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Thread: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

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    Smile Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    Aside from the Leica mount lenses, there could be many old gems that could still be usable on the upcoming A7/7r. Of course, only real testing would show how useful they might be.

    Here is a list (based on checking with projection on a GG and in some cases on my Leica MM) of probables:

    First E mount lenses (not really "small" but I thought I will throw them in ):

    1. 30/3.5 Macro (needs to get rid of rear baffle)

    2. 24/1.8 (rear baffle has to go)

    3. 50/1.8 (ditto).

    4. 18-55 (possibly from ~28mm onwards)

    Olympus pen F lenses (not sure of the corners!):

    1. 40/1.4

    2. 38/2.8

    3. 42/1.2

    4. 60/1.5

    5. 70/2 (no worries)

    6. 100/3.5, 150/4

    If you anything to add, feel free.
    Likes 1 Member(s) liked this post

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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    My first curiousity is to try the:

    VC Heliar 15/4.5
    Zeiss M Biogon 25/2.8

    and compare them to the:

    Contax Zeiss Distagon 18/4
    Minolta MD 24/2.8
    Contax Zeiss Distagon 28/2.8

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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R



    Untitled by Vivek Iyer, on Flickr

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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    Oops! It isn't entirely a non-leica lens!


    Untitled by Vivek Iyer, on Flickr
    NEX-6, APO Rodagon-D 75/4.5

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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    If my Leica r19 in Nikon mount would work on it than I may buy the Sony a7r.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

    www.guymancusophotography.com

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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    That will work fine but how long will the A7R last with constant use is an open question.

    The Elmarit weighs ~100g more than the A7R without an adapter....

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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    The Zeiss Contax G lenses are very small and light. Plus they are very sharp.
    You can read more about their characteristics in Ken Rockwell's pages.
    I owned (well, still own, but don't use film cameras anymore) a G2. These lenses are very sharp, especially the 45mm F2 and the 21mm F2.8. The 90mm was producing less sharp results, but since I use it on MFT cameras and focus them manually I saw it was not so much due to the lens, than to the focusing mechanism.

    They have a relatively busy bokey and can show purple fringing in the corners against a bright sky, but when you want a sharp picture with much DOF there is nothing like them.

    None weight more than 200gr. So they should be well balanced on the A7s. People used to call that system the poor man's Leica M.

    I'm sure that both the 45mm and the 90mm will perform beautifully on both FF A7s, but I'm waiting to see what the wide angle ones will deliver (I have the 16mm, the 21mm and the 28 in addition to the 45 and 90mm). I fear that the 21mm will not perform very well. But if it did well on the A7, I would be very tempted to get one. May be it is a sentimental thing : the Contax G was my first interchangeable lens camera system.

    PS you can download the Zeiss data sheets for each of these lenses here.

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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    I have the 45 and the 21 myself. The 45 has been a joy on the NEX cameras. I have a feeling the edges of the 21 may look a little funny but then again maybe not. Can't remember if anyone has tried the Contax G 21mm yet and given results on-line.

    Good luck
    John

    Quote Originally Posted by Annna T View Post
    The Zeiss Contax G lenses are very small and light. Plus they are very sharp.
    You can read more about their characteristics in Ken Rockwell's pages.
    I owned (well, still own, but don't use film cameras anymore) a G2. These lenses are very sharp, especially the 45mm F2 and the 21mm F2.8. The 90mm was producing less sharp results, but since I use it on MFT cameras and focus them manually I saw it was not so much due to the lens, than to the focusing mechanism.

    They have a relatively busy bokey and can show purple fringing in the corners against a bright sky, but when you want a sharp picture with much DOF there is nothing like them.

    None weight more than 200gr. So they should be well balanced on the A7s. People used to call that system the poor man's Leica M.

    I'm sure that both the 45mm and the 90mm will perform beautifully on both FF A7s, but I'm waiting to see what the wide angle ones will deliver (I have the 16mm, the 21mm and the 28 in addition to the 45 and 90mm). I fear that the 21mm will not perform very well. But if it did well on the A7, I would be very tempted to get one. May be it is a sentimental thing : the Contax G was my first interchangeable lens camera system.

    PS you can download the Zeiss data sheets for each of these lenses here.

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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    I have the 90/2.8 (I am sure it will be superb!) and lust a 16/8 Hologon.

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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    Quote Originally Posted by Vivek View Post
    I have the 90/2.8 (I am sure it will be superb!) and lust a 16/8 Hologon.
    Well, for me that 16mm was rather a youth error : it has a fixed focus of F8 and is vignetting like mad. So you have to add a special rectangular shaped filter which is sold with the lens along with the add-on OVF. That special graduated grey filter is taking you something like at least 1 stop if not more. So in the end that lens wan't very usable unless it was a bright day. But at the time, the 21mm wasn't yet issued and I wanted something wider than the 28mm to shoot buildings.

    Anyway, the protruding rear elements are sticking so deep inside of the camera that you can't adapt it on any mirrorless camera.

    They are going up to almost 2000$ on Ebay. Although there are some cheaper offerings. They seem to be handled like a collector item more or less.

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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    While certainly not youthful, I still lust after the Hologon. I think it is a 4 stop ND filter. Not for the faint of heart.

    And, yes, you can use it on the A7/7R (with the expected color issues).

    See: http://www.zeissimages.com/showreplies.php?qid=964

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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    Quote Originally Posted by Vivek View Post
    I have the 90/2.8 (I am sure it will be superb!) and lust a 16/8 Hologon.
    I had the Hologon 16 when I owned the G2. With the filter, it was an f/16 lens (native corner falloff is about 1.5 stops). Very nice results, but awkward to work with due to the slow speed and very thin control ring ... It was hard to keep your fingers out of the FoV.

    I replaced it with a Heliar 15 when I went back to M-mount. Not as great on performance but a far easier to use lens.

    I doubt the Hologon will adapt well to any digital body, never mind a full frame sensor.

    G

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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    Having used the Cosina 15/4.5 on every camera (film, digital FF, cropped), my lust for the Hologon got intense.

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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    Quote Originally Posted by Vivek View Post
    Having used the Cosina 15/4.5 on every camera (film, digital FF, cropped), my lust for the Hologon got intense.
    Whatever turns you on. :-)

    The Hologon 16 was a particularly expensive lens, I bought it as a gift to myself when I received a windfall bonus for something or other. It was an amazing performer when used correctly, but that took a lot of work and I ended up not using it very much at all as a consequence. The Heliar 15 was much easier to use well, and produced a lot of good photos for me despite its lower performance. I did not miss the Hologon at all.

    In the end, I have realized that generally speaking an EFoV much wider than about 20mm, or 90 degrees across the diagonal, was simply not my thing. I've been much happier and gotten much more use and many more satisfying photographs out of wides in the 20 to 28mm EFoV range.

    G

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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    Quote Originally Posted by jfirneno View Post
    I have the 45 and the 21 myself. The 45 has been a joy on the NEX cameras. I have a feeling the edges of the 21 may look a little funny but then again maybe not. Can't remember if anyone has tried the Contax G 21mm yet and given results on-line.

    Good luck
    John
    My copy of the 21g biogon has very poor edge/corner performance with lots of smearing. On center with cropping it is very sharp.

    _DSC0868_ff-Edit.jpg photo - Carl Schofield photos at pbase.com
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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    Quote Originally Posted by scho View Post
    My copy of the 21g biogon has very poor edge/corner performance with lots of smearing. On center with cropping it is very sharp.

    _DSC0868_ff-Edit.jpg photo - Carl Schofield photos at pbase.com
    Hello Carl:

    What camera were you using it on? Was it one of the NEX cameras?

    Regards,
    John

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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    Quote Originally Posted by scho View Post
    My copy of the 21g biogon has very poor edge/corner performance with lots of smearing. On center with cropping it is very sharp.

    _DSC0868_ff-Edit.jpg photo - Carl Schofield photos at pbase.com
    Not sure what to do here : I can't add a "like" to your comment, because it is not a very good news. More or less what I feared, but I'm grateful that you are always willing to share your experience with those Contax lenses.

    How much do you have to crop to get good enough corners ? Would you say that you are still getting a wider angle of view than with the 28mm ?

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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    Quote Originally Posted by Godfrey View Post
    Whatever turns you on. :-)

    The Hologon 16 was a particularly expensive lens, I bought it as a gift to myself when I received a windfall bonus for something or other. It was an amazing performer when used correctly, but that took a lot of work and I ended up not using it very much at all as a consequence. The Heliar 15 was much easier to use well, and produced a lot of good photos for me despite its lower performance. I did not miss the Hologon at all.

    In the end, I have realized that generally speaking an EFoV much wider than about 20mm, or 90 degrees across the diagonal, was simply not my thing. I've been much happier and gotten much more use and many more satisfying photographs out of wides in the 20 to 28mm EFoV range.

    G
    Topogon design turns me "on". . The perfect lens design ever.

    I have a tiny Topogon 1.3 cm f/3.5 lens that will work on m43rds. The GM1 is the most appropriate body, thusfar.

    For the FF, the Topogon clones W-Nikkor 2.5 cm f/4 and the Orion-15 28mm f/6 will have to do for now (far better light fall off than the Hologon).

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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    Quote Originally Posted by Vivek View Post
    Oops! It isn't entirely a non-leica lens!
    The 40/2.4 Summarit is a wonderful lens, but the 40/2 Summicron is a lot easier to adapt.

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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    contax lenses. Conica Hexanon lenses, pentax three princesses. Especially the Hexanon primes, only 30 bucks on ebay!

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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    Quote Originally Posted by monza View Post
    The 40/2.4 Summarit is a wonderful lens, but the 40/2 Summicron is a lot easier to adapt.
    Sure, I have a great sample of the M Rokkor 40/2. Still, the Summarit was available for a give away a price. Just how many "normal" primes one needs? How about 12-14?

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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    Quote Originally Posted by mmbma View Post
    contax lenses. Conica Hexanon lenses, pentax three princesses. Especially the Hexanon primes, only 30 bucks on ebay!
    Hexanons are great! (value)

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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    anyone predict what the small OM MF wides would be like on the 7R?

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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    Quote Originally Posted by jfirneno View Post
    Hello Carl:

    What camera were you using it on? Was it one of the NEX cameras?

    Regards,
    John
    NEX6 John, with both the AF adapter and straight Contax G to E MF adapter.

    Quote Originally Posted by Annna T View Post
    Not sure what to do here : I can't add a "like" to your comment, because it is not a very good news. More or less what I feared, but I'm grateful that you are always willing to share your experience with those Contax lenses.

    How much do you have to crop to get good enough corners ? Would you say that you are still getting a wider angle of view than with the 28mm ?
    It is somewhat image dependent, but yes significantly wider perspective than the 28 biogon that also has some smearing, but not as bad as the 21. My favorite 21 is the CV 21 1.8 Ultron that performs very well on the NEX and the M9.
    Carl
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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    Quote Originally Posted by Shac View Post
    anyone predict what the small OM MF wides would be like on the 7R?
    I think by f8 they will all be swell.
    Likes 1 Member(s) liked this post

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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    here are examples of the 90mm Contax G2 on a Nex



    and i think the 15mm Heliar:

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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    Quote Originally Posted by Vivek View Post
    I think by f8 they will all be swell.
    Thanks Vivek

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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    Contax Zeiss 45mm Tessar pancake lens? That will be a tiny package.

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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    Quote Originally Posted by Vivek View Post
    While certainly not youthful, I still lust after the Hologon. I think it is a 4 stop ND filter. Not for the faint of heart.

    And, yes, you can use it on the A7/7R (with the expected color issues).

    See: zeissimages.com Forums - CornerFix Profile for the NEX-7 + Hologon 8/16mm Contax G mount
    I finally had the time to visit that page, very interesting, I was sure it would be impossible to mount the Hologon, because it sticks very deep in the body; makes me lust for an A7 or A7r even more.

    I just digged into the archives and found some pictures taken with the 16mm Hologon and Contax G2.

    Straight out of camera :


    with perspective corrected in LR5 :


    Misty morning, Ascona lakeshore :
    Likes 5 Member(s) liked this post

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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    Quote Originally Posted by JoelM View Post
    Contax Zeiss 45mm Tessar pancake lens? That will be a tiny package.
    It will be (not counting the adapter ). You will have to stop a Tessar down to f/8-f/11 to get even illumination.

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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    The Tessar is a lovely lens!
    I made a print of 90 x 60 cm for an upcoming exibition of the second one and it looks great.




    Likes 6 Member(s) liked this post

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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    Cannot wait for the chance to try out some Contax G, AF lenses, especially the 45/2.0 and the 28/2.8. Maybe even the 21/2.8 will work.

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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    Quote Originally Posted by algrove View Post
    ...Maybe even the 21/2.8 will work.
    Unlikely, I'm afraid. It looks like Biogon-designs are not well suited for the sensor designs used in the A7/A7R:

    SONY A7R With Rangefinder Lenses - a set on Flickr
    SONY A7 With Rangefinder Lenses - a set on Flickr

    I own a ZM 2.8/21, and had my hopes up that it will be usable on the A7R. It doesn't look that way, unfortunately...

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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    Quote Originally Posted by algrove View Post
    Cannot wait for the chance to try out some Contax G, AF lenses, especially the 45/2.0 and the 28/2.8. Maybe even the 21/2.8 will work.
    The 28/2.8 has severe colour shift and corner smearing as does my ZM Biogon 25/2.8

    But I am still hoping for old reflex alternatives.
    So send me my A7r now and I will find out.

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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    Images from tiny lenses are trickling in.

    Example: Sony a7 - a set on Flickr

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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    The CV 21/4 doesn't look to bad, mainly colour shift.

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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Pfister View Post
    Unlikely, I'm afraid. It looks like Biogon-designs are not well suited for the sensor designs used in the A7/A7R:

    SONY A7R With Rangefinder Lenses - a set on Flickr
    SONY A7 With Rangefinder Lenses - a set on Flickr

    I own a ZM 2.8/21, and had my hopes up that it will be usable on the A7R. It doesn't look that way, unfortunately...
    Agree, but I think that the CV 21 1.8 Ultron will be OK on the A7R - at least I'm hoping it will.
    Carl
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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    Just wondering if anyone has tried the cv 35/2.5 on the a7r yet? It is an old Leica thread mount lens with very nice rendering and pretty high contrast which I like a lot on my bessa-r.

    Saw a sample shot done on the a7 that looks good but no information as to whether it has been cropped.

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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    Anyone tried the Canon LTM 50mm lenses, the likes of the 50/1.4, or the 50/1.2?
    I think I saw Vivek tried the 0.95 Canon?
    Gary

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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    The CV35/2.5 feels very good on the A7R. I'll need to test it outside the house further but seems that there is only corner shading at F2.5.


    Sony A7R by Rurouni, on Flickr

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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    Quote Originally Posted by Vivek View Post
    While certainly not youthful, I still lust after the Hologon. I think it is a 4 stop ND filter. Not for the faint of heart.

    And, yes, you can use it on the A7/7R (with the expected color issues).

    See: zeissimages.com Forums - CornerFix Profile for the NEX-7 + Hologon 8/16mm Contax G mount
    It's a 2 stop ND. I used it a bit when I tried the 16 on the G1 years ago. I still have the 15mm Hologon for Leica, with its ND filter etc. A wonderful lens for its time, and soooo much smaller than the 15 I got for the Nikon about the same time.

    Henning

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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    Not many (in Leica mount) were actually made and at least 2 samples ended up in Vancouver!

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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    Quote Originally Posted by Gbealnz View Post
    Anyone tried the Canon LTM 50mm lenses, the likes of the 50/1.4, or the 50/1.2?
    I think I saw Vivek tried the 0.95 Canon?
    Gary
    I have briefly tried the 50 1.4 and it was great. Been an unusual first week with this camera because I have ended trying everything without really doing anything
    David
    Auckland, NZ.

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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    Quote Originally Posted by Vivek View Post
    Not many (in Leica mount) were actually made and at least 2 samples ended up in Vancouver!
    You're right, but I've never seen another here, and I (and the lens) have been here since I bought it in 1973 or 74. I later found out that at least 4 others were sold in Vancouver. There are quite a few Leica shooters here though. I see quite a few when out for a walk relative to other places.

    I haven't tried it on the M, but I did mount it on the M8 and took a number of trial shots. SEVERE vignetting. Basically black in the outer 1/3 on the M8. As I got a WATE during Leica's promotion with the M8 at an astoundingly good price, I use that now rather than the 15 Heliar or the Hologon. Size isn't as good though.

    Henning

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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    Quote Originally Posted by Hausen View Post
    I have briefly tried the 50 1.4 and it was great. Been an unusual first week with this camera because I have ended trying everything without really doing anything
    Thank you David.Seemed a long way to go to get a reply, we are less than 150 kilometers apart, LOL.
    I ended up buying a 1.2 Canon, on spec, so will see.
    Gary

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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    Hey Vivek, have you actually tried penF lens on the A7 or A7r? I suspect there would be massive vignett as it is really designed for half frame cameras, which is slightly larger than 1.5x crop or APS-C. I have used penF on my Nex 5n and they work a treat. Also PenF lens work well on my Em1 hehe.

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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    Vivek has tried the Pen F lenses and posted samples -- somewhere on this site.

    Paul
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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    Has anyone tried out the Canon EF 40mm yet?

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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    Quote Originally Posted by mazor View Post
    Hey Vivek, have you actually tried penF lens on the A7 or A7r? I suspect there would be massive vignett as it is really designed for half frame cameras, which is slightly larger than 1.5x crop or APS-C. I have used penF on my Nex 5n and they work a treat. Also PenF lens work well on my Em1 hehe.
    Check this out: http://www.getdpi.com/forum/sony/49391-fun-a7-7r.html

    For the first time, despite having >100 lenses that I can use on the A7R, I am not doing any testing for the sake of testing. I am just enjoying my photography. Just keep an eye on that thread.
    Likes 4 Member(s) liked this post

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    Re: Small (non Leica) lenses that have potential on the A7/7R

    Vivek

    You only have 100 lenses! Just joking. I am thinking it must take a entire room just to store them all where you can get to them.

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