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Question about A7/r/s

Valentin

New member
I must be missing something here, because the Sony cameras can all shoot RAW + JPG Valentin, saving both to card. And you can always do some post processing on your smartphone or smart pad after the WiFi transfer, don't forget. ;)
Chuck,

I only shoot RAW and I would like to keep it that way. It seems that there is some kind of conversion going on even when shooting RAW (as seen further down the thread).
 

Valentin

New member
As a wedding tool, the Fuji XT-1 seems that it might be a more viable mirrorless alternative to a DSLR than the A7, if you are looking for small and light, but want good responsiveness (in part due to a good range of native lenses), but it has questionable AF in low light......
Turtle??,

I tried the X-T1 and returned it. I wasn't happy with the IQ and the AF is not good in low light. It had no problems and was responsive outdoors, but in low light was hunting and having trouble locking focus. I wish my eyes were better so I could manual focus (reliably).
 

fotografz

Well-known member
Hi Valentin, I am a wedding photographer in "low light" Michigan.

I professionally shot with Canon for years, then Nikon for a while, then 5 years ago settled in using Sony when they brought out the 24 meg FF A900 … which had the same sensor as the Nikon D3X I was using at the time. One main reason was to get at the Zeiss ZA AF optics I preferred. The other was a then considerable shedding of Pro body size and weight.

I now use a 24 meg FF Sony SLT A99 which is roughly the equivalent of your 5D-III except it is a SLT "Translucent Mirror" camera that acts like a mirror-less with a EVF rather than an optical one. It was this camera that helped me convert to electronic viewfinder use. I now also use a A7R which is truly mirror-less and really small.

A few observations and cautions.

1) Initially, EVF at a wedding is a bit difficult to get accustomed to. The bonus is that with the camera menu set to "Setting Effect On" you get exactly what you see in the viewfinder in every respect. The distracting part is you see overexposures or underexposures which can be startling at first.

If you shoot auto WB in low tungsten lit venues, the VF image will be grossly yellow/red unless you custom WB.

If you shoot a higher ISO in low light, the viewfinder shows gain and noise compared to an OVF. The view smears if you move the camera quickly in lower light ilke we often shoot in during reception events.

When you use strobes and are using a lower ISO in low light @ f/5.6 or f/8+, the viewfinder will go black.

2) With the camera menu set to "Setting Effect Off", mirror-less is similar to an OFV. This is the setting required for that type of strobe work.

3) Unlike my A99 and my second shooter's 5D-III, the A cameras are more complex to set up and to use. For one example, there isn't a dedicated button for ISO … you have to assign it to one of the buttons scattered around the camera then remember which one because it isn't marked as such. It just takes time to commit it to muscle memory.

4) The instant review of the last shot appears in the viewfinder as well as the LCD, and this is my biggest negative coming from an OVF. It was incredibly confusing when this first happened to me … shoot an decisive moment, and it "sticks" in the VF. The only way to avoid this is to completely turn instant review off … so you have to press a button to see the last shot on the LCD.

These are only meant as cautions regarding making a wholesale swap over to all Sony A kit for AF work at a wedding. It WILL slow you down at first, so I'd advise making a slower transition. This is NOT like changing OVF systems … it is a different learning curve.

Lenses:

I have the advantage that my A99 ZA optics work on the A7R camera using a LEA4 adapter that has an AF motor and Translucent Mirror in it … effectively making it a 36 meg version of the A99 that is a smaller. So, I only have the native FE 35/2.8 and 55/1.8. I had the FE 24-70/4, but it was to slow max aperture and it distorted to much IMO.

I only use the 55/1.8 at weddings. MY ZAs are generally larger on the A cameras just like your Canon Ls would be … but lenses like the AF ZA-24/2 are smaller, optically stellar, and focus very fast even in lower light thanks to the Sony AF assisted LEA4 adapter. That said, I find no difficulty with the FE-55/1.8 in lower light.

I have no intention to move to all A cameras for weddings/event work until the FE AF lens line up is more complete and better/faster than the 24-70/4 was. I tend to use the A7R for available light with the FE-55/1.8 (ISO 3200 is better than the 5D-III) … and also use it for off-camera strobe work at weddings.

Speed-Lights:

The native Sony pro speed-lights are simply too big and awkward on the little A cameras … I recently got the mentioned Nissin i40 and it is just the right size IMO … and a nifty little flash. I used it at a wedding this past week-end but in a limited manner until I come to trust it.

- Marc
 

Valentin

New member
Hi Valentin, I am a wedding photographer in "low light" Michigan....

- Marc
Somebody that's in my boat :)

Thanks Marc. I will rent one for my next wedding before making any changes: I'm not that crazy to just jump in in a totally new system :) . I just wanted to hear some feedback from real working photographers using the cameras in similar manner as mine. What works great for landscapes doesn't mean with will be OK for event work. Even that, (wedding) photographers in CA have different situations compared with photographers up North. Also, the manual doesn't have much information in it and the 400 pages user guide was designed by someone on mushrooms: very hard to find information. Hence this thread.

Tips like Anna T posted is something that it's not known (or it's buried somewhere in the manual) and you usually find by asking questions.
 

Valentin

New member
People mentioned that you can customize the Fn buttons. You could do that with the X-T1 as well but you were limited, so let me ask you more specific.

Can I put on one of the Fn buttons the following settings:

-ISO
-Format Card
-WB
-Settings Effect On/Off

So basically, when I press the Fn button, I have the option of selecting (and change) one of them. Or is it one setting per function button?
 

tn1krr

New member
People mentioned that you can customize the Fn buttons. You could do that with the X-T1 as well but you were limited, so let me ask you more specific.

Can I put on one of the Fn buttons the following settings:

-ISO
-Format Card
-WB
-Settings Effect On/Off

So basically, when I press the Fn button, I have the option of selecting (and change) one of them. Or is it one setting per function button?
There is a thing called "Fn Menu", that bring two rows (12 items total) of quick access items into LCD/EVF; you navigate/change these items with front/back dial and back panel control wheel. Navigating the Fn menu items is quite easy/efficient once you get used to it. This is in addition to about 8 (depending on if you count back dial up/down/left/right as such) configurable "soft buttons" that access a specific setting directly.

Out of the items you asked only ISO and WB are assignable to button or Fn menu, personally I miss the quick access to Setting Effect a lot. There is a lot of quite useful stuff that can be assigned like: OSS on/off, face detect settings, focus peaking colour and strength,flash mode, focus mode, metering mode, drive mode. But unfortunately there are sort of small but glaring holes too like the Setting Effect.
 

Annna T

Active member
Somebody that's in my boat :)

Thanks Marc. I will rent one for my next wedding before making any changes: I'm not that crazy to just jump in in a totally new system :) . I just wanted to hear some feedback from real working photographers using the cameras in similar manner as mine. What works great for landscapes doesn't mean with will be OK for event work. Even that, (wedding) photographers in CA have different situations compared with photographers up North. Also, the manual doesn't have much information in it and the 400 pages user guide was designed by someone on mushrooms: very hard to find information. Hence this thread.

Tips like Anna T posted is something that it's not known (or it's buried somewhere in the manual) and you usually find by asking questions.
I see what you mean : first time in my life I felt the need to get a book about a camera ! But there is one which can be useful to experienced photograohers :

Sony A7 A7r Book by Gary L. Friedman

I'm coming from Canon too and had a real pain understanding the different focusing modes, as well as finding the best settings for peaking and zebra : they are all well explained in that book.

As a side note, while my main subject isn't people, I had the occasion to participate in a wedding lately and used the A7r. I'm happy with the results (and the bride even more), but I'm accustomed to slow cameras needing prefocusing. The A7r was slow to operate and its AF was useless on moving subjects in low light (lack of reactivity). This is also true for the EVF/LCD : there is a lag between what happens and what you see in the EVF; you have to anticipate a little. My E-M5 had less lag in the VF than the A7r (May be the problem would lessen with an A7 or A7s where there are less pixels to handle ?)

However the DR is fantastic, the noise remains rather low (I shot up to 6400 ISO) and given the many pixels I could easily down sample and crop for closer views.

Concerning AF performance : read the DPreview review attentively. : the A7 performs better than the A7r, but only in good lights. in dark environments the A7 doesn't outperform the A7r, if I remember correctly.
 

Valentin

New member
...

Concerning AF performance : read the DPreview review attentively. : the A7 performs better than the A7r, but only in good lights. in dark environments the A7 doesn't outperform the A7r, if I remember correctly.
Every review I've read said that A7 is more responsive than A7r in terms of focus (regardless of light).

Obviously, I have to try it for myself since everybody is different as well as how they shoot and what they expect. I think I'll rent both the A7 and A7s to see how they compare in terms of high ISO performance as well as AF (how fast it locks focus and how accurate it is). From what I'm hearing though, it's not 100% there (for event work like weddings). I'm curious what my experience will be.
 

Annna T

Active member
Hopefully they will change that since it's a software thing.

With Canon's "My menu", you can put ANY available function in that camera in the "My men" place (see the bottom of the page Canon EOS 5D Mark III Review: Digital Photography Review). It's very useful.
I don't know for the 5D3, but on the 6D, I wanted to add the possibility to change the flash manual power (1/1, 1/2, .. 1/32, etc..) to My menu, but I could only add the top Flash Menu and still had to click way too many times to control the manual flash power.
 

fotografz

Well-known member
Valentin, I have Jump Mag set to the C1 button, ISO assigned to the C2 button next to the viewfinder so I can change it without taking my eye from the viewfinder. WB is already available with a right side push of the command wheel with-in thumb reach and also visible in the viewfinder.

I leave Setting Effect as the top menu item so I can toggle between available light, and use of off-camera strobes. When you use a properly enabled speed-light on camera, the camera automatically switches over.

- Marc
 

Valentin

New member
I don't know for the 5D3, but on the 6D, I wanted to add the possibility to change the flash manual power (1/1, 1/2, .. 1/32, etc..) to My menu, but I could only add the top Flash Menu and still had to click way too many times to control the manual flash power.
I know you can add any function that's available via the menu. Flash power is not one of them. There are a few things that you can control on the flash that way, but I'm not familiar with it. For me, it's faster to do it via flash (habit).
 

Annna T

Active member
I know you can add any function that's available via the menu. Flash power is not one of them. There are a few things that you can control on the flash that way, but I'm not familiar with it. For me, it's faster to do it via flash (habit).
I have a 430 EX II and the buttons are so uneasy to press successfully that it is a pain to use them directly on the flash. They are at the same time small, recessed and mushy. I can't understand how Canon could design such an un-ergonomic device..

BTW, I can use that flash with the A7r, but only as a dumb manual flash (only the center connector is used). You can't push the foot completely inside of the grip, so keeping the flash on the body may not be wise. I have a Yongnuo flash cord and that was working quite well for copying slides on a self-made lightbox.
 

philip_pj

New member
Stick with Canon maybe, Valentin, the small Sonys are more Leica M than DSLR, if you get my drift. A high end enthusiast camera, takes excellent small lenses, not much for flash or hardened pro usage, menus have a learning curve, but fabulous focus and exposure aids, fine EVF and industrial strength file quality even in quite low light.

I am sure you could struggle through and do pretty well but it's quite a different schtick, is what I am seeing, and from the questions people ask. Very high end the Sonys are for what they do though, very nice for a lot of people whose needs correspond to the a7 series' strengths. I do travel and wilderness, it is tailor-made for this, better than anything else, and it takes all the great lenses, apart from ironically enough, Leica M class lenses! ;-)
 

Paratom

Well-known member
I have a 5dIII, Leica M and mirrorless.
I agree that the influence of the different viewfinders make maybe a bigger influence on my images than the difference in IQ.
The 5dIII is hard to beat in regards of speed and easy to control.

With all EVF I find it harder to judge the real light and to frame the image. I also find it harder to know if I caught the image.I do not agree that one sees what one gets, because the EVF can not display the same IQ the sensor can catch.

Size is an obvious advantage of the mirrorless cameras.
 

xdayv

New member
Question: What is the best focusing aid / method to use for manual focus lenses? Is focus peaking the most effective way? Or a combination with other focusing aids (like magnification)? (Leica M lenses mounted to A7).
 

Viramati

Member
Question: What is the best focusing aid / method to use for manual focus lenses? Is focus peaking the most effective way? Or a combination with other focusing aids (like magnification)? (Leica M lenses mounted to A7).
Peaking is Ok with longer lenses and wide open but gets problematic on anything wider than 35 (at least for me) and on slower lenses. I also find it annoying that on a half press of the shutter the peaking doesn't go away (like it used to in my fuji) as it can become distracting. I also find that the peaking can be somewhat inaccurate on the wider lenses as it tends to show to much as being in focus even on the lowest setting. So on the whole I don't use it that much as I find that magnification is more accurate and in fact because the EVF is so good I can usually hit the focus not using any of the aids at all. On the A7 (not for some reason on the S and maybe because of the loser resolution sensor) you seem to get a sort of shimmering on brightly light highlights when that are in focus even with peaking turned off again can be useful or annoying
 
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