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A7r - and why I'm keeping it ...

k-hawinkler

Well-known member
Re: A7R+Vario-Elmar-R 105-280/4.2 - Shutter Shock?

KH:

That is a very solid looking support. I was looking at the RRS site a couple of days ago looking for a way to join the camera body to a lens foot mount to eliminate vibration. I was figuring a rail arranement might be available but what you've got there looks very custom and optimized for that lens. Was it custom made?

Regards,
John

Thanks John. Great question. Answer: No, not at all.
I just got standard parts from RRS and Novoflex.
From RRS the rail, a plate, and two double sided clamps.
From Novoflex an R to E adapter and the collar ASTAT-NEX.
That's it.

In fact I reused the clamps from post #74 and combined them with a shorter rail.
 

Ron Pfister

Member
I think it is important to state, though, that it is sheer coincidence that the two tripod collars (or rather the QR-plates attached to them) provide attachment points that are at the same distance from the optical axis. My guess is that this particular setup is highly unlikely to work for any other lens.
 

k-hawinkler

Well-known member
I think it is important to state, though, that it is sheer coincidence that the two tripod collars (or rather the QR-plates attached to them) provide attachment points that are at the same distance from the optical axis. My guess is that this particular setup is highly unlikely to work for any other lens.

Thanks Ron.
Sometimes I get lucky! :)
Better lucky than smart! :D
 

jfirneno

Member
Re: A7R+Vario-Elmar-R 105-280/4.2 - Shutter Shock?

Thanks John. Great question. Answer: No, not at all.
I just got standard parts from RRS and Novoflex.
From RRS the rail, a plate, and two double sided clamps.
From Novoflex an R to E adapter and the collar ASTAT-NEX.
That's it.

In fact I reused the clamps from post #74 and combined them with a shorter rail.
KH:

Would you be willing to tell me what the part number is for the RRS plate under the lens foot?

Regards,
John
 

k-hawinkler

Well-known member
Re: A7R+Vario-Elmar-R 105-280/4.2 - Shutter Shock?

KH:

Would you be willing to tell me what the part number is for the RRS plate under the lens foot?

Regards,
John

Thanks John, You are welcome. Of course, no problem.

B9: Bidirectional plate with many uses - B9

BTW, there is no extra plate below the ASTAT-NEX foot.
Also, it would not fit and it's not needed here.
The two-sided clamps need to be used with the 2 little screws on the lens and not the rail side.
Then everything can be tightened just fine. ;)
 

k-hawinkler

Well-known member
Re: A7R+Vario-Elmar-R 105-280/4.2 - Shutter Shock?

Although the Leica APO-R 280/4 is a tad shorter than the Leica Vario-Elmar-R 105-280/4.2 I put the rail, clamps, plate, and collar on it and it works equally well with the A7R one a tripod.
 

jfirneno

Member
Re: A7R+Vario-Elmar-R 105-280/4.2 - Shutter Shock?

Thanks John, You are welcome. Of course, no problem.

B9: Bidirectional plate with many uses - B9

BTW, there is no extra plate below the ASTAT-NEX foot.
Also, it would not fit and it's not needed here.
The two-sided clamps need to be used with the 2 little screws on the lens and not the rail side.
Then everything can be tightened just fine. ;)
KH:
Thank you very much. Sometimes one link is worth a thousand pictures. That makes it crystal clear.

Best regards,
John
 

algrove

Well-known member
John
Just posted what I use from RRS on another Sony thread about shutter vibration here. RRS sells the lens support package. You can configure anyway you want. I use the kit with CB-YS-QR. Mine has two wheels that support the outer most end of the lens and this support can be raised up or down as needed. I also use a second BR Duo double clamp for some applications.
 

jfirneno

Member
John
Just posted what I use from RRS on another Sony thread about shutter vibration here. RRS sells the lens support package. You can configure anyway you want. I use the kit with CB-YS-QR. Mine has two wheels that support the outer most end of the lens and this support can be raised up or down as needed. I also use a second BR Duo double clamp for some applications.
Thanks algrove:

I'm interested to see what I can accomplish when this camera arrives tonight (or at worst tommorrow). Last tracking had it within my area but sometimes the last few miles can take forever,

Regards,
John
 

k-hawinkler

Well-known member
Shutter Shock at 784 mm in Portrait Mode!

So, I added an APO-Extender-R 1.4x and a 2x to the APO-R 280/4 and A7R.

This rig looks like this and has a focal length of 784 mm..


Here is a shot in landscape mode, OOC JPG reduced in size at ISO 100, ½ s, 2 s delay.


Now a 100% crop.



Switching to portrait mode now.


This shot is in portrait mode, OOC JPG reduced in size at ISO 100, ½ s, 2 s delay.


Now a 100% crop.


Apparently I finally know now what motion/vibration blur looks like. :eek:
If the crane didn't move, then ... my sensor must have.
I repeated these shots several times with similar results.

Shutter Shock at work? What do you think? Thanks.
 

Knorp

Well-known member
Re: Shutter Shock at 784 mm in Portrait Mode!

Apparently I finally know now what motion/vibration blur looks like. :eek:
If the crane didn't move, then ... my sensor must have.
I repeated these shots several times with similar results.

Shutter Shock at work? What do you think? Thanks.
Congrats :D, this is exactly what others showed us previously: some kind of "double image" effect.
I've yet to see it in my images, but as you clearly "proved" here the effect can be induced if you're happen to have found the critical setup for your rig.
Also, not shooting in portrait mode seems to cancel out a good deal of the effect ... :confused:

Edit: I'm amazed that this much of mass can be effected by that stupid little shutter :shocked:

Thanks and kind regards.
 

Ron Pfister

Member
Re: Shutter Shock at 784 mm in Portrait Mode!

Edit: I'm amazed that this much of mass can be effected by that stupid little shutter :shocked:
Bart, focal lengths in this range are affected by you breathing behind the camera, despite the mass. Better step away - or better yet use an IS lens. ;)
 

turtle

New member
Re: Shutter Shock at 784 mm in Portrait Mode!

You've copied my street photography rig, dammit! :D

So, I added an APO-Extender-R 1.4x and a 2x to the APO-R 280/4 and A7R.

This rig looks like this and has a focal length of 784 mm..


Here is a shot in landscape mode, OOC JPG reduced in size at ISO 100, ½ s, 2 s delay.


Now a 100% crop.



Switching to portrait mode now.


This shot is in portrait mode, OOC JPG reduced in size at ISO 100, ½ s, 2 s delay.


Now a 100% crop.


Apparently I finally know now what motion/vibration blur looks like. :eek:
If the crane didn't move, then ... my sensor must have.
I repeated these shots several times with similar results.

Shutter Shock at work? What do you think? Thanks.
 

benroy

Subscriber Member
A monster set-up like that requires (even on a tripod) shutter speeds at least equivalent to the focal length of the lens...the earth shakes, the wind blows, your hands on...all contribute at shutter speeds of 1/2s. I don't think you can blame the camera shutter for this problem...crank up the shutter speed!
 

GrahamB

New member
Re: Shutter Shock at 784 mm in Portrait Mode!

Shutter Shock at work? What do you think? Thanks.
I'm not convinced 2s is adequate to still the shake introduced by actuating the shutter button. I'd be very interested in seeing another example of your rig shot with the 10s delay, or better yet, a wired or wireless shutter release.

I'd also like to see a comparison with another camera shot with the same lens configuration. I've had some less than pleasing results using a 2x TC. Combining both a 2x and 1.4x may produce fringing, or blurring that has nothing to do with shutter shake.

Graham
 

Gio

New member
Re: Shutter Shock at 784 mm in Portrait Mode!

Apparently I finally know now what motion/vibration blur looks like. :eek:
If the crane didn't move, then ... my sensor must have.
I repeated these shots several times with similar results.

Shutter Shock at work? What do you think? Thanks.
Nothing new - Fritz Pölking, a german nature photographer wrote about the difference of landscape and portrait orientation some years ago:

Google Übersetzer
 

k-hawinkler

Well-known member
Re: Shutter Shock at 784 mm in Portrait Mode!

Nothing new - Fritz Pölking, a german nature photographer wrote about the difference of landscape and portrait orientation some years ago:

Google Übersetzer

Scharf

Many thanks for this reference. Much appreciated.
I have to take a closer look then and see what else I can learn.
Being relatively new to photography this certainly is an educational experience! :D


PS:

Very interesting reading indeed! Thanks again.
From the one comment with date of 2. August 2000, I have to conclude this article was written on or before the year 2000.
The author was primarily concerned with mirror slab and image stabilization available at that time in his Canon gear.

Obviously in my current gear situation I try to see whether Shutter Shock makes its mark. Of course, there is no mirror.
It also would be interesting to use this lens setup with my Olympus OM-D E-M1 with and without IBIS and see what effect if any that has.
In order for me to do that I first have to get the fitting Novoflex adapter. I already have the Novoflex ASTAT-MFT.

As suggested by forum members I can also change some of the parameters I used, like exposure time, delay, remote control, etc.
That should keep me busily entertained for awhile! :rolleyes:

I noticed also two interesting remarks by the author Fritz Pölking, quote:


"Cable release or hand

A very interesting finding was that landscape shots often been sharper if you use an electric cable release (especially with the mirror lock-up), vertical shots but when you depress the shutter button with your finger. The explanation: When horizontal exposures, the kinetic energy of shutter and mirror goes down into the lens and ball head and tripod. Vertical picture but it is directed to the side, and there helps the hand which holds the camera, destroying part of the kinetic energy before it merges into motion."



"Light or heavy ball heads?

I made ​​this test with the Kirk ball head of 1,000 grams of weight, and with the Earl Ball Head with 1.700 grams of weight. The results with the heavy head were not better, what you actually would have expected, but often slightly or significantly worse. Explanation: The heavy ball head is rigid and takes the energy of motion of the mirror and shutter is not on, but which must be 'destroyed' in the camera, resulting in vibrations in the camera. The light ball head is 'flexible like a poplar', takes the camera shake on, absorbed it and forwards it to the tripod. Thus they do not stay in the camera and therefore cause less motion blur on the slide."



Do we know in which direction the mechanical shutter moves in the A7R?
Up or down? Or sideways?
Thanks for a reply.
 
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