IBIS issue A7II

[Viramati]

Hi thought I would start a separate thread about this issue I have been having so here is the text from the Users report thread. Any input would be welcome

Ok Guys so have got the new body and it is still doing it What I have figured out is that if I change from either FE24-70 or the 16-35 to an adapted lens IBIS won't click in. If I change from either the FE55 or 35 it will, so I am thinking there is a firmware bug. what maybe happening is that the camera doesn't seem to register when a non electronic lens is attached after a OSS lens has been attached. I would suggest others if possible try to replicate this. I have contacted Sony UK about it.Here is the text of the email

Dear Nick
Here is a summary of the issue as far as I see it
I bought the ILCE-7M2 last Friday the 12-12-14 and noticed on Sunday that at times that the IBIS feature stopped working when using a manual lens with an adaptor (voigtlander close focus adaptor or non specific Chines adaptor) with leica Rangefinder lenses. I noticed again yesterday that the IBIS had stopped working in these circumstances and thinking it maybe a camera issue my dealer (London Camera exchange in London) replaced it with a new camera. Unfortunately the issue is still there and I have narrowed down to when it is happening.

First scenario IBIS doesn't work with adapted lens
1. I have been using the 'FE24-70 OSS' or 'FE16-35 OSS’ and switch to a manual lens with adaptor
2. I turn on the camera and hear click and if I hold camera near to my ear I can hear a slight whirring
3. I dial in the correct focal length for the lens
4 On half press of shutter release the image doesn’t stabilise
5. I can turn IBIS on and off and there is no difference

Second Scenario IBIS works with adapted lens
1. I have been using the ‘FE55/f1.8’ or 'FE35/f2.8’
2. I turn on the camera and hear click and if I hold camera near to my ear I can hear a slight whirring
3. I dial in the correct focal length for the lens
4 On half press of shutter release the image does stabilise and behaves as I would expect

I am shooting RAW without jpeg and with batteries that are fully charged. All other functions appear normal

What appears to me to be happing is that when a lens that is not electronically in contact with the camera is used after the use of and OSS (Optical Steady Shot) lens for some reason the camera won’t activate the IBIS mechanism even though it sounds like is functioning. When using an adopted lens after using a Sony FE non OSS lens IBIS seems to activate.
It would appear that this maybe be a software bug as I am having the same issue even on the 2nd camera.

 

[jonoslack]

David
Right - I've swapped lenses - 24-70, 55, 135 M, 80-200 R etc. etc. sometimes with the camera turned on, sometimes off. I certainly can't always hear the IBIS (but then I'm pretty deaf). However - it has always worked - tough to see with a half press on 50mm lenses, but easy on 135 and 200 - and as far as I can see it's working consistently.

Which doesn't mean it isn't firmware - it just means we have something else set differently so that it doesn't happen with me. Have you tried a factory reset and then see? I'm pretty much on factory settings except that.

1. I've turned off manual focus assist (zoom in? paff)
2. I've turned off focus peaking (because it's easier to focus without it)
3. I've put C4 (the dustbin) to focal length selection for IBIS.

 

[jonoslack]

Hi David
Yes! I agree, However I don't think that the IBIS is turned off, but that the screen based stabilisation doesn't cut in when you've previously used an OSS lens. (I'm not certain about this).

Do you have anyone to report this to?

Incidentally I think you're brilliant to have pinned it down so precisely.

Does everyone see the same?

 

[Viramati]

My first post shows the copy of the email i have sent to Sony after speaking to the service dept. They said they would forward to the development dpt and I should hear something back tomorrow

 

[Show Performance]

Will be curious to follow this.

I have tested with native, dumb and electronic adapters and all have worked fine with IBIS. Tested using the 55/1.8, Contax G 90mm, Sony Zeiss 135/1.8 and Minolta AF 200/2.8

Note, I don't have any OSS lenses so you may be onto something...

 

[Show Performance]

The easiest way for Sony to clear questions like this up would be to have a graphical IBIS strength indicator like they do on A-Mount.

 

[k-hawinkler]

Is there a way to dump on demand all camera settings to the memory card to share with Sony?
Or send off via wi-fi?
It also would be useful if one could read in those settings, configure another A7II camera that way and try to reconstruct the problem.

 

[Viramati]

Is there a way to dump on demand all camera settings to the memory card to share with Sony?
Or send off via wi-fi?
It also would be useful if one could read in those settings, configure another A7II camera that way and try to reconstruct the problem.

let's hope so

 

[k-hawinkler]

let's hope so

Well, I hate to suggest this.
I did it when there were initial firmware problems with the M9.
I sat down and made a template, entering by hand all settings.
Making the initial template spreadsheet to capture all settings is a lot of work.
After that it's easy to keep track of the few changes one makes.
Then I kept a detailed record and posted incidents of failure.
And developed a work around for issues.

It looks like you already know your work around for this specific issue.
Good luck with working on the cutting bleeding edge of technology.

This time around I'll wait a bit before jumping in.
I first would like to know how things shape up, also with A7R II and A9.

 

[Viramati]

Thanks for that. I quite enjoy diagnostics which I suppose come from my days as a heating engineer and having to solve central heating boiler and system problems. I just hope that I can manage to get into direct contact with the Sony development team.

 

[k-hawinkler]

Thanks for that. I quite enjoy diagnostics which I suppose come from my days as a heating engineer and having to solve central heating boiler and system problems. I just hope that I can manage to get into direct contact with the Sony development team.

I hope so too, as it would also be to Sony's benefit to take advantage of your skill set and experiences with the A7II camera. Again good luck to you. Your are helping all prospective owners. Thanks.

 

[Viramati]

I hope so too, as it would also be to Sony's benefit to take advantage of your skill set and experiences with the A7II camera. Again good luck to you. Your are helping all prospective owners. Thanks.

I did point that out them and the Guy I spoke to on the phone and he did seem to realise that I had a faint inkling that I had some idea that I knew what I was talking about

 

[k-hawinkler]

I did point that out them and the Guy I spoke to on the phone and he did seem to realise that I had a faint inkling that I had some idea that I knew what I was talking about

Well you already accomplished the first step to solving the problem, namely being able to demonstrate the problem on demand! Sony couldn't hope for being more lucky!

 

[jonoslack]

So, David - would you agree with me that the IBIS is still working, but that the problem is the viewfinder steadying when half pressing the shutter is not working?

 

[k-hawinkler]

So, David - would you agree with me that the IBIS is still working, but that the problem is the viewfinder steadying when half pressing the shutter is not working?

How do you determine/conclude this?
What's the evidence?

 

[Guy Mancuso]

Just a thought which still bugs me the FE glass is working but 3rd party are not. Maybe in the viewfinder it only works with lenses it can read the electronics even though it works in reality on the sensor. But it's not showing 3rd party In The finder itself because it has no electronics to read. Also the manual plug in for length of lenses may only apply for the sensor not the finder.

This makes some sense as others report it is actually working on the sensor side.

To shorten that whole thing. 3rd party lenses without electronics work but don't show in the finder it's working.

I can't test this because I have Canon glass with electronics in the metabones adapter which works in the finder and sensor. So I can't tell

 

[k-hawinkler]

Just a thought which still bugs me the FE glass is working but 3rd party are not. Maybe in the viewfinder it only works with lenses it can read the electronics even though it works in reality on the sensor. But it's not showing 3rd party In The finder itself because it has no electronics to read. Also the manual plug in for length of lenses may only apply for the sensor not the finder.

This makes some sense as others report it is actually working on the sensor side.

To shorten that whole thing. 3rd party lenses without electronics work but don't show in the finder it's working.

I can't test this because I have Canon glass with electronics in the metabones adapter which works in the finder and sensor. So I can't tell

Could you please name a source for "as others report"?

Question: Assume it's true what you say, which image does the finder show?

As I have seen it described, for native OSS lenses 2 modes of image stabilization are used from the OSS, 3 from IBIS. For all other lenses 5 from IBIS. Is that correct?

 

[Guy Mancuso]

Well I think right here Folks are saying its actually working with 3rd party lenses. I think Jono said it in the other thread and 2 or 3 posts up

I'm guessing at this but it's starting to make sense to me. If it's actually working but we are not seeing it happen in the finder itself than there is some kind of electronic disconnect to the finder show it. Not having any electronics in the lens might just be the cause for it. My canons show it both in finder and sensor but they have electronic connections.

Now we need to prove it but reading this , I'm smelling something fishy and it comes down to electronics. He is not having a body issue as this is his second one and still not showing it in the finder. My other guess if your plugging in the focal length than only the sensor side is getting that data. That would explain it actually working in image but maybe that plugging in the focal length does not give the data to the finder .

 

[k-hawinkler]

So, where does the jerky image, that the finder shows, come from if the sensor image itself is stabilized and presumably doesn't jerk?

 

[Guy Mancuso]

So, where does the jerky image that the finder shows come from if the sensor image is stabilized?

That's a excellent question. Not being the engineer type I don't know but I can guess damn good. Lol

I suspect its identical until the shutter goes down than the image stabilizer is active on the sensor.

The hard part is we don't know the actually design part on what Sony did to implement the system. We may never know that.

I'm just thinking this through and it makes some sense to me this is what's happening. Also these 3rd party lenses are only using 3 types of stabilzation not 5