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Thread: Pre Order

  1. #51
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    Re: Pre Order

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack View Post
    Preorder what?

    Next November's F/S items …

    - Marc
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    Re: Pre Order



    My guess, I'll have to start another thread like: "A7r II - and why I'm keeping it ..."
    With best regards, K-H.
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    Re: Pre Order

    Or worse yet... "why I am selling this camera" after stating a month earlier how it is the greatest thing since sliced bread..... then moving on to the next latest and greatest new techno widget only to do the same thing after a month or so.
    It's a never ending insatiable cycle for some where satisfaction is never totally realized..... like a hamster on a wheel. But, it is great for the used buyers ..... nearly new cameras at significant discount.

    The local guy's I know who's only income is their photography (like wedding guy's) use the same old gear which consist of 4 or 5 of the same bodies till the wheels literally fall off them.... their cameras are duct taped, 12mp or under cameras that maybe 4-5 years old. They can't afford to chase the latest and greatest nor do they want to use unfamiliar gear every two to three months. I do product photography part time but I have investments and a decent retirement from a fortune 500 major industry to rely on so my photography monies just help pay for more toys.
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    Re: Pre Order

    For me this camera is more about the fixes I needed. I don't expect to change anytime soon to be honest. This looks to be it for me.

    I'm done chasing pie in the sky and big rainbows. I just want a good working system.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Re: Pre Order

    Guy I was not referring to anyone specifically.... I just see this behavior all over the web. I fully understand the desire for a one body does all expectation..... sadly I have not found it either as I use 7 different bodies for their strengths and to avoid their weaknesses. I hope this a7rII is the all rounder we all want too.....
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    Re: Pre Order

    I know, no worries at all but my true motivation on this body is getting the corrections and after that with all these new features. I really don't need anything more. I'm hoping this works. I don't complain much about cameras as others do and tend to stay a little quiet on my frustrations but the A7r started to get on my nerves with certain issues. Sync speed was not as advertised for one.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Re: Pre Order

    Guy, the sync speed is always going to be less than what is advertised with a single point contact. Only with Sony system and compatible speedlights it will be as advertised. It is the way the new Sony flash shoe is configured.

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    Re: Pre Order

    Actually it's off camera studio strobes are a issue
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Re: Pre Order

    What are the odds of an A9 now that an A7RII has been announced? What bases would it cover that the A7RII does not?

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    Re: Pre Order

    Quote Originally Posted by hcubell View Post
    What are the odds of an A9 now that an A7RII has been announced? What bases would it cover that the A7RII does not?

    Great question.
    I think it will be awhile before the A7R II needs updating - whatever they will call that.
    But I suppose an A7S II soon still makes sense.
    With best regards, K-H.

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    Re: Pre Order

    Quote Originally Posted by k-hawinkler View Post
    Great question.
    I think it will be awhile before the A7R II needs updating - whatever they will call that.
    But I suppose an A7S II soon still makes sense.
    Sure.

    Mind you what about a 48mpx version with back lit curved sensor? So much better for all that legacy/manual glass.

    Then the back-lit, curved, stacked sensor giving 150mpx?

    Then the...

    Sony product management is all about churn not stability of the product line.

    Just my two cents.

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    Re: Pre Order

    FWIW, this is what will follow the A7rII, rather quickly- I think.

    A lower priced version of the A7rII.

    Sony would have already started production on this based on the preorder estimates for the A7R II.

    The rumored A9 solely rests on the success of the A7RII.

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    Re: Pre Order

    Quote Originally Posted by biglouis View Post
    Sure.

    Mind you what about a 48mpx version with back lit curved sensor? So much better for all that legacy/manual glass.

    Then the back-lit, curved, stacked sensor giving 150mpx?

    Then the...

    Sony product management is all about churn not stability of the product line.

    Just my two cents.

    LouisB

    LouisB, I hope you are spot on.
    With best regards, K-H.
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    Re: Pre Order

    Quote Originally Posted by hcubell View Post
    What are the odds of an A9 now that an A7RII has been announced? What bases would it cover that the A7RII does not?
    20 fps at full resolution.

    My Samsung NX1 does 15fps.
    My D4 does 10fps.

    Sony, bring on a sports camera !!

    -Bill

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    Re: Pre Order

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim DE View Post
    Or worse yet... "why I am selling this camera" after stating a month earlier how it is the greatest thing since sliced bread..... then moving on to the next latest and greatest new techno widget only to do the same thing after a month or so.
    It's a never ending insatiable cycle for some where satisfaction is never totally realized..... like a hamster on a wheel. But, it is great for the used buyers ..... nearly new cameras at significant discount.

    The local guy's I know who's only income is their photography (like wedding guy's) use the same old gear which consist of 4 or 5 of the same bodies till the wheels literally fall off them.... their cameras are duct taped, 12mp or under cameras that maybe 4-5 years old. They can't afford to chase the latest and greatest nor do they want to use unfamiliar gear every two to three months. I do product photography part time but I have investments and a decent retirement from a fortune 500 major industry to rely on so my photography monies just help pay for more toys.
    Jim:

    I think the reason for this constant churn is the possition of mirrorless cameras in the market place. Sony is attempting to displace an existing product (DSLRs) with a still developing product (A7 series). The A7 cameras have not yet matured to the point where each generation is only incrementally different from the last. Whole new features (IBIS, EFCS, etc.) are appearing with each new model so owners feel left behind and are willing to trade up to get these new features. I guess it's the curse of a new platform.
    Regards,
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    Re: Pre Order

    I would agree with John that Sony are still at a similar stage to Fuji have been recently in that they are making quite major tweaks and amendments to the platform to get it right. The A7II ticked pretty much all my boxes (ok, AF isn't on a par even now with a real DSLR), and hopefully even an A7R as it was plus the A7II updates would make me happy.

    As regards the new sensor ... We'll have to wait and see.

    My order goes in tomorrow.
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    Re: Pre Order

    I agree with the above statements hence the "need" for more frequent updates as major technological advances occur. This isn't exclusive to Sony. Everyone does /did this although it happens less frequently with DSLR's and Rangefinders now. Technology is moving at a much faster pace than ever before. When it gets "there" the major updates and number of various models will slow down to target models for a particular price point/application.

    In the mean time I'm happy with the updates that Sony has provided although I've skipped the A7II in hopes of this camera and a future A9.
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    Re: Pre Order

    Quote Originally Posted by HiredArm View Post
    In the mean time I'm happy with the updates that Sony has provided although I've skipped the A7II in hopes of this camera and a future A9.
    Tre:
    Yes, exactly. I think people sometimes forget that you can skip a couple of iterations (and wait 6 months for the price to fall) and still have a usable kit. Part of the problem is the overly enthusiastic descriptions that certain early reviewers give. I now rent these cutting edge cameras before buying. That way I only have myself to blame if it isn't what I thought it would be.
    Regards,
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    Re: Pre Order

    I wouldn't blame it on "overly enthusiastic descriptions that certain early reviewers give".
    No, independent of them for me this is just exciting new technology that I want to get my hands on. :-)
    With best regards, K-H.
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    Re: Pre Order

    Quote Originally Posted by k-hawinkler View Post
    I wouldn't blame it on "overly enthusiastic descriptions that certain early reviewers give".
    No, independent of them for me this is just exciting new technology that I want to get my hands on. :-)
    Well, I feel that for people who aren't familiar with the current state of mirrorless technology it's helpful to share with them what are some of the weaker aspects of these cameras. I know I appreciate getting helpful hints whenever I start out researching anything new. In the long run I think it helps to give the product a better reputation if people go into a purchase already knowing the strengths and weaknesses. But some of the early reviewers are way too enthusiastic. This can lead to unreasonably high expectations.
    Regards,
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    Re: Pre Order

    Thanks.
    At this early stage I am not aware or reviews - only of, let's call them, infomercials for lack of a better word and Sony press releases.
    Could you please point me to publications that deserve the description review? TIA.
    With best regards, K-H.
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    Re: Pre Order

    Quote Originally Posted by k-hawinkler View Post
    Thanks.
    At this early stage I am not aware or reviews - only of, let's call them, infomercials for lack of a better word and Sony press releases.
    Could you please point me to publications that deserve the description review? TIA.
    k-hawinkler:
    I think there is a misunderstanding. I do not think you are inexperienced with the A7 cameras. I was speaking of folks who are new to Sony. You are already familiar with the A7 cameras.
    Regards,
    John
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    Re: Pre Order

    Quote Originally Posted by jfirneno View Post
    Jim:

    I think the reason for this constant churn is the possition of mirrorless cameras in the market place. Sony is attempting to displace an existing product (DSLRs) with a still developing product (A7 series). The A7 cameras have not yet matured to the point where each generation is only incrementally different from the last. Whole new features (IBIS, EFCS, etc.) are appearing with each new model so owners feel left behind and are willing to trade up to get these new features. I guess it's the curse of a new platform.


    If this phenomenom only recently occurred with the introduction of the a7 line I would tend to agree with you but sadly it has been a roller coaster ride since the a900 and the introduction of the first SLT's. The wave of enthuesiasm then disgust to another models enthuesiasm to yet another degree of disgust a month or two later. Same goes for the lenses as well....... Bottomline is for some the excitement to photography is in the chase of technological advancements (that seem to never quench this thirst) where others it is in the capture of light with whatever they have in their hands. Both are all well and good and I am not telling anyone what they should enjoy about this activity it is just new readers need to recognize these differences in those posting and not click "buy" when they hear something is the best thing since buttered bread. Only to see the techno hoards that promoted XYZ running away from the product (they just bought a month or two ago) selling them at a loss in their hurry and buying the newer and greatest for this month model ABC or make MNO.

    It is not just a a7 phenomenom unfortunately .........
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    Re: Pre Order

    Quote Originally Posted by jfirneno View Post
    I think people sometimes forget that you can skip a couple of iterations (and wait 6 months for the price to fall) and still have a usable kit.
    By next year, they'll all be last-year's model.

    There's no proverbial "It" in this game, and I've got proof:

    http://www.getdpi.com/forum/gear-fs-or-wtb/
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    Re: Pre Order

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim DE View Post
    If this phenomenom only recently occurred with the introduction of the a7 line I would tend to agree with you but sadly it has been a roller coaster ride since the a900 and the introduction of the first SLT's. The wave of enthuesiasm then disgust to another models enthuesiasm to yet another degree of disgust a month or two later. Same goes for the lenses as well....... Bottomline is for some the excitement to photography is in the chase of technological advancements (that seem to never quench this thirst) where others it is in the capture of light with whatever they have in their hands. Both are all well and good and I am not telling anyone what they should enjoy about this activity it is just new readers need to recognize these differences in those posting and not click "buy" when they hear something is the best thing since buttered bread. Only to see the techno hoards that promoted XYZ running away from the product (they just bought a month or two ago) selling them at a loss in their hurry and buying the newer and greatest for this month model ABC or make MNO.

    It is not just a a7 phenomenom unfortunately .........
    I guess we each have our reasons for climbing onto the Sony fun-ride. When the A-850 came out it combined a full frame sensor, 24 mpix and IBIS for only $2,000. I thought I was getting a high end DSLR at a bargain price. I didn't anticipate SLT, NEX, e-mount adapters and all the other trials and tribulations of the Sony odyssey. But I have adapted and learned that I don't necessarily need every model (or even every technology). For instance I've never owned an SLT camera. I was tempted by the A-99 but when the results were analyzed I only saw about a half stop of better high ISO performance over my A-850 so I decided to wait. I do think I jumped the gun with the NEX-5N and the A7R but I'm very happy with the A7S camera for indoor photography, so 7 years later I have the upgrade I was looking for my A-850 (wow that's a long time between cameras). For the future, I'm hoping for a camera that will autofocus very accurately. I don't need 40 (or even 20) mpix. If Sony came out with an 18 mpix camera like the A7S that was excellent in the dark and also had good AF I'd be satisfied. Maybe Sony will make that camera or maybe it will be Samsung (or Apple, Nikon or Canon). If I knew in 2008 what I know now I'd have saved my pennies and bought a Nikon D3S. Just about now I'd be looking at what Sony is doing and deciding if it was something i was interested in. But these companies have their strategies and priorities and we have our needs and rationalizations for our decisions. Shoulda, coulda, woulda.
    Regards,
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    Re: Pre Order

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim DE View Post
    If this phenomenom only recently occurred with the introduction of the a7 line I would tend to agree with you but sadly it has been a roller coaster ride since the a900 and the introduction of the first SLT's. The wave of enthuesiasm then disgust to another models enthuesiasm to yet another degree of disgust a month or two later. Same goes for the lenses as well....... Bottomline is for some the excitement to photography is in the chase of technological advancements (that seem to never quench this thirst) where others it is in the capture of light with whatever they have in their hands. Both are all well and good and I am not telling anyone what they should enjoy about this activity it is just new readers need to recognize these differences in those posting and not click "buy" when they hear something is the best thing since buttered bread. Only to see the techno hoards that promoted XYZ running away from the product (they just bought a month or two ago) selling them at a loss in their hurry and buying the newer and greatest for this month model ABC or make MNO.

    It is not just a a7 phenomenom unfortunately .........
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    Re: Pre Order

    So does GasX ...
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    Re: Pre Order

    Devil's advocate here.

    I've jumped off the Sony Ride entirely now. I felt the A7 was a good sensor and a decent EVF in a clunky body. The II model doesn't make me feel any different. It let me use my Leica R lenses, but I never really loved using it. I don't see that changing given Sony's pell-mell rush to introduce new products every seven months.

    All my Sony stuff is sold and gone. Paring the kit down to the specifics I really like to work with, one thing at a time, is making me much happier.

    G

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    Re: Pre Order

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim DE View Post
    So does GasX ...
    You got it.
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    Re: Pre Order

    Quote Originally Posted by Godfrey View Post
    Devil's advocate here.

    I've jumped off the Sony Ride entirely now. I felt the A7 was a good sensor and a decent EVF in a clunky body. The II model doesn't make me feel any different. It let me use my Leica R lenses, but I never really loved using it. I don't see that changing given Sony's pell-mell rush to introduce new products every seven months.

    All my Sony stuff is sold and gone. Paring the kit down to the specifics I really like to work with, one thing at a time, is making me much happier.

    G
    Ironically that sort of why I got rid of my M. Great body to work with within the strengths of the system (focal lengths from 24-90mm) but once you need to do more outside of that there are other choices that are more befitting. Mirrorless or DSLR are your main choices to fill the needs.

    I chose mirrorless for the ability to have more capable sensors than Leica currently offers and flexibility to mount the lenses I choose so that I'm not tied to Canon/Nikon exclusively. Yes I could've gone Micro 4/3 but as the saying goes - been there, done that, got the t-shirt, and moved on to Full Frame sensors only.
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    Re: Pre Order

    Quote Originally Posted by HiredArm View Post
    Ironically that sort of why I got rid of my M. Great body to work with within the strengths of the system (focal lengths from 24-90mm) but once you need to do more outside of that there are other choices that are more befitting. Mirrorless or DSLR are your main choices to fill the needs.

    I chose mirrorless for the ability to have more capable sensors than Leica currently offers and flexibility to mount the lenses I choose so that I'm not tied to Canon/Nikon exclusively. Yes I could've gone Micro 4/3 but as the saying goes - been there, done that, got the t-shirt, and moved on to Full Frame sensors only.
    Whatever works for you is best.

    The Leica M-P allows me to use my Nikon (or Leica R) lenses when I want to do macro or other work outside the range of Leica M lenses (copy work, long tele work, etc). And when I want a more automation oriented solution, I have my Olympus E-M1 system with lenses from 20mm to 600mm EFOV available with full automation, image stabilization, WiFi remote control, full-function wired tethering, etc.

    No one system does everything best. For me, the complementary nature of the Leica M-P and the Olympus E-M1 work very well for the majoriy of what I want to do.

    If I want a FF DSLR for fast sports work with a long lens, well, I have all the lenses (for use with my F6, 18mm to 800mm) and just rent the appropriate Nikon DSLR body du jour. :-)

    I simply wasn't happy working with the Sony A7 system. It didn't do what I wanted as well as the M-P does for full frame, and felt crude and annoying to me, compared to the E-M1. That said, I found it quite capable of producing very high quality photos and don't want to be thought of as disparaging it ... It just wasn't right for me.

    G
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    Re: Pre Order

    I didn't take it that way at all Godfrey and I agree that Sony has some ways to go in refinement compared to more established systems. I find them going in the correct direction generally and seem to be learning from some past mistakes. No they don't have the prestige of Leica, the heritage of Canon/Nikon, the purely photographic vision of Fuji, the compactness of Micro 4/3, but they do have innovation/technology/responsive nature to the desires of customers on their side more than many other brands.
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    Re: Pre Order

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    For me this camera is more about the fixes I needed. I don't expect to change anytime soon to be honest. This looks to be it for me.

    I'm done chasing pie in the sky and big rainbows. I just want a good working system.
    I think consumerism has a way to making one change or update their cameras but adding irresistible features or fixes. Time will tell when an A7r iii comes out in the future....

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    Re: Pre Order

    Quote Originally Posted by Godfrey View Post
    Devil's advocate here.

    I've jumped off the Sony Ride entirely now. I felt the A7 was a good sensor and a decent EVF in a clunky body. The II model doesn't make me feel any different. It let me use my Leica R lenses, but I never really loved using it. I don't see that changing given Sony's pell-mell rush to introduce new products every seven months.

    All my Sony stuff is sold and gone. Paring the kit down to the specifics I really like to work with, one thing at a time, is making me much happier.

    G

    So, it was the feel and the controls that put you off the a7 series cameras? Or was the the sure romance of the Leica that allured you back .

    Appearance wise, in my opinion, both the a7 style mark i and mark ii designs do not really appeal to me, especially with regards to the fake prism hump iteration on the mark i. The mark ii's fake hump is better but still not as well implemented as the Olympus E-M1 aesthetic wise. I would have personally preferred the A7 to follow similar form factor to the a6k, maybe slightly larger with the viewfinder tucked into the left corner. As the rumours have it, the a9 is meant to sport this type of formfactor.


    Specification wise, there is not much to fault, the A7 series sensors and EVF do not disappoint, and it seems the mk ii's further add to an already feature packed ILC.

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    Re: Pre Order

    Specifications do little for me.

    It is the feel, the controls, and the fact that I see better quality photos even with my M9 compared to the A7. Remember that I already had the "romance of the Leica" in hand when I bought the A7. I was looking for more, but the A7 didn't deliver the "more" I was looking for.

    I don't know about anyone else, but the best cameras to me have been serviceable lumpkins that fit in the hand well. Of course, they all have to meet the minimum level of performance that I want too. Hasselblad, Nikon, Leica, Olympus, Linhof, and Rollei have all made cameras that had the kind of in-hand utility and performance that I look for. The Sony A7, for me, is simply awkward to hold, awkward to use, and I quite frankly like the files that come out of my Olympus E-M1 and (now) Leica M-P more.

    The fact that the Leica M-P is modestly attractive, in a utilitarian sort of way like the Nikon F6 and Hasselblad SWC, is a minor plus. I don't spend a lot of time looking at my cameras... :-)

    G

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    Re: Pre Order

    From my perspective, time and familiarity have reduced my "old" Sony A7 to the picture-taking instrument that it is. And that's been true of every other camera that I've owned to date. (Then again, I've never tried a Pignons Alpa--oh hey there's an idea...)

    Considered purely as a picture-taking machine, I got no complaints about the A7, though I wish it retained the flatter shape of the NEX-7 rather than the current pseudo-SLR shape.

    I discovered the writings of Deyan Sudjik a number of years ago and in light of this discussion, I figure that one of his more recent works might be worth a read:

    http://books.wwnorton.com/books/detail.aspx?ID=12224
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    Re: Pre Order

    Quote Originally Posted by Michiel Schierbeek View Post
    For € 3.500 this is sure an expensive baby.
    Not sure if I am willing to pay the extra € 1.400 compared to the then new A7r.
    Anyway not a first buyer this time, I think.
    +1 for me this time around as well.

    I like everything I'm seeing about the A7RII, EXCEPT the price. Sony sure is proud of this puppy, eh? I'm not an early buyer this time either until I actually use one.

    Will one of you early buyers please have a close look when you get yours, and see if they are sporting a red dot or at least a POLISHED red 7? I mean, that Hasselblad rebranding at ten times the Sony price must have gone to someones head... :roll eyes:

    I am often critical about the cost of high tech gadgetry when first announced. So often I've paid the initial prices as an early adopter only to end up disappointed with the cost, the performance after some testing, and the low resale value. Sony tech is never cheap, but lately in the camera arena Sony (full frame 35mm), Samsung (APS-C), and Olympus (M43) have been on fire. I don't know of any other cameras from any other manufacturers that deliver the same overall value.

    I was a critic of the A7S pricing on announcement, even to the point of writing a critical article about the price on my blog. I had to eat my words. After actually using one, I found the A7S for my work is the best all around camera I've ever owned. So the value is very much there for my professional work. I suspect the same will be true of the replacement A7S Mark II when it comes. If they bump it just a few MP like the A7RII, hold the excellent high ISO, add IBIS and internal 4k recording, I'll try to buy two. And yea, I am resigned to the likelihood that it will also cost over $3k this time around.

    Between my A7R and this new little Olympus OM-D EM-5 Mark II (it has a fabulous multi-shot high Megapixel mode) my high MP needs are well covered, and both are already paid for. Shooting fees being what they are these days, there isn't any room in my budget for carrying camera debt anymore.

    I spoke with my Congressman the other day and asked them why not consider adding a camera replacement benefit to Social Security here in the USA if they wanted to do something in this election year that people would really love? I mean, they could hide it under Obamacare by defining GAS as a Medicare covered condition for the elderly, right? I got told that ridiculous benefits are strictly reserved for banks, oil companies, car manufacturers and other large corporations. :face smack:

    Power to the people!
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    Re: Pre Order

    Oh brother! I will not add to your fire by disclosing the price I paid for my new A7s.

    Early birds always get the worms and only the worms.
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    Re: Pre Order

    I bought 5 Medium format backs. Talk about feeling violated. This is nothing, it's almost comical.

    Seriously I know price feels a little high but end of day I'm buying about 95 percent perfect when buying the A7r it was 75 percent. I want that 95 percent so I can stop looking over my shoulder and just get on with my life. I'm seriously really tired of the game.
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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  40. #90
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    Re: Pre Order

    Quote Originally Posted by k-hawinkler View Post
    Thanks.
    At this early stage I am not aware or reviews - only of, let's call them, infomercials for lack of a better word and Sony press releases.
    Could you please point me to publications that deserve the description review? TIA.
    The closest thing I know of in the way of an honest "review" is what Brian Smith wrote up as his Field Test trial here: http://briansmith.com/field-test-sony-a7rii/ Full disclosure, Brian is a Sony Artisan of Imagery, so he is compensated by Sony to use and write about their products.

    But Brian is an excellent "A List" commercial portrait and event photographer who I am proud to recommend and have known personally for over fifteen years to be honest and trustworthy in his photography advice as well as an excellent judge in his ability to critique camera gear.

    I trust Brian's opinion both from his experience and also from his technical chops. Brian's access allowed him to literally "write the book" on the original A7R: http://thecameraforum.com/sony-a7-a7...s-great-shots/ Brian is a photographers photographer, a Pulitzer Prize winner. Photography sources don't come any better than Brian, in my opinion. Am I a Brian Smith fanboy? You bet I am. I think he is one of the best modern day portrait photographers going, but he is my friend so you would probably expect that. Judge for yourself by his work on his website.

    Brian Smith is the only one of the bloggers I know of that has a close enough trust relationship with Sony that they work with him in developing their new camera gear. This gives Brian insights into the latest Sony technology and thinking the rest of us who only get a quick look at new tech before writing our initial impressions don't have.

    Google rewards greatly those who get news out online first, so the rest of us have to rely on outside sources, our own contacts information, and yes, very much on the Sony and others press releases. This goes for myself, Huff, Petapixel, DpReview, F-Stoppers, Luminous, and all the rest who have already written something on the A7RII. We try our best as journalists, but nothing beats being an actual insider when it comes to writing about a particular manufacturer's new announced, but still unreleased, technology.


    Have a GREAT day!

    Chuck Jones

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    Re: Pre Order

    As I already pointed out, these "Artisans" have to be handled with a glove online.

    As for the "honesty". Hmm... there are several shades. When Sony had few lenses for the FE, it is the same artisan who recommended a ZM 18/4 for A7r (!!!) and the NEX 10-18 f/4 zoom.

    Soviet union had an official newspaper called "Pravda". LOL

    The first "artisan" who writes an article critical of the crap load of NEX' and other blue labelled stuff that Sony churned out would make me believe.
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  42. #92
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    Re: Pre Order

    Quote Originally Posted by 4season View Post
    From my perspective, time and familiarity have reduced my "old" Sony A7 to the picture-taking instrument that it is. And that's been true of every other camera that I've owned to date. (Then again, I've never tried a Pignons Alpa--oh hey there's an idea...)

    Considered purely as a picture-taking machine, I got no complaints about the A7, though I wish it retained the flatter shape of the NEX-7 rather than the current pseudo-SLR shape.

    I discovered the writings of Deyan Sudjik a number of years ago and in light of this discussion, I figure that one of his more recent works might be worth a read:

    http://books.wwnorton.com/books/detail.aspx?ID=12224
    That looks like an interesting book! thank you.. :-)

    G

  43. #93
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    Re: Pre Order

    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck Jones View Post
    The closest thing I know of in the way of an honest "review" is what Brian Smith wrote up as his Field Test trial here: http://briansmith.com/field-test-sony-a7rii/ Full disclosure, Brian is a Sony Artisan of Imagery, so he is compensated by Sony to use and write about their products.

    But Brian is an excellent "A List" commercial portrait and event photographer who I am proud to recommend and have known personally for over fifteen years to be honest and trustworthy in his photography advice as well as an excellent judge in his ability to critique camera gear.

    I trust Brian's opinion both from his experience and also from his technical chops. Brian's access allowed him to literally "write the book" on the original A7R: http://thecameraforum.com/sony-a7-a7...s-great-shots/ Brian is a photographers photographer, a Pulitzer Prize winner. Photography sources don't come any better than Brian, in my opinion. Am I a Brian Smith fanboy? You bet I am. I think he is one of the best modern day portrait photographers going, but he is my friend so you would probably expect that. Judge for yourself by his work on his website.

    Brian Smith is the only one of the bloggers I know of that has a close enough trust relationship with Sony that they work with him in developing their new camera gear. This gives Brian insights into the latest Sony technology and thinking the rest of us who only get a quick look at new tech before writing our initial impressions don't have.

    Google rewards greatly those who get news out online first, so the rest of us have to rely on outside sources, our own contacts information, and yes, very much on the Sony and others press releases. This goes for myself, Huff, Petapixel, DpReview, F-Stoppers, Luminous, and all the rest who have already written something on the A7RII. We try our best as journalists, but nothing beats being an actual insider when it comes to writing about a particular manufacturer's new announced, but still unreleased, technology.


    Have a GREAT day!

    Chuck Jones

    Thanks Chuck for confirming my point.
    With best regards, K-H.
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  44. #94
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    Re: Pre Order

    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck Jones View Post
    Google rewards greatly those who get news out online first, so the rest of us have to rely on outside sources, our own contacts information, and yes, very much on the Sony and others press releases. This goes for myself, Huff, Petapixel, DpReview, F-Stoppers, Luminous, and all the rest who have already written something on the A7RII. We try our best as journalists, but nothing beats being an actual insider when it comes to writing about a particular manufacturer's new announced, but still unreleased, technology.
    Chuck Jones
    Hi Chuck:

    When you handled the A7RII were you able to tell how good the autofocus was? I've been wondering when Sony would reach parity with a DSLR for both static and moving subjects.

    Would love to hear your opinion.
    Regards,
    John
    Sony fanboy, shamelessly shilling for "the man" since 2010.

  45. #95
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    Re: Pre Order

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Mancuso View Post
    For me this camera is more about the fixes I needed. I don't expect to change anytime soon to be honest. This looks to be it for me.

    I'm done chasing pie in the sky and big rainbows. I just want a good working system.

    Guy, you should print out this post and hang it on your monitor. I cannot tell you the number of times I have said something similar. But then I weaken. Always happens. I do have a three year old D800E. Everything else is newer. But what's so bad about having some fun too?
    Alan

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  46. #96
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    Re: Pre Order

    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck Jones View Post
    The closest thing I know of in the way of an honest "review" is what Brian Smith wrote up as his Field Test trial here: http://briansmith.com/field-test-sony-a7rii/ Full disclosure, Brian is a Sony Artisan of Imagery, so he is compensated by Sony to use and write about their products.
    ...
    I enjoyed reading his article. One little detail I found ironic and amusing. When talking about "5-Axis Image Stabilization Optimized for 42.4 MP", he suggested that Sony had shoehorned it into the A7 keeping size to a minimum and said, "..Great news is the a7RII body is a mere 10mm deeper than it’s predecessor."

    At least one fellow on this forum, when I pointed out that a Leica M-P body was only 4mm thicker than a Leica M4-2 body (a dimension change of 11%), continued to insist that the M-P was fat and bloated compared to the film Ms. It'll be amusing to see how this fellow reacts to an A7RII that's a whole 10mm thicker (25% fatter; and never mind 160g (34%) heavier) than the one he's using now.

    The A7RII looks like a fine piece of technology. I hope it's as good a camera as its specifications indicate. I look forward to hearing user reports by people who aren't in the review-blogger community. :-)

    G
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  47. #97
    Administrator, Instructor Guy Mancuso's Avatar
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    Re: Pre Order

    Even though bigger the A7II over the A7 and heavier also, it seems to fit me better for some reason. I heard this both ways though, some like the A7 body style better than the new one as well. Just depends what feels good in the hands. But let's be honest here too we are not talking real weight and real size here. When we get to pounds and inches than it really starts to count. Read many arguments over a few millimeters and a few grams that make my head spin. Not you but on the net it gets really nuts reading this stuff. It's kind of funny especially us film guys that came from 8x10 / 4x5 film days. Now that was a size and weight issue. LOL
    Photography is all about experimentation and without it you will never learn art.

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    Re: Pre Order

    Quote Originally Posted by Vivek View Post
    As I already pointed out, these "Artisans" have to be handled with a glove online.

    As for the "honesty". Hmm... there are several shades. When Sony had few lenses for the FE, it is the same artisan who recommended a ZM 18/4 for A7r (!!!) and the NEX 10-18 f/4 zoom.

    Soviet union had an official newspaper called "Pravda". LOL

    The first "artisan" who writes an article critical of the crap load of NEX' and other blue labelled stuff that Sony churned out would make me believe.
    Blue labeled or not the 55FE and 35FE Distagon are great lenses by most standards. Whether the NEX cameras were crap or not I can't say for certain. They did exhibit a tangible improvement to sensor technology that was available in the Micro 4/3 cameras at the time... So much so that Olympus andPanasonic incorporate custom versions of them now.
    Sony Visible Light & IR Photographer
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  49. #99
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    Re: Pre Order

    Quote Originally Posted by Godfrey View Post
    I enjoyed reading his article. One little detail I found ironic and amusing. When talking about "5-Axis Image Stabilization Optimized for 42.4 MP", he suggested that Sony had shoehorned it into the A7 keeping size to a minimum and said, "..Great news is the a7RII body is a mere 10mm deeper than it’s predecessor."

    At least one fellow on this forum, when I pointed out that a Leica M-P body was only 4mm thicker than a Leica M4-2 body (a dimension change of 11%), continued to insist that the M-P was fat and bloated compared to the film Ms. It'll be amusing to see how this fellow reacts to an A7RII that's a whole 10mm thicker (25% fatter; and never mind 160g (34%) heavier) than the one he's using now.

    The A7RII looks like a fine piece of technology. I hope it's as good a camera as its specifications indicate. I look forward to hearing user reports by people who aren't in the review-blogger community. :-)

    G
    The M may be many things but physically bloated isn't among them. When people say things like the M is too large I just dismiss rational thought from being associated with that person. Desire from a more svelte body is one thing... Calling it too large is another.

    Sometimes people are too sensationalist regarding their personal desires. I enjoyed my M's in the past and the Monochrom (a product I was extremely wrong about initially) always interests me.
    Sony Visible Light & IR Photographer
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    Re: Pre Order

    Digital M's too large? Perish the thought.

    Unless one has just been shooting with one's pristine M3 with DR Summicron.

    Then they are fat and bloated.

    Just my experience. YMMV

    -Bill
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