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Thread: Speed booster for NEX

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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    Quote Originally Posted by brianc1959 View Post
    I'm not sure I understand what a "full frame version of the m43" is??
    Sorry, it is what I think of it as.

    This would be a version of the Speedbooster that would pull the entire image circle down to cover the m43 sensor. Similar to what is being done for the APS-C size sensors of the Nex right now. Thus getting the same angle of view from my FF lenses on the m43 body as I would get on a FF body. This would be instead of ending up with a 1.4x multiplier on m43...


    So perhaps an FF equivalent angle of view? Or the .5x focal reducer for M43? Pipe dream, I know, and I plan on being fully happy with the .71x version when it becomes available for Nikon to m43.

    But that is why I am interested in the potential of the Nikon to Fuji version as well (I'm not a Nex fan ergonomically). Having that adapter would get me to being able to use my nikkors at an equivalent angle of view that I had with them on film.

    Doug

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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    Quote Originally Posted by brianc1959 View Post
    I'm not sure I understand what a "full frame version of the m43" is??
    I think he is hoping there will be a FF to m4/3 version of the speed booster eventually. Imagine that though, the glass will look quite odd on mft bodies as they are soo small, plus, imagine the light you would get from reducing from 1.0 crop to 2.0 crop. Would that equate to 2 stops more light? So a 2.8 full frame lens would become a f1.4 lens on m4/3.

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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    Quote Originally Posted by brianc1959 View Post
    Very interesting result Vivek!

    FWIW, any UV capability is purely coincidental - its not something that I considered when doing the design. Assuming perfect coatings (i.e., just accounting for the intrinsic absorption of the glass) I calculate the following transmission values for the Speed Booster:
    400nm - 94%
    390nm - 90%
    380nm - 81%
    370nm - 60%
    365nm - 49%

    I can't do any calculations below 365nm because one of the glass types (S-TIH1) basically has zero transmission at 360nm and below. So I wouild assume that 365nm is pretty much the limit. The coatings are an efficient multilayer design tuned for the visible, so they will definitely cause a significant drop in transmission for the values I've given above.

    Also, the Speed Booster will suffer from a large amount of chromatic aberration in the UV band. Did you re-focus when you added the Baader filter?

    By contrast, the Speed Booster actually works very well in the near infrared, with surprisingly low chromatic aberration all the way out to 1.0 microns. The coatings will also be better in the IR than they are in the UV.
    Thanks a bunch for the data, Brian!

    Regarding CA- absolutely none whatsoever! In fact, I am yet to see any objectionable or even noticeable CA in near UV shots taken with any lens! Least of my worries. If I did not hand hold that 1/10s test shot, it would have been clear how sharp an image can be obtained (as I saw it in live view).

    Re: Focus shift: This is also one thing that is of no concern to me with a live view cam. Ever since I started shooting with one, I have forgotten what a menace it was with a DSLR and shooting blind. With the NEX also, I can see, magnify a region 8X and focus before tripping the shutter.

    Yes, you are correct about the near IR performance. No issues there at all. The Speed Booster work very well there.

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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    The Noflexar (my sample which is original in a Nikon F mount) does not focus to infinity and just avoids touching the SB optics.


    Untitled by Vivek Iyer, on Flickr

    It does quite well in near UV. If I use it as is, I can have focus from ~2.5m to 10cm!

    At the moment I only have fuzzy examples (out of focus). I am quite impressed with the whole set up though. Useful.

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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    Quote Originally Posted by mazor View Post
    I think he is hoping there will be a FF to m4/3 version of the speed booster eventually. Imagine that though, the glass will look quite odd on mft bodies as they are soo small, plus, imagine the light you would get from reducing from 1.0 crop to 2.0 crop. Would that equate to 2 stops more light? So a 2.8 full frame lens would become a f1.4 lens on m4/3.
    See my response above, but yes, reducing the FF image circle down to the m43 sensor size is the idea.

    Btw, they would look no odder than using them on the Nex now. That actually is the point of the Speed Booster:

    "Finally utilize Full Frame Lenses on mirrorless cameras today"

    Vivek has been using a number of Nikkors that I have already. 45mm, 20mm f3.5, etc...

    Doug

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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    Doug, I have only showed pictures from the 20/3.5 AiS (gem of a lens!), I think.

    The 28/2.8 AiS is just awesome! Devoid of any corner problems or even distortion at f/2.8 already! Will have to go out with it next time and snap some pics.
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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    nice doug, I think it will eventuate for m4/3 whereby a FF lens becomes 1.5x crop when used with speedbooster, hence ability to reuse the same premium quality optic found in the current speedbooster for nex or fuji.

    What would be amazing if they completely redeveloped the speed booster optic to allow proper FF to m4/3 with 1.0x crop. The compressing would be approx 2 stops extra.

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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    Any idea when the real Nikon to NEX SB becomes available?

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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    Quote Originally Posted by Theodoros Fotometria View Post
    Any idea when the real Nikon to NEX SB becomes available?
    The Nikon-NEX and Nikon-m43 version should be coming out in March.
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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    Quote Originally Posted by brianc1959 View Post
    The Nikon-NEX and Nikon-m43 version should be coming out in March.
    Good... 'cause AI-s lenses are the ultimate ones for video....

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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    Quote Originally Posted by mazor View Post
    nice doug, I think it will eventuate for m4/3 whereby a FF lens becomes 1.5x crop when used with speedbooster, hence ability to reuse the same premium quality optic found in the current speedbooster for nex or fuji.

    What would be amazing if they completely redeveloped the speed booster optic to allow proper FF to m4/3 with 1.0x crop. The compressing would be approx 2 stops extra.
    Although the m43 versions of the Speed Booster will have the same 0.71x magnification factor as the NEX version, the optics are completely different. The reason is that by optimizing for a smaller format it is possible to achieve slightly higher performance As a result, corner performance on m43 will be a bit better than if the NEX optics were used.

    A 2-stop Speed Booster is possible if you use slow lenses with *lots* of rear working space (e.g., long telephotos and telescopes), but that would not be a very interesting product IMO.
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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    Quote Originally Posted by Theodoros Fotometria View Post
    Any idea when the real Nikon to NEX SB becomes available?
    if you want to uase AIS nikors, just get the Canon ef to nex and use an adapter, hence you can adapt multiple types of lens to nex.


    If a nikon to nex adapter comes out, it should have ability to control electronic apertures from modern nikkor lens as well as VR, similar to what the ef to nex

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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    Quote Originally Posted by monza View Post
    I believe they are all 0.71x reduction.

    Equivalent DOF for m4/3 would be (2 x 0.71 x the f-stop) (2 being the crop factor of m4/3)
    The reason for 0.71x is that for the adapter to gain a stop, the image area compression must be equal to what root square of 0.5 result comes too... i.e. =0.71, this means that if a 4/3 lens image area would have to be covered by a 35mm FF lens exactly, the compression should be of half the area of the image circle radius than what FF is and thus the reduction would cause ...two stops of aperture gain (i.e 0.71x0.71)!!!! There would have to be some problems though, with some lenses that are only able to cover a 2:3 image area in FF, a few lenses that would cause viggneting in case the FF area was 4:3 (this is because the diagonal in 4:3 is slightly larger than 2:3 at the same width) but of the same width ....i.e. 36mm!
    Last edited by Theodoros Fotometria; 20th February 2013 at 07:13.

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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    Quote Originally Posted by Vivek View Post
    Doug, I have only showed pictures from the 20/3.5 AiS (gem of a lens!), I think.

    The 28/2.8 AiS is just awesome! Devoid of any corner problems or even distortion at f/2.8 already! Will have to go out with it next time and snap some pics.
    I thought I saw you using the 45mm pancake also?

    I have the 28mm f2 which renders beautifully for me on a DX nikkor, so thinking about it on an m43 with the speedbooster is something to anticipate.

    I have lots of others to play with...

    Doug

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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    Quote Originally Posted by brianc1959 View Post
    Although the m43 versions of the Speed Booster will have the same 0.71x magnification factor as the NEX version, the optics are completely different. The reason is that by optimizing for a smaller format it is possible to achieve slightly higher performance As a result, corner performance on m43 will be a bit better than if the NEX optics were used.

    A 2-stop Speed Booster is possible if you use slow lenses with *lots* of rear working space (e.g., long telephotos and telescopes), but that would not be a very interesting product IMO.
    Hi Brian,
    I am not completely following this. Is it because the size of the glass in a 2 stop speedbooster would be such that it would interfere with the lenses physically?

    My primary interest is indeed using the wider lenses at their "original" angle of view. Although I will be curious how longer lenses do in terms of increased image quality using the speedbooster as well.

    Doug

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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    Quote Originally Posted by greypilgrim View Post
    Hi Brian,
    I am not completely following this. Is it because the size of the glass in a 2 stop speedbooster would be such that it would interfere with the lenses physically?

    My primary interest is indeed using the wider lenses at their "original" angle of view. Although I will be curious how longer lenses do in terms of increased image quality using the speedbooster as well.

    Doug
    You won't be able to use the current SB to achieve "original" AOV on micro 4/3rds Brian, what it will be, is that the crop factor of "original" AOV will be reduced from 2x to 1.4x i.e. the root square of 2... (1.4x1.4=2 (aprox.)) this is because you gain one stop of aperture...

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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    Quote Originally Posted by greypilgrim View Post
    Hi Brian,
    I am not completely following this. Is it because the size of the glass in a 2 stop speedbooster would be such that it would interfere with the lenses physically?

    My primary interest is indeed using the wider lenses at their "original" angle of view. Although I will be curious how longer lenses do in terms of increased image quality using the speedbooster as well.

    Doug
    I've explained this a little before Doug, the 4/3rds crop factor may be 2x as far as width of sensor is concerned, but it is less as far as sensor diagonal is concerned... This is because FFsensors are of 3:2 ratio while O&Pan are of 4:3 ratio... so, a 2stop SB would mean that some FF lenses would be compressed off their limits and some more would expose problems that normal use wouldn't show... also, some APS-c lenses that now work, they would have to be excluded... in other words there are many complexities involved that among others could harm the reputation of a great product... better as is then...

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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    OK Brian, prepare a new SB for this... Nikon to announce a high end compact camera: 16MP DX sensor, fixed 28mm f/2.8 lens, Expeed 2 processor | Nikon Rumors
    I believe that Canon will follow shortly....

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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    Quote Originally Posted by Theodoros Fotometria View Post
    OK Brian, prepare a new SB for this... Nikon to announce a high end compact camera: 16MP DX sensor, fixed 28mm f/2.8 lens, Expeed 2 processor | Nikon Rumors
    I believe that Canon will follow shortly....
    If true, I can only hope that:
    1) the lens isn't "fixed", but is interchangeable
    2) the camera has a proper EFV (like the NEX-7)
    3) the flange distance is short
    4) they haven't cluttered up the optical path to the sensor so that a Speed Booster will be possible.
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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    Quote Originally Posted by greypilgrim View Post
    Hi Brian,
    I am not completely following this. Is it because the size of the glass in a 2 stop speedbooster would be such that it would interfere with the lenses physically?

    My primary interest is indeed using the wider lenses at their "original" angle of view. Although I will be curious how longer lenses do in terms of increased image quality using the speedbooster as well.

    Doug
    A 2-stop general-purpose speed booster in a cramped space has to have alot of optical power. This in turn creates a ton of under-corrected field curvature that just can't be corrected. As a result, the optical performance would be horrendous, and I'm just not interested in that kind of product.
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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    Quote Originally Posted by Theodoros Fotometria View Post
    I believe that Canon will follow shortly....
    Canon already have a mirrorless system camera, the EOS-M. I hope Nikon will wake up one of these days and start to smell the coffee. Even when they do, they will not offer any challenge to the NEX or the m4/3rds systems. Judging from their toy "1" system, they will be priced atrociously (even more than the EOS-M).
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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    Quote Originally Posted by greypilgrim View Post
    I thought I saw you using the 45mm pancake also?

    I have the 28mm f2 which renders beautifully for me on a DX nikkor, so thinking about it on an m43 with the speedbooster is something to anticipate.

    I have lots of others to play with...

    Doug
    Sure. I even have the F3AF Nikkors (they do fantastically well with the Speed booster)!

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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    Quote Originally Posted by brianc1959 View Post
    A 2-stop general-purpose speed booster in a cramped space has to have alot of optical power. This in turn creates a ton of under-corrected field curvature that just can't be corrected. As a result, the optical performance would be horrendous, and I'm just not interested in that kind of product.
    Brian,
    Thanks for the reply. Optically horrendous, yech, totally agreed, no interest in that at all.

    Thanks for clarifying,

    Doug

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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    When will a dumb Canon speed booster be made for the NEX?

    The basic concept has proven itself with all the outstanding photos and lens combinations we have seen.

    I and many other people are waiting.

    We will then be able to use it for a variety of lenses, as the master adapter, without paying the higher price for the Smart Canon speed booster.

    It is a marketing opportunity that has/will be filled

    Thanks

    Paul

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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    Quote Originally Posted by camping View Post
    When will a dumb Canon speed booster be made for the NEX?

    The basic concept has proven itself with all the outstanding photos and lens combinations we have seen.

    I and many other people are waiting.

    We will then be able to use it for a variety of lenses, as the master adapter, without paying the higher price for the Smart Canon speed booster.

    It is a marketing opportunity that has/will be filled

    Thanks

    Paul
    I think that is a valid outlook on this and hope the makers would consider it.

    Apart from the optical qualities, once you have the SB mounted to a NEX (even 5N), the ergonomics change for the better, manifold! I use it with the tripod mount attached to it and it makes holding it comfortable and balanced. Also, what might look like big additions (AiS Nikkors, for example) in a picture, do not feel that way. This, one has to experience it in their own hands to see. Just fabulous.
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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    The earliest examples from an SB and tele lenses were from K-H and showed problems with vignetting and corner darkening. However, not all tele lenses behave that way. I have already shown a few samples. Here are a few more from an old Nikkor which is a forerunner to the 180 f/2.8 ED. All shot handheld and wide open- effective aperture f/2.5.


    Untitled by Vivek Iyer, on Flickr


    Untitled by Vivek Iyer, on Flickr


    Untitled by Vivek Iyer, on Flickr

    NEX-6, Speed Booster, AF-Nikkor*ED 200mm f/3.5, Effective f/2.5
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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    Hey guys! This seems to be the only really active thread regarding the speedbooster on the net, so here I am.

    I'm currently renting one for 2 weeks to evaluate. So far I've been using it with my Nikkor 50mm F/1.2 AI-s lens on my NEX-6:


    When We Escape by I.Cherkasov, on Flickr


    Kitty Love - MetaBones Speedbooster by I.Cherkasov, on Flickr

    So far, I've noticed that this combination produces more vignetting than the Nikkor on a FF setup. However, it isn't that bad - it's got character!
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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    One more:


    A Lapse in Perspective. by I.Cherkasov, on Flickr

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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    Kaptnkain/I.Cherkasov,
    great shots here and on your SLR to Nex 6 thread. Your shots certainly have character. Could you see yourself moving from SLR to Nex 6 and speedbooster?
    John

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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    Speed booster is just a cool toy for NEX in my eyes. The NEX is worthy to replace my 40D, but it might not be worthy for everyone.

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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    Last one with the Nikkor 50mm F/1.2. I'm getting really attached to this combo...

    Next up will be the Nikkor 85mm F/1.8D and the Canon 100mm F/2.8 Macro. I tested out the macro lens briefly today, and to my surprise AF was working! Now, it was horribly inaccurate, but it was working nonetheless!.


    After All by I.Cherkasov, on Flickr
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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    Hi Vivek,

    I lost count.
    How many different lenses have you tried out on the MSB?

    Thanks, K-H.

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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    Hi K-H, I have no idea how many lenses I have, honest! All I know is that only a small portion has been mounted on the SB and whenever I mount a prime, a few hundred snaps are taken before a lens change.

    Here are some mundane wall snaps using an OM 50/1.2. Brian was wondering how it behaves with respect to vignetting at various apertures.

    At f/1.2


    Untitled by Vivek Iyer, on Flickr

    f/5.6


    Untitled by Vivek Iyer, on Flickr

    f/11


    Untitled by Vivek Iyer, on Flickr

    f/16


    Untitled by Vivek Iyer, on Flickr

    NEX-6, Speed Booster, Olympus OM 50/1.2, Tripod mount setup

    No hood on the lens (I do use a hood while shooting for real). One thing to note is the change of WB due to changes in the amount of vignetting. There is no added vignetting from the use of the Speed Booster.

    I used to own a Nikkor 50/1.2 AiS which vignetted even on a D200/300 at f/1.2. One of the forum buddies Kevin is now enjoying it on his Canon FF cams. The OM 50/1.2, I bought expressly to use with the Speed Booster. It has not disappointed. It is stunningly awesome (I am out of superlatives..).
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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    I have updated this set: Speed Booster - a set on Flickr

    with a bunch of snaps from the SB+ OM 50/1.2 combo.

    For my use, I am happy with shots like these, even though they are not in focus:


    Untitled by Vivek Iyer, on Flickr


    Untitled by Vivek Iyer, on Flickr


    Untitled by Vivek Iyer, on Flickr
    NEX-6, Speed Booster, OM 50/1.2, Effective f/0.9

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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    However..when the focus is spot on and everything else is taken care of, the results are incredibly sharp images.


    Untitled by Vivek Iyer, on Flickr


    Untitled by Vivek Iyer, on Flickr


    Untitled by Vivek Iyer, on Flickr
    NEX-6, Speed Booster, Olympus OM 50/1.2, Effective f/0.9

    The OM 50/1.2 +SB combo is incredibly contrasty wide open. Even more contrasty than the Summicron R 50/2 on a NEX using a plain adapter! In the samples above, I toned down the contrast by 10%.

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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    Great to see these,
    Thanks Vivek!

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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    Quote Originally Posted by Vivek View Post
    However..when the focus is spot on and everything else is taken care of, the results are incredibly sharp images.
    Great stuff, Vivek! I'm very glad to see that vignetting isn't really an issue with this combination.

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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    Quote Originally Posted by John Inglis View Post
    Great to see these,
    Thanks Vivek!
    Thanks, John!

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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    Quote Originally Posted by brianc1959 View Post
    Great stuff, Vivek! I'm very glad to see that vignetting isn't really an issue with this combination.
    Thank you, Brian!

    Just to show the compact size of this set up, in comparison to the Sony/Zeiss 24/1.8..


    Untitled by Vivek Iyer, on Flickr

    (That is the hood I use with the OM 50/1.2)
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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    Vivek, great shots over at the Street thread, including the three shots above the following,
    http://www.getdpi.com/forum/sony/349...tml#post493086

    Here is the Nikon 20mm 2.8 als via Canon SB on 5n,
    note my comment at the bottom of this post, that Metabones does not recommend using this lens!


    And the Contax CY 28-85 at 28mm and 85 with some architecture circa 1900 on a dull day,





    Now I see that the Nikon 20mm 2.8 als is on the metabones list for not fitting on the Canon EF Speedbooster!
    The protusion appears to be pushing down the Canon ef contact pins, making it harder to turn the lens when mounting, so perhaps not recommended, and certainly not recommended by Metabones, as you can see on the following link or below,
    http://www.metabones.com/sony/ef-e-speed-booster
    "Many manual focus lenses have rear protrusions (spikes, levers, other appendages) which would damage the optics and/or housing of Speed Booster™. They need to be modified before they can be safely used on Speed Booster™. Check and make sure there are no rear protrusions from the adapter/lens combination before using on Speed Booster. Scratches and damages caused by rear protrusions or by poor quality adapters are not covered by warranty. The following is an incomplete list of lenses known to be incompatible.

    Leica R
    Super-Elmar-R 15mm
    Elmarit R 28/2.8
    Elmarit R 35/2.8
    Summicron R 50/2

    Nikon F
    20/2.8 AI-S

    Olympus OM
    OM 18/3.5
    OM 21/2
    OM 21/3.5
    OM 28/2.8
    OM 50/1.8

    Pentax K
    Every Pentax K-mount lens has a protruding fin and an aperture lever. It does NOT fit."
    Last edited by John Inglis; 25th February 2013 at 06:40. Reason: additon

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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    A question Vivek. Can they OM Zuiko 50/1.4 be used on the EOS SB without damaging the glass?

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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    And I may be completely late to the party on this one, but has anyone notice the C/Y to NEX SB on the Metabones site?

    Sony NEX System : Contax Yashica Lens to Sony NEX Speed Booster

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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    I only noticed the CY SB over the last few days

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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    Quote Originally Posted by John Inglis View Post
    I only noticed the CY SB over the last few days
    Ah, I see. Wasnt sure if it had been mentioned in this thread. Which is pleasingly getting rather long.

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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    Quote Originally Posted by f/otographer View Post
    A question Vivek. Can they OM Zuiko 50/1.4 be used on the EOS SB without damaging the glass?
    I know for sure that the OM 50/1.2 needs no alterations. The OM 50/1.8, I just yanked (gently) the rear aluminum shroud out with a pair of pliers. I do not know if the 50/1.4's aluminum shroud would interfere with the optics. It is safer to pull it out. No harm done to the lens or its functions.
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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    Quote Originally Posted by John Inglis View Post
    Vivek, great shots over at the Street thread, including the three shots above the following,
    http://www.getdpi.com/forum/sony/349...tml#post493086

    Here is the Nikon 20mm 2.8 als via Canon SB on 5n,

    And the Contax CY 28-85 at 28mm and 85 with some architecture circa 1900 on a dull day,
    Thanks, John.

    I like your shots. Nice composition and use of the 20/2.8 Nikkor. The C/Y zoom shots are impressive enough to make me look for one.

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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    An indoor snap with the OM 50/1.2.


    NEX-6, Speed Booster, Olympus OM 50/1.2, Effective f/0.9

    I still do not think I have a decent picture with the SB + OM 50/1.2 combo to fully show how sharp the images (in the focused areas that is) can be.
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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    The move to out of focus is so smooth, really nice

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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    Indeed! Combine that with the sharpness (that does not happen with a OM 50/1.2, straight on), the results are quite pleasing.

    Here is a test snap using a grand old CZJ Biotar 75/1.5 lens under the usual overcast skies. Absolutely no worries with CA! The swirly bokeh is back but, in my view, in a very controlled fashion (just about right for my taste).


    NEX-6, Speed Booster, CZJ Biotar 75/1.5, Effective f/1
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    Re: Speed booster for NEX

    Leica R 60mm via Canon SB on Nex 5n


    I do wonder whether wide ZM and Contax G lens will work on a future full frame Nex all the way to the edges. From reports on the VG900 this sounds possible. Otherwise a Nex crop camera and a speed booster is a great way to go in order to use ZMs and Contax Gs on crop and SLR lenses for the FF like look.

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