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Thread: How many A850/A900 shooters are going to hold on to their cameras?

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    Re: How many A850/A900 shooters are going to hold on to their cameras?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Ortego View Post
    Hmm, the more I read about the A99, the more I think I'll hold onto my 900. I'm not really into video shooting and the rest of the stuff isn't worth it to me. Heck, I think I'm more interested in the RX1 at about the same base price. At least it's clearly a different tool and would be very nice for my vacation trips.
    I've been hearing this quite a bit around the web.

    For me, the improved sensor is all the enticement I need (if it proves to be as good as promised). As a concert photographer, high ISO is critical and the A900 was really a stop gap (coming from my Canon gear) until the A99 arrives.

    I'm wondering how many will indeed jump if the IQ looks to be a substantial improvement or will the A900 be good enough.

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    Re: How many A850/A900 shooters are going to hold on to their cameras?

    Quote Originally Posted by Show Performance View Post
    I've been hearing this quite a bit around the web.

    For me, the improved sensor is all the enticement I need (if it proves to be as good as promised). As a concert photographer, high ISO is critical and the A900 was really a stop gap (coming from my Canon gear) until the A99 arrives.

    I'm wondering how many will indeed jump if the IQ looks to be a substantial improvement or will the A900 be good enough.
    I seriously doubt the A900 IQ will be surpassed anytime soon. Sometimes they get it right, and after that it either gets no better or even worse. Had that happen more than once.

    However, for me, the critical piece of information on the A99 is still missing ... the high ISO IQ. I look forward to reports from those who shoot available light. If it delivers in this one area, then it is a strong candidate for replacing one of my A900s. I'll keep the other for normal shooting with a OVF.

    -Marc

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    Re: How many A850/A900 shooters are going to hold on to their cameras?

    Quote Originally Posted by fotografz View Post
    I seriously doubt the A900 IQ will be surpassed anytime soon. Sometimes they get it right, and after that it either gets no better or even worse. Had that happen more than once.

    However, for me, the critical piece of information on the A99 is still missing ... the high ISO IQ. I look forward to reports from those who shoot available light. If it delivers in this one area, then it is a strong candidate for replacing one of my A900s. I'll keep the other for normal shooting with a OVF.

    -Marc
    I guess I am more optimistic than you Marc. Early buzz on that new sensor has been very positive as have been some of the high ISO samples.

    Still, like you, the A900 will remain in my bag as a second body. It will be nice to have the option of OVF or EVF depending on the subject, environment or my mood. Something you cannot get on Nikon or Canon at the moment.

    -Chad

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    Member Dan Ortego's Avatar
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    Re: How many A850/A900 shooters are going to hold on to their cameras?

    Quote Originally Posted by fotografz View Post
    I agree with this Hank ... yet at the same time I do wish Sony would cut back on the minor variations with-in a model line every thirty seconds, and had offered an A950 or something using the same OVF, activated the dual card slots to shoot redundant parallel capture, instituted live view, and upgraded the sensor with this new one for a better IQ and high ISO ... which seems to be a minimal R&D endeavor, and would have further amortized their existing investment possibly producing a better pay-out per camera with an existing user base that is still relatively satisfied with the A900...

    -Marc
    Boy, do I ever agree with you on that! Sony is quite content with mass-market appeal and it seems to be working with their NEX line. Though I briefly considered jumping ship Iím staying on board although Iím currently reluctant to buy anymore Alpha glass. Running an updated OFV parallel product would have been a wise decision in my view. They would have retained or acquired a segment of shooters while refining the EFV to a more acceptable state. I like shooting portraits and I have yet to understand how to capture the subtle expressions of the face in a EVF unless youíre shooting Bart Simpson.
    Last edited by Dan Ortego; 26th September 2012 at 05:48.

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    Re: How many A850/A900 shooters are going to hold on to their cameras?

    Quote Originally Posted by fotografz View Post
    I agree with this Hank ... yet at the same time I do wish Sony would cut back on the minor variations with-in a model line every thirty seconds, and had offered an A950 or something using the same OVF, activated the dual card slots to shoot redundant parallel capture, instituted live view, and upgraded the sensor with this new one for a better IQ and high ISO ... which seems to be a minimal R&D endeavor, and would have further amortized their existing investment possibly producing a better pay-out per camera with an existing user base that is still relatively satisfied with the A900.
    -Marc
    Marc,

    Didn't you just describe a D800? As good as the A900 is (and I think most here are in agreement on that subject), I think it became clear to Sony that they will never gain market share playing third fiddle to Canon and Nikon tech. The EVF and translucent mirror are disrupter technologies meant to differentiate and excite. Sony is all-in and I think it is a good gambit.

    Camera tech is changing dramatically as witnessed by the mirrorless segment. SAR reported today - via Sony's own numbers - that Sony is the market leader in the mirrorless space. I think Sony is carving out a niche that the big two have so far been reluctant to commit to in a convincing manner. By owning this space early, they can sap more customers from Canon and Nikon as users move up to a DSLR(T). A NEX user would be almost immediately comfortable using an A99 where a more traditional OVF experience would be a bit of a step backwards for that user.

    Face it, Sony is playing to new customers, not to the old. If the old customers embrace this new direction - and many are - then they are welcome aboard the train. Otherwise, they are heading for the OVF world of Canon and Nikon - and how long before those companies go EVF? Maybe they will, maybe they won't but as EVF tech continues to evolve there won't be much argument for an OVF.

    In my community I am starting to see more and more entry level Sony SLTs in the hands of my friends and neighbors. I think there is a powerful draw to seeing your photo before it is captured that gives a level of comfort to a beginner. That same technology can be used even more powerfully by a pro.

    Sorry for the extended diatribe. As a pro who shoots more film cameras than digital, I get why people are passionate about the OVF but I see the merits of the EVF and think that is where the future lies.

    Chad

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    Re: How many A850/A900 shooters are going to hold on to their cameras?

    Quote Originally Posted by Show Performance View Post
    Marc,

    Didn't you just describe a D800? As good as the A900 is (and I think most here are in agreement on that subject), I think it became clear to Sony that they will never gain market share playing third fiddle to Canon and Nikon tech. The EVF and translucent mirror are disrupter technologies meant to differentiate and excite. Sony is all-in and I think it is a good gambit.

    Camera tech is changing dramatically as witnessed by the mirrorless segment. SAR reported today - via Sony's own numbers - that Sony is the market leader in the mirrorless space. I think Sony is carving out a niche that the big two have so far been reluctant to commit to in a convincing manner. By owning this space early, they can sap more customers from Canon and Nikon as users move up to a DSLR(T). A NEX user would be almost immediately comfortable using an A99 where a more traditional OVF experience would be a bit of a step backwards for that user.

    Face it, Sony is playing to new customers, not to the old. If the old customers embrace this new direction - and many are - then they are welcome aboard the train. Otherwise, they are heading for the OVF world of Canon and Nikon - and how long before those companies go EVF? Maybe they will, maybe they won't but as EVF tech continues to evolve there won't be much argument for an OVF.

    In my community I am starting to see more and more entry level Sony SLTs in the hands of my friends and neighbors. I think there is a powerful draw to seeing your photo before it is captured that gives a level of comfort to a beginner. That same technology can be used even more powerfully by a pro.

    Sorry for the extended diatribe. As a pro who shoots more film cameras than digital, I get why people are passionate about the OVF but I see the merits of the EVF and think that is where the future lies.

    Chad
    Chad, all,

    VERY true!!!!

    Myself coming from the film DSLR world, I am still more leaning to an OVF than anything else (EVF, LCD). BUT we have to admit, that the EVF even in high end pro models is just a matter of time before it happens. I dare to predict that in 5 years from now more than 50% of today's enthusiast, semi-pro and pro DSLRs will work with an EVF. Sure a EVF with maybe 5MP and 240fps refreshing or even higher numbers, but then this will mean actually no more difference in visual quality to even the best OVFs.

    And another 5 years later even MF cameras will rely on EVFs - if not already earlier!

    Maybe there will be kind of a retro line of DSLRs, which then for very high prices will offer OVFs but be based on the same sensor designs and electronics as their EVF counterparts.

    We as the kind of dinosaur's need to understand this trend exists and either follow or just die out.

    I am prepared

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    Re: How many A850/A900 shooters are going to hold on to their cameras?

    Quote Originally Posted by ptomsu View Post
    Myself coming from the film DSLR world, I am still more leaning to an OVF than anything else (EVF, LCD).
    I am pretty sure you used film SLRs, without a D

    Myself I just got an A900 for small money and I love OVFs as well as shooting film cameras. Having used the NEX-5N with EVF I have to admit that it has reached a pretty usable state (whereas the Fuji X-Pro1 EVF mode can be considered a bad joke). Anyway it is almost there, but not quite, imho.
    It is decent for a Ä 1000,-- camera, but with a 135 format DSLR I expect a bit more and I think Sony is a bit too early using it in that calibre of camera. But the video shooters will love it I am sure.

    On the other hand it is a lot like shooting larger format film cameras

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    Re: How many A850/A900 shooters are going to hold on to their cameras?

    I bought D800 when it arrived, and I am very glad I am keeping all my glass with alpha mount
    There are many things A99 being much better than D800.
    Quote Originally Posted by alphaman View Post
    I sold all my Sony A mount stuff in favour of Nikon; the combination of my dislike for EVF and the allure of the D800 proved too much and my A900, etc had to go.

    I don't regret this move but there are some nice things about the Sony system which I wish I could have in the Nikon. These are:

    1) in body stabilisation (I miss that more than anything else),

    2) The way the Sony flash can adjust the colour balance to match the ambient,

    3) Zeiss AF lenses.

    All of these things can be overcome and aren't enough on their own.

    There were things which Sony still need to address to get my vote:

    1) Noise, noise and noise! The Nikon using a Sony sensor handles this so very much better (sorry Sony, but they do),

    2) The exposure meter works much better in the Nikon, I don't have to work quite so much to get reliably exposed images, particularly with flash. Flash underexposure being a particular issue.

    3) EVF; whilst I think this may become good enough in time, OVF is so much nicer on the eye and gets my vote.

    I've still got my NEX7 which I love and won't change (has an EVF - a necessary evil but an OVF would be impossible in this instance!). I don't dislike Sony, it's just that they aren't meeting my needs at the moment.

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    Member Hank Graber's Avatar
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    Re: How many A850/A900 shooters are going to hold on to their cameras?

    Quote Originally Posted by Show Performance View Post
    I think it became clear to Sony that they will never gain market share playing third fiddle to Canon and Nikon tech. The EVF and translucent mirror are disrupter technologies meant to differentiate and excite. Sony is all-in and I think it is a good gambit.
    I agree. I don't think there is much point in dumping Sony over the VF as like digital sensors its just a matter of time before digital VF (and integrated video/still capture devices) takes over everywhere. Sony had the least to lose getting out front on this and could become a major player by dominating the next technology transition.

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    Re: How many A850/A900 shooters are going to hold on to their cameras?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mark K View Post
    I bought D800 when it arrived, and I am very glad I am keeping all my glass with alpha mount
    There are many things A99 being much better than D800.
    I think in an ideal world, I'd have kept my A900 and Zeiss primes as well as "going Nikon", that said, maybe in future when the world is in less of a financial mess I will be able to afford to run both systems.

    I think that one must be objective and each person must use the tools they need for their work. In my case I'm perfectly happy with my transition to Nikon but I still have a liking for the A900/Zeiss combo. The SLT only option was what proved to be the killer for me.

    Hope too many don't consider me a traitor to the cause, however, for me in any case the camera system is not the be-all and end-all, it's the actual pictures that interest me and my ability to earn a living from them.

    As to the A99 being better than the D800, clearly I didn't agree but there will always be a new and better model from either Sony, Canon or Nikon for someone to gravitate towards.

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    Re: How many A850/A900 shooters are going to hold on to their cameras?

    I have have using D800 since this summer but I also kept my A900. In low ISO, I much prefer the IQ from A900. I can only hope that A99 will have better high ISO performance. But from what I saw in my NEX-7, I am very skeptical. I will keep my A900 until it seizes to function.

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    Re: How many A850/A900 shooters are going to hold on to their cameras?

    I got a lot of lenses for the A mount because I felt the quality level was there with the a900, I still do. So no Nikon for me. A99 - run your eye over the feature list and it is very impressive indeed, but they aimed the camera at very different uses from mine, and they left off the most important part for me - the 36Mp sensor, on some pretext that it did not work right with video or some such. I care not for video nor for AF in general and high ISO just gives poorer images, so.....

    I want to buy the sweetest camera around, the RX1; and for the system stuff wait for Sony to get over the video/flashy AF for a few lenses/low Mp game, and get on with the job for landscape people next.

    Note that the RX1 is out of the Cybershot division in some kind of internal arms race inside Sony. That RX1 looks both all business, like a small camera attached to a super lens with real rings and tactile excellence, not like some dinky P&S - and has a lot going for it - an instant classic I feel, and a great offsider for any Sony DLSR - same menus, memory settings, ergo etc. How about a 36Mp one? Looking at the MTF even adjusting for the crap method of calculation, the lens will be fine, they could simply add the better sensor in both that and the A99.

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    Re: How many A850/A900 shooters are going to hold on to their cameras?

    I think that Sony have done a lot to encourage new users and have also continued to supplement their existing lenses and flash so that existing users have a good choice. There are some real gaps in the lens line-up, such as a range of TS&E lenses, but that may well be changed one day.

    The real flaw I can see is the SLT only approach to DSLR design. I can see some real advantages to SLT but partly because photographers are a conservative (small c!) bunch and also because SLT isn't completely "right" yet (i.m.o.), I think that at the very least the A900 should still be a current model and not discontinued.

    While I currently have no stake in the Sony DSLR camp, I think that limiting the viewing options for their cameras limits the appeal to new (and existing) users and added to that while there is currently the option of a full frame 24mp Nikon at approximately £1600 and a soon to be Canon full frame model at about £1700 with the A99 at about £2600 .... hmmm! I bought my (ex) A900 for about £1600 and would think that would be a good choice for the budget conscious Sony full frame shooter!

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    Re: How many A850/A900 shooters are going to hold on to their cameras?

    Yes, would have been nice if Sony packaged the new sensor in the 900 body and priced it at $1799 as an alternative for stills only shooters and those looking for a low priced FF.

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    Re: How many A850/A900 shooters are going to hold on to their cameras?

    anyone want to sell their a900 for a grand?

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    Re: How many A850/A900 shooters are going to hold on to their cameras?

    Quote Originally Posted by MikalWGrass View Post
    anyone want to sell their a900 for a grand?


    Looks like the second hand price of A900/A850 is rather going up, than down, the more people are realizing the big advantage of the A900 vs. A99.

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    Re: How many A850/A900 shooters are going to hold on to their cameras?

    Mine sits nose down w/lens and L-bracket right next to my NEC display and I have no intentions on selling it.

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    Re: How many A850/A900 shooters are going to hold on to their cameras?

    Quote Originally Posted by MikalWGrass View Post
    anyone want to sell their a900 for a grand?
    In the words of General Anthony Clement "Nuts" McAuliffe ...

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    Re: How many A850/A900 shooters are going to hold on to their cameras?

    just received my previously loved A900, cant wait to try it out this weekend, and compare it to my nex7 and a700

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    Re: How many A850/A900 shooters are going to hold on to their cameras?

    Brian Smith on How to Take Better Portraits | BH Insights

    How many professionals use Sony for their professional work?

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    Re: How many A850/A900 shooters are going to hold on to their cameras?

    I think many A900 fans will be pleasantly surprised by the A99... I spent the weekend shooting one and it was an interesting experience. The weight is a huge advantage IMO as the camera is so much lighter then its predecessor. The EVF takes a little bit of getting used, especially if you leave it in auto where it is constantly toggling between screens. Once you use the EVF for a bit though, it has its advantages. Being able to shoot and review the image right after it was shot without moving your head from the camera is nice. A bit confusing for the assistant (me) however as you're not sure whether boss is shooting or reviewing.... In lower light scenes the EVF was actually better then optical in that the view is brighter then reality and you have the ability to zoom in to check critical focus. The high iso on this sensor is really a leap forward from the A900 as well. These are just a few things I noticed from the weekend of using it.
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    Re: How many A850/A900 shooters are going to hold on to their cameras?

    Pete, what kind of subjects was your boss shooting? Portraits? Fairly stationary subjects? I am wondering how the camera will work in lower light for action sports such as water polo. Any idea? Thanks.

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    Re: How many A850/A900 shooters are going to hold on to their cameras?

    Hi, I shot mostly production images inside an ambient lit studio class, read bad lighting. The photographer I was assisting shot an outdoor night portrait. For the lower light the camera did well, the amped up gain that the evf provides helped in seeing the scene better. As for sports I believe it will be better then the a900 because the camera has the ability to keep tracking focus even DURING shots, something traditional DSLRs are unable to do. the 24mp sensor seems like a winner, although I reall wish Sony release their 36mp version. I just got my D800e and I'm really impressed by the pixel quality and density of that sensor.

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    Re: How many A850/A900 shooters are going to hold on to their cameras?

    Despite the fact I love my A850's OVF (and those on D800), I believe the conveniences brought by slt technology using EVF is a plus in my style shooting.
    I wonder if there's a chance that Sony gives us another FF body with 36MP sensor and hybrid view finder.

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    Re: How many A850/A900 shooters are going to hold on to their cameras?

    No, there is no chance. They flatly stated that EVF is the only technology they are going to use from now on. If you think about it, it makes sense as all of their video products have been using EVFs for years. This not a new technology for them.

    Hmmm, the A99 Hybrid AF system reports distance information. What other camera de we know of that relies on distance information captured from the sensor at every pixel?

    **cough**, Lytro, **cough**

    Can Sony be thinking of this?

    Apologies for the mild thread hijack.
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    Re: How many A850/A900 shooters are going to hold on to their cameras?

    Carlo, love the pics of the Gables on your website. Not sure if you think the a99 is a good camera or not. Personally I would like a hybrid vf only because I am used to an ovf but technology marches on.

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    Re: How many A850/A900 shooters are going to hold on to their cameras?

    Hmm, all this talk about the virtues between OFV and EFV in a thread as to whether to keep your A850/900. I don’t currently have any experience with a camera mounted EFV so I’ll just have to wait and see.

    I plan to use the external EVF for the RX1 when it arrives so by this measure I can have a 'sorta' hybrid system if I opt for the OVF (framing) as well. Insomuch as my A900, all I can say is that it didn’t suck when it first came out and it still doesn’t suck today.

    hand-held grab shot
    Last edited by Dan Ortego; 20th October 2012 at 09:30.
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    Re: How many A850/A900 shooters are going to hold on to their cameras?

    The more I read about the RX1, the closer I'm getting to selling the A900 to help fund a purchase (already buying an A99).

    Anyone want one?

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    Re: How many A850/A900 shooters are going to hold on to their cameras?

    Quote Originally Posted by MikalWGrass View Post
    Carlo, love the pics of the Gables on your website. Not sure if you think the a99 is a good camera or not. Personally I would like a hybrid vf only because I am used to an ovf but technology marches on.
    Thanks Mikal. I have myself on a preorder list with our friend Monza for both the SLT-A99V and NEX-6. Glad you liked the Gables photos. I look to expand that series an exhibit them next year.
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    Re: How many A850/A900 shooters are going to hold on to their cameras?

    Put the a900 and ZA 135/1.8 through its low light / fast action paces tonight at my son's water polo practice, and the results show me that either the camera is not the best at focusing in low light, fast paced situations; I am not the best photographer (ok, a given); or both. At 3200 the images were usable, and they were useable at 4000, 5000, and 6400, but the focus was decidedly slower and inaccurate as the iso increased. I just wonder if the a99 would help matters.

    I will post a few pics after they are resized to 1200. Hopefully the data will be posted with the photos. I won't do too much post processing work.

    Can anyone recommend a good photo hosting service so my posted pics can appear larger than what they do when I import them from my computer? Once I get set up I will post the pics.

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    Re: How many A850/A900 shooters are going to hold on to their cameras?

    crap. seem to have used my predetermined amount of space so i can't post pics at the moment.

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    Re: How many A850/A900 shooters are going to hold on to their cameras?

    I used to have the A850 and just got the A99 yesterday. So far, I think it's a significant improvement in PQ & WB accuracy. I don't miss the OVF at all.

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    Re: How many A850/A900 shooters are going to hold on to their cameras?

    Yat,
    Glad to hear.
    I should have mine next week.
    Steven
    Steven Kornreich
    www.kuau.com

  34. #84
    Member Dan Ortego's Avatar
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    Re: How many A850/A900 shooters are going to hold on to their cameras?

    Quote Originally Posted by MikalWGrass View Post
    Put the a900 and ZA 135/1.8 through its low light / fast action paces tonight at my son's water polo practice, and the results show me that either the camera is not the best at focusing in low light, fast paced situations; I am not the best photographer (ok, a given); or both. At 3200 the images were usable, and they were useable at 4000, 5000, and 6400, but the focus was decidedly slower and inaccurate as the iso increased. I just wonder if the a99 would help matters...
    It’s another slow Sunday so I decided to respond to this somewhat dated thread. I have the same combo as you and frankly I can’t think of a worst environment to shoot with that set-up. My 900 w/135 does best in a more controlled setting and preferably with a tripod. If you're just a casual shooter like many; there is no better combo to learn from in my view. Likewise, it's still more than great for portraits and such, and when the ZA 50 1,4f arrives next year, the A900 may be worth hanging onto.
    Last edited by Dan Ortego; 18th November 2012 at 12:48.

  35. #85
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    Re: How many A850/A900 shooters are going to hold on to their cameras?

    Dan, actually the a900 and 135/1.4 do pretty well in low light if one doesn't mind the noise from the higher isos. I have always shot with relatively high speed film so grain never bothered me.

    I just adapted a Leica R 180/4 to the a900 and got some pretty decent shots at 5000 and f4. The Leitax adapter and Lau chip is a good combination, but I think the chip needs a bit of work. Like the R 50/1.4 that I adapted with Leitax and Lau, the focus confirmation is more accurate depending upon which way you are focusing from. It can be maddening in a quick situation but otherwise it is fine.

    I just bought a monopod for the water polo stuff, so I will see how that goes.

    I wish I could shoot in a more controlled environment but that isn't the case.

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