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Loxia 35mm VS 16-35 at 35mm test

Stuart Richardson

Active member
Hi Guy,
I did not mean no vignetting of course, but this one just seems like a lot to me...the corners are very dark indeed in comparison to the 5.6 shots...at least 2 stops. Anyway, I am not here to argue with your experience, but it does not jive with mine in this respect.
Anyway, not one for me!
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
I will test this but that image is hard to judge since the whole bottom half is in the shade. So vignetting is a little harder to pick up my gut says by 2.8 its great reduced
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
Okay went back in and made adjustments to that F2 shot





Opened up the shadows a little pulled down the highlights added 12 points of clarity and minus .27 stops on vignetting
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
Okay this one is interesting as I said i shot this building a ton. Last review I did was the Credo 50 Mpx CMOS back with a tech cam and a Rodenstock 40mm which it does not get much better than that. There is rise on this as I was doing a stitch but this was one of the images. Focused at the same spot at F11

Colors are different as the Credo does need a LCC but I just want to see the clarity between the two





100 percent crop no compensation for mpx or framing and such but close enough





Now Credo is closer in and it is 14 mpx bigger but just for fun its pretty interesting
 

JonPB

New member
Not sure why there is not a lot more hoopla on it as its a damn good lens.
Personally, I lost interest in this lens after seeing the rather strong coma wide open. Your test shots, though, show that this virtually disappears by f/2.8. I'm now thinking that the Loxia 35/2 could be the best general-purpose 35mm out there (aside from those who believe they need autofocus). At f/2, which seems most at home with people shots in dim light, unwanted details are softened and the coma adds a cinematic flare-like effect that I find pleasing. (I prefer flare and undercorrected spherical aberration, but the tangential alignment of coma would make for a pleasant swirly appearance even when objects are relatively in focus, such as with many social indoor scenes where 35/2 makes a lot of sense.) At f/4 (!), it looks quite capable of handling the needs of even rather demanding landscape photos. And all of this in a package that one might be willing to carry with them even when they're not specifically planning to shoot photos.

On the other hand, Guy, I don't think Sony should send you lenses unless they're rather confident they will hold up to your scrutiny. :) Manufacturers that want to showcase their glass, however, would certainly be more likely to make a sale to me after being put through the wringer here.

Cheers,
Jon
 

iiiNelson

Well-known member
Folks thats pretty darn good in my mind.
Agreed the that is pretty impressive comparing a ~$3K combo to a ~$35-40K combo and seeing it being roughly 80% of the performance (albeit without MF look.) The family resemblance of Sony sensors is very strong and the Leaf color isn't all too different from the Sony color - just a bit more saturated and bolder which is great for skin tones I'm told. The important thing is the amount of latitude in PP.

To be honest the more I look at both the Loxia and the Distagon the more I'm torn. I think the Distagon is better all around optically for my purposes from what I've seen but I don't know that it's $3-400 better outside the extra stop and the smoother bokeh (from what I've seen.) What the Distagon would allow me to do is sell the Sigma Art and not have to buy the Loxia which would offset the price quite a bit and lightened my bag a bit with one lens to do the job of two. I could possibly even swing the Distagon and 28FE for the price of the Loxia (~$1300) IF I decided to sell the Sigma Art.

Hmmm... Decisions... Decisions...
 

thomas

New member
Personally, I lost interest in this lens after seeing the rather strong coma wide open.
The closer shots show damn good sharpness at f2.0. So I think you are talking about the wider shots taken at f2.0 that look somehwhat soft, correct?
Now, I have yet to see a fast wide (wider than normal) lens that is really sharp wide open at wide distances (although sharp at shorter distances).

Too... did you look at the RAW files? Some shots are a bit misfocused (front focus in some captures)...
And finally don't underestimate appropriate sharpening settings. Guy clearly stated he applied standard settings. But the A7R shines when you apply relatively high sharpening settings with very small radius and very low threshold... IMHO
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
This lens will make that new Distagon a tough decision. I view that as a nice statement for the Loxia. Now wide open well no one in there right mind would shoot a distance shot wide open. Kind of what would be the point unless low light. But still we have to beat these things up to see what they can do. Do okay with the Raws folks. Web is a little tough to see what's going on. I will reload them again if need be when it expires. Believe me all your comments are a excellent dialogue to get to the performance level. It's not exactly a cheap lens and if you ask me about 200 more than it should be. What else is new
 

thomas

New member
Thomas what settings are you using in C1 . I have sharpness at 190/.6/1
280|0.4|0.4. These are my "preview" sharpening settings based on the ZM Planar 2.0/50 and FE Sonnar 2.8/35 both at f8 optimized for the midfield of the capture frame. Alternatively I've also stored 650|0.3|0.2... (IIRC I've adjusted these for the FE 1.8/55 wide open - these settings also seem to work quite good for the Loxia wide open with the close shots).
I do process my captures without sharpening out of C1, though ... so, mind you, these settings are for preview purposes only.

BTW... just ordered a Loxia 35. Should be here end of the week ... :)
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
Thanks Thomas glad this helped make a decision for and please keep us updated on your findings as well. All great data here for folks to consider.

I'll try those settings sounds interesting
 

JonPB

New member
The closer shots show damn good sharpness at f2.0.
Yes, but that has to do more with the scene than the lens. Almost any lens made in the last 50 years will render high contrast, hard edges as sharp at moderate magnification.

I completely agree with you that this lens has very good resolution at f/2 for an f/2 lens. In fact, it appears very well corrected, especially for color, except for this one problem (and my own idiosyncratic distaste for the overcorrected spherical aberration that characterizes most Zeiss lenses but which is admittedly mild here). The word "sharp" bothers me in discussions like this, however, due to it being subject so many variables...so I tend to overreact to its use.

So I think you are talking about the wider shots taken at f2.0 that look somehwhat soft, correct?
Specifically, I would point out the nailhead in the upper left corner of the '9309 file, which shows distinct smearing (I may be wrong that it is caused by coma) in a tangential pattern. This is practically gone in the '9310 file. Also, compare the floodlight that's even closer to the corner, where the same thing shows. Now that you know what I'm referring to, look at the thick white line on the horse's nose in the middle portion of the frame. Again, the same smearing is dominant across that edge at f/2, but gone at f/2.8.

Admittedly, this coma/smearing won't show up across low-contrast edges, but I seek out strong light in my own photography so that level of aberration was a no-go for me in those circumstances.

Before Guy posted these samples--and made such glowing (pun intended) remarks about the lens that I had to download the images to challenge my prior impression--I had only seen f/2 and f/8-ish samples. I figured that the coma died out across a few f-stops, like it does with most lenses. As it is, at least from these test shots, it appears that this lens is an extremely well-behaved lens. I'd probably shoot it as if it were an f/2.8 lens, but that's okay because I prefer slow lenses, and the Loxia would simply add an f/2 option to my arsenal. If I were in the market, it would have just shot to the top of my list.

Now, I'll have to not lurk in this thread quite so much or the gear lust will overcome me and put an unnecessary dent in my liquor budget. :D

Cheers,
Jon
 

Viramati

Member
I have have the 16-35 and the FE35 and find them both to be very good in the areas where they are known to perform best. Personally I just find the 35/1.4 just too big and expensive to justify it's purchase as I already own the CV35/1.2 which performs very well at 1.4 when I need that kind of shot
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
280|0.4|0.4. These are my "preview" sharpening settings based on the ZM Planar 2.0/50 and FE Sonnar 2.8/35 both at f8 optimized for the midfield of the capture frame. Alternatively I've also stored 650|0.3|0.2... (IIRC I've adjusted these for the FE 1.8/55 wide open - these settings also seem to work quite good for the Loxia wide open with the close shots).
I do process my captures without sharpening out of C1, though ... so, mind you, these settings are for preview purposes only.

BTW... just ordered a Loxia 35. Should be here end of the week ... :)
Thomas i tried out these settings . Going back to the one image

Here is the 650/.3/.2 setting. This is sharp for sure



Now the other setting 280/.4/.4
is here



Here is the full image so not to confuse folks



I think I like the 280/.4/.4 settings and may just make that my new default.
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
I can see why you could use the higher setting as well if you really want to get sharp sharp. It maybe slightly overdone but that maybe a personal call on my part but nice to see you can get there wide open with this lens. The more I play around with the images the more I like this lens. I want the 50mm F2 Planar bad now

Actually that is incredible how sharp that is for wide open.
 

iiiNelson

Well-known member
Those settings do improve the IQ that much more. I do like the increased sharpness of the top image better but I think the bottom one would work better as a general baseline to start unless you see a trend of constantly applying additional sharpness to most images.
 

Guy Mancuso

Administrator, Instructor
Yes I like the lower sharpness settings as a new baseline than take it from there per type of image.
 

thomas

New member
I can see why you could use the higher setting as well if you really want to get sharp sharp. It maybe slightly overdone ...
Those settings do improve the IQ that much more. I do like the increased sharpness of the top image better but I think the bottom one would work better as a general baseline to start ...
Yes I like the lower sharpness settings as a new baseline than take it from there per type of image.
Agree with Guy here. The higher settings (650|0.3|0.2) show too much halos in such a high contrast scene. They are better suited for low contrast scenes. 500|0.5|0.5 might be a compromise for a default setting at wide open aperture :)

Personally I do print all of my images (well, not of all of them, but all successful or at least reasonable images). This is why I set relatively high sharpening settings in C1 for preview purposes. As outlined above I do process my captures without sharpening applied out of C1. For the actual final sharpening I do use different tools ... depending on the motif/expression. Basically I try to avoid ANY halos when sharpening (at least any halos visible in a print)... this is why I sharpen in Photohsop on multiple layers with different settings for blacks/whites, image center and image edges. Quite often I also use Iridient Developer for sharpening (for a first instance of deconvolution sharpening of my TIFs processed out of C1).

To get back on topic... the one capture that really tells quite something about the capabilities of the lens at f2.0 is the capture of the cemetery posted in "biglouis'" review posted here: LouisBerk.com - Zeiss Loxia 35/2 Review ... and referenced to here in this thread in post #51 ( http://www.getdpi.com/forum/635187-post51.html ) ... because at the edges there is low contrast and still the lens reveals some decent detail edge to edge (at least decent for f2.0). Direct link: http://www.louisberk.com/getdpi/loxia352/_DSC0093.JPG
There is some "blur" of course ... but it's a nice kind of blur - a kind of blur that really reminds me of my Contax645 2.0/80 Planar at f2.0 (look-wise one of my favorite lenses of all time ...).
Can't wait to compare the Loxia 50-Planar to my ZM 2.0/50 Planar on the A7R :)
 
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