 24-35-85 set up could be a great set up that I hadn't considered yet. I'm off traveling later this week with a 20/2.8, 50/1.4, and 100 macro so that should give me an indication of if I can make an all prime kit work (and if I will miss the reach of the 135).

    I've heard very mixed reviews of the sony 35mm - how does it perform stopped down and at infinity vs. wide open at 2-3m?

    Thanks again for the suggestion.
    My pleasure

    It took me 2 years to gather the courage to get the 35G precisely because of the mixed reviews. I tried 2 copies at different Sony showrooms and they were both sharp, so I bought yet another copy and it was sharp as expected, so no sample variations here.

    I did a comparison with the Zeiss 35/2 (one of the most respected 35 lenses for landscapes) at infinity and f/8, the results were posted on FM. To sum it up, they are similar in the center, the Zeiss wins in zone B (APS-C borders), and the Sony wins in the corners. The Zeiss has more contrast as expected, but the sharpness differences were really minimal, and one wouldn't see them without a direct comparison. Of course, the Zeiss wins clearly at infinity and wide apertures but that's not how I shoot landscapes.

    At wide apertures the 35G has a beautiful drawing style and nice bokeh.

    Here's a recent shot at f/8:

    Attachment 41511
    Last edited by edwardkaraa; 9th October 2012 at 04:44.
    M262 ZM 25/2.8 35/1.4 50/2 85/2

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    Senior Member edwardkaraa's Avatar
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    Re: Full frame lens options?

    Quote Originally Posted by Simon M. View Post
    Thanks all for the suggestions so far. I've found the gap between 20 and 50 large, this is why I was considering the 24-70.

    The three lens kit with 24/2, 35/1.4, and 85/1.4 sounds nice - I'll have to see if I find the gap between 35 and 85 problematic. I suppose I could also include the 50/1.4 if it was...

    Thanks for all the opinions. I'll have to get out and find away to test these options now.
    This is only my personal preference, but I would rather shoot either slightly wide (35) or slightly long (85). The 50 is a jack of all trades and I use it as such when I want to take only one light weight lens. I personally find this FL not so inspiring but others may disagree.
    M262 ZM 25/2.8 35/1.4 50/2 85/2

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    Re: Full frame lens options?

    I have also been thinking about this topic. For the next trip I take, I'm planning to take a 20/2.8, a 28-75/2.8 Minolta and an old 135/2.8. I have found that the bulk of the photographs I take when traveling are made in the 28-85 range (the 28-75 is close enough and I like it much better than any of the cheaper, wider range zooms I've tried). Since I don't travel alone, I find it much easier on my wife if I don't have to keep switching lenses. She gets annoyed enough with me sometimes for just taking so many pictures. I might prefer fixed lenses if I were going by myself. The 135/2.8 is there for when I just can't get close enough to what I want to photograph and it's pretty small and light if I don't use it much. I might prefer something like the old Nikkor 200/4 that I used to have. Wish there were a Minolta or Sony equivalent. The 20 for when 28 just isn't wide enough.

    I've thought about the 24-70, but I'm happy with the 28-75 image quality and don't want to carry the extra weight. I would like to have 24mm, but the 20 and 28-75 combined are lighter than the 24-70. I've also thought about the 135, but I believe this lens is just too big and heavy to take for the limited amount I would use it. I have an 85/1.4, but it is too close to the 75mm of the zoom to use much unless I expect to make portraits.

    I have a 35/1.4 Minolta. I don't know how much different it is from the Sony version. It is an "interesting" lens. It's a bit of a challenge to focus accurately at closer distances and wider apertures. I think some of its reputation is due to focusing problems. Stopped down to f/8 or f/11, I don't see much reason to prefer it over the 28-75mm at 35mm. The 35/1.4 is a rather long lens (it's only slightly shorter than the 135/2.8) and is very heavy for it's size.

    I'm generally walking a lot when I travel. I find I come home with better photographs when the gear I carry doesn't: weigh so much that I'm sore at the end of the day, requires being put in a backpack where it is too hard to get to or, even worse, stays at the hotel or in the car. The A900, 28-75, 20 and 135 fit pretty easily in a Domke F803 which is easy to carry without looking too much like a camera bag and easy to work out of.

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    Senior Member dhsimmonds's Avatar
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    Re: Full frame lens options?

    I have travelled extensively with the 24-70 and 16-35 Zeiss zooms as companions on my A900. I have recently though done two extensive trips in Africa and Central America with jus a Minolta 24-105 and SONY G70-400 with the A900 and A700 body as back-up. Reason for the 70-400 is of course for the wildlife and ringing the changes between the A700 and A900 is equal to another two lenses with the extra 50% reach on the A700.

    Filling the frame on the A700 is infinitely superior to cropping the A900 to the same size!

    Everyone travels for a host of different reasons and these are mine.
    Cheers, Dave
    www.simmondsphotography.com

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    Senior Member pegelli's Avatar
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    Re: Full frame lens options?

    I second the 24-105, not the best lens you will ever own but light/small, pretty good for the money and not bad sharpness for a "superzoom". Drawback are not constant f4 (but getting to 4.5 pretty late in the range) and an ugly moustache distortion at the short end with no good Lightroom profile available. However with a bit of tweaking the Canon 24-105 profile can deal with it.

    I don't have a 70-400G, but that's a pretty heavy beast anyway to lug around. So for the long end I usally take my old Minolta 200/2.8 + 1.4x converter which covers most tele needs when 105 is too short and gives a pretty light package with a lot of flexibility.

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    Senior Member dhsimmonds's Avatar
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    Re: Full frame lens options?

    Quote Originally Posted by pegelli View Post
    I second the 24-105, not the best lens you will ever own but light/small, pretty good for the money and not bad sharpness for a "superzoom". Drawback are not constant f4 (but getting to 4.5 pretty late in the range) and an ugly moustache distortion at the short end with no good Lightroom profile available. However with a bit of tweaking the Canon 24-105 profile can deal with it.

    I don't have a 70-400G, but that's a pretty heavy beast anyway to lug around. So for the long end I usally take my old Minolta 200/2.8 + 1.4x converter which covers most tele needs when 105 is too short and gives a pretty light package with a lot of flexibility.
    I use the Minolta 24-105 mainly for people shots as it is small and not so intimidating as some of the Zeiss big beasts. Yes F4 for most of the focal range but as I usually travel to areas where there is plenty of light (having gone through dull english winters!) I have never noticed the distortion at the wide end but I would use the 16-35 Zeiss for architectural shots where this might have been a problem. The 24/105 does however focus nice and close, not a macro replacement but very useful and mine is plenty sharp enough for people work. I always shoot Raw and Capture One Pro 6.1.1 handles this lens very nicely as it does all my lenses.

    The 70/400G is a heavy lens, which is why I usually only take the Minolta 24/105 as it is so small and light! However the 70/400 is a cracking lens for the work that I use it for. The A900 and A700 bodies are also quite heavy.

    The whole lot goes in a Tamrac Adventure 7 bag together with my Macbook Pro and will meet most International Airline requirements for size but I admit that on some charter flights it is over the top on weight! A little low cunning is then required with alternative solutions if the charm doesn't work! I handle the Tamrac with some nonchalance at the airports even lifting it with one hand in sight of the check in attendant and usually get away with it!

    My real emergency back up in these situations is that I always wear a photographers vest with masses of large pockets that I can if necessary put lenses and accessories to lighten the carry on luggage. At security, off comes the vest and goes through the X ray machine together with money, watch, shoes, keys etc. and everything is OK. Just reverse the process on the other side! I have only ever needed to do that once!

    I am by the way, a slightly built 72 year old, so by no means a Tarzan! So you younger guys should have no problems at all. I hope that this helps.
    Cheers, Dave
    www.simmondsphotography.com

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    Re: Full frame lens options?

    I also have a copy of the Minolta 24-105. I'd be willing to bet it's my least used lens, but that's more a function of how/what I shoot than a statement on that lens. Everything everyone has said about it is true, the only part being left out is that you can usually pic a copy up for not a lot on money at all. I got mine for $60 US.
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    Senior Member Braeside's Avatar
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    Re: Full frame lens options?

    Dave, thanks for the tip on The Tamrac Adventure 7 bag, I have ordered one.

    Where do you put your laptop in it? The top compartment? (I have a 13" MBP).

    Weight is the problem, my holiday flight is 5Kg carry on! - I'll be taking my photo jacket to carry heavy bits if necessary too.

    I note that the depth (23cm) is about 3 cm over the limit as well , but I hope I can squeeze it up a bit to fit the 40cm x 20 cm x 55 cm limit.
    David Anderson

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    Re: Full frame lens options?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lonnie Utah View Post
    I also have a copy of the Minolta 24-105. I'd be willing to bet it's my least used lens, but that's more a function of how/what I shoot than a statement on that lens. Everything everyone has said about it is true, the only part being left out is that you can usually pic a copy up for not a lot on money at all. I got mine for $60 US.
    I'm glad to see the 24-105mm still getting praise, in its own way. I remember when it was originally launched, I was able to get the manager of the photo lab/camera store I frequented to pull some strings with her Minolta rep so I got the lens a few days before it was officially on shelves. The thing about this lens is it covers a good range in a pretty compact package. I remember it cost a little over $400 back then. It still works fine on my a900, but I admit it doesn't come out with me much anymore. I like to have primes for my favorite focal lengths - 24mm, 35mm, and 135mm.

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    Senior Member dhsimmonds's Avatar
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    Re: Full frame lens options?

    Quote Originally Posted by Braeside View Post
    Dave, thanks for the tip on The Tamrac Adventure 7 bag, I have ordered one.

    Where do you put your laptop in it? The top compartment? (I have a 13" MBP).

    Weight is the problem, my holiday flight is 5Kg carry on! - I'll be taking my photo jacket to carry heavy bits if necessary too.

    I note that the depth (23cm) is about 3 cm over the limit as well , but I hope I can squeeze it up a bit to fit the 40cm x 20 cm x 55 cm limit.
    There is a padded and zipped "slot"between the camera section and the harness side of the bag purposely designed for a laptop. Many of the Tamrac range have this. I also have the largest Tamrac Expedition bag that is International Airline legal which has a similar zipped slot designed for laptops. The Expedition bag has better rain protection including an optional fully enveloping rain cover. I only ever use this when I visit rain forest areas though! The laptop is quite safe from knocks and weather in either bag...but it does push up the overall weight!
    Cheers, Dave
    www.simmondsphotography.com

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    Senior Member Braeside's Avatar
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    Re: Full frame lens options?

    There is a padded and zipped "slot"between the camera section and the harness side of the bag purposely designed for a laptop. Many of the Tamrac range have this. I also have the largest Tamrac Expedition bag that is International Airline legal which has a similar zipped slot designed for laptops. The Expedition bag has better rain protection including an optional fully enveloping rain cover. I only ever use this when I visit rain forest areas though! The laptop is quite safe from knocks and weather in either bag...but it does push up the overall weight!
    Thanks Dave, that sounds ideal. I should have the Tamrac bag tomorrow. I had a similar but larger Crumpler bag that I used (once), it was rather heavy because of huge amount of padding on the back. Since then I have never had a flight that would allow it as carry on because of the dimensions.
    David Anderson

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    Subscriber Member kit laughlin's Avatar
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    Re: Full frame lens options?

    @ Braeside: what is that el cheapo (but apparently great) 85/2.8 like wide open? I have an excellent copy of the 100/2 that is simply excellent wide open so have not been drawn to the 85/1.4. Very interested in your answer, TIA, kl

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    Senior Member pegelli's Avatar
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    Re: Full frame lens options?

    Kit, the 85/2.8 wide open is excellent. Both bokeh and sharpness do not show el cheapo at all.
    I could test one at a Dyxum get together last year:







    All 3 at f2.8 on my A850

    And here's a 100% crop of the last one:


    And here's a link to a test on photozone.de.




    Btw Kit, happy birthday today, were you thinking about a birthday present when you posted the question?
    Last edited by pegelli; 19th March 2011 at 00:57.

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    Senior Member pegelli's Avatar
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    Re: Full frame lens options?

    Quote Originally Posted by dhsimmonds View Post
    I have never noticed the distortion at the wide end but I would use the 16-35 Zeiss for architectural shots where this might have been a problem.
    Sorry gentlemen, I have to eat my words and you're absolutely right.
    I went back to my Lightroom library and indeed the 24-105 at 24 mm has some barrel distortion (not even a great lot) but when you try to correct it with the "manual" lens correction options it becomes a moustache, as the curvature of the barrel is a bit different from the standard barrel that lightroom assumes. So my statement on the lens having moustache distortion was wrong.

    However I also found that if you use the Canon 24-105L profile and then on top dial in somewhere around +5 manual distortion correction it comes out near perfect.

    I know I really should go out and produce my own profile, but you know there's so many other fun things to do that I haven't done it yet. If someone knows one I'd be grateful for a reference.

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    Subscriber Member kit laughlin's Avatar
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    Re: Full frame lens options?

    Thanks for the BD wishes, pegelli, and I agree: from what I see here, this is an outstanding little lens.

    Re. birthday prezzies (as we say here): got myself a Zeiss ZA 135/1.8....

    Thanks sincerely for the reply!

    KL

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    Senior Member Braeside's Avatar
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    Re: Full frame lens options?

    Kit, sorry for late reply, you got the answer anyway!
    It's a super little lens.
    David Anderson

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    Senior Member Braeside's Avatar
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    Re: Full frame lens options?

    Quote Originally Posted by dhsimmonds View Post
    There is a padded and zipped "slot"between the camera section and the harness side of the bag purposely designed for a laptop. Many of the Tamrac range have this. I also have the largest Tamrac Expedition bag that is International Airline legal which has a similar zipped slot designed for laptops. The Expedition bag has better rain protection including an optional fully enveloping rain cover. I only ever use this when I visit rain forest areas though! The laptop is quite safe from knocks and weather in either bag...but it does push up the overall weight!
    Dave, the Adventure 7 just arrived and no padded slot for laptop on this one.

    Are you sure it was 7 you that have?
    David Anderson

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    Senior Member pegelli's Avatar
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    Re: Full frame lens options?

    Quote Originally Posted by kit laughlin View Post
    Re. birthday prezzies (as we say here): got myself a Zeiss ZA 135/1.8....
    Kit, you're a lucky man, but to be fair: I just bought the same lens second hand without my birthday even close.

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    Senior Member dhsimmonds's Avatar
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    Re: Full frame lens options?

    Quote Originally Posted by Braeside View Post
    Dave, the Adventure 7 just arrived and no padded slot for laptop on this one.

    Are you sure it was 7 you that have?
    David, we have corresponded privately on this post and for the sake of any others who either followed, or are about purchase, I regret to say that I made a mistake as it is of course the Adventure 9 which has the Zipped section for a laptop. My only excuse is that I bought it about 4 years ago and as there is no label on the product other than the Tamrac label, I guessed the model number and got it wrong.

    Apologies to David and anyone else that I misled. It is still an excellent bag and whilst measuring it for David, I realised that It's still got another four and probably many more years service to give.
    Cheers, Dave
    www.simmondsphotography.com

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    Senior Member Braeside's Avatar
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    Re: Full frame lens options?

    Dave, absolutely no problem. I composed a long PM reply to you explaining what I was going to do instead and why, but left the message half finished while I had my tea and it appears to have timed out and it has now vanished into a blackhole.

    So once again, thanks for explaining all the details and getting back to me so promptly.

    Best wishes
    David Anderson

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